HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

We Need A Leader!

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
09-11-2004, 03:40 PM
  #1
ChrisKreider20
But y u mad?
 
ChrisKreider20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,551
vCash: 500
We Need A Leader!

Now that Messier is gone, we need a new veteran locker room presence....

I think we should get Ron Francis. He's played with Jagr could motivate him, as well as act as a leader for the kids and wear the C

Lundmark- Francis- Jagr
Wiseman- Nylander- Balej
Murray- Holik- Ortmeyer
Giroux- Moore- Dawes/Helminen/Betts

ChrisKreider20 is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 04:37 PM
  #2
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
Messier's officially gone?

I didn't hear the news. As for a leader, there is no 'c' on this team, but it will be led by Holik, Jagr and Kaspar.

Fletch is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 05:10 PM
  #3
Rodent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: On your dinner plate
Posts: 590
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancid
He's played with Jagr could motivate him
Please explain what it is you personally know about Jaromir Jagr that qualifies you to say what could motivate him.

Please explain what it is you personally know about Ron Francis that qualifies you to say whom he wishes to motivate.

Did Jagr tell you this would be a good idea? Did Jelinek say this on JJ's behalf?

Did Ron Francis make a statement somewhere that he'd like to skate with JJ and felt he could get the Czech's juices going?

Are you a psychologist? Psychiatrist?

Have you played hockey on a professional club so can (at least) speak with some experience as to what motivates a multi-millionaire (who has won just about every award eligible) to perform at world-class levels while living 4000 miles from home and his new girlfriend after having split with his long-time girlfriend and his mother moving back to Kladno?

Have even you read Jagr's book?

I ask these questions because I have spoken to people who have direct contact with JJ and the universal theme from these folks is that when it comes to motivation there is but one single human being on this planet who motivates the Ranger right wing.

And that is Jaromir Jagr himself.

Ivan Hlinka didn't even motivate JJ to play for his national team. Hlinka convinced JJ to play. But JJ wasn't playing "motivated" as he personally admitted to Czech press. His decision was a concession to Hlinka. And Ivan was JJ's coach in Pittsburgh for a while. So if there was anyone who was "missioned" with the task of motivating JJ, it was Ivan.

So I'm kinda coming to the conclusion that you have no idea as to what you're talking about.

Rodent is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 05:23 PM
  #4
Rodent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: On your dinner plate
Posts: 590
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancid
Now that Messier is gone, we need a new veteran locker room presence....
Do you know how old Ron Francis is?

He is 41 years old.

Do you know how many years ago he last played on the same team as Jaromir Jagr?

Try 1997-1998.

Jaromir Jagr has scored more than 200 goals since Francis left the Penguins. Somehow, I get the the impression that JJ's motivation has very little to do with Ron Francis.

That means the sole remaining reason to recruit Ron Francis would be that he can contribute other things to NYR that other unrestricted free agents cannot.

My own opinion is that the Rangers will not require the kind of leadership you're describing until such time as they demonstrate themselves to be true contenders.

Given the extensive roster overhaul and the need to permit head coach Tom Renney time to install his system and his team philosophy, quite frankly, my feeling is that the fewer opinionated veterans are inside that locker room the better - myself included!

And we certainly do not need the presence of another fossil such as Francis.

My goodness, I'm already livid about the length of Mikael Nylander's contract given his age.

AND YOU WANT TO ADD A 41-YEAR OLD?????

At 41, Ron Francis is the kind of player you add to a team very close to contention to help "put them over the top".

This does not describe the Rangers.

These kids need to look towards Renney for their leadership. They should not be looking to Bobby or JJ or Nylander or Darius or any other veteran.

That quartet should be leading - don't get me wrong. But they should be leading by example on the ice, not with pontification in the locker room.

Rodent is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 06:10 PM
  #5
Yizee*
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 419
vCash: 500
Leader

Messier was no leader on this team last year or any year before that he would rather skip practice or stand on the ice and do nothing while a teammate gets banged around

As for a leader I like the Keith Tkachuk idea - having a first line of 3 stars would be great for our kids to play behind that

Yizee* is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 06:46 PM
  #6
CoolDude*
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 379
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yizee
Messier was no leader on this team last year or any year before that he would rather skip practice or stand on the ice and do nothing while a teammate gets banged around

As for a leader I like the Keith Tkachuk idea - having a first line of 3 stars would be great for our kids to play behind that
Was that a joke? Cause if it was it was very funny.

