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11-28-2011, 07:09 AM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
what has he done here (outside of being here) that makes consideration even remotely necessary?
It's hard to take you seriously when you say things like that. If maybe you would take even a slight effort to be a bit more objective...

251 wins, 26 shutouts, a Vezina, thousands of hours of work, community service (2009-2010, NHL Foundation Player Award), etc...

Now, if Miller does want out (which I doubt), then I say the Sabres get what they can for him. It's a business after all, and you have to do that. I just don't like the implication that he's not done anything for the team, community, etc...

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11-28-2011, 07:14 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
The basic premise I take from this thread is that since this particular writer got a story right once, that means everything he ever writes should be taken at face value, and not be questioned.

How many other rumors has he written about that proved not to be true? Has anyone bothered to look? I doubt it.

Stop fellating the guy and understand this for what it is ; rumor-mongering for pageviews.
Good point on the rumor hit and miss situation and I'd like to know as well.
But, you failed to take into account what he did, how did you say it? He did get right.

No one had Pegula's name on the Sabres prior to him, point blank, hands down. He either has direct info from the Sabres organization somehow, or he has a contact at NHL headquarters that is familiar with the Sabres organization.
He didn't call a hit or miss situation, he pulled Pegula's name as the new future owner of the Sabres......this makes a huge difference from what your saying here.

If he reports he's hearing Miller wouldn't mind a trade, I would have no reason to doubt him.

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11-28-2011, 07:16 AM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BowieSabresFan View Post
It's hard to take you seriously when you say things like that. If maybe you would take even a slight effort to be a bit more objective...

251 wins, 26 shutouts, a Vezina, thousands of hours of work, community service (2009-2010, NHL Foundation Player Award), etc...

Now, if Miller does want out (which I doubt), then I say the Sabres get what they can for him. It's a business after all, and you have to do that. I just don't like the implication that he's not done anything for the team, community, etc...
Just seemed like an odd statement. Did the organization do everything possible to move Marty Biron where he wanted to go?

I dont think Miller has done anything out of the ordinary, so far as to give him some special treatment in trade consideration, ESPECIALLY since this is based on the idea that he's asking for a trade.

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11-28-2011, 07:17 AM
  #104
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Originally Posted by BowieSabresFan View Post
It's hard to take you seriously when you say things like that. If maybe you would take even a slight effort to be a bit more objective...

251 wins, 26 shutouts, a Vezina, thousands of hours of work, community service (2009-2010, NHL Foundation Player Award), etc...

Now, if Miller does want out (which I doubt), then I say the Sabres get what they can for him. It's a business after all, and you have to do that. I just don't like the implication that he's not done anything for the team, community, etc...
ding ding ding
We have a Winner Johnny......

The bolded statement is absolutely the correct answer.
Ryan Miller is a hockey commodity, pure and simple.
If the Sabres can improve their organization as an on ice product, then he should be moved without question.

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11-28-2011, 07:25 AM
  #105
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Assuming that it wasn't from this guys wife' brother's naighbor's five year old daughter's best friend, I don't see buffalo pulling the trigger as I don't see any team willing to pony up enough to make darcy even listen to an offer. =/

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11-28-2011, 07:58 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by static80 View Post
ding ding ding
We have a Winner Johnny......

The bolded statement is absolutely the correct answer.
Ryan Miller is a hockey commodity, pure and simple.
If the Sabres can improve their organization as an on ice product, then he should be moved without question.
That is a very big if, and the deal would have to include a good goaltender. There is no way around that right now.

However, I would doubt that Miller wants out right now.

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11-28-2011, 08:09 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by BowieSabresFan View Post
That is a very big if, and the deal would have to include a good goaltender. There is no way around that right now.

However, I would doubt that Miller wants out right now.
Agreed that it is a big if.
I don't believe they need a good goaltender coming back. I believe they will depend on Enroth and they should.
The organization is aware they are still a few pieces away from a cup run. So, the "there is no way around that right now" perception I'm just not feeling right now.

