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Old
11-29-2011, 10:03 PM
  #1
dkollidas
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San Jose- Buffalo

Just wondering if the value was relatively equal in this proposal. Not saying either team would make the deal, but from a value standpoint if it was equal. So please don't flame me, just a curious fan.

To San Jose:

C-Derek Roy
G-Ryan Miller
D-Jordan Leopold

To Buffalo:

C-Joe Pavelski
G-Antti Niemi
D-Douglas Murray


Was also considering leaving both defensemen out and having a deal of Miller/Roy for Pavelski/Niemi, would that be acceptable at all either???

Thanks

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11-29-2011, 10:10 PM
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WTFetus
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Sharks don't have the cap-space for it.

Seems like a stealthy fantasy question to me.

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11-29-2011, 10:12 PM
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Gilligans Island
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Well, taking cap out of it, from a pure value standpoint, seems close to me.

I'd rate Pavs > Roy but Miller > Niemi.

Leopold and Murray are a wash, though they obviously have different types of games.

That said, yeah - neither team does this deal

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11-29-2011, 10:16 PM
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dkollidas
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Consider it for end of the season, so cap room can be accomodated? Also, Miller ($6.3) Roy ($4.0) and Leopold ($3.0) vs. Niemi ($3.8), Pavelski ($4.0) and Murray ($2.5) is a total difference of $3M/yr. But you guys do have a few guys coming off the books this year (Vandermeer, White, Mitchell, Nittymaki) that's about $5.5M coming off the books. And no one huge to re-sign I don't believe.

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11-29-2011, 10:20 PM
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i'll send them White (yes he'll agree to the deal) for pizza for the team and the Sabres GM agreeing to stock the sharks locker room coke machine for a year. Hurry, i'm taking to another team - first call back gets the deal...

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11-29-2011, 10:21 PM
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I wouldn't do this. Pavelski is a pivotal player for the future and Murray is our only physical guy on the entire team

I'm still not sold on Niemi, although I don't think he's a chump or anything

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11-29-2011, 10:23 PM
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This is awful. Pavelski is substantially better than Roy and, sure, Miller's a better goalie than Niemi but certainly not $2.2 million better. No goalie in the league is worth what Miller makes apart from perhaps Thomas.

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11-29-2011, 10:23 PM
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i'll send them White (yes he'll agree to the deal) for pizza for the team and the Sabres GM agreeing to stock the sharks locker room coke machine for a year. Hurry, i'm taking to another team - first call back gets the deal...
Ring... Ring.. Hawks GM Bowman on line 1...

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Old
11-29-2011, 10:28 PM
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No deal bro. Sharks only open holes.

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Old
11-29-2011, 10:44 PM
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Miller is better than Niemi but Pavelski is better than Roy...

Pavs is light-years ahead of Roy, but is Miller that much better than Nemo to make it a wash? Nope.

I just don't think this would ever work...why would Buffalo want to get rid of Miller and why would we want to get rid of Pavs? It doesn't make sense for either team.

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Old
11-29-2011, 10:59 PM
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How about something more reasonable like Hecht for a 2nd '12?

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11-29-2011, 11:18 PM
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I'd do it.

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Old
11-29-2011, 11:50 PM
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dkollidas
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What about just Miller/Roy for Pavelski/Niemi? I realize Pavelski is better, but "light-years"? Roy has a career 0.81ppg, Pavelski, 0,71. It's not huge, but it's true. Roy can play center, or the point on the power-play, can play the wing, and kills penalties. He's winning just about 55% of his face-offs, so while Pavelski is a bit higher, Roy has taken a lot more of them as well. So I don't know about "light-years". Miller is an elite talent, and while Niemi is solid, Miller gives them a guy in net who can steal games all on his own.

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11-30-2011, 12:00 AM
  #14
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Give us boyes, thats all we want.

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11-30-2011, 12:12 AM
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Give us boyes, thats all we want.
Why would we want Brad Boyes back? I don't think he would fit on our 3rd line that well.

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11-30-2011, 12:15 AM
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Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
What about just Miller/Roy for Pavelski/Niemi? I realize Pavelski is better, but "light-years"? Roy has a career 0.81ppg, Pavelski, 0,71. It's not huge, but it's true. Roy can play center, or the point on the power-play, can play the wing, and kills penalties. He's winning just about 55% of his face