CoolDude* is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 07:06 PM
  #7
Rodent
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: On your dinner plate
Posts: 590
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yizee
Messier was no leader on this team last year or any year before that he would rather skip practice or stand on the ice and do nothing while a teammate gets banged around

As for a leader I like the Keith Tkachuk idea - having a first line of 3 stars would be great for our kids to play behind that
Well, whether KT is a good addition for NYR or not is food for another thread or maybe even a Rodent Rant.

However, if we assume that your acquisition of Tkachuk makes sense, then I'd actually lobby against placing him onto the same line as Jagr's.

Both guys are "puck possession" types in the attacking zone. If one is scoring, it means the other one isn't getting the puck enough. By splitting these offensive threats across two lines you:

1) eliminate the "parisitism" I just described

2) spread enemy defenders thin because they don't know which Ranger line to counter with their "checking" line. Eg: if they try to thwart Jagr's line, then KT will be facing a line with weaker defensive capability. And vice versa.

The time for KT was when Slats traded for Eric Lindros or when he dealt Mike York.

I don't "feel right" about adding KT at this time. Oh, I love Tkachuk, don't get me wrong. But the timing isn't right.

Frankly, I don't believe Keith wishes to play for the Rangers anyway. But you can certainly draw up lines and debate them.

My vote would be to split Jagr and KT across two lines.

Both are specialists in carrying the puck deep into the attacking zone once the puck has entered the zone.

What both lines now need is a center and contra-wing who can motor the puck through the neutral zone and be responsible defensively.

So Jagr should be with a LW more like Rucinsky than KT.

Wanna hear something radical?

If Kovalev were still a Ranger, I'd place him with KT. Troll Boy's forte is moving the puck out of his own zone and through the neutral zone. On a line with KT, the burden on Kovvy to produce goals is greatly lessened - yet he's still a valid threat which means he can draw some attention away from KT. But with this pair you'd need a defensively responsible pivot.

Your turn.

Rodent is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 07:28 PM
  #8
Fotiu22
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Rockville Centre, NY
Posts: 491
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Fotiu22
Geez, the guy just gave his opinion, no need to fricken crusify him.

Fotiu22 is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 08:18 PM
  #9
Shadowtron
Registered User
 
Shadowtron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,532
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotiu22
Geez, the guy just gave his opinion, no need to fricken crusify him.

Yeah, Rodent. What's up? You don't typically flay other posters unless it's deserved. Do you have a history with this guy...or is it just one of those days?

Shadowtron is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 08:58 PM
  #10
JCProdigy
Registered User
 
JCProdigy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: I want what I want
Posts: 1,232
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowtron
Yeah, Rodent. What's up? You don't typically flay other posters unless it's deserved. Do you have a history with this guy...or is it just one of those days?

Eh, I was thoroughly amused. Rodent never personally attacked him just gave a stern counter-point to the opinion. A little harsh but you'll get reactions like that when you suggest a team that is noted for being too old to go out and get a 41 year old for any reason. Especially at Hockey'sFUTURE.

The rant did make me wonder if male squirrels PMS.....

JCProdigy is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 09:47 PM
  #11
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
I'm with Rodent...

tell Tyutin, Ortmeyer, Lundmark and Murray that Mess is not a leader. And what's has there been to lead? Further, yeah Mess missed practice, but so few players on this team stepped up every night that a 43 year old man regularly outplayed 20-somethings and 30-somethings and didn't practice because he was old and exhausted and needed to rest for games.

As for Tkachuk...when has he been a leader? I haven't seen it personally. I don't dislike like a laches would, but I've never called him a leader.

Fletch is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 09:54 PM
  #12
Yizee*
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 419
vCash: 500
outplay

Messier outplayed nobody - he was given no rules but the rest of them had to backcheck and do defensive stuff - but Messier had no rules he was allowed to just float around waiting for the puck to be moved to him so he can shoot it - he was always missing defense assignments and I never once saw him lead this team with anything - he is crap and is too old to do anything - and we are talking about leadership - if you skip practice that is not leadership - and if he's such a great leader how come the rest of the teammates didnt play hard enough?

Yizee* is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 09:57 PM
  #13
Firefly
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mohawk Valley
Country: Poland
Posts: 3,464
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Firefly Send a message via Skype™ to Firefly
Sounds to me like Rodent's just heard enough on the subject of "inspiring Jagr" and decided to have at it. The straw that broke the camel's back, if you will.

