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Old
11-10-2011, 04:57 AM
  #1
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Some sabres observations

First off forgive me I am living in Europe so I watch games on my computer and they start at 1am, I am either half asleep when I watch the games or miss them.


Some points I am hoping people can comment on.
1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?
2. What is wrong with Leino?
3. When is Ennis back?
4. How is Kassian doing and why didn't he get the call over Tropp?
5. It seems like Lindy Ruff is the wrong coach for this team, true?
6. Is Ryan Miller becoming expendable? Does Enroth make Miller a worse goalie?
meaning with a really bad backup Miller looks great
7. Buffalo is #9 on the PP is this good enough?
8. When is Hecht back?
9. I see many people split on Ehrhoff, this guy has a cannon and it seems as usual Buffalo tries to work the puck down low on the PP instead of setting up Ehrhoff. Is Ehrhoff being used properly? I think so far he is having trouble fitting in.

These are the questions I have since I live so far away it is hard to keep up with the sabres

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Old
11-10-2011, 05:32 AM
  #2
Corto
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1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?
Same system, guys executing better. Goose has been great, Regehr a rock.

2. What is wrong with Leino?
He was rubbish, and misused at C (IMO), now looking much better on Roy's wing.

3. When is Ennis back?
Not sure really, few weeks away still.

4. How is Kassian doing and why didn't he get the call over Tropp?
Gonna leave this to the local guys to answer, I only get to see like 4 AHL games a year.

5. It seems like Lindy Ruff is the wrong coach for this team, true?
Not true... Why even ask it?

6. Is Ryan Miller becoming expendable? Does Enroth make Miller a worse goalie?
meaning with a really bad backup Miller looks great
Nope. Don't read stupid threads or silly articles which are looking for sensations.

7. Buffalo is #9 on the PP is this good enough?
/shrug
Can be better.


8. When is Hecht back?ž
Noone knows yet. First thing's first, there's a good number of people doubting his comeback at all...
Hopefully though, January or so, so he has time to get to 100% for the playoffs.


9. I see many people split on Ehrhoff, this guy has a cannon and it seems as usual Buffalo tries to work the puck down low on the PP instead of setting up Ehrhoff. Is Ehrhoff being used properly? I think so far he is having trouble fitting in.
Ehrhoff had some issues mainly because he was bad defensively in a few games, not because of the system or anything.
He was easily the best D in all 3 zones last game, so hopefully he'll be back to how he was playing in the first couple of games.

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Old
11-10-2011, 05:33 AM
  #3
DJN21
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Some points I am hoping people can comment on.
1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?
2. What is wrong with Leino?
3. When is Ennis back?
4. How is Kassian doing and why didn't he get the call over Tropp?
5. It seems like Lindy Ruff is the wrong coach for this team, true?
6. Is Ryan Miller becoming expendable? Does Enroth make Miller a worse goalie?
meaning with a really bad backup Miller looks great
7. Buffalo is #9 on the PP is this good enough?
8. When is Hecht back?
9. I see many people split on Ehrhoff, this guy has a cannon and it seems as usual Buffalo tries to work the puck down low on the PP instead of setting up Ehrhoff. Is Ehrhoff being used properly? I think so far he is having trouble fitting in.

1. if you recall we ended last year very strong on the PK and it just carried over into this year Id venture to guess. Also adding Robyn and another year of growth on our younger Dmen sure helps.

2. He is what he is. Everyone hyped him up and hoped he'd be the messiah at a "new/old" position that he previously hadnt found success in at least in America. He's doing the little things right and is playing well along the board and defensively but over the course of his highly paid contract I feel he will be looked upon as hecht is by most...an ok 2way player who is just paid too much for what he brings

3. Still no word, didnt skate yet this week to my knowledge

4. Kassian is still obviously young. You can see it in his play. he has some more maturation to go through before he gets the nod. Likewise Tropp had a great preseason, and ruff noticed. not to mention Tropp is very Kaleta-esque so he was an easy fill in.

5. No I think that some of the players are the wrong style for his system. Darcy and Pegula and Black knew his philosophy and what he asks for and still got him some players that werent that style i.e Leino. guys like Vanek and Poms who know his style in and out are thriving this year, new guys are struggling..

