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Return for Carter vs. Return for Richards

View Poll Results: Which return is better?
Sean Couturier + Jakub Voracek + Nick Cousins (early 3rd 2011) 62 66.67%
Brayden Schenn + Wayne Simmonds + late 2nd 2012 31 33.33%
Voters: 93. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-15-2011, 03:58 PM
  #1
CS
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Return for Carter vs. Return for Richards

This should be closer now than it ever was due to Couturier. I think at this point the question becomes necessary.

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Old
10-15-2011, 04:04 PM
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BringBackStevens
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Too early, obviously.

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10-15-2011, 04:04 PM
  #3
JDinkalage Morgoone
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As of right now, it looks like Coots and Jake were a more bountiful return.

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Old
10-15-2011, 04:06 PM
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Krishna
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Cant vote right now.. But i would currently vote Return for Carter

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Old
10-15-2011, 04:06 PM
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We'll let you know in 5 years

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Old
10-15-2011, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
We'll let you know in 5 years
The way couturier is playing now, and it seems like voracek and simmonds are ready to take the next step we should be able to tell by the end of next year, if not this year if we continue to have succes.

This is more than just player for player comparison, it is how the new guys suit the team, the speed and size both voracek and simmonds bring to the wing is awesome, and fits lavy style. Couturier already has his defense game, it cannot get worse but only better over time, and if his offense game develops into what he is capable he will be off the charts as an all around player. Schenn looks to be ready looking like a man among boys in the AHL. The locker room seems better, the players are all giving it 100% every shift, playing a full 60 minutes, they all seem comfortable and happy to be part of the team, and all of that is extremely underrated when adding up the value of the trades.

It is likely everyone looks back on both these trades sooner rather later saying how we ran away with a kings ransom in both cases. (I already feel that way)

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10-15-2011, 04:22 PM
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I like Couturier more as a prospect than Schenn. So I'll go with the Carter deal.

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10-15-2011, 04:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
We'll let you know in 5 years
This isn't a poll asking "Wait five years." or "Too close right now."

I want to know which way people are honestly leaning now. I will point out that it was probably unanimously in favor of the Richards trade when it happened since we didn't know we would be drafting Couturier.

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10-15-2011, 04:30 PM
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Couturier will be a better player then Schenn...

Honestly though its too early to tell.

But i like the Carter deal better as of right now.

I like both returns though. Simmonds is a heck of a player.

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Old
10-15-2011, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
This isn't a poll asking "Wait five years." or "Too close right now."

I want to know which way people are honestly leaning now. I will point out that it was probably unanimously in favor of the Richards trade when it happened since we didn't know we would be drafting Couturier.
Nothing has changed really since the summer. You're asking if there is any difference based on 4 games.


Luca Sbisa was a superstar after the same amount of time.

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Old
10-15-2011, 04:52 PM
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I cannot really cast a vote right now... I'll pick one eventually I suppose BUT not only do we really have to see how these players turn out over the course of a season, but we have to look at how they end up in their Flyers careers; do they re-sign at a fair valued contract or do they hamstring the Flyers or have to be moved? Also how Richards and Carter play out their contracts and develop has to come into play, IMO... But as it has been already posted the way the players fit in ultimately counts most, and we will never know how Richie and Carts would have made out here going forward.

At this point I will assume that Couturier and Schenn will pan out as projected and as so far observed as top tier players... And I will also assume that Cousins and the 2nd Rounder from the Kings play out equals... Which to me says that it comes down to Simmonds vs Voracek.

Right now I see Simmonds as more of an as advertised very good fit for the Flyers and maybe a better than seamless replacement for Harntell when he moves on (probably at the end of his contract)... He appears to be what we were told; a player we will love here. Jake on the other hand to me is an X-factor who, if he can hit his original scouted projection in the NHL will be a wonderful fit here and might resolve the question... but if he doesn't get his talent working game to game a this level, and/or does not keep in as good a physical and mental state as he needs to, he might resolve the question the opposite way.

... Also I suppose we must look at the long range Cap effects from each trade... which also will not be known for quite a while.



I guess with all the above taken into consideration I will cast my vote for he Return on Richards... BUT I sure hope we revisit this periodically over the next several years.

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
Nothing has changed really since the summer. You're asking if there is any difference based on 4 games.