Firefly is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 10:06 PM
  #14
Edge
Registered User
 
Edge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sin City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yizee
Messier outplayed nobody - he was given no rules but the rest of them had to backcheck and do defensive stuff - but Messier had no rules he was allowed to just float around waiting for the puck to be moved to him so he can shoot it - he was always missing defense assignments and I never once saw him lead this team with anything - he is crap and is too old to do anything - and we are talking about leadership - if you skip practice that is not leadership - and if he's such a great leader how come the rest of the teammates didnt play hard enough?
Gee and I thought school was back in session?

We've had this argument a million times. Either you don't agree or you have the reading ability of a potato.

Either way it's not worth it at this point.

Edge is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 10:19 PM
  #15
majicpixie
Registered User
 
majicpixie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: The Tardis
Country: United States
Posts: 1,571
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to majicpixie Send a message via AIM to majicpixie Send a message via MSN to majicpixie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotiu22
Geez, the guy just gave his opinion, no need to fricken crusify him.
I agree, that was uncalled for. When will the nastiness die down on this forum?

majicpixie is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 10:25 PM
  #16
Edge
Registered User
 
Edge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sin City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by majicpixie
I agree, that was uncalled for. When will the nastiness die down on this forum?
Probably right after the reading comprehension goes up

Edge is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 11:01 PM
  #17
NYR469
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancid
Now that Messier is gone, we need a new veteran locker room presence....

I think we should get Ron Francis. He's played with Jagr could motivate him, as well as act as a leader for the kids and wear the C

Lundmark- Francis- Jagr
Wiseman- Nylander- Balej
Murray- Holik- Ortmeyer
Giroux- Moore- Dawes/Helminen/Betts
if you think that the rangers are going to sign a 40+ year old not named mark messier then you need to put down the crackpipe

NYR469 is offline  
Old
09-11-2004, 11:37 PM
  #18
Edge
Registered User
 
Edge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sin City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,196
vCash: 500
Ideally a guy like Tom Fitzgerald was a guy i wouldnt mind signing to a one or two year deal.

Edge is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 08:34 AM
  #19
Dantes19
Registered User
 
Dantes19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 1,355
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by majicpixie
I agree, that was uncalled for. When will the nastiness die down on this forum?
I really didnt think he was nasty with him at all. Rodent just called the guy out on a couple of pretty ridiculuous assumptions. I've seen much much worse in terms of personal attacks on this board. At least Rodent took the time to back up his opinions with some rationale, whereas the first poster just made a blanket assumption...

Dantes19 is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 11:14 AM
  #20
Ocelot
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Ontario, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 394
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancid
Now that Messier is gone, we need a new veteran locker room presence....

I think we should get Ron Francis. He's played with Jagr could motivate him, as well as act as a leader for the kids and wear the C

Lundmark- Francis- Jagr
Wiseman- Nylander- Balej
Murray- Holik- Ortmeyer
Giroux- Moore- Dawes/Helminen/Betts
Thats that last thing the Rangers need. Why would he even want to come hear? He's 42 years old. He would not want to come to a team that is rebuilding.

Ocelot is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 12:04 PM
  #21
Edge
Registered User
 
Edge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sin City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,196
vCash: 500
In the hall stop trying to be everyone's Adam Graves.

Some people have it coming.

Edge is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 03:32 PM
  #22
NYFAN
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 361
vCash: 500
Knowing that poster as I do from another site, I can tell you he doesn't stop with his anti Messier rants. Granted the guy can't perform at the same level he used to , but who can at 42 years of age. As for Rodents reply, I think he was pretty gentle compared to some posters on alot of these boards. Besides when you consistently post obviously silly comments sometimes you need a good verbal spar to wake you up. How could any die hard Ranger fan actually want to sign Ron Francis. We are moving toward youth in a big way. He would do nothing but take away a spot from a younger player, and increase the average age of the roster.

NYFAN is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 05:17 PM
  #23
Dantes19
Registered User
 
Dantes19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 1,355
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by barnaby63
This point was already made. There was no reason for you to add your 2 cents into the subject about Rodent, especially with your snide remarks about his life and website.

Unless you have a better website with better connections than Rodent, dont say nothing.
amen....

Dantes19 is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 06:23 PM
  #24
barnaby63
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Long Island
Posts: 860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by little a from da bx
ok i will, all it takes is wait a day or 2 and make a new name, i could care less trust me .
Can anyone understand what this clown just wrote?

barnaby63 is offline  
Old
09-12-2004, 07:07 PM
  #25
Levitate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 21,533
vCash: 500
heh, i think BB bickering is some sort of cosmic law...it just has to occur, it's impossible if it doesn't.

Levitate is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:05 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.