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How many games for Pacioretty? [UPDATE: 3-game suspension]

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Old
11-28-2011, 03:38 PM
  #301
LyleOdelein
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's sad that fans can't tell if a player will be suspended or not, or for how much.
Great job for the new sheriff...

As for the hit, I think it should be suspended. If it were Staal hitting PK or Gorges like this, then everybody here would ask for a suspension. I don't see why it should be different when it's our players.

Whether Malone, Lucic or Chara were suspended or not is irrelevant. I want to see consistency, so if they suspend MaxPac, then they better follow the same direction for every darn player and hit.
If they're gonna suspend MaxPac only to let Lucic KO someone else tomorrow, then yea, I'll be pissed big time.
Maybe that hypothetical applies to some people, but I don't buy that argument from my perspective.

If Staal hit Subban like this, I would be saying exactly the same things I'm saying right now. I think this is a play that falls right on the borderline with regards to the new standards that are being applied.

I'm just interested to see what the decision is and how it is justified.

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11-28-2011, 03:40 PM
  #302
The Doors
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There shouldn't be a suspension. Letang comes across the middle, looks and sees Pacioretty, and decides to shoot anyways. If he keeps carrying the puck, his head would be more upright and Pacioretty would have got home shoulder to chest. It's not his fault that the player changed what he was doing, which was the reasoning behind the Malone non-suspension, right?

How can you suspend Pacioretty after all of the things that happen in the league that go unpunished? If youre going to suspend one, suspend them all.

The NHL is like a woman. It acts completely irrational, makes no sense in its decision making half of the time, and it can really piss us off... yet, we love it anyways.

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11-28-2011, 03:48 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by JC93 View Post
There shouldn't be a suspension. Letang comes across the middle, looks and sees Pacioretty, and decides to shoot anyways. If he keeps carrying the puck, his head would be more upright and Pacioretty would have got home shoulder to chest. It's not his fault that the player changed what he was doing, which was the reasoning behind the Malone non-suspension, right?

How can you suspend Pacioretty after all of the things that happen in the league that go unpunished? If youre going to suspend one, suspend them all.

The NHL is like a woman. It acts completely irrational, makes no sense in its decision making half of the time, and it can really piss us off... yet, we love it anyways.
The first paragraph you wrote is exactly, word for word, what i was going to write. It's only a blindside hit because Letang accepted the fact that he would get hit. It's on him, imo.

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11-28-2011, 03:51 PM
  #304
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The problem is that BS (fill in your own joke here) is trying to give the perception of consistency in whether a hit is a suspendable action or not.

The issues arise when these decisions are based on millimeters of difference in contact location, fractions of seconds of reaction time, subtle distinctions of what the hit player does and so on. The minutae are so small in some cases as to be indistinguishable between a legal and illegal hit.

In fact, a few times already this season, hits that appear to be virtually identical to ones where suspension occured were deemed legal (unsuspendable). This creates a very large gray area of intersection between a "tough hockey play" and a suspendable offense. In these cases, there will inevitably be outcries of bias or collusion, because the judgement criteria are far too subjective.


The fog becomes even thicker, when a decision to suspend, or not, is derived by whether a particular player admits his intent. This takes some of the decisions made from the arcane to absurd.

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Old
11-28-2011, 03:57 PM
  #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by groovejuice View Post
The fog becomes even thicker, when a decision to suspend, or not, is derived by whether a particular player admits his intent. This takes some of the decisions made from the arcane to absurd.
I still can't quite understand how the 'intent to injure' thingy works... Obviously, in 99% of cases, a player will not admit his wrongdoing or that he wanted to destroy another player... It's simply impossible to know with a 100% certainty. In my opinion, it's useless!

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11-28-2011, 04:03 PM
  #306
Ceux de Montreal
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On devrait apprendre vers 19h si Max Pacioretty sera suspendu ou non par la LNH. Nous vous l'annoncerons à #Hockey360 en début d'émission.

