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Around the NHL 2011-12: Part II - Where'd You Get These Guys From, Ray? Mexico?

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Old
11-29-2011, 12:13 AM
  #76
UnderratedBrooks44
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That would be stupid on the part of the Ducks. They're just not a great team up and down the roster. They need to improve the team not get rid of a budding star.

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11-29-2011, 12:15 AM
  #77
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Staal would probably be one of them and I wouldn't want to risk losing him for Ryan.

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Old
11-29-2011, 12:18 AM
  #78
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Just for fun:

Martin + Jeffrey + 1st + Prospect (Beau Bennett is from California)

We did get Kunitz + Tangradi from Anaheim for Whitney.

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Old
11-29-2011, 12:21 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Big McLargehuge View Post
I don't think Dan Bylsma was on any Penguins fans' wishlist for replacing Therrien.

Finding the right coach is insanely hard, but this is a league where there's only a couple coaches that have such a high reputation that they're basically guaranteed a job somewhere...sometimes a change for change's sake is for the best. It sure as hell has less downside than trading a stud 24 year-old power forward does. Randy Carlyle is going to be a hell of a lot easier to replace than Bobby Ryan is going to be.

Carlyle won't be unemployed for long, but it's not exactly unheard of for a coach's message to start to become worn out when he's been with a team for a while. NHL teams go through coaches like tissues and Carlyle has coached every single post-lockout game for the Ducks...that's nearly 600 games with the playoffs included.
I know that, but having one great line is not going to get Anaheim anywhere regardless of the coach.

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Old
11-29-2011, 12:22 AM
  #80
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Paul Martin has a NTC. He wouldn't want to go to Anaheim this year.

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Old
11-29-2011, 12:30 AM
  #81
mpp9
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Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
That would be stupid on the part of the Ducks. They're just not a great team up and down the roster. They need to improve the team not get rid of a budding star.
They've needed a proper #2C for awhile. They're not going to get a player of Staal's caliber with prospects and picks. Nor are they going to get a top pairing D-man.

Getzlaf-Perry
Staal-Selanne

Staal's a 70 pt center in that situation. And making Anaheim a hell of alot more competitive against the offensive powerhouses in the west.

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11-29-2011, 12:44 AM
  #82
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They'd want too much.

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Old
11-29-2011, 12:57 AM
  #83
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Anaheim would have to add to make me even consider it. There is zero reason to break up a team that is doing this well and seems this complete without a vast overpay. Staal for Ryan is not that, and would disrupt this team and how it is built.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:05 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theicebox View Post
Just for fun:

Martin + Jeffrey + 1st + Prospect (Beau Bennett is from California)

We did get Kunitz + Tangradi from Anaheim for Whitney.
Martin has a NTC which he'd enforce, Jeffrey's value is severely weakened by the fact that he's barely been healthy in the calender year, that 1st rounder is going to be a very late 1st rounder, and...well Bennett could interest them, but certainly not as a centerpiece.

Really any trade negotiations would begin and end around Jordan Staal...and, to be completely honest, I'd rather have the 3 line depth than two absurd first lines...especially with Staal in the midst of a breakout season and the fact that it would almost certainly be Staal + for Ryan and not just Staal. I'd rather have Staal on our third line and Beau Bennett in the prospect pool than Bobby Ryan on the first line. I just don't see the Ducks as being too interested in trading a 24 year-old former 2nd overall power forward stud for a bunch of players...Ryan's value is huge and they can definitely get some team to offer up a couple of young big ticket names...we really can't offer that without blowing up the core. If Anaheim really is shopping him we should definitely inquire...but I really doubt they're doing so, and if they are I imagine they're only trying to see what the high water mark is for Ryan...and that would be something hard for us to reach without moving someone on this team that none of us want to see moved.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:14 AM
  #85
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I know that, but having one great line is not going to get Anaheim anywhere regardless of the coach.
And I agree with that, but Anaheim is playing well below the caliber of team that roster says they should be, even if they are just a one line team. 2 wins in 18 games is inexcusable, even for a no line team.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:21 AM
  #86
UnderratedBrooks44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
They've needed a proper #2C for awhile. They're not going to get a player of Staal's caliber with prospects and picks. Nor are they going to get a top pairing D-man.

Getzlaf-Perry
Staal-Selanne

Staal's a 70 pt center in that situation. And making Anaheim a hell of alot more competitive against the offensive powerhouses in the west.
Staal has nothing to do with it and Selanne isn't going to be around much longer, though I do think Staal could be a 70 point player anyways.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:23 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
Staal has nothing to do with it and Selanne isn't going to be around much longer, though I do think Staal could be a 70 point player anyways.
Anaheim is not going very far in the postseason without a proper #2C. Their fans like to talk up RPG's ability to control play in the offensive zone against a team's top line. Never understood why you'd want that matchup. Staal can take on more defensive responsibilities and let their top line wreck havoc offensively.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:29 AM
  #88
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Anaheim is not going very far in the postseason without a proper #2C. Their fans like to talk up RPG's ability to control play in the offensive zone against a team's top line. Never understood why you'd want that matchup. Staal can take on more defensive responsibilities and let their top line wreck havoc offensively.
Staal, once again, for the 100 billionth time, isn't going to be traded.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:30 AM
  #89
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Bobby Ryan is one of my favorite non-Pens, and I think he's just about as good a winger as we could possibly get to play with Crosby. Wish it was a possibility.