Luca Sbisa was a superstar after the same amount of time.
Exactly. Not a question that can be answered right now. I like all 4 of the players they got. We'll see how it turns out.

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:06 PM
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Luca Sbisa was a superstar after the same amount of time.
LMFAO that is so true. I love going to games and seeing people with Sbisa jerseys.

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10-15-2011, 05:10 PM
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People are taking this as a personal affront as if I'm in here trying to trick them into picking the wrong answer.

I'm just curious as to what everyone's impression is right now. I promise I'm not going to quote and say "hahaha" while rubbing it in your face years from now.

While I'm starting to like Couturier more than Schenn, I'm also starting to like Simmonds more than Voracek. I think Simmonds brings something a little more unique in terms of similar players in the NHL. I also think Simmonds can do that while putting up similar numbers to Voracek if Voracek never takes the leap.

It's not an easy question. You don't need to take it as a trick though.

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10-15-2011, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usahockey22flyers View Post
LMFAO that is so true. I love going to games and seeing people with Sbisa jerseys.
I was tempted... the kid was impressive for a while... and I liked the number 47 which is a good one for me. So glad I was smart enough in the end.

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10-15-2011, 05:13 PM
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The Carter return is going to win by a landslide since everyone is over-the-moon with Couturier right now, while Schenn has yet to make a mark.

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10-15-2011, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damaged Goods View Post
The Carter return is going to win by a landslide since everyone is over-the-moon with Couturier right now, while Schenn has yet to make a mark.
Well, if you haven't seen Schenn dominating the AHL like it's his own personal play thing I suggest you look into it.

People who think they may be disappointed by Schenn are in for a pleasant surprise.

It's on the level of JVR vs. the Caps rookie team right before JVR made his NHL debut.

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10-15-2011, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
People are taking this as a personal affront as if I'm in here trying to trick them into picking the wrong answer.

I'm just curious as to what everyone's impression is right now. I promise I'm not going to quote and say "hahaha" while rubbing it in your face years from now.

While I'm starting to like Couturier more than Schenn, I'm also starting to like Simmonds more than Voracek. I think Simmonds brings something a little more unique in terms of similar players in the NHL. I also think Simmonds can do that while putting up similar numbers to Voracek if Voracek never takes the leap.

It's not an easy question. You don't need to take it as a trick though.
I just think we are saying that it is waaaaaaaaaay too early to say.

I think a discussion thread would have been better than a POLL where we have to suffer PE...............(Premature Evaluation)

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:22 PM
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My Vote went for Schenn, Simmonds and a 2nd, but that is long term. I think right now, the better deal is Couturier and Voracek.

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10-15-2011, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Well, if you haven't seen Schenn dominating the AHL like it's his own personal play thing I suggest you look into it.

People who think they may be disappointed by Schenn are in for a pleasant surprise.

It's on the level of JVR vs. the Caps rookie team right before JVR made his NHL debut.

I'm aware. I meant yet to make a mark on the Flyers. I'm just saying that the votes are going to be heavily skewed by short-term perceptions. The Carter package is going to run away with it, when they are actually pretty equal value. Take it for what it's worth.

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:33 PM
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When the trades were made I liked the Richards package more because Schenn was a known quantity unlike the 8th pick, but the Flyers got lucky with Coututier and made a good selection with Cousins. Right now our Carter pieces are a little better.

Voracek > Simmonds
Couturier = Schenn
Cousins > 2nd rounder (right now)

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:37 PM
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That is a 2nd in a deep defensive draft. I'm hoping for good fortune with that pick. We need defensemen anyway.

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:46 PM
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Shafer, there is no answer now. People are offended because you're asking a silly question. It simply doesn't have an answer yet. If they wanted to post unqualified opinions they'd just write for some hockey site.

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Old
10-15-2011, 05:54 PM
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Shafer, there is no answer now. People are offended because you're asking a silly question. It simply doesn't have an answer yet. If they wanted to post unqualified opinions they'd just write for some hockey site.
If people actually get offended over a question like this, I have some serious concerns about them.

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10-15-2011, 05:57 PM
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Terence Peterman
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
If people actually get offended over a question like this, I have some serious concerns about them.
Nice quick edit.

They'd answer because they're stupefied they're even being asked at this point.

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