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@fritz114
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#Habs Pacioretty has been suspended. I think he will get 3 games for hit on Letang. Nothing announced till 7ET.

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11-28-2011, 04:06 PM
  #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's sad that fans can't tell if a player will be suspended or not, or for how much.
Great job for the new sheriff...

As for the hit, I think it should be suspended. If it were Staal hitting PK or Gorges like this, then everybody here would ask for a suspension. I don't see why it should be different when it's our players.

Whether Malone, Lucic or Chara were suspended or not is irrelevant. I want to see consistency, so if they suspend MaxPac, then they better follow the same direction for every darn player and hit.
If they're gonna suspend MaxPac only to let Lucic KO someone else tomorrow, then yea, I'll be pissed big time.
If you want to see consistency then you should not want a suspension because that is what has happened up until now. If Patches gets a suspension that would be the first and i don't want him to be a trend setter...especially knowing that Lucic got a free run at Miller, Malone got a free Shot at Campoli when we certainly could have used him and just about anybody not wearing a Habs jersey can plead innocence and are absolved.

Patches should get nothing but it looks more and more like he will be getting something. A very tough pill to swallow considering the league doing absolutely nothing when Chara did his thing. The argument that every teams best player always has leeway (ala Malone) is BS because Patches is our best so far this season and he looks to be getting something tonight.

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11-28-2011, 04:08 PM
  #308
LyleOdelein
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceux de Montreal View Post
On devrait apprendre vers 19h si Max Pacioretty sera suspendu ou non par la LNH. Nous vous l'annoncerons à #Hockey360 en début d'émission.

----


@fritz114
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#Habs Pacioretty has been suspended. I think he will get 3 games for hit on Letang. Nothing announced till 7ET.
An hour ago that guy posted something about how Pacioretty is a hypocrite and how there should be an 11 month investigation launched.

Random Twitter douchers do not make reliable sources.

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Old
11-28-2011, 04:15 PM
  #309
Ozymandias
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My guess is that'll they suspend him 1 game (no priors) even if he doesn't deserve, just so they can set a prior in his case and can suspend the **** out of him the next time he makes a faux-pas.

Same reason they didn't give Chara a suspension on the many times he could've earned one, just so he doesn't get a prior, so that he can never be taken out more than 1 or 2 games when he'll actually tear someone's head off.

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11-28-2011, 04:20 PM
  #310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceux de Montreal View Post
On devrait apprendre vers 19h si Max Pacioretty sera suspendu ou non par la LNH. Nous vous l'annoncerons à #Hockey360 en début d'émission.

----


@fritz114
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#Habs Pacioretty has been suspended. I think he will get 3 games for hit on Letang. Nothing announced till 7ET.

Well if there's anyone I'll trust for NHL news, its the first year play-by-play announcer for a college team. I'm sure he has the ins with all the NHL top execs.

Face it, we aren't hearing anything until they land. I think the precedents say he shouldn't be suspended (Campoli, among others), but the behavior today from Shanahan makes me think there is a suspension coming. If it was good news they would just say so, wouldn't they?

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11-28-2011, 04:23 PM
  #311
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Originally Posted by Kue View Post
If it was good news they would just say so, wouldn't they?
That's what I'm thinking... Would be lol-worthy if he actually gets 0 games... Trolling the fans and media!

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11-28-2011, 04:32 PM
  #312
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Originally Posted by PhysicX View Post
That's what I'm thinking... Would be lol-worthy if he actually gets 0 games... Trolling the fans and media!
That would be hilarious. But maybe there are legit reasons they are holding it back, even if it is zero games? Possibly PG had requested the team to be the first to know? The media can be crazy, and hours with no response from the team (even for zero games) would allow too much speculation to get out? Maybe Shanahan wants to tell PG and/or Max something in regards to the hit before the media knows?