6. Not really at least yet and having 2 good goalies is no problem its a blessing, ask Boston about that.

7. PP and PK numbers this early on arent worth getting excited about...one game good or bad could vastly change both. If we give up 3 goals or get 3 on either side of special teams we go up 10 places in any direction. Give it time, and in terms of the PP give Erhoff time too because he will help there eventually

8. Would be surprised to see him anytime this calendar year at least

9. Good observations, he hasnt been able to unleash his shot yet. His pairing on the blueline has been weak with gragnani usually being there with him and now some Roy. Buffalo should be allowing him to fireaway and let vanek and poms get their usual garbage goals yet for some reason we seem intent on doing exactly the opposite.

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Old
11-10-2011, 07:48 AM
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I mention Ruff for a few reasons(He is a good coach
He favors players to a fault
he doesn't get the most out of his players
he has never won a cup
He doesn't motivate his players ie Miller, Myers....
He missuses his players
This is only my opinion and I could be wrong.

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Old
11-10-2011, 10:59 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJN21 View Post
Some points I am hoping people can comment on.
1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?
2. What is wrong with Leino?
3. When is Ennis back?
4. How is Kassian doing and why didn't he get the call over Tropp?
5. It seems like Lindy Ruff is the wrong coach for this team, true?
6. Is Ryan Miller becoming expendable? Does Enroth make Miller a worse goalie?
meaning with a really bad backup Miller looks great
7. Buffalo is #9 on the PP is this good enough?
8. When is Hecht back?
9. I see many people split on Ehrhoff, this guy has a cannon and it seems as usual Buffalo tries to work the puck down low on the PP instead of setting up Ehrhoff. Is Ehrhoff being used properly? I think so far he is having trouble fitting in.

1. if you recall we ended last year very strong on the PK and it just carried over into this year Id venture to guess. Also adding Robyn and another year of growth on our younger Dmen sure helps.

2. He is what he is. Everyone hyped him up and hoped he'd be the messiah at a "new/old" position that he previously hadnt found success in at least in America. He's doing the little things right and is playing well along the board and defensively but over the course of his highly paid contract I feel he will be looked upon as hecht is by most...an ok 2way player who is just paid too much for what he brings

3. Still no word, didnt skate yet this week to my knowledge

4. Kassian is still obviously young. You can see it in his play. he has some more maturation to go through before he gets the nod. Likewise Tropp had a great preseason, and ruff noticed. not to mention Tropp is very Kaleta-esque so he was an easy fill in.

5. No I think that some of the players are the wrong style for his system. Darcy and Pegula and Black knew his philosophy and what he asks for and still got him some players that werent that style i.e Leino. guys like Vanek and Poms who know his style in and out are thriving this year, new guys are struggling..

6. Not really at least yet and having 2 good goalies is no problem its a blessing, ask Boston about that.

7. PP and PK numbers this early on arent worth getting excited about...one game good or bad could vastly change both. If we give up 3 goals or get 3 on either side of special teams we go up 10 places in any direction. Give it time, and in terms of the PP give Erhoff time too because he will help there eventually

8. Would be surprised to see him anytime this calendar year at least

9. Good observations, he hasnt been able to unleash his shot yet. His pairing on the blueline has been weak with gragnani usually being there with him and now some Roy. Buffalo should be allowing him to fireaway and let vanek and poms get their usual garbage goals yet for some reason we seem intent on doing exactly the opposite.
2. In rebuttal, not everyone hyped him up. Also, I think it's been shown in these threads Leino's historically minimal North American stints at center are likely far more related to the organizational center depth in Detroit and Philly. Also, it's not clear to me a 3-zone puck-possession forward, regardless of his actual position, isn't worth the money Leino is scheduled to make over the life of his Sabre contract. Lastly, as the #2 forward UFA this past offseason, it's doubtful Leino could have been signed for significantly less money, nor that, e.g., $500k less per year is/would influence the composition and flexibility of the Sabre roster.

5. No way Vanek played Lindy's style when #26 first arrived (in Rochester or Buffalo). So you can't have your argument both ways. Leino, being an older, more experienced professional, should get it (Lindy's style) quicker than Vanek did; I'm willing to let that clock continue to run before judging. Conversely, there are also guys that aren't new (Stafford, Roy until very recently, and I'm throwing Ennis in as a weaker example, too) that aren't lighting the world on fire.