I can't say if Miller "wants out" or not. The article didn't say he did or did not want out, it merely stated that "We keep hearing that Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller is out with a concussion and wouldn’t mind if the Sabres traded him."

I would have to believe that if any deal is done, it would come in the off season. Of course, merely my opinion mind you, but if Miller comes back in just after Christmas/New Years and plays, he could potentially enhance his value enough that some team looking for goaltending on a serious playoff run may overpay him.

There are many variables involved here if he is indeed under consideration to be moved.

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11-28-2011, 08:10 AM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by static80 View Post
ding ding ding
We have a Winner Johnny......

The bolded statement is absolutely the correct answer.
Ryan Miller is a hockey commodity, pure and simple.
If the Sabres can improve their organization as an on ice product, then he should be moved without question.
Then surely you agreed that Enroth should be traded if he can be moved for a skater or two who'd improve the team. Right?

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11-28-2011, 08:11 AM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by static80 View Post
If the Sabres can improve their organization as an on ice product, then he should be moved without question.
And I don't think a single person here would dispute that. The question is: Does trading Ryan Miller improve your team?

- If you think goalies are interchangable parts and skaters are more important, then you do this without much thought.

- If you think goalies are in fact just as important a piece to a hockey team as any other position, then you have to decide if you can upgrade the goaltender position by making this move. If you can't, then you don't do it.

Since I believe that goaltenders are an important piece, then I would not trade Miller unless I received such a massive return that it upgraded my team substantially.

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11-28-2011, 08:15 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
And I don't think a single person here would dispute that. The question is: Does trading Ryan Miller improve your team?

- If you think goalies are interchangable parts and skaters are more important, then you do this without much thought.

- If you think goalies are in fact just as important a piece to a hockey team as any other position, then you have to decide if you can upgrade the goaltender position by making this move. If you can't, then you don't do it.

Since I believe that goaltenders are an important piece, then I would not trade Miller unless I received such a massive return that it upgraded my team substantially.
It's an interesting conversation to be sure, but there is only 1 Darcy Regier and 1 Ted Black.
When moving a commodity such as Miller, those 2 hold the seats of power in any type of negotiations for a deal.
I have confidence they can get a deal done, I wouldn't know if those components they bring back in such a deal will actually be what the team needs until I see the final product.

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11-28-2011, 08:18 AM
  #111
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Ted Black does not get involved in these things. Ted and Terry have made that abundantly clear. Terry will obviously get involved, but only with players that Darcy is chasing.

Any possible deal starts and ends with Darcy. That's it. And again, none of this matters unless someone reports some concrete information that Miller actually wants out, and not just baseless speculation.

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11-28-2011, 08:26 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
Ted Black does not get involved in these things. Ted and Terry have made that abundantly clear. Terry will obviously get involved, but only with players that Darcy is chasing.

Any possible deal starts and ends with Darcy. That's it. And again, none of this matters unless someone reports some concrete information that Miller actually wants out, and not just baseless speculation.
Ted Black:
http://sabres.nhl.com/club/page.htm?id=67959

He will be involved, to state other wise is merely to lie to yourself.
His job duties include such situations.

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11-28-2011, 08:31 AM
  #113
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I think the thread name is a little deceptive. Nowhere has it been reported that he wants out. Dom Hasek wanted out of Buffalo. Dany Heatley wanted out of Ottawa. All this report states is that he's heard Miller would accept a trade.

My parents live outside of Phoenix. My wife's parents are moving to Flagstaff, Arizona next month. Both my employer and a competitor have offices in Phoenix. Would I be open to accepting a transfer to my employer's Phoenix office if they came to me with one? Sure, I'd be open to it, and I'd probably accept it. If the competitor came to me with a job offer for their Phoenix office, would I be open to it? Probably, and I might even accept it.

Does this mean that I "want out" of my current job or my office or my current city? Nope. But I may (and probably would) accept either if presented with the opportunity, especially given that it would put both of us closer to our respective families.

I understand it's not a perfect analogy, but I fear people are quickly forgetting what the article is really saying--that he'd be open to or accepting of such a trade--and him wanting out. They are two very different animals.