I really have no clue what will happen.

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Old
11-28-2011, 04:33 PM
  #313
Mats NAslund
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Originally Posted by Protest the Hero View Post
I personally have no problem with this hit, classic cutting across the middle hit, but the NHL wants to get rid of it, so I definitely expect a suspension, and they'd probably be hypocrites if they didn't suspend him. Two games.
Then how do you explain Malone not getting suspended for basically the same hit on Campoli?

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11-28-2011, 04:51 PM
  #314
Andy
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I have no faith in this league.

Pacioretty should get 1-2 games, but knowing this league he'll either get none or 4-5 games.

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11-28-2011, 04:52 PM
  #315
Prendan Brust
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Originally Posted by Mats NAslund View Post
Then how do you explain Malone not getting suspended for basically the same hit on Campoli?
north south hit. Pac's hit wasnt.

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11-28-2011, 04:52 PM
  #316
Andy
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Originally Posted by Mats NAslund View Post
Then how do you explain Malone not getting suspended for basically the same hit on Campoli?
Because it wasn't the same hit at all.

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11-28-2011, 04:54 PM
  #317
Prendan Brust
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My prediction: 2 games.

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Old
11-28-2011, 05:01 PM
  #318
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Because it wasn't the same hit at all.
Are they still make a distinction of north-south and east-west type of hits? In both the Campoli and Letang hits, I don't think they are aware that they are about to be hit.

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11-28-2011, 05:01 PM
  #319
LyleOdelein
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Originally Posted by Harmony View Post
north south hit. Pac's hit wasnt.
The direction of contact no longer has any relevance to rule 48 and supplementary discipline.

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11-28-2011, 05:02 PM
  #320
Alaix
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Just heard that the decision on Max Pacioretty will come when Habs plane lands in Anaheim and Pierre Gauthier speaks with Shanahan.

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11-28-2011, 05:12 PM
  #321
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I think if they're waiting for the Habs to land to announce the decision it probably means Pacioretty is getting a suspension.. I wouldn't even try to guess the number of games since the NHL is still way too inconsistent when dealing with disciplinary matters.. It seems adding Shanahan hasn't fixed a thing since he's just as inconsistent as what that clown Campbell was..

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11-28-2011, 05:13 PM
  #322
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NHL should be careful before passing harsh judgment.

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11-28-2011, 05:19 PM
  #323
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
I have no faith in this league.
i'm with you.

while i think shanahan is a much better alternative than campbell, i do believe he's been quite inconsistent mostly due newby enthusiasm and making his mark, characterized by his wide range of punishment he's handed out. while i do realize its a feeling out process, trying to establish some sort of standardization and norms, its just too unpredictable for my liking.

if you look at a player's history, his conduct in that specific game and general conduct throughout the season, you can infer his basal attitude.

boston for example, you always see chara and lucic taking extra liberties after the whistle, cheap shots, punching someone in the face etc. and when it comes done review with disciplinary authorities, they play innocent and sell a great story. don't tell me lucic had no idea miller was there, lol.

letang was aware max was coming in. he looked up and saw him. he has the responsibility to protect himself. they used that arguement on campoli/malone. max isn't a malicious player.

zero games, imo.

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11-28-2011, 05:23 PM
  #324
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by Alaix View Post
renhockey Renaud P Lavoie
Just heard that the decision on Max Pacioretty will come when Habs plane lands in Anaheim and Pierre Gauthier speaks with Shanahan.
6:50 Eastern

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Old
11-28-2011, 05:29 PM
  #325
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Because it wasn't the same hit at all.
Your right in the Malone game he was getting penalties left and right for his dirty play. Guy was psycho because both White and Moen were injured and he was taking liberties against Hab players but Shanny never bothered to look at this otherwise Malone should of received a suspension.
Knowing Bettman he probably called Shannahan and told him to suspend Max just because if the ****-storm Hab fans caused for him last year

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