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Rangers Interested in Cody Franson

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Old
11-02-2011, 12:37 PM
  #176
JeffMangum
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Franson will not garner any of Anisimov, Stepan, Kreider, or Dubinsky. He's a bottom pairing PP specialist who may, stress may, become a #4.

I'd offer Bourque and a pick. Burke would LOVE Bourque.

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11-02-2011, 12:37 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by apb03 View Post
It's like talking to a brick wall. What's a broski?

I'm just saying knowing my GM, he'd be interested in already drafted players who have the potential to upgrade what we currently have and is less interested in picks. This is why he picked up Colborne and Gardiner and is more interested in players like Kreider.

That's all I'm saying. Some of you guys are frothing at the mouth, calm the hell down.
A brick wall? Ahh I see now. Im not frothing and no need to tell me to calm the hell down. Im just stating what some people here refuse to understand. What Toronto fans want, Rangers fans most likely won't give up.

Admittedly I don't know as much about Franson as I do about other leaf players so I do understand what your saying about him being only 23 and still being able to develop to more then a bottom Dman.

However the Rangers are not a team stocked with offensive prospects which is why Kreider and Thomas are non starters for us and want something more established if we are going to move one of them as a piece in a trade.

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11-02-2011, 12:41 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by apb03 View Post
First of all, Franson is a bottom pairing D-man today. But he's also a 23 year old. Do you know what he'd be like if given the opportunity? Nobody does at this point. He has potential though. I'm not trying to sell you on him, I'd rather keep him to be honest, I'm just partaking in the discussion here.

Right now Kreider is not even an NHL forward so Franson is a healthy upgrade to you today. If Kreider breaks into the NHL next year, you think he's going to be blast his way into your top 6 out of the gate? He'll probably be like most rookies, work his way up starting from the bottom like...Franson.
Marc Staal(24)
Dan Girardi(27)

Ryan McDonagh(22)
Michael Sauer(24)

Michael Del Zotto(21)
Tim Erixon(20)

Dylan McIlrath(19)

Rangers are intersted in a solid bottom pairing guy who isn't going to cost something significant. Would they be willing to offer more for someone more valuable? Likely. But Franson isn't that guy. Neither is Gunnar. You're talking about bottom-pairing dmen who are readily available for less than our blue-chip prospect.

Kreider's value to the Rangers is a hell of a lot more vital than a bottom pairing dmen with upside. Even if it's a young dmen who projects as a second-pairing guy.

I don't value Prospects as high as other guys. I think bona fide NHLers > Prospects, but teams have different blueprints and the Rangers current system isn't stocked with legitimate top-6 LW prospects.

Would the Rangers shop Kreider? Yes.
Would they shop him for a bottom pairing dmen? Absolutely, positively not.

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11-02-2011, 12:41 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by apb03 View Post
First of all, Franson is a bottom pairing D-man today. But he's also a 23 year old. Do you know what he'd be like if given the opportunity? Nobody does at this point. He has potential though. I'm not trying to sell you on him, I'd rather keep him to be honest, I'm just partaking in the discussion here.

Right now Kreider is not even an NHL forward so Franson is a healthy upgrade to you today. If Kreider breaks into the NHL next year, you think he's going to be blast his way into your top 6 out of the gate? He'll probably be like most rookies, work his way up starting from the bottom like...Franson.
Actually, I do think Kreider is going to be in the Rangers Top-6 right out of the gate next year. Wolski isn't getting qualified at the bloated $3.8M he already makes, so he really only needs to leapfrog Boyle and Fedotenko to get into the Top-6. Both Boyle and Feds are more suited for Bottom-6 roles. Kreider has shown he can play well against grown men, and has shone in the WCs and WJCs. He would be one of the fastest players in the NHL right now, and has an NHL-level shot and hands. On top of that, the kid is built like a mack truck. Even if he completely busted at this point (highly unlikely), he would still be a very good 3rd liner due to his physical gifts alone.

