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Old
01-04-2012, 10:58 AM
  #126
arsmaster
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Originally Posted by windflare View Post
Learn to read history on the players and watch them play before making judgments like this. Tanner Pearson is a legitimate 1st rounder prospect, and he passed in the last draft because of his injury pre-draft year and position on the team last year. There are articles regarding that online.

He's on pace to outscore Hodgson in his post-draft year - and he's also in his post-draft year.
THis is his 3rd draft.

If he was a legitimate 1st round prospect he wouldn't have slipped through 2 drafts all ready.

Cody Hodgson during his draft year played the majority of his time on a line that didn't included Duchene and Grachev (other that PP), Pearson plays with with Scheifele and Telegin every game. Its a dominant line with high end prospects who are mature and assimilated in the OHL.

If we took Pearson in the round 1 there would be outrage on this forum, it would be a bad pick (even if its 30th overall).

Can you remember anything from Pearson at the WJ that didnt include taking a bad penalty? I cant....not a great player and was spoon fed PP time (not to bring my anger to this thread, but why did the keep giving him PP time, when you had guys like Connolly who was probably a top 3 forward on the team?).

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01-04-2012, 11:37 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
THis is his 3rd draft.

If he was a legitimate 1st round prospect he wouldn't have slipped through 2 drafts all ready.

Cody Hodgson during his draft year played the majority of his time on a line that didn't included Duchene and Grachev (other that PP), Pearson plays with with Scheifele and Telegin every game. Its a dominant line with high end prospects who are mature and assimilated in the OHL.

If we took Pearson in the round 1 there would be outrage on this forum, it would be a bad pick (even if its 30th overall).

Can you remember anything from Pearson at the WJ that didnt include taking a bad penalty? I cant....not a great player and was spoon fed PP time (not to bring my anger to this thread, but why did the keep giving him PP time, when you had guys like Connolly who was probably a top 3 forward on the team?).
Or Scheifele for that matter....any who

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01-06-2012, 12:53 PM
  #128
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The curse of 2012 Draft continues, hopefully its only minor, but project 1st overall, Nail Yakupov left the ice injured in OT of the gold medal game at the WJC.

http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/story/?id=384384

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Yakupov joins a long list of of 2012 prospects that have been or still are on the injured list, which includes Sarnia's Alex Galchenyuk and Moose Jaw defenceman Morgan Rielly (ACL injuries), Everett blueliner Ryan Murray (high ankle sprain), Halifax forward Martin Frk (concussion), and Peterborough Petes defenceman Slater Koekkoek (dislocated shoulder).
Frk is back, and Murray obviously played at the WJ...but these injuries may allow for some droppers....love a chance at Reilly.

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01-06-2012, 01:00 PM
  #129
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If Russian goalie Makarov is available in the 2nd rd would the Canucks take him?

With Schneider being a UFA after next season and most likely being the odd goalie out with Luonogo signed long term, I think it would be smart to grab another strong goaltender prospect.

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Old
01-06-2012, 01:25 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by crazycanuck View Post
If Russian goalie Makarov is available in the 2nd rd would the Canucks take him?

With Schneider being a UFA after next season and most likely being the odd goalie out with Luonogo signed long term, I think it would be smart to grab another strong goaltender prospect.
He played well last night, but I dont see him as an Elite Prospect, worth using a 2nd round pick on considering: Lack, Cannatta, Illiahti, Honzik are pretty good prospects to start with.

Makarov isn't as good as Vasilevski. I might take him with our 2nd, because he could be the BPA, but I see Makarov as more of a 4th-6th round option.

We have more holes in the organization on defense and gritty forwards, then we do on goaltending prospects.

I'd like to build the defense this year, especially in a defense heavy top end of the draft.

Their are some industious forwards available that could fit too.

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01-06-2012, 01:25 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by crazycanuck View Post
If Russian goalie Makarov is available in the 2nd rd would the Canucks take him?

