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The Karlsson Konundrum

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Old
11-07-2011, 05:14 PM
  #101
Curtinho
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I think he'll get 5.5 and a decently long contract.

Personally I'm not a fan of long contracts just because you never know what can happen to a player, but in this case and relative to other contracts in the league he deserves it. It'll be a pretty cool day when he gets signed.

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11-07-2011, 05:59 PM
  #102
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My guess, is something to the effect of 3 years for around $14 mil.

What I WOULD LIKE is more to the effect of, say, 10 years, for $51 mil.

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11-07-2011, 06:03 PM
  #103
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My guess, is something to the effect of 3 years for around $14 mil.

What I WOULD LIKE is more to the effect of, say, 10 years, for $51 mil.
You think Karlsson takes shorter term because his side thinks he can cash in at 6+ long term if they wait?

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11-07-2011, 06:09 PM
  #104
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You think Karlsson takes shorter term because his side thinks he can cash in at 6+ long term if they wait?
Would be the smarter business decision. Logic says that his defence will continue to improve and he may continue to improve offensively aswell. Being an offensive wizard that is reliable defensively with a more proven track record could yield quite the contract. I think it depends on if he has his heart set on staying in Ottawa.

I'm hoping that Alfredsson has enough influence on the kids to get them to want to stay here long term and take decent contracts to that effect.

I'd like to see all these guys more interested in playing for Ottawa than making ridiculous money (considering they already make a lot of money anyway.)

Karlsson 5 - 5.5 cap hit over a long term, Rundblad around the same, Cowen 3.5 - 4.5 would be ideal for our blueline.

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11-07-2011, 06:23 PM
  #105
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Would be the smarter business decision. Logic says that his defence will continue to improve and he may continue to improve offensively aswell. Being an offensive wizard that is reliable defensively with a more proven track record could yield quite the contract. I think it depends on if he has his heart set on staying in Ottawa.

I'm hoping that Alfredsson has enough influence on the kids to get them to want to stay here long term and take decent contracts to that effect.

I'd like to see all these guys more interested in playing for Ottawa than making ridiculous money (considering they already make a lot of money anyway.)

Karlsson 5 - 5.5 cap hit over a long term, Rundblad around the same, Cowen 3.5 - 4.5 would be ideal for our blueline.
I'm guilty of just assuming they're all going to want to be a part of whats going on here for their whole careers. Some of them it won't be possible.

With Tim Murray at a reasonably young age and the next in line (and arguably making a lot of the key decisions anyways), and Alfie making it pretty clear he'll be in Ottawa post-retirement and in all likelihood apart of the org....I don't see us having some sort of regime change that could cut into what's going on.

The Swedes especially is a culture movement in a way and I expect the ones that buy in and have success will be a priority. At the moment, Karlsson's at the forefront. The movement just seems so perfect and sustainable at the moment.

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11-07-2011, 06:29 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
I'm guilty of just assuming they're all going to want to be a part of whats going on here for their whole careers. Some of them it won't be possible.

With Tim Murray at a reasonably young age and the next in line (and arguably making a lot of the key decisions anyways), and Alfie making it pretty clear he'll be in Ottawa post-retirement and in all likelihood apart of the org....I don't see us having some sort of regime change that could cut into what's going on.

The Swedes especially is a culture movement in a way and I expect the ones that buy in and have success will be a priority. At the moment, Karlsson's at the forefront. The movement just seems so perfect and sustainable at the moment.
Yep, and it might just be me but it seems like this is easiest to pull off with Swedes (look at Detroit.) They just seem to be more down to earth and have a more relaxed demeanor outside of the rink. I also love that Alfredsson is going to be there not only as a mentor but as an example of a class act. The pay cut he took for us is amazing and I hope that's the golden standard that our players adhere to.

Zibanejad, Karlsson, Rundblad, Silfverberg and Lehner all look like they are going to be a big part of our future and I think that could yield great results for us.

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11-07-2011, 06:45 PM
  #107
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Yep, and it might just be me but it seems like this is easiest to pull off with Swedes (look at Detroit.) They just seem to be more down to earth and have a more relaxed demeanor outside of the rink. I also love that Alfredsson is going to be there not only as a mentor but as an example of a class act. The pay cut he took for us is amazing and I hope that's the golden standard that our players adhere to.

Zibanejad, Karlsson, Rundblad, Silfverberg and Lehner all look like they are going to be a big part of our future and I think that could yield great results for us.
I really hope it's explained how this all happened someday. It's like they got Anders Forsberg one day and said "meh, what the hell, lets start a Swedish movement"

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11-07-2011, 07:45 PM
  #108
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Skim read the first few pages and my take on Karlsson's defensive abilities at this point are they are overall ordinary. I find he is generally pretty effective against skill players but against power forwards he just doens't have the strength to compete against them at the moment. Postionally he is sound and he has an active stick in the D zone that he uses quite effectively. My memory is little bit shady but agianst the B's when Lucic scored on the PP with a backhand, Karlsson just didn't have the strength to box Lucic out of that position or clear him out entirely. However, he is a pretty small kid at this point and once he puts on enough muscle he will be much more effective against the stronger players. In his prime I imagine he will have progressed much further but I believe this trend will continue because genetically he just won't have the size to compete against some of the bigger players in the game. As long as putting on muscle doesn't sacrifice his shiftiness and speed, in his prime I envision that he will be an above average defensive player which coupled with his offensive abilities will mean he will be a huge force.

