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Old
11-01-2011, 07:54 PM
  #26
number72
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Originally Posted by frankthefrowner View Post
They bottom feed on cheap talent out of need. They cant get anyone worth a damn to sign. Every year they throw a big contract or 2 out there and get turned down. This year it was Ehrhoff and by all accounts they sent the brinks truck to his house and he said now.

The Islanders cant possibly spend up to the cap even if they wanted to... no one will sign. If it wasnt for DP's contract they might not be at the cap floor.
I'm not sure if I believe this completely. Wisniewski signed in Columbus for 6M or something ridiculous. And a reason veterans don't want to come here may be that they are often traded on the deadline to save money. I understand the business reason but it does not send the best message to Erhoff and other quality players that the islanders is committed to winning (if you trade talent at deadline) and this is a place you can expect to stay and raise your family for a few years.

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11-01-2011, 10:53 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
I'm not sure if I believe this completely. Wisniewski signed in Columbus for 6M or something ridiculous. And a reason veterans don't want to come here may be that they are often traded on the deadline to save money. I understand the business reason but it does not send the best message to Erhoff and other quality players that the islanders is committed to winning (if you trade talent at deadline) and this is a place you can expect to stay and raise your family for a few years.
Who have they traded to save money?... Sutton? Roloson? those were no brainers.

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11-01-2011, 11:12 PM
  #28
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Who have they traded to save money?... Sutton? Roloson? those were no brainers.
I was thinking of Wisniewski who was traded to Montreal.

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11-02-2011, 12:14 AM
  #29
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anyone that says rolston < hunter, staios < martinek or reasoner < konopka is lying to themself this is a better team then last season they just haven't clicked yet

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I was thinking of Wisniewski who was traded to Montreal.
how about the fact that he completely sucked defensively?

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11-02-2011, 12:45 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by startainfection View Post
anyone that says rolston < hunter, staios < martinek or reasoner < konopka is lying to themself this is a better team then last season they just haven't clicked yet



how about the fact that he completely sucked defensively?
First part is really tough to make a decision on because Hunter hasn't been able to stay consistently on the ice in 3 years and Martinek hasn't been able to in ever.

I'm not the biggest Konopka fan and I wasn't fanatical about re-signing him as a lot of people around here were but as of right now I'd prefer Z. Admittedly I have never watched Reasoner closely over the past couple years (who has really) but looking at his stats (I'm well aware stats don't say everything) BUT last three seasons Konopka has a total of 15 points where as Reasoner has 47 so perhaps it's too early to jump to conclusions on him. But on flip side perhaps age is catching up with him who knows but I think it's too early to give up on him considering every line (besides the 1st line) has yet to show up so far this season.

Second part couldn't agree with you more here... While I did like Wiz's offensive output from the blue line he would make really weak moves that would make you pull your hair out.

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11-02-2011, 12:59 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Calvin De Haan Job View Post
First part is really tough to make a decision on because Hunter hasn't been able to stay consistently on the ice in 3 years and Martinek hasn't been able to in ever.

I'm not the biggest Konopka fan and I wasn't fanatical about re-signing him as a lot of people around here were but as of right now I'd prefer Z. Admittedly I have never watched Reasoner closely over the past couple years (who has really) but looking at his stats (I'm well aware stats don't say everything) BUT last three seasons Konopka has a total of 15 points where as Reasoner has 47 so perhaps it's too early to jump to conclusions on him. But on flip side perhaps age is catching up with him who knows but I think it's too early to give up on him considering every line (besides the 1st line) has yet to show up so far this season.

Second part couldn't agree with you more here... While I did like Wiz's offensive output from the blue line he would make really weak moves that would make you pull your hair out.
Only reason Reasoner had 32 points last year is because he was on the Panthers 3rd line, he is a 4th liner here, to expect him to repeat his points total last year, this year is ridiculous.

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11-02-2011, 01:28 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by ledzep1212 View Post
Only reason Reasoner had 32 points last year is because he was on the Panthers 3rd line, he is a 4th liner here, to expect him to repeat his points total last year, this year is ridiculous.
Like I said I didn't see him play really at all was just going by stats which like I said admittedly doesn't paint the whole picture.