With Schneider being a UFA after next season and most likely being the odd goalie out with Luonogo signed long term, I think it would be smart to grab another strong goaltender prospect.
BPA... but I doubt the Canucks take a goalie that high, lots of other goalie prospects right now with Lack, Cannata, Ilhati, Honzik and there are usually great goalies taken in later rounds.

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01-06-2012, 01:28 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
BPA... but I doubt the Canucks take a goalie that high, lots of other goalie prospects right now with Lack, Cannata, Ilhati, Honzik and there are usually great goalies taken in later rounds.
Beat ya!

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Old
01-06-2012, 01:36 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
BPA... but I doubt the Canucks take a goalie that high, lots of other goalie prospects right now with Lack, Cannata, Ilhati, Honzik and there are usually great goalies taken in later rounds.
Yes...I am excited to see what Cannatta can do once he leaves University.

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01-06-2012, 01:37 PM
  #134
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Beat ya!

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Old
01-06-2012, 01:47 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
He played well last night, but I dont see him as an Elite Prospect, worth using a 2nd round pick on considering: Lack, Cannatta, Illiahti, Honzik are pretty good prospects to start with.

Makarov isn't as good as Vasilevski. I might take him with our 2nd, because he could be the BPA, but I see Makarov as more of a 4th-6th round option.

We have more holes in the organization on defense and gritty forwards, then we do on goaltending prospects.

I'd like to build the defense this year, especially in a defense heavy top end of the draft.

Their are some industious forwards available that could fit too.
Lack could be in Schneider's position in 2-3 years(to a lesser extent though). The Canucks may have a few goalie prospects after that but none look to be AHL ready at this point.

How easy is it to compare goalies to skaters when trying to determine BPA? BPA between defensemen and forwards is tough enough but goalies are completely different. Goaltender prospects are tough to judge, as there are many goalies that come in the later rounds.

I agree that picking a goalie in the first round is a HUGE risk but after that I think it's fair game based on who is available at the time of the pick.

Makarov may not look to be as good as Vasilevski (who looks to me as a potential 1st rd pick in 2013) but I do see him being better than all the other prospects in the Canucks goaltending stable at this point. I can see him going anywhere between 2nd and 4th rds based on his WJC showing.

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Old
01-06-2012, 02:01 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by crazycanuck View Post
Lack could be in Schneider's position in 2-3 years(to a lesser extent though). The Canucks may have a few goalie prospects after that but none look to be AHL ready at this point.

How easy is it to compare goalies to skaters when trying to determine BPA? BPA between defensemen and forwards is tough enough but goalies are completely different. Goaltender prospects are tough to judge, as there are many goalies that come in the later rounds.

I agree that picking a goalie in the first round is a HUGE risk but after that I think it's fair game based on who is available at the time of the pick.

Makarov may not look to be as good as Vasilevski (who looks to me as a potential 1st rd pick in 2013) but I do see him being better than all the other prospects in the Canucks goaltending stable at this point. I can see him going anywhere between 2nd and 4th rds based on his WJC showing.
Vasilevski is 2012 eligible.

Cannatta looks like a young Jon Quick if you ask me, he is absolutely dominating the NCAA.

Could be our 'Next' Cory Schneider.

Just because a player is at the WJ does not make him better than a player who isn't. I believe that is the case with a few other goalies available this year...Subban, Dansk, Gillies

Say you are picking at the bottom of the rounds, there are a lot more spots to play as a forward or a skater over a goalie in development, I see no reason to draft a goalie unless he is the clear BPA.

You already have people knocking the Honzik pick last year as a 3rd rounder....I wouldn't take a Makarov in the 2nd round, 5th maybe.

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01-06-2012, 02:13 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
Vasilevski is 2012 eligible.
Cannatta looks like a young Jon Quick if you ask me, he is absolutely dominating the NCAA.