Franson is 24 years old and over 6 years out of his draft year. Realistically, how much development do you think he has left? It can't be much. And I'm not trying to rag on the guy, but he is what he is: a bottom-pairing dman. You don't give up a guy like Kreider for that. Ask yourself if you would give up Kadri if the roles were reversed. I don't think you would, rightfully.

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11-02-2011, 12:41 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by apb03 View Post
I'm not offering anything, unless you think I'm a GM. I'm merely stating the obvious. You aren't getting a top pairing d-man mid season, so if that's what is needed, then well I guess you should hope for a lottery pick.

I get it, the Rangers are high on Kreider. If they aren't willing to move a significant prospect for a D man that's available, then that's just fine. I'm just having a discussion here. I'm being realistic, you clearly aren't.
no, you're not at all

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11-02-2011, 12:52 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
Actually, I do think Kreider is going to be in the Rangers Top-6 right out of the gate next year. Wolski isn't getting qualified at the bloated $3.8M he already makes, so he really only needs to leapfrog Boyle and Fedotenko to get into the Top-6. Both Boyle and Feds are more suited for Bottom-6 roles. Kreider has shown he can play well against grown men, and has shone in the WCs and WJCs. He would be one of the fastest players in the NHL right now, and has an NHL-level shot and hands. On top of that, the kid is built like a mack truck. Even if he completely busted at this point (highly unlikely), he would still be a very good 3rd liner due to his physical gifts alone.

Franson is 24 years old and over 6 years out of his draft year. Realistically, how much development do you think he has left? It can't be much. And I'm not trying to rag on the guy, but he is what he is: a bottom-pairing dman. You don't give up a guy like Kreider for that. Ask yourself if you would give up Kadri if the roles were reversed. I don't think you would, rightfully.
Your arguement is flawed in that Franson is not a typical bottom pairing defenseman. A regular bottom pairing guy won't get you a top prospect - you are right. A young, sizable D in only his 3rd season coming off a 30 pt season - much different.

You nor I can say definitely how high his ceiling is, but given he's still considered green in the NHL, I'd say the notion that he has already reached it is more flawed IMO than thinking otherwise.

Joe Shmoe bottom pairing D? Sure, not worth Krieder. But Franson is worth something in that ballpark at some point this year, even if Toronto needs to add a little to get it done.

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11-02-2011, 12:57 PM
  #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
Your arguement is flawed in that Franson is not a typical bottom pairing defenseman. A regular bottom pairing guy won't get you a top prospect - you are right. A young, sizable D in only his 3rd season coming off a 30 pt season - much different.

You nor I can say definitely how high his ceiling is, but given he's still considered green in the NHL, I'd say the notion that he has already reached it is more flawed IMO than thinking otherwise.

Joe Shmoe bottom pairing D? Sure, not worth Krieder. But Franson is worth something in that ballpark at some point this year, even if Toronto needs to add a little to get it done.
It doesn't matter. You're argument is flawed in that RIGHT NOW, Franson isn't even a bottom pairing defensemen. He's been a healthy scratch on a team with Mike ****ing Komisarek, and hasn't lived up to his billing.

That won't return Kreider, or Thomas, unless you ad significantly

Dream on.

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11-02-2011, 01:00 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Vinner View Post
Trade him in the off-season for picks.

That does absolutely nothing at the moment, except take away from the team's depth, you don't even save much cap room. He's cheap and productive in a limited role, with potential to expand on that role.
And defensemen do seem to be highly valued by contenders at the trade deadline.

What a team is offering right now may pale in comparison to what a GM will forfeit when his team is riddled with injuries going into the stretch drive and playoffs.

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11-02-2011, 01:03 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by YouCantYandleThis View Post
It doesn't matter. You're argument is flawed in that RIGHT NOW, Franson isn't even a bottom pairing defensemen. He's been a healthy scratch on a team with Mike ****ing Komisarek, and hasn't lived up to his billing.

That won't return Kreider, or Thomas, unless you ad significantly

Dream on.
It's just not that simple. We have NO space for him on the side he plays. He can't play the other side.

Anyway, whatever, we'll keep dreaming then. Personally I'd rather keep him for when we need him, like tonight.

