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Old
11-27-2011, 02:16 PM
  #51
nEaLB4ZoD
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If this is at all true, then I think we have to trade him. If the team is going to win it all they need all the leaders to be 100% and not "not mind if they were traded."

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11-27-2011, 02:17 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TehDoak View Post
Yawn

Anytime you have a starter out/struggling and a backup playing well, these will creep up.

Up until Thomas won the conn smythe, all it took was Rask winning a start for the rumor mills to start churning.

If Enroth continues to play well AND Miller comes to Regier and says he wants to move some place to be closer to his wife, ok, let's look at potential trades. And in the offseason.

Trading a 6 million dollar goalie isn't something you do in season. And if they trade him, we are looking at the Luongo return:

A salary dump (Bertuzzi), a decent asset (Allen), and a veteran goalie (Auld)

The only potential trading partner I see that could work isn't a west coast team, but I think Miller would gladly accept a trade to is Chicago.

Something like Crawford+Hjalmarsson for Miller+ Leopold gives Buffalo some immediate cap relief, gives Buffalo a good veteran netminder to platoon with Enroth, and gives us the that OTHER stay at home d-man we need in the top 4.

Miller won't accept a trade for Phoenix.
Colorado just paid through the nose for Varalamov.
SJ, LA, and Anaheim have been covered as to their situations.

But again, this will always happen with a high profile goalie+ backup playing well. The only fire we can expect to see from this smoke is a writer trying to get some attention.
Excellent analysis. Miller is not going to get us some amazing return. He's on the wrong side of 30 now, coming off a concussion, and probably closer to top 10 than top 5 for NHL goalies these days with a few more years of big pay checks due. If we have to lose him, and I don't necessarily want to, than I'd be happy with a top-4 defensemen who's stay at home and a center prospect plus a vet salary dump. Perfectly ok with me.

Jame brought up last season the marginal difference between elite goalies and good goalies in the NHL these days and how a team may be better off investing in the forwards and defense rather than from the net outward. I think that's a legitimate theory.

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Old
11-27-2011, 02:39 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buffalowing88 View Post
Excellent analysis. Miller is not going to get us some amazing return. He's on the wrong side of 30 now, coming off a concussion, and probably closer to top 10 than top 5 for NHL goalies these days with a few more years of big pay checks due. If we have to lose him, and I don't necessarily want to, than I'd be happy with a top-4 defensemen who's stay at home and a center prospect plus a vet salary dump. Perfectly ok with me.

Jame brought up last season the marginal difference between elite goalies and good goalies in the NHL these days and how a team may be better off investing in the forwards and defense rather than from the net outward. I think that's a legitimate theory.
The other side of thirty is way overused and doesn't apply to goalies as much.

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11-27-2011, 02:49 PM
  #54
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Hard to get excited about trading the closest thing we have to world-class talent. New wife or not, the guy signed a long-term deal with the previous ownership - I can't see him wanting to jump ship now that Pegula is running the show and committed to winning.

Not only that, but as has been mentioned, the return would most likely be mediocre at best - we're not going to fix the center problem by moving Miller. So unless he really wants out (to the point where staying here would negatively impact his play and the room), we almost certainly get worse in any realistic deal.

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Old
11-27-2011, 02:53 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by siKmoNStir View Post
The other side of thirty is way overused and doesn't apply to goalies as much.
Agreed in terms of goalies getting better with age normally, but how often do you see veteran goalies bringing in a big return from a trade? Hell, Hasek got Buffalo all of Kozlov and a first round pick. He was 5 years older than Miller by than, but the point remains that goalies don't net a good return unless their ceiling hasn't been reached.

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11-27-2011, 03:13 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by buffalowing88 View Post
Agreed in terms of goalies getting better with age normally, but how often do you see veteran goalies bringing in a big return from a trade? Hell, Hasek got Buffalo all of Kozlov and a first round pick. He was 5 years older than Miller by than, but the point remains that goalies don't net a good return unless their ceiling hasn't been reached.
Hasek was 36 when he was traded. If he were traded at 31 which Miller is now, he would have brought a Kings Ransom. Not to compare Miller to Hasek but see what I'm getting at.

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11-27-2011, 03:32 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
No, he did not. He had concrete information about Pegula before anyone else. He wasn't speculating then. He is now.

Read what was written. That's not someone who has facts that Miller wants out. That's someone speculating that Miller wants out, and saying he wants to be out west because of his wife.

Just because he got one thing right once doesn't mean people should ******* the guy and instantly believe everything he says in the future.
Kind of makes sense that a guy would want to see his wife often.....

I say let's wait to see if Eklund breaks this report also....If he does then we all know it won't happen, and we can go back to business as usual.

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Old
11-27-2011, 03:38 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
More baseless innuendo from garbage sportwriters whoring for pageviews.

Everyone KNEW Miller wanted to play in Detroit before he signed his extension. Now everyone KNOWS he wants to be out west because of his wife.

Quick, how many Sabres players are married or dating someone who doesn't live in town? Do all those players want out too?

BS. All of it.
I have a few points.