Could be our 'Next' Cory Schneider.

Just because a player is at the WJ does not make him better than a player who isn't. I believe that is the case with a few other goalies available this year...Subban, Dansk, Gillies

Say you are picking at the bottom of the rounds, there are a lot more spots to play as a forward or a skater over a goalie in development, I see no reason to draft a goalie unless he is the clear BPA.

You already have people knocking the Honzik pick last year as a 3rd rounder....I wouldn't take a Makarov in the 2nd round, 5th maybe.

Ok, wow, he's a young draftee this year.

Again, I agree it's tough to pick a goaltender unless he is clearly the BPA. Either Russian goalie is worth the gamble IMO though.

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Old
01-06-2012, 02:18 PM
  #138
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Ok, wow, he's a young draftee this year.

Again, I agree it's tough to pick a goaltender unless he is clearly the BPA. Either Russian goalie is worth the gamble IMO though.
in the 2nd round?

Makarov isn't that good.

Sweden fired 50+ shots, majority coming from the outside. i cant recall a single "huge" save he made in that gold medal game, just a lot of routine.

Vasilevski is younger and better in all aspects of the position IMO.

I'd take Vasilevski 2nd round, not Makarov....If we drafted Makarov in the 4th or 5th it would be a good pick, 2nd or 3rd round not so much.

That said, Im not much of a goalie guy...just saw what I felt was a better technical goalie from the Vasilevski.

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01-06-2012, 02:26 PM
  #139
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in the 2nd round?

Makarov isn't that good.

Sweden fired 50+ shots, majority coming from the outside. i cant recall a single "huge" save he made in that gold medal game, just a lot of routine.

Vasilevski is younger and better in all aspects of the position IMO.

I'd take Vasilevski 2nd round, not Makarov....If we drafted Makarov in the 4th or 5th it would be a good pick, 2nd or 3rd round not so much.

That said, Im not much of a goalie guy...just saw what I felt was a better technical goalie from the Vasilevski.
I think both have higher potential then any of the Canucks goalie prospects, I agree Vasilevski is the better goalie, but Makarov is still a very good prospect, although more of a stretch in the 2nd round.

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01-06-2012, 02:59 PM
  #140
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I think both have higher potential then any of the Canucks goalie prospects, I agree Vasilevski is the better goalie, but Makarov is still a very good prospect, although more of a stretch in the 2nd round.
Eddie Lack and Cannata have shown to be pretty good prospects (older yes). Honzik is having and up and down season but he is still very young. I don't think there is a need for a gut reaction to the WJ's to pick a goalie in the top two rounds.

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01-06-2012, 06:12 PM
  #141
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I think both have higher potential then any of the Canucks goalie prospects, I agree Vasilevski is the better goalie, but Makarov is still a very good prospect, although more of a stretch in the 2nd round.
Sorry, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

If either of those goalies have higher potential than Lack or Cannata they would be gone in the first round. They don't, though.

The Canucks have no need to take another goaltender in the first 3/4 rounds this year, and I'd be surprised if they did.

We are stacked in net. Even if Schneider is moved, we have Lack as a back-up, with Cannata in the AHL developing and Honzik/Illihati behind him.

If we drafted either of those Russian goalies they'd be in the same spot Honzik is in, and I'm not sure either is a significant upgrade on Honzik. Definitely not worth a 2nd round pick given our position

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01-06-2012, 06:40 PM
  #142
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Sorry, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

If either of those goalies have higher potential than Lack or Cannata they would be gone in the first round. They don't, though.

The Canucks have no need to take another goaltender in the first 3/4 rounds this year, and I'd be surprised if they did.

We are stacked in net. Even if Schneider is moved, we have Lack as a back-up, with Cannata in the AHL developing and Honzik/Illihati behind him.