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11-02-2011, 01:03 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by apb03 View Post
Well Kreider isn't in the NHL right now and if they need a quality NHL D-man right now, that would make sense no?

I know the Rangers are high on Kreider but the immediate needs will probably force them to make a decision as I'm sure they'd rather give themselves the best chance for success this season. I don't know for certain but given the profile of players that Burke covets, I can see him going hard after Kreider.

I can envision a deal that makes sense for both sides. Burke could offer Franson + a good prospect for Kreider or something like that.

Like I said, the Leafs are in a position of strength when it comes to Defense, so anyone wanting to pry away a young NHL ready D man whom is 6'5 and has a good shot making only 800k is going to have to give up something of value in return. Sucks but that's kind of how trades work, both teams have to benefit. An equivalent roster player to Franson will not upgrade the Leafs right now because of the logjam.
Considering how hard Torts rides his top 4, a defenseman who likely won't see more than 8-9 minutes at ES isn't going to garner our top prospect.

Say you guys really wanted a third line LW. Fedotenko for Kadri sound fair? Didn't think so.

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11-02-2011, 01:04 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
Your arguement is flawed in that Franson is not a typical bottom pairing defenseman. A regular bottom pairing guy won't get you a top prospect - you are right. A young, sizable D in only his 3rd season coming off a 30 pt season - much different.

You nor I can say definitely how high his ceiling is, but given he's still considered green in the NHL, I'd say the notion that he has already reached it is more flawed IMO than thinking otherwise.

Joe Shmoe bottom pairing D? Sure, not worth Krieder. But Franson is worth something in that ballpark at some point this year, even if Toronto needs to add a little to get it done.
Franson is 24, 6 years out from his draft year (he was a 3rd rounder btw, not a 1st), and is now starting his 5th season of professional hockey. He doesn't play PK, and gets sheltered minutes. I really don't know what I'm missing here. He's a bottom-pairing guy. The odds of him developing into anything more are slim. And there's nothing wrong with that. The overwhelming majority of 3rd rounders never even see NHL ice. He's just not worth anything close to Kreider.

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11-02-2011, 01:05 PM
  #187
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The rangers are looking for a stop gap here. They won't be trading their top prospects for a stop gap.
Unless the D man they are trading for is the top 4 two way vet they've identified as one of their missing pieces, then Kreider isn't getting traded. It's not how Sather works. If that doesn't get us a guy who would be both a stop gap and a bottom pairing guy for us at the same time then I think we can survive. Maybe without Staal we don't make the playoffs. But we are not going to make a knee jerk reaction that will affect our future. In no way is it worth it and Franson isn't a guy who puts us over the top or in anyway upgrades our d core with Staal in significantly.

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11-02-2011, 01:07 PM
  #188
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Prust for Franson
good call. sounds about right to me.

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11-02-2011, 01:08 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
Franson is 24, 6 years out from his draft year (he was a 3rd rounder btw, not a 1st), and is now starting his 5th season of professional hockey. He doesn't play PK, and gets sheltered minutes. I really don't know what I'm missing here. He's a bottom-pairing guy. The odds of him developing into anything more are slim. And there's nothing wrong with that. The overwhelming majority of 3rd rounders never even see NHL ice. He's just not worth anything close to Kreider.
Lol that paints a much different picture then the other guy was trying to paint. With that being said then there is no way the conversation with Kreider or Thomas is even relevant to what would actually take place.

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11-02-2011, 01:11 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
Franson is 24, 6 years out from his draft year (he was a 3rd rounder btw, not a 1st), and is now starting his 5th season of professional hockey. He doesn't play PK, and gets sheltered minutes. I really don't know what I'm missing here. He's a bottom-pairing guy. The odds of him developing into anything more are slim. And there's nothing wrong with that. The overwhelming majority of 3rd rounders never even see NHL ice. He's just not worth anything close to Kreider.
Skin it any way you like it, in his sophomore slump he still put up 29 and got playoff EXP. He's still only 24 and has great size. We will get a good prospect for him with or with out you.