First, in response to the above quote, I question whether anyone is saying that they KNOW something about Miller's thoughts. The Edmonton writer wrote that he HEARD something about Miller, and given the writer's history, it seems fair to take him at his word. Whether what he heard is true is another matter, but the fact remains it's easier to assume he actually heard it than it is to assume he made it up.

Second, there is a little smoke here independent of the rumor. It's not like the team actually stuck up for Miller the night he got run, and I have to say I find it very interesting that Miller's concussion symptoms prevented him from playing only after the second period, by which time it was abundantly clear that nobody in blue and gold intended to exact retribution for the hit on Miller. Just sayin'. Moreover, for those here who have been or are married, I think it's safe to say that the trans-continental commute is probably not an ideal way to start a marriage. I won't even touch the possibility that Miller's wife, a Hollywood actress, prefers to winter in LA (nice weather, auditions, etc.) rather than Buffalo (lousy weather, no auditions, also my home and a place I love dearly for those upset about my weather comment) because that issue is something relative to which I have no knowledge or insight.

Third, I saw a lot of conjecture about trading Miller to a Cali or southwest team. All things being equal, if Miller has to go it would be nice to ship him to a Cali team out of consideration for what he's done here. If, however, he has to go and the best offer is from a team to which his contract permits a trade and which is not in Cali or SW, that's where he's going. Nothing against Miller, but he's an asset, and if we're going to move him, we have to maximize our return, irrespective of where he wants (or doesn't want) to go. So, teams other than the Ducks, Kings, Sharks, Coyotes, and Avalanche are in play.

Fourth, Chicago is kind of a cosmopolitan place with a direct flight to LA. I wonder if they have anyone who might pique our interest? Just a thought.


Last edited by SabresFan79: 11-27-2011 at 03:52 PM.
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Old
11-27-2011, 03:43 PM
  #59
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Package miller in a deal to COL for Stastny ...? hmmm

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Old
11-27-2011, 04:08 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockFlagAndEagle View Post
Even if it was true (which I don't think) what could we really get for Miller? People act like we could get a stud centre, but goalies don't really give that great of a return these days.
You probably could get a ton for him if you wait it out and a #1 goalie goes down or a team is on the cusp of making the playoffs but lacks a true #1 goalie.

With saying that, I am not advocating trading Ryan Miller.

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11-27-2011, 04:46 PM
  #61
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I think one of the big things to remember here is that we don't have any definitive evidence that Miller does want out. Nor do we have any definitive evidence that he's ever requested a trade or told management that he'd be open to a trade. Rather, as another poster pointed out, all that we know is that Matheson has heard that Miller would be open to accepting a trade, preferably to one of the California-based teams.

The obvious question: From whom did Matheson hear that? From years of reading these types of articles, these writers almost always state generally from whom they've heard such a rumor if they believe it would add credibility to their rumor--i.e., "from a Western Conference GM" or "source inside the organization," or "someone close to the organization." Here, Matheson did not do that, which suggests to me that he didn't hear it from anyone he believed to be prominent enough to add credibility to the published rumor, or it came to him through too many levels of hearsay to lend it much credence. Also, consider where this tidbit was: buried beneath many news bits that would be considered far less newsworthy than one of the most recognized goaltenders in the league potentially wanting out of his current organization.

My guess, and it's only a guess, is that Matheson heard this from a couple people who have some limited familarity with Miller, and are making inferences based on his wife's location, his recent tiffs with the media, and the team's repeated failure to defend their goaltender when he's been ran. Frankly, I don't think Matheson is lending it all that much credence, either, and he made sure to note his built-in out: the goaltending situations of the California teams--"All I said was that he'd accept a deal there, but the California teams just didn't really need him given their current goaltending situations, and the whole situation just blew over."

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Old
11-27-2011, 05:05 PM
  #62
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Let's be honest....it wouldn't be unprecedented.

Wayne Gretzky-Janet Jones........traded.

Mike Fisher-Carrie Underwood.......traded.

Ryan Miller?

I guess we'll see.

Though we will probably never know the driving force behind either the Gretzky or Fisher trades the rumors were certainly out there that they were driven by the spouses in their lives.

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Old
11-27-2011, 06:00 PM
  #63
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I've said before that if we can get a fair compensation in return for a trade, no one should be untouchable regardless of their status such as Miller.

If we can bring in some guys to help the team out and fulfill our needs, make it happen.

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Old
11-27-2011, 06:07 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by sba View Post
This is the same writer who first mentioned anything about Pegula buying the team. Probably worth mentioning.
I don't think that automatically gives this opinion piece merit.
(and by the way, I would dispute that point too that he broke that story).

Let's stop clicking on his story. I think its well known among the internet hockey writing community that fake rumors about Buffalo players generate a great deal of page (and ad!) views and site traffic. Its the same reason that E and (others) keep making up rumors about Buffalo players.

anyway, give me a quote, and as long as there's no quote (as in Bucky's recent piece about a little bird making stuff up) I'll assume the writer is full of ****.

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Old
11-27-2011, 07:02 PM
  #65
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I file this under "I'll believe it when I see it".