But I'll give you full credit on the other 7 of 9, plus bonus points for replying to the OP, so a solid "B" grade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by heartsabres View Post
I mention Ruff for a few reasons(He is a good coach
He favors players to a fault
he doesn't get the most out of his players
he has never won a cup
He doesn't motivate his players ie Miller, Myers....
He missuses his players
This is only my opinion and I could be wrong.
Ignoring semantics, e.g., opinions are not facts; facts are either objectively true (right) or false (wrong), I'd argue he gets more out of his players than he is given credit for. But heck, that's my opinion, too, which is difficult to "prove".

Also, it's not clear to me Miller and Myers are not motivated.

That whole line of thought, IMO, devolves into a philosphical discussion as to the extent a distribution of talent and/or training (i.e., = capability) along a continuum of capability is combined with a distribution of motivation along a continuum of motivation, in a Monte-Carlo-like simulation, the product of which is a distribution of performance (i.e., output / outcome). [I'm sure such topic has been discussed / studied in both academia and the military, and if/when I ever get the chance, I'd be real curious to learn the findings.] My intuition is talent / training (i.e., capability) is a far better predictor of performance than is motivation, for both individual data points and measures of average (mean, median, mode). Granted, I would not be surprised to see that motivation is more strongly correlated to the "outliers" of performance (e.g., a fit function to the residuals of performance would have a higher weighting to the individual motivation, in both directions of high and low performance).

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Old
11-10-2011, 11:47 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heartsabres View Post
First off forgive me I am living in Europe so I watch games on my computer and they start at 1am, I am either half asleep when I watch the games or miss them.


Some points I am hoping people can comment on.
1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?
Regehr helps us in the Pk alot, but also the forwards are defending better.
2. What is wrong with Leino?
He has played well the last 3-4 games, the points will come. He had a rough start with turnovers constantly. proberly getting used to the system.
3. When is Ennis back?
Sometime in next two weeks i think i heard Lindy say he was skating. (Can someone confirm this?)
4. How is Kassian doing and why didn't he get the call over Tropp?
Not putting up amazing numbers but doing ok, Tropp was the best RW in the farm, played well in pre-season so he gets the call.
5. It seems like Lindy Ruff is the wrong coach for this team, true?
No, Lindy Ruff is not the reason we have lost some of these games.
6. Is Ryan Miller becoming expendable? Does Enroth make Miller a worse goalie?
No, Miller is Elite, still got a better save % then other "Elite" goalies despite hitting a major slump from the Philly game. Miller may be having a tough time now, but he stole the W at Montreal and will do that again this season. Having two good goalies is a good thing. (Sorry Lalime.)
7. Buffalo is #9 on the PP is this good enough?
Yes, but there is always room for improvement. We move the puck well on the PP.
8. When is Hecht back?
he is on IR, concussion, might not played til way after christmas.
9. I see many people split on Ehrhoff, this guy has a cannon and it seems as usual Buffalo tries to work the puck down low on the PP instead of setting up Ehrhoff. Is Ehrhoff being used properly? I think so far he is having trouble fitting in.
Yes he is used properly and No he isn't fitting in badly, although we need to find him the right d partner.
There is my answers.

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Old
11-10-2011, 01:00 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corto View Post
1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?
Same system, guys executing better. Goose has been great, Regehr a rock.
You can't ignore the substantial personnel changes on the PK. Last year, we had Grier, Hecht and Connolly as mainstays on the PK, not to mention Niedermeyer and Morrissonn at various points. Now, you've got Vanek, Stafford, Regehr and Gerbe seeing lots of PK time. Same system, but lots of new faces. Also, Roy missed more than half the season, and he's been killing a lot of penalties this year.

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Old
11-10-2011, 03:15 PM
  #8
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2. In rebuttal, not everyone hyped him up. Also, I think it's been shown in these threads Leino's historically minimal North American stints at center are likely far more related to the organizational center depth in Detroit and Philly. Also, it's not clear to me a 3-zone puck-possession forward, regardless of his actual position, isn't worth the money Leino is scheduled to make over the life of his Sabre contract. Lastly, as the #2 forward UFA this past offseason, it's doubtful Leino could have been signed for significantly less money, nor that, e.g., $500k less per year is/would influence the composition and flexibility of the Sabre roster.