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11-02-2011, 01:24 PM
  #191
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Lol that paints a much different picture then the other guy was trying to paint. With that being said then there is no way the conversation with Kreider or Thomas is even relevant to what would actually take place.
And let me paint another.


He led the team in D points through 12 games - 6 pts, 1 more than Suter or Weber. He did this while averaging half as much PP time per game as Suter and Weber.

He averaged 15 minutes of ice, per game, and led the team in takeaways while tied for lowest giveaways.


This guy may be soft but he certainly isn't the bottom pairing scrap that most of you are making him out to be.

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11-02-2011, 01:41 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
We will get a good prospect for him with or with out you.
That's the issue. Kreider isn't just A good Prospect. Kreider's a blue-chip prospect. A great prospect.

A good prospect is someone like Kundratek. Or Bourque. Not Kreider. lol...

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Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
This guy may be soft but he certainly isn't the bottom pairing scrap that most of you are making him out to be.
Nobody here has suggested he's scrap. What we're saying is he isn't worth a prospect like kreider. That's all.

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11-02-2011, 01:47 PM
  #193
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That's the issue. Kreider isn't just A good Prospect. Kreider's a blue-chip prospect. A great prospect.
A good prospect is someone like Kundratek. Or Bourque. Not Kreider. lol...
Nobody here has suggested he's scrap. What we're saying is he isn't worth a prospect like kreider. That's all.
Perhaps I misread this, but it sure seems like the consensus is to label him as the non-roster 7th (crapbag) D.

I do agree he isn't worth a blue chipper, but a good prospect - for sure. As I said earlier for Kreider the leafs would have to add something to top it off.

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11-02-2011, 01:54 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
Perhaps I misread this, but it sure seems like the consensus is to label him as the non-roster 7th (crapbag) D.

I do agree he isn't worth a blue chipper, but a good prospect - for sure. As I said earlier for Kreider the leafs would have to add something to top it off.
The Leafs would have to talk about someone like Kadri when discussing Kreider. And no, I am not kidding.

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11-02-2011, 01:55 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
Perhaps I misread this, but it sure seems like the consensus is to label him as the non-roster 7th (crapbag) D.

I do agree he isn't worth a blue chipper, but a good prospect - for sure. As I said earlier for Kreider the leafs would have to add something to top it off.
Did you even read this thread?

Calling Franson a bottom-pairing dman is not insulting. That's what he is. Expecting people to value him more than what he is worth isn't realistic. 5/6 dmen don't garner alot in trades, as I've said before.

You would have to add a ton to get Kreider, who is our Top Prospect, and plays a position that we are organizationally weak at. Stop being so defensive.

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11-02-2011, 02:03 PM
  #196
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Maybe I only saw "good Franson" games when he was in Nashville, but I really like the kid. I see him (ultimately) as a second-pairing guy who can contribute on both ends of the ice.

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11-02-2011, 02:06 PM
  #197
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I'd be willing to add quite a bit (aside from a 1st) to get Thomas from NYR. Imagine Stumpy's kid in Blue and White! Match made in heaven.

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11-02-2011, 02:11 PM
  #198
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avery beng shopped?

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11-02-2011, 02:13 PM
  #199
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avery beng shopped?
No. People could have had him for half price. No one in the league besides NYR wants him.

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11-02-2011, 02:14 PM
  #200
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Originally Posted by Wolskii View Post
Well said. Really well said actually. If a bottom pairing guy like Franson is worth more than a 2nd, I.E. a 1st, or more then a bottom 6 forward, I.E. a top 6 forward, then what is a a guy like Luke Schenn worth Alex ****ing Ovechkin????
lol man..
I think what hes trying to say is why trade Franson now for a 2nd & loose the depth we have, when we could trade him before the draft for a 2nd and keep him for the whole season? makes no sense, we already have injuries on our back end so it'd be stupid to move him.
Yes leafs fans are overrating their players, but les not forget that rangers fan are doing the exact same thing with Stepan, & Kreider, they are talking like they're worth Sidney ****ing Crosby

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