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How to get Dubinsky jump started?

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Old
12-04-2011, 01:49 PM
  #126
smoneil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
People get way too caught up in points instead of play.
I agree with this comment, though I'm not sure if our thoughts on the situation are shared. Dubinsky has been playing fine, but he hasn't been shooting the puck. That's literally the ONLY thing he's not doing.

I don't mind the cut in Dubi's minutes right now. Dubinsky was being too picky with his shooting options. The Dubi of old would just try and get the puck on net. Early in this season, it seemed as if he was waiting for the perfect shot too often. As the season progressed and the goals didn't come, it seemed as if he were almost afraid to shoot the puck (so he focused on his passing instead). By cutting his minutes, Dubinsky KNOWS that he doesn't have the time to wait for the perfect shot. By putting him with Avery and Prust, he knows that he's the best option to score a goal on that line.

Last game, Dubi had 2 SOG in under 10 minutes of play. That's a good sign. To be perfectly honest, I don't see the minute cut as a punishment. I think it's just Torts' attempt to force Dubinsky to focus on the one glaring weakness in his game (the absurdly low SOG total). Once Dubi is consistently getting pucks on net in 10 minutes of play, I'm sure he'll be moved back up the lines, and paired with players who will help him turn those shots into goals. The entire team is clicking and picking up wins. Now is the perfect time to do this (and this started in the middle of this run of great play).

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12-04-2011, 02:10 PM
  #127
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Duby will come around.

By the end of the season I expect a 20 goal 50 point player.

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12-04-2011, 04:39 PM
  #128
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Agree with a lot of things already said.

Yea, don't change things when they're not broke, but imo Dubi should definitely be playing on the 3rd line over Boyle. I think that line would do well. A very hard working line with scoring potential.

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12-04-2011, 04:45 PM
  #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
I would love to see:

Wolski - Step - Gaborik
Feds - Richards - Cally
Dubinsky - AA - Hagelin
Avery/Rupp - Boyle - Rupp

Mitchell as ev 14th FWD player

Staal - Girardi
Erixon - McD
MDZ - Sauer
Why?

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Old
12-04-2011, 05:28 PM
  #130
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listen, at one point in the season were inevitably going to hit some sort of bad streak,perhaps a 2-3-4 game losing streak and the lines are going to receive some sort of shake up.
when and if that happens I'd try to reunite the Pack line. That line played amazing as basically our first unit last year and they werent given much of a chance to re-establish that chemisty early on when basically the whole team was horrendous. Dubi would thrive again on that line imo.
Stepan-Richards-Gaborik
Dubi-AA-Cally

also, early on AA was playing like *******, partly why that line couldnt get going. Since joining the top unit with Steps and Gabby he's been much better.

also another interesting note, completely forgot we had Wolski on this team.
I also wouldnt mind giving him one more chance on a top line with Richards + Gabby again and see if anything comes of it.

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12-04-2011, 05:46 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by MaximusT View Post
listen, at one point in the season were inevitably going to hit some sort of bad streak,perhaps a 2-3-4 game losing streak and the lines are going to receive some sort of shake up.
when and if that happens I'd try to reunite the Pack line. That line played amazing as basically our first unit last year and they werent given much of a chance to re-establish that chemisty early on when basically the whole team was horrendous. Dubi would thrive again on that line imo.
Stepan-Richards-Gaborik
Dubi-AA-Cally

also, early on AA was playing like *******, partly why that line couldnt get going. Since joining the top unit with Steps and Gabby he's been much better.

also another interesting note, completely forgot we had Wolski on this team.
I also wouldnt mind giving him one more chance on a top line with Richards + Gabby again and see if anything comes of it.
I really don't think it's a good idea to put Stepan and Richards on the same line, especially now that Stepan has developed chemistry with Gaborik. We have two playmaking centers right now. Putting them both on the same line kills our scoring depth.

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12-04-2011, 06:33 PM
  #132
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I see no reason to reunite the Pack line any time soon unless Richards and Callahan begin to not put any pucks in the net. That I just can't see either with Richards being so good, Cally can hit 30 goals this year.