I suppose "hyped him up was a bad way to put it but "had high hopes for" may be more appropriate. Likewise i dont buy into Leino having been the 2nd best forward on the market last year. Laich,Gagne,Connolly,Cole,Jokinen,Tanguay,Selanne, RyderHedjuk, and Jagr say hello. now if you lowered your statement to 2nd best center this offseason perhaps youd be closer to the right ballpack but since we arent even utilizing Leino as a center...

5. No way Vanek played Lindy's style when #26 first arrived (in Rochester or Buffalo). So you can't have your argument both ways. Leino, being an older, more experienced professional, should get it (Lindy's style) quicker than Vanek did; I'm willing to let that clock continue to run before judging. Conversely, there are also guys that aren't new (Stafford, Roy until very recently, and I'm throwing Ennis in as a weaker example, too) that aren't lighting the world on fire.

The fact is though that Vanek and Stafford at least DO now play into lindy's system and it is currently evident and has been documented in the past that Leino seems to have a bit of a chip on his shoulder and has at time not fit into systems before. You're correct that the jury is still out on them but young Vanek and older crappier Leino are apples n oranges here

But I'll give you full credit on the other 7 of 9, plus bonus points for replying to the OP, so a solid "B" grade.

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Old
11-10-2011, 03:54 PM
  #9
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1. The penalty kill is #1 in the league, what is the difference from last year?

More aggressiveness. Pride. Better detail. Regehr.

2. What is wrong with Leino?

There are some valid excuses for his play, but it's mostly just confidence. It's between his ears. He's been absolutely awful all year, I'd like to see Tropp take his spot.

3. When is Ennis back?

I haven't heard anything on him, but if it's an ankle sprain it could be another month.

4. How is Kassian doing and why didn't he get the call over Tropp?

Kassian has put up okay numbers, about the same as Tropp, but Tropp had an amazing pre-season and deserved the call up more. And they made the right choice.

5. It seems like Lindy Ruff is the wrong coach for this team, true?

It doesn't seem that way to me, but I question his (and anybody else who coaches the team for that matter, cause I'm a control freak) intuition at times. I don't like the way he has handled the ice time with some of the players.

6. Is Ryan Miller becoming expendable? Does Enroth make Miller a worse goalie?
meaning with a really bad backup Miller looks great

Enroth's awesomeness doesn't diminish Miller's awesomeness, instead, their combined awesomeness combines into one awesome...thing. Miller looks like Miller no matter who his back up is. Having said that, he's probably not feeling the love of the fans right now. I heard the mock cheers from the Sabre's fans the other night, and it pissed me the **** off. Nobody should ever mock cheer Miller, he's done too much good for you fans in attendance! He's down, how about having his back for a change? Yeah you Sabre's Nation, stop being dicks to Miller!7.

7.Buffalo is #9 on the PP is this good enough?

See below, it could be better.

8. When is Hecht back?

He's got concussion issues, his career might be over.

9. I see many people split on Ehrhoff, this guy has a cannon and it seems as usual Buffalo tries to work the puck down low on the PP instead of setting up Ehrhoff. Is Ehrhoff being used properly? I think so far he is having trouble fitting in.

When they work the puck around and gain a shooting lane for the Hoff, oftentimes, the puck isn't passed with the right timing or accuracy. Gragnani is not as good from the left point as he is the right point. Or he gets the puck fine, but there's no lane. They need better movement, better passing, and Myers on the left point with Ehrhoff on the right point, Pomminville on the left boards, Roy on the right boards, and Vanek in his office.


Last edited by Play4Miracles*: 11-10-2011 at 04:04 PM.
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Old
11-10-2011, 05:09 PM
  #10
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I think the 9th overall on the PP is a bit misleading so far.

They've scored a bunch of individual effort type goals - off the rush with Vanek and Pominville.

When they get it set up they're not as strong. It has been a lot better since Myers and Roy have been on the first PP, but I think it's something they still need to work on. I don't like Roy manning the point all year.

and yeah I also don't think Ehrhoff hasn't found his way with the team yet. I think he needs to be on the first PP unit. He's not just a shot, he's smart with the puck and is a great passer too.

I think they should try Myers and Ehrhoff together on the 1st PP.

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