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11-28-2011, 08:31 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Then surely you agreed that Enroth should be traded if he can be moved for a skater or two who'd improve the team. Right?
Absolutely. If it improves this team that's trying to contend this year, then you move either goalie. It needs to push us further into contention this year though. No futures. No picks. Players that will help this team now, not in three years.

That said, I don't want either moved. Buffalo has a great situation in goal. Enroth is good. Miller is great. He carried us in the 05-06 playoffs and to the 09-10 playoffs. I don't care what stats you spin. 251 wins is 251 wins. Sure, it's not a stanley cup yet. But we're making the right moves to get there.

Miller is this team's number one and this report that he wants out is unsubstantiated.

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11-28-2011, 08:32 AM
  #115
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more fun...

To St Louis for:
Berglund, Halak, 1st

To New Jersey for:
Zajac and Hedberg
or
Josefsen, Tallinder, Hedberg

To Edmonton for:
Gagner, Khabibulin, Pitlick, 1st rounder

To Columbus for:
Brassard, Mason, 1st

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11-28-2011, 08:32 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
Miller for Kane!


I'd do Bolland and Crawford for Miller. But, Regier wouldn't.
Yikes. I'm glad Darcy wouldn't do that. I wouldn't either.

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11-28-2011, 08:33 AM
  #117
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Thanks. I know what his job title is. Maybe you should reference the myriad of interviews where Ted and Terry have both said that Darcy is completely in charge of the hockey department, and they aren't involved in player decisions.

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11-28-2011, 08:33 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by static80 View Post
Agreed that it is a big if.
I don't believe they need a good goaltender coming back. I believe they will depend on Enroth and they should.
The organization is aware they are still a few pieces away from a cup run. So, the "there is no way around that right now" perception I'm just not feeling right now.

I can't say if Miller "wants out" or not. The article didn't say he did or did not want out, it merely stated that "We keep hearing that Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller is out with a concussion and wouldn’t mind if the Sabres traded him."

I would have to believe that if any deal is done, it would come in the off season. Of course, merely my opinion mind you, but if Miller comes back in just after Christmas/New Years and plays, he could potentially enhance his value enough that some team looking for goaltending on a serious playoff run may overpay him.

There are many variables involved here if he is indeed under consideration to be moved.
Enroth's stats as a starter are very unimpressive. Granted it is a small sample size, but he has hardly shown himself to be the starter of the future so far. You're kidding yourself if you think otherwise. Also, if you do not get a goalie in return, who is your backup? Any deal HAS to include a goaltender.

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11-28-2011, 08:37 AM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I think the thread name is a little deceptive. Nowhere has it been reported that he wants out. Dom Hasek wanted out of Buffalo. Dany Heatley wanted out of Ottawa. All this report states is that he's heard Miller would accept a trade.

My parents live outside of Phoenix. My wife's parents are moving to Flagstaff, Arizona next month. Both my employer and a competitor have offices in Phoenix. Would I be open to accepting a transfer to my employer's Phoenix office if they came to me with one? Sure, I'd be open to it, and I'd probably accept it. If the competitor came to me with a job offer for their Phoenix office, would I be open to it? Probably, and I might even accept it.

Does this mean that I "want out" of my current job or my office or my current city? Nope. But I may (and probably would) accept either if presented with the opportunity, especially given that it would put both of us closer to our respective families.

I understand it's not a perfect analogy, but I fear people are quickly forgetting what the article is really saying--that he'd be open to or accepting of such a trade--and him wanting out. They are two very different animals.
Why would the discussion of "being open to...." a trade even come up if there wasn't reason to want to leave?

I would prefer if the "franchise" goaltender, when broached about the subject of being open to a trade... would instead reply:

"I signed a 6 year deal in Buffalo to win a Stanley Cup, and with the new Ownership in place and the changes that have been made we are one step closer to our goal. The Buffalo Sabres made a hefty financial commitment to me, and I intend to be committed to them."

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11-28-2011, 08:38 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
more fun...