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11-02-2011, 01:34 AM
  #33
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If you're a free agent do you sign with Neil Smith the Cup winner? UFA's did. Snow? He's gotta prove himself a bit more to even get the B guys to sign.

Wang NEEDED to hire the best GM he could given the mark he leaves on the team as an eccentric owner.

Wanna blame the arena? The Joe is a bigger ****hole. The owner there just made it tons nicer out of his own pocket. Wanna blame the uncertainty of the team? Blame the guy that together with Nassau and his partners botched that one over the years (even 8/1 was botched).

If we continued to build on the 2001 team rather than have an impulsive owner and a terrible GM demolish it, would we be talking about it?

The lesson is.....the GM, the owner and the team itself have no leg to stand on. It's all about winning.

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11-02-2011, 02:13 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
If you're a free agent do you sign with Neil Smith the Cup winner? UFA's did. Snow? He's gotta prove himself a bit more to even get the B guys to sign.

Wang NEEDED to hire the best GM he could given the mark he leaves on the team as an eccentric owner.

Wanna blame the arena? The Joe is a bigger ****hole. The owner there just made it tons nicer out of his own pocket. Wanna blame the uncertainty of the team? Blame the guy that together with Nassau and his partners botched that one over the years (even 8/1 was botched).

If we continued to build on the 2001 team rather than have an impulsive owner and a terrible GM demolish it, would we be talking about it?

The lesson is.....the GM, the owner and the team itself have no leg to stand on. It's all about winning.
This is 100% true OTH. This is the GIGANTIC elephant that surrounds this team that will remain a crutch until the team starts winning.

It's one thing to be happy with Snow's discipline, his cap management (cheap owner?) and building from within, with solid prospects (tanking strategy?) - but until there's progress in the W-L department, this team remains a colossal failure.

You can hide behind blindness, cautious optimism, whatever - reality is in the standings.

It's really too bad. If Wang/Snow would just use that cap space a bit more effectively, this could be a really good team even now.

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Old
11-02-2011, 09:17 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
But a good businessman (one whose partners aren't fearful in the showers) knows that playoffs means 10k fans turns to 15-16k reliably in time and that's 42 days where there are a few thousand more fans coming. That's, say, $50 avg per seat (arbitrary #) X 4,000 X 42 games (which is not plausible but possible) meaning $12M invested gets you playoff revenue of 16,234 X $50 (arbitrary #of roughly $800k PER GAME) PLUS extra season revenue of $9.6M.

Now add parking, concessions and increased advertising......

But it's more work. More expectations. Happier fanbase, though.
True. But, the rub is that greater investment doesn't always equal a better team. The team could very well land in the bottom 5 again despite the $12 investment. So, the choice is cut payroll and ensure minimal loss or invest and risk maximum loss. Not saying that it's right, but that's usually how it goes with bad owners.

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11-02-2011, 09:29 AM
  #36
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Look I understand the frustration. I have been an Isles fan for 30 years myself. I understand all those bad draft pics......bad trades....bad owners.....bad building.....bad GM's. I even had some second guessing going on when GMG was hired and Neil Smith left. I get it. But what GMG has been/is doing is NOT A BAD PLAN. And it does take time....time that I know wears thin b/c of all the frustration the fan base has gone through. It seems that no matter what the Isles try it ends in failure. I get it. Everytime a FA doesn't sign.....I feel it too. With all that said.......CAN WE WAIT UNTIL THE END OF NOVEMBER TO CALL THIS TEAM A FAILURE. Really 9 games? After 9 games the team has failed? We don't even know what kind of team the Isles are yet. People can guess-timate but no one REALLY knows. The team doesn't even know. I'm not drinking from any kool-aid. Being a realist I just can't throw in the towel after an 82 game season that has yet to reach double digits in games. I understand why Wang is reserved in spending money......the man has lost MILLIONS every year since buying the team. Think about that? How often have we ourselves have cried everytime we gas up our car? Nassau itself voted NO b/c they don't want to pay anymore taxes. And people here complain that WANG won't spend (any more) money? Everyone has a right to speak their mind. I just think it is unrealistic to call the season a failure after 9 games. I am going to wait until at least THANKSGIVING.