If we drafted either of those Russian goalies they'd be in the same spot Honzik is in, and I'm not sure either is a significant upgrade on Honzik. Definitely not worth a 2nd round pick given our position
As good as Lack has looked and as big a fan of him as I am, I dont' see him being the all star stud goaltender. I haven't seen Cannata but realistically he doesn't project to being a starting goaltender at this point. All this can change as goaltenders are a different animal to skaters and even then Burrows was undrafted so...

Canucks after the top 3 are not any different than most NHL teams, they have a few goaltender prospects who have been drafted in the middle to late rounds who have some upside but are more than anything projects and longshots to make a real impact in the AHL let alone make the NHL

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01-06-2012, 06:46 PM
  #143
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As good as Lack has looked and as big a fan of him as I am, I dont' see him being the all star stud goaltender. I haven't seen Cannata but realistically he doesn't project to being a starting goaltender at this point. All this can change as goaltenders are a different animal to skaters and even then Burrows was undrafted so...

Canucks after the top 3 are not any different than most NHL teams, they have a few goaltender prospects who have been drafted in the middle to late rounds who have some upside but are more than anything projects and longshots to make a real impact in the AHL let alone make the NHL
But there is no goalie projected to go in the first round... so why are we talking about using a high pick on a goalie?

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01-06-2012, 06:49 PM
  #144
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But there is no goalie projected to go in the first round... so why are we talking about using a high pick on a goalie?
Subban and Vasilevski as well as Dansk have all received some 1st round consideration.

That said, we dont need one.

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01-06-2012, 06:58 PM
  #145
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For those that have followed this draft a bit closer: If the nux were to pick 25 or later, what type of player (F or D) gives them the best value for their position? Seeing as it is said to be a D heavy draft, would the nux be better off taking Dman or Forward?


Also, haven't followed the draft too closely, but is there a lot of movement of the players in rankings by the various scouting resources? For example, last year it seemed like there were players moving around 10 to 15 spots from their initial and mid-term rankings. Wondering if this draft is more of the same.

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01-06-2012, 09:50 PM
  #146
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Thats tough to say. I think there is a possibility to have up to 15 D men picked in the 1st round, but the order in which is tough to decipher right now.

For me at least, I'm not that enamored with a lot of the forwards in that range. I'm intrigued by Faksa, Di Giuseppe, Kerdiles and perhaps Hertl, beyond the Gaunce/Girgensons who i think will be chosen much earlier. I think there may be some D that fall into that area, Koekkoek for injury reasons (out for the season with shoulder surgery), hopefully Matt Finn doesn't rise too high, or some under-rated guys like Thrower/Severson might enter that conversation.

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01-06-2012, 10:09 PM
  #147
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From where we're probably selecting I would pick a defenseman unless Faksa, Aberg or Zharkov is avaliable

Not very high on Hertl, Sissons, and Maidens. Would definitely be okay if we selected one of them in the 2nd or Hudon

otherwise we should get a very very good D

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01-06-2012, 10:25 PM
  #148
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Thanks feebster and hodgson. I will read up on the players mentioned.


15D possibly picked in the 1st and the order undecipherable = I like that set up for the nux. It gives them a chance to nab a good Dman as a "faller" or go boom/bust with one, or both!

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Old
01-06-2012, 10:26 PM
  #149
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From where we're probably selecting I would pick a defenseman unless Faksa, Aberg or Zharkov is avaliable

Not very high on Hertl, Sissons, and Maidens. Would definitely be okay if we selected one of them in the 2nd or Hudon

otherwise we should get a very very good D
Zharkov is interesting. Is he hurt?

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01-07-2012, 12:41 AM
  #150
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Zharkov was hurt in the beginning of the season missing 17 games

He is on the same team as Gaunce who will probably be a top 10 pick. Both are big players, Zharkov is 6'3, Gaunce is 6'2 and a centre so some team will definitely pick this guy early. Zharkov is a Russian though, but if he's available we should consider taking him, 15 goals in 20 games definitely a big goal scoring winger

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