With that in mind I don't mind locking him up long term - 6 to 8 years at around 5-6 per. I just wonder if it would be in the interests of the Sens to not consume any of his UFA years at this point to drive down the cost as it may lead to savings that we could put towards a UFA maybe 3-4 years down the road if we are ready to compete which i believe is totally plausible.

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11-07-2011, 09:12 PM
  #109
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Karllson is all offence. His only check is made with his stick and that sometimes works. I'd say same money as Schenn (all defense)

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11-07-2011, 09:15 PM
  #110
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He's going to at least get Myers money.

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11-07-2011, 09:17 PM
  #111
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I'm not worried the players like BM so i think it'll happen and good for both parties

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11-07-2011, 09:18 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Canuckman44 View Post
Karllson is all offence. His only check is made with his stick and that sometimes works. I'd say same money as Schenn (all defense)
Agreed. Karllson can't play even a lick of defence. Karlsson on the other hand is constantly getting better defensively and is on the ice more than anybody else on the team. Unlike Karllson, Karlsson will be getting quite a bit more than Schenn.

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11-07-2011, 09:27 PM
  #113
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Agreed. Karllson can't play even a lick of defence. Karlsson on the other hand is constantly getting better defensively and is on the ice more than anybody else on the team. Unlike Karllson, Karlsson will be getting quite a bit more than Schenn.
True about the icetime. I don't think he is getting much better defensively.

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11-07-2011, 11:56 PM
  #114
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True about the icetime. I don't think he is getting much better defensively.
Schenn's all defense? Karlsson would be getting tougher defensive minutes than Schenn if they played on the same team right now.

I think you're the only guy in this entire thread that would say he hasn't shown a marked improvement in his defensive play since last year.

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11-08-2011, 12:01 AM
  #115
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True about the icetime. I don't think he is getting much better defensively.
What makes you say this?

If anything, we're lucky because defence and positioning can be taught. Hell, I improved tenfold during the time in which I played defence as a kid. It's hard to believe Karlsson won't learn proper defensive play over the course of the next 5-6 seasons.

Players are always improving. Look at Spezza. A few seasons ago, he never steeped foot on the ice while we were a man down, and was a half-rink player. Greening is another example at 25 years old.

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11-08-2011, 12:07 AM
  #116
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What makes you say this?

If anything, we're lucky because defence and positioning can be taught. Hell, I improved tenfold during the time in which I played defence as a kid. It's hard to believe Karlsson won't learn proper defensive play over the course of the next 5-6 seasons.

Players are always improving. Look at Spezza. A few seasons ago, he never steeped foot on the ice while we were a man down, and was a half-rink player. Greening is another example at 25 years old.
Nope he's gonna be too small to be a strong defensive player, he's going to be a similar size as Toby Enstrom, but has no chance of being just as good or even a better all around player.

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11-08-2011, 12:54 AM
  #117
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Something like wisniewski contract (defensively both are poor) but a couple million less since he is an RFA and the team can undercut his contract.

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11-08-2011, 08:10 AM
  #118
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100 million 50 years

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11-08-2011, 10:35 AM
  #119
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I think EK camp could make a compelling case he is worth 10% of the cap and I see him settling at around 8.5% for the next 6-8 years

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11-08-2011, 10:53 AM
  #120
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I think EK camp could make a compelling case he is worth 10% of the cap and I see him settling at around 8.5% for the next 6-8 years
Which puts him right inline with Myers 5.5 hit over 7 years. Like I said before, I think the Sens know that's exactly what to expect.

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11-30-2011, 01:35 AM
  #121
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Karslsson and the Senators are in Winnipeg to face the Jets Tuesday night. Asked after the morning skate what makes Karlsson so good, Ottawa coach Paul MacLean spoke of the 21-year-old’s speed.

“He can flat out skate,” said MacLean. “Better than anybody on the rink.”
I wonder just how much they could argue for if this keeps up.

If Karlsson puts up 70+ this year...is he a Norris candidate?

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11-30-2011, 01:48 AM
  #122
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I wonder just how much they could argue for if this keeps up.

If Karlsson puts up 70+ this year...is he a Norris candidate?
I just hope he gets signed to reasonable amount so we don't have to hear our fanbase bashing the kid everytime he goes through little ruts. "I can't believe he is making 7mil!!!!! garbage...etc...etc"

Hopefully the new CBA will provide some guidelines so that these young players work their way up to huge contracts, and don't just get 5mil+ handed to them at 22.

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11-30-2011, 01:48 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
I wonder just how much they could argue for if this keeps up.

If Karlsson puts up 70+ this year...is he a Norris candidate?
If we make the playoffs I think he is for sure. If we don't I'd expect him to at least finish in the top 8 in votes.

But if we make the playoffs he's one of the biggest reasons why.

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11-30-2011, 05:32 AM
  #124
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Nope he's gonna be too small to be a strong defensive player, he's going to be a similar size as Toby Enstrom, but has no chance of being just as good or even a better all around player.
You do know enstrom hadnt even made the nhl at 21 and at 24 whe he did make it he wasent as good as he is now?

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11-30-2011, 06:43 AM
  #125
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You do know enstrom hadnt even made the nhl at 21 and at 24 whe he did make it he wasent as good as he is now?

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