So many reporters and posters want to be right. Or be the one that says "see I told you". Or be the one that was the first before anyone else gets the chance to find out.

I, personally don't care a fig about those things. I just require it to be 100% true before spewing it out your pie hole, or pounding your keyboard as fast as possible to disseminate the story.

To me, and maybe others, rumors are as worthy as a waterlogged cellphone.

So, I'll believe it when I see it.

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Old
11-27-2011, 07:03 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronin View Post
I don't think that automatically gives this opinion piece merit.
(and by the way, I would dispute that point too that he broke that story).

Let's stop clicking on his story. I think its well known among the internet hockey writing community that fake rumors about Buffalo players generate a great deal of page (and ad!) views and site traffic. Its the same reason that E and (others) keep making up rumors about Buffalo players.

anyway, give me a quote, and as long as there's no quote (as in Bucky's recent piece about a little bird making stuff up) I'll assume the writer is full of ****.
What opinion piece is at issue? As best I recall, the writer in question indicated that he HEARD something. In other words, the writer is relating a fact.

I genuinely appreciate what I perceive to be your view that the absence of a source makes a report such as that at issue less credible, but if newspapers wouldn't print information from unnamed sources, Richard Nixon would have finished two terms as President of the United States. Besides, I really don't think an Edmonton newspaper would "make something up" to drive hits in Buffalo. I'll believe that the writer accurately related what he heard, but will not pass judgment on whether the information related to the writer is accurate.

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11-27-2011, 07:08 PM
  #67
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since everyone else is doing it:

Miller and Roy
for
Getzlaf and Hiller

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11-27-2011, 07:12 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
since everyone else is doing it:

Miller and Roy
for
Getzlaf and Hiller
Of course we do this, Anaheim on the other hand...

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11-27-2011, 07:30 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by SabresFan79 View Post
Third, I saw a lot of conjecture about trading Miller to a Cali or southwest team. All things being equal, if Miller has to go it would be nice to ship him to a Cali team out of consideration for what he's done here. If, however, he has to go and the best offer is from a team to which his contract permits a trade and which is not in Cali or SW, that's where he's going. Nothing against Miller, but he's an asset, and if we're going to move him, we have to maximize our return, irrespective of where he wants (or doesn't want) to go. So, teams other than the Ducks, Kings, Sharks, Coyotes, and Avalanche are in play.

Fourth, Chicago is kind of a cosmopolitan place with a direct flight to LA. I wonder if they have anyone who might pique our interest? Just a thought.
what has he done here (outside of being here) that makes consideration even remotely necessary?

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11-27-2011, 07:40 PM
  #70
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Miller and ? for Niemi and Pavelski

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11-27-2011, 07:47 PM
  #71
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Miller and ? for Niemi and Pavelski
San Jose would have no reason to do that. Niemi is terrific - maybe just as good as Miller, but much cheaper - and Pavelski keeps getting better and better.

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11-27-2011, 07:47 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by 5 Minute Major View Post
Let's be honest....it wouldn't be unprecedented.

Wayne Gretzky-Janet Jones........traded.

Mike Fisher-Carrie Underwood.......traded.

Ryan Miller?

I guess we'll see.

Though we will probably never know the driving force behind either the Gretzky or Fisher trades the rumors were certainly out there that they were driven by the spouses in their lives.
Let's not forget about Mr. Lauren Pronger and his wife Chrissy. Ladies and "family" call the shots - even in this profession - more than we think.

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Old
11-27-2011, 08:19 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
what has he done here (outside of being here) that makes consideration even remotely necessary?
Seriously? His on-ice and off-ice work speaks for itself. I made the point that he's an asset, and as such he doesn't call the shots as to where he goes, but, as I said, if all things are equal, it behooves the organization to do its best to take care of a guy like this. It's good business, and makes the organization more attractive to prospective employees in the future.

By the way, all of this is coming from a guy who thinks they should seriously consider moving him as soon as he's healthy.

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11-27-2011, 08:33 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by SabresFan79 View Post
Seriously? His on-ice and off-ice work speaks for itself. I made the point that he's an asset, and as such he doesn't call the shots as to where he goes, but, as I said, if all things are equal, it behooves the organization to do its best to take care of a guy like this. It's good business, and makes the organization more attractive to prospective employees in the future.

By the way, all of this is coming from a guy who thinks they should seriously consider moving him as soon as he's healthy.
Take care of a guy who wants out of an organization half way into a contract that pays him as one of the elites at his position?

Sorry, if Miller wants out, the Sabres should do nothing to consider his desire, and everything to get the best return possible



His on ice work is mostly generic over his career

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Old
11-27-2011, 08:40 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by SabresFan79 View Post

Second, there is a little smoke here independent of the rumor. It's not like the team actually stuck up for Miller the night he got run, and I have to say I find it very interesting that Miller's concussion symptoms prevented him from playing only after the second period, by which time it was abundantly clear that nobody in blue and gold intended to exact retribution for the hit on Miller. Just sayin'.
Since you are accusing Miller of faking his injury, then I refuse to respond to anything else in your post.

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