To St Louis for:
Berglund, Halak, 1st

To New Jersey for:
Zajac and Hedberg
or
Josefsen, Tallinder, Hedberg

To Edmonton for:
Gagner, Khabibulin, Pitlick, 1st rounder

To Columbus for:
Brassard, Mason, 1st
No on Mason. Here's a recent article from Hockey Prospectus regarding Mason:

Quote:
The Columbus Blue Jackets' record has them as one of the worst teams in the NHL. In Part One of this series, we looked beyond that record and their terrible goal differential, and into some of the underlying numbers. What we found was that the Jackets are both outchancing and outshooting their opposition, but that their opponents have been far more likely to score on any given shot or scoring chance.

Left unanswered is why this is happening, and that's what we'll delve into now.

The obvious answer for at least half the question is goaltending. If the opposition is scoring a lot on relatively few shots/scoring chances, it probably means there's a problem in net.

Thirty-one goaltenders have played at least 10 games in the NHL this season. Of that group, exactly one has a save percentage below .900: Steve Mason.

...

The message here should be clear: Steve Mason's performance this year is of the type that ends NHL careers. An average NHL goaltender will post a .910 SV%, and a bad one will be around .900. A .900 goalie playing in place of Mason would have allowed 43 goals; Mason's allowed 54. That's almost a full goal per game worse than a sub-average NHL goalie; no team can win with that kind of netminding.

Mason has been relentlessly horrible, and only a lack of options has forced the Blue Jackets to keep going to him; now he's in serious jeopardy of losing his job to a recently-healthy Curtis Sanford.
http://puckprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1188

Keep him far, far away from this team. If we're trading Miller to Columbus, I want Carter+, and even trying to include Mason would be a dealbreaker for me.

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11-28-2011, 08:38 AM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
more fun...

To St Louis for:
Berglund, Halak, 1st

To New Jersey for:
Zajac and Hedberg
or
Josefsen, Tallinder, Hedberg

To Edmonton for:
Gagner, Khabibulin, Pitlick, 1st rounder

To Columbus for:
Brassard, Mason, 1st
None of these are very good. I'm interested in the first from Columbus, but only because it could very well be Yakupov.

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11-28-2011, 08:40 AM
  #122
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(Didn't have time to read all the thread, so sorry if this has already been speculated)

Pure speculation on my part, but a Sabres source for an Edmonton beat writer could pretty easily be Stafford -> Stafford's uncle (Barrie) -> Writer.

I have NO IDEA if that is accurate, just saying there could be a dotted line connection.

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11-28-2011, 08:43 AM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I would prefer if the "franchise" goaltender, when broached about the subject of being open to a trade... would instead reply:

"I signed a 6 year deal in Buffalo to win a Stanley Cup, and with the new Ownership in place and the changes that have been made we are one step closer to our goal. The Buffalo Sabres made a hefty financial commitment to me, and I intend to be committed to them."
Please point me to an on the record interview where Ryan Miller is asked about being traded, and responds differently. I've yet to see such a thing.

You're criticizing Miller for what here exactly? About a response he didn't give to a question he wasn't asked?

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11-28-2011, 08:43 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by KevinFG View Post
(Didn't have time to read all the thread, so sorry if this has already been speculated)

Pure speculation on my part, but a Sabres source for an Edmonton beat writer could pretty easily be Stafford -> Stafford's uncle (Barrie) -> Writer.

I have NO IDEA if that is accurate, just saying there could be a dotted line connection.
I've known about this connection for years, just hadn't thought about it in regards to this story until now. Good call.

I still don't see it, but I guess it does have some legs.

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11-28-2011, 08:44 AM
  #125
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Originally Posted by KevinFG View Post
(Didn't have time to read all the thread, so sorry if this has already been speculated)

Pure speculation on my part, but a Sabres source for an Edmonton beat writer could pretty easily be Stafford -> Stafford's uncle (Barrie) -> Writer.

I have NO IDEA if that is accurate, just saying there could be a dotted line connection.
Random speculation on the source of random speculation accomplishes what exactly?

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