Need to keep Stepan/Gabby and Cally/Richards together on our top two and if things start becoming shaky plug players in to those lines.

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Old
12-04-2011, 09:44 PM
  #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
People get way too caught up in points instead of play.
I don't disagree with your comment but if you're implying that Dubinsky's all around play is a problem then I do.

Dubi is classic snakebit right now. Not the end of the world. Unless you're on HFboads where everything is extreme X10. He's been fine but he's slumping. It's funny cause when he actually does try and shoot lately (now that he's getting zero ice time on a line with Prust and Avery) it always seems to be at the wrong time and gets blocked or misses the net. His offensive game is just not there right now, but the way to get him out of it is not to cut his minutes in half and play him with guys who have less of a chance to help him succeed. I have no issues with Dubi. He's doing everything we can ask he's just not scoring right now. It is what it is. It's about the team and the team is succeeding. Dubi will come up big when we need him most because this is an actual team and that's what happens.

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12-04-2011, 10:47 PM
  #134
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You just have to have faith that Dubi will come out of it. We've all seen players go through deep stretches of not making the score sheet. He is not a liability out there, that's the thing.
Since I have seen what he can do offensively when he gets rolling, I'm going to hold that vision in my head. He can do it again.

I don't even think he has really found his game yet. If that's still true by end of next season, I will call it reality and say he is not going to be a scorer on the Rangers. In the meantime, and barring being traded in a transaction for the good of the team, I'm interesed in watching come out of the funk he is in.

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Old
12-04-2011, 11:47 PM
  #135
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I remember how much people were crapping on Dan Girardi last year and before. That turned out OK and so will this. Like Girardi, Dubinsky has not quite figured it all out yet. Dubi's 25, we'll be laughing our selves silly about this by the time he's 27. Just my take.

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Old
12-05-2011, 12:00 AM
  #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
I remember how much people were crapping on Dan Girardi last year and before. That turned out OK and so will this. Like Girardi, Dubinsky has not quite figured it all out yet. Dubi's 25, we'll be laughing our selves silly about this by the time he's 27. Just my take.
Agreed. This isn't a video game where development and production are linear throughout a players career. There are going to be highs and lows.

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12-05-2011, 10:11 AM
  #137
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So if Dubi was playing with Stepan and Gaborik and had 3 goals and 15 points it'd all be fine? But since he's got 2 less goals and 4 less points and is now getting half the ice time playing with Prust and Avery we need to jump start him? I'm not advocating replacing Anisimov with him I'm just trying to put things in perspective.

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Old
12-05-2011, 11:28 AM
  #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
I remember how much people were crapping on Dan Girardi last year and before. That turned out OK and so will this. Like Girardi, Dubinsky has not quite figured it all out yet. Dubi's 25, we'll be laughing our selves silly about this by the time he's 27. Just my take.
My take is that by the time he's 27, he'll be playing for another team.

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12-05-2011, 11:31 AM
  #139
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Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
My take is that by the time he's 27, he'll be playing for another team.
Damn!! I shoulda made that bet. I'd be a $100 richer right now.

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12-05-2011, 12:29 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
I don't mind the cut in Dubi's minutes right now. Dubinsky was being too picky with his shooting options. The Dubi of old would just try and get the puck on net. Early in this season, it seemed as if he was waiting for the perfect shot too often. As the season progressed and the goals didn't come, it seemed as if he were almost afraid to shoot the puck (so he focused on his passing instead). By cutting his minutes, Dubinsky KNOWS that he doesn't have the time to wait for the perfect shot. By putting him with Avery and Prust, he knows that he's the best option to score a goal on that line.