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11-02-2011, 10:35 AM
  #37
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No progress other than having JT on the roster right now. Prospects are nice to have but until they do it in the NHL they do not mean much. Just look at Bailey and Okposo, they look to be at best 40 point guys. Those are not guys you build teams around.

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11-02-2011, 01:08 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie Daggers Crime View Post
True. But, the rub is that greater investment doesn't always equal a better team. The team could very well land in the bottom 5 again despite the $12 investment. So, the choice is cut payroll and ensure minimal loss or invest and risk maximum loss. Not saying that it's right, but that's usually how it goes with bad owners.
The investment I would worry about FIRST would be in a better or the best GM to carry it out.

Give Snow more money and we get a high priced 38 year old. Give Milbury more money and at least we got Satan and others who weren't around for disco.

If Snow can make a trade that is not absurd, I would reward him with the money (notice the standards employed here?) to draw more fans. No playoffs? We're shopping for a new GM who can do better, as we should do with every member of the personnel.

But it's Wang's money, so if horrid is a step up from absurd and rationale for patience, so be it.

Right now I'm wishing we had Trent Hunter. The other scraps are fine, but we have a guy all year who is not helping Bailey any but IS costing us a fortune.

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11-03-2011, 04:28 PM
  #39
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General Question on our progress? Now I will admit to being ignorant on our Farm System specifically Bridgeport, seems like successful Eastern Conference NHL Teams, Pittsburgh and Washington have really good AHL clubs in Scranton/Hershey... I think those teams have won Calder Cups recently... Now the Isles, consistently in the bottom of the East, have Bridgeport who seem to toil in the bottom of the AHL... Can someone explain why I should change my stance on the organization? Guess I should change my name to "Negative Isles." Look, out of all my four major favorite teams, remarkably (you wouldn't know from the tener of my posts) the Isles rank as the top on my list... I just want answers from Wang/Snow!!!

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11-03-2011, 06:00 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by startainfection View Post
anyone that says rolston < hunter, staios < martinek or reasoner < konopka is lying to themself this is a better team then last season they just haven't clicked yet



how about the fact that he completely sucked defensively?
? He is a top offensive dman like Streit. His offensive play needs to be paired with a stay at home defender.

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11-03-2011, 08:28 PM
  #41
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Progress is a four letter word. Snow Must Go!

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11-03-2011, 08:37 PM
  #42
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I'll take Hunter over Rolston right now. Rolston has been a ****ing joke since he's gotten here.

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11-03-2011, 08:40 PM
  #43
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Rolston's the highest paid player on the team.

There's $8MM committed to Rolston, Pandolfo, Staios (including bonuses) to reach the cap floor.

Does this sound like a GM who's trying to win games? Or save by using unachievable bonuses to save $$$ and meet the cap minimum?

When Snow wrote his objectives at the start of the season, and submitted them to Wang, at the top of the list was "SPEND BELOW THE CAP FLOOR" - not "make the playoffs"

It's really obvious.

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11-03-2011, 10:40 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by redbull View Post
Rolston's the highest paid player on the team.

There's $8MM committed to Rolston, Pandolfo, Staios (including bonuses) to reach the cap floor.

Does this sound like a GM who's trying to win games? Or save by using unachievable bonuses to save $$$ and meet the cap minimum?

When Snow wrote his objectives at the start of the season, and submitted them to Wang, at the top of the list was "SPEND BELOW THE CAP FLOOR" - not "make the playoffs"
I wonder how long it will take the people who didn't believe us, to admit we were right?

Nail Yakupov looks pretty good though.

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11-03-2011, 10:54 PM
  #45
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for all we know the players are still feeling the effects of not having a proper training camp.

for all we know the players are feeling a sense of security with their new 5 year deals

for all we know the players are feeling a sense of resentment towards the organization for yet again not bringing in any legitimate talent to help

for all we know the players are playing soft because they don't want to get hurt?

Who knows WTF is going on with this bunch. all I know is I'm going to be livid if they don't make some serious changes to the lines come saturday.

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11-03-2011, 10:55 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
The investment I would worry about FIRST would be in a better or the best GM to carry it out.
Agreed, but it seems obvious that's not the agenda in play here. Snow is Wang's boy. He's doing exactly what Wang wants him to be doing.

Quote:
Progress is a four letter word. Snow Must Go!
Snow's not going anywhere.

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