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11-29-2011, 01:44 AM
  #90
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A year ago, I'd have driven Staal to the airport to make a trade for Ryan. I'd still probably make the trade this year, but I'd have to pause for a Hell of a lot longer.

It just comes down to what you think would make this team more dangerous; Sid and Geno with legit wingers (Kunitz - Crosby - Ryan, Sullivan - Malkin - Neal) or the 3C model. I think it's close, but Crosby with a guy like Ryan would be absolutely ridiculous.

It won't happen though. Shero's never trading Staal, and I don't think the Ducks will want Martin+ for Ryan.

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Old
11-29-2011, 01:45 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by PTWarrior66 View Post
Staal, once again, for the 100 billionth time, isn't going to be traded.
It's not likely, but it's not outside the realm of possibility either. Bobby Ryan is no slouch. IMO Shero would not deal Staal + for Ryan. I can't see the Pens improving substantially enough to make Staal expendable.

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Old
11-29-2011, 02:07 AM
  #92
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Ryan on Sid's RW would be a dream. Alas like most of you, I have no desire to part with Staal, which is what it would take. If Jeffrey wouldn't have gotten hurt last year, he might have been able to lock down that 3rd C spot in training camp (he was playing really well before the injury lest we forget) and maybe the option to trade Staal for Ryan might have been possible with DJ's emergence. Unfortunately that didn't work out but hey, I have no problem keeping Staal.

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Old
11-29-2011, 02:14 AM
  #93
mpp9
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Originally Posted by PTWarrior66 View Post
Staal, once again, for the 100 billionth time, isn't going to be traded.
This is a discussion board. Anything is possible. Staal is too important to our team but from a value standpoint, it's be doable.

Ryan's a possible 100 pt player on this team with 1st unit PP time.

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Old
11-29-2011, 05:22 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theicebox View Post
Just for fun:

Martin + Jeffrey + 1st + Prospect (Beau Bennett is from California)

We did get Kunitz + Tangradi from Anaheim for Whitney.
I love this very much. Doubt it would happen though.

So I'd do Staal + Bennett for Ryan + their lower prospect than Bennett.

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Old
11-29-2011, 05:43 AM
  #95
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I think the Pens should offer Martin and Jeffrey for Ryan.

Ducks are getting two first names for the price of one.

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Old
11-29-2011, 06:17 AM
  #96
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So many problems with trading Martin though. He has a NTC and it was rumored he picked the Pens over the Kings because he didn't want to move all the way out west. I really doubt he'd waive it to move out there now.

I also wonder if it would hurt Shero's reputation with future free agents if he trades a guy less than a season and a half after giving him a big deal. Especially a guy like Martin that gave up more money elsewhere to sign with the team.

I also don't consider Engelland, Niskanen or Lovejoy top 4 D-Men. Niskanen has played like one and I do love Engelland's game, but they could still get exposed big time if they have to play top 4 minutes all year and in the playoffs. I know we could get a rental top 4 D-Man if we decide to move Martin, but we could keep our defense together and get a rental winger even cheaper. I think that's more likely.

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Old
11-29-2011, 07:59 AM
  #97
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Ryan would be a great fit on this team, not sure what would be going the other way but Shero likes to deal with the Ducks

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Old
11-29-2011, 09:03 AM
  #98
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Yeah, Martin would never waive his NTC to go to Anaheim.

We just don't have the pieces to get it done unless we let them essentially make their own package with our prospects.

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Old
11-29-2011, 09:31 AM
  #99
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why on earth would we tinker with what we got?
Bobby Ryan would be awesome, however Staal is as or more valuable then Ryan. Selke candiate Centers who can pot 30 goals are worth more on the market than guys who put up 35g/35a.

It's not like Ryan is doing this on his own, he's on a line with a 50 goal scorer in Perry, and Gretzlaf is not exactly a slouch at center.

Staal is on a line with Cooke and Kennedy for most of his career, he doesn't get #1 PP time. He is great at killing penalties and is relied on to shut down the other teams top line, he's doing that and on his way to 30G this year.

Why on earth would we trade that for Bobby Ryan, I would want Bobby Ryan + for Jordan Staal.

We are leading the league in points right now, it's fun to say what if, but unless RS gets an offer he can't refuse he won't do anything right now.

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Old
11-29-2011, 09:34 AM
  #100
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Attaining Ryan isn't convenient, nor is it a necessity. This roster needs adjustments, not a significant change.

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