Last game, Dubi had 2 SOG in under 10 minutes of play. That's a good sign. To be perfectly honest, I don't see the minute cut as a punishment. I think it's just Torts' attempt to force Dubinsky to focus on the one glaring weakness in his game (the absurdly low SOG total). Once Dubi is consistently getting pucks on net in 10 minutes of play, I'm sure he'll be moved back up the lines, and paired with players who will help him turn those shots into goals. The entire team is clicking and picking up wins. Now is the perfect time to do this (and this started in the middle of this run of great play).
Very interesting post. Well done. For the life of me, I couldn't see any benefit in relegating Dubi to the 4th line. Hopefully you're right, and this will do as intended. Cause other than this,... I don't see how this helps him or the team.

Here's my beef,... Dubi has been a work horse in all situations, and if it's just his scoring thats a problem, why hurt the PK or protecting the lead, or the forecheck by sitting him? He is always noticeable on the ice, even when he's not scoring.

Something tells me it's more than him not scoring. If you notice he plays with Prust and Avery and all 3 lead this team in Penalties. Avery has played only 12 games so if you double his PIM's he'd be right there with Prust n Dubi.

I would love to see him drop the gloves tonight. Even if he can't help himself maybe he can help jump start the team. Help the team that way. Can't be Prust every night.

Ya know, one thing that has not been mentioned is maybe he is banged up. But with Step and Mitchell taking pucks and getting more icetime, I doubt it.

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Old
12-05-2011, 12:36 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
I agree with this comment, though I'm not sure if our thoughts on the situation are shared. Dubinsky has been playing fine, but he hasn't been shooting the puck. That's literally the ONLY thing he's not doing.

I don't mind the cut in Dubi's minutes right now. Dubinsky was being too picky with his shooting options. The Dubi of old would just try and get the puck on net. Early in this season, it seemed as if he was waiting for the perfect shot too often. As the season progressed and the goals didn't come, it seemed as if he were almost afraid to shoot the puck (so he focused on his passing instead). By cutting his minutes, Dubinsky KNOWS that he doesn't have the time to wait for the perfect shot. By putting him with Avery and Prust, he knows that he's the best option to score a goal on that line.

Last game, Dubi had 2 SOG in under 10 minutes of play. That's a good sign. To be perfectly honest, I don't see the minute cut as a punishment. I think it's just Torts' attempt to force Dubinsky to focus on the one glaring weakness in his game (the absurdly low SOG total). Once Dubi is consistently getting pucks on net in 10 minutes of play, I'm sure he'll be moved back up the lines, and paired with players who will help him turn those shots into goals. The entire team is clicking and picking up wins. Now is the perfect time to do this (and this started in the middle of this run of great play).
That's a solid, solid take. Nothing to add.

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Old
12-05-2011, 12:49 PM
  #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
I agree with this comment, though I'm not sure if our thoughts on the situation are shared. Dubinsky has been playing fine, but he hasn't been shooting the puck. That's literally the ONLY thing he's not doing.

I don't mind the cut in Dubi's minutes right now. Dubinsky was being too picky with his shooting options. The Dubi of old would just try and get the puck on net. Early in this season, it seemed as if he was waiting for the perfect shot too often. As the season progressed and the goals didn't come, it seemed as if he were almost afraid to shoot the puck (so he focused on his passing instead). By cutting his minutes, Dubinsky KNOWS that he doesn't have the time to wait for the perfect shot. By putting him with Avery and Prust, he knows that he's the best option to score a goal on that line.

Last game, Dubi had 2 SOG in under 10 minutes of play. That's a good sign. To be perfectly honest, I don't see the minute cut as a punishment. I think it's just Torts' attempt to force Dubinsky to focus on the one glaring weakness in his game (the absurdly low SOG total). Once Dubi is consistently getting pucks on net in 10 minutes of play, I'm sure he'll be moved back up the lines, and paired with players who will help him turn those shots into goals. The entire team is clicking and picking up wins. Now is the perfect time to do this (and this started in the middle of this run of great play).
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohbaby View Post
Very interesting post. Well done. For the life of me, I couldn't see any benefit in relegating Dubi to the 4th line. Hopefully you're right, and this will do as intended. Cause other than this,... I don't see how this helps him or the team.

Here's my beef,... Dubi has been a work horse in all situations, and if it's just his scoring thats a problem, why hurt the PK or protecting the lead, or the forecheck by sitting him? He is always noticeable on the ice, even when he's not scoring.

Something tells me it's more than him not scoring. If you notice he plays with Prust and Avery and all 3 lead this team in Penalties. Avery has played only 12 games so if you double his PIM's he'd be right there with Prust n Dubi.

I would love to see him drop the gloves tonight. Even if he can't help himself maybe he can help jump start the team. Help the team that way. Can't be Prust every night.

Ya know, one thing that has not been mentioned is maybe he is banged up. But with Step and Mitchell taking pucks and getting more icetime, I doubt it.

The reason I still have an issue with it is that it's just smoneil's opinion and that's fine, but it's speculation and we have absolutely no evidence of that being the reason behind this decision.

Torts has said, and most of us can realize, that Dubi has been doing the little things right he's just not scoring. If Torts wanted him to shoot the puck more, it shouldn't be any more difficult than telling Dubi he wants him to shoot the puck more. To be honest, I think he has been shooting more, he just seems to do so at inopportune times and clearly looks like he's forcing the shot. He has the ability to use his body and be patient and wait to make a play (but he probably wouldn't want half this board yelling at him for thinking he's a play maker), but instead he's just throwing it towards the net.

Saying once he gets his shots on goal up in 10 minutes of play is equivalent to saying once Avery gets his goal totals up in 5 minutes of ice time he'll be in the top six. Each game and each shift it different. Our fourth line could come on the ice when we don't have possession of the puck and by the time their shift is done they've never had it until it was time to dump it in and go for a change. That could be a minute of his ice time gone right there and there was never a chance for offense.

There's just no reason for the rest of this roster to be getting more ice time than him. He lead our team in goals and points last year. He's still contributing. He's not some young forward oozing with talent that is a liability in his own end and hurting the team more than helping them. Just put him in a position to succeed for crying out loud.

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12-05-2011, 12:51 PM
  #143
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Jumper Cables? Power Pack? lol

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12-05-2011, 01:03 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by ruckus View Post
So if Dubi was playing with Stepan and Gaborik and had 3 goals and 15 points it'd all be fine? But since he's got 2 less goals and 4 less points and is now getting half the ice time playing with Prust and Avery we need to jump start him? I'm not advocating replacing Anisimov with him I'm just trying to put things in perspective.
The expectations on Anisimov are not the same as Dubinsky...so no idea what you're trying to prove. If Gaborik had 1 goal, would you make a similar argument?

And...I'm not sure anyone is "fine" with Anisimov's 3 goals.

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12-05-2011, 01:07 PM
  #145
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Dubi has still quietly gotten 10 assists. Unfortunately he can't score for crap. Hopefully the goals will come.

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12-05-2011, 01:26 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by ruckus View Post
There's just no reason for the rest of this roster to be getting more ice time than him. He lead our team in goals and points last year. He's still contributing. He's not some young forward oozing with talent that is a liability in his own end and hurting the team more than helping them. Just put him in a position to succeed for crying out loud.
The more I think about, it has to be the penalties he's taking,... for his demotion.

Remember early in the season, we were taking way too many penalties. Well since our run the last 15 games,... we have cut our time in the box way down.

Dubi is probably being made as an example,... that if you take penalties you sit. He has 47 pim, Prust has 49. And most of Prust's are majors for fighting. Needless to say, most of Dubi's are minors. It's no coincidence with Him, Prust, and Avery, getting very limited icetime,.... the penalties are way down.

This has to be the reason. Otherwise it just doesn't make sense.


Last edited by ohbaby: 12-05-2011 at 02:03 PM.
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12-05-2011, 01:34 PM
  #147
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Duby will come around.

By the end of the season I expect a 20 goal 50 point player.
Oh boy...

I mean...I HOPE.

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12-05-2011, 01:59 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Vito Andolini View Post
The expectations on Anisimov are not the same as Dubinsky...so no idea what you're trying to prove. If Gaborik had 1 goal, would you make a similar argument?

And...I'm not sure anyone is "fine" with Anisimov's 3 goals.
Arty had more goals (18 to 13) and more points (44 to 41) than Dubinsky in their second full season. Dubinsky went on to pot 20 goals in 69 games his third year for 44 points. Pretty sure that's about the expectations for Arty this season. The "point I'm trying to prove" is that people are all up in arms about Dubinsky's struggles when he's had a pretty comparable season to Anisimov this year and he isn't playing with our best player and, this season, our best set up guy.

There aren't too many people up in arms over Arty...yet he only has three goals. And I"m not saying people SHOULD be up in arms over Arty. I just don't think there's any reason to go crazy about Dubinsky either, and I definitely don't think there's any reason he should be getting 9:45 a night with Avery and Prust. It lacks logic.

You might not be fine with Anisimov's goal total, but you won't hear anywhere near as many people upset about him as you will Dubinsky. And he's playing on our top line with Gab and Step.

There's a lot of people that have loved to knock Dubi for a long, long time on here.

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12-05-2011, 03:42 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by ruckus View Post
Arty had more goals (18 to 13) and more points (44 to 41) than Dubinsky in their second full season. Dubinsky went on to pot 20 goals in 69 games his third year for 44 points. Pretty sure that's about the expectations for Arty this season. The "point I'm trying to prove" is that people are all up in arms about Dubinsky's struggles when he's had a pretty comparable season to Anisimov this year and he isn't playing with our best player and, this season, our best set up guy.

There aren't too many people up in arms over Arty...yet he only has three goals. And I"m not saying people SHOULD be up in arms over Arty. I just don't think there's any reason to go crazy about Dubinsky either, and I definitely don't think there's any reason he should be getting 9:45 a night with Avery and Prust. It lacks logic.

You might not be fine with Anisimov's goal total, but you won't hear anywhere near as many people upset about him as you will Dubinsky. And he's playing on our top line with Gab and Step.

There's a lot of people that have loved to knock Dubi for a long, long time on here.

Dubinsky led the team in points last year, and outscored his line-mate Anisimov by 10pts & 6 goals. For a big part of the year he played at a signficantly higher level than basically anyone on the roster. You can't tell me that the expectations on these players are the same.

And enough about 9:45. You quote 1 game and go on and on about it. Dubinsky's about 18mins per game this year and played over 20 mins numerous times before he got bumped. Stop making believe that he's played with Prust and Avery all year. It's crap. It's been what? 5 games?

The team lost 2 bad games in a row. Torts decided to shake things up a little and guess who gets bumped. The guy with 1 goal in ~ 20 games. When things go south again (and they will) Dubinsky will be back. Much ado about nada.

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12-05-2011, 04:08 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Vito Andolini View Post
Dubinsky led the team in points last year, and outscored his line-mate Anisimov by 10pts & 6 goals. For a big part of the year he played at a signficantly higher level than basically anyone on the roster. You can't tell me that the expectations on these players are the same.

And enough about 9:45. You quote 1 game and go on and on about it. Dubinsky's about 18mins per game this year and played over 20 mins numerous times before he got bumped. Stop making believe that he's played with Prust and Avery all year. It's crap. It's been what? 5 games?

The team lost 2 bad games in a row. Torts decided to shake things up a little and guess who gets bumped. The guy with 1 goal in ~ 20 games. When things go south again (and they will) Dubinsky will be back. Much ado about nada.
I'm not making a big deal about it. I'm stating my opinion in a thread that's about Dubinsky.

Anisimov's projections for this year would be right there with what Dubinsky put up last season, especially considering he's playing with Gaborik and Stepan. That's my point. And no one seems to be having a heart attack worrying about him.

I'm not trying to make it about Arty v. Dubi at all, I'm just saying it's funny how a big portion of the fan base seems to hold Dubi to a different standard when honestly their offensive projections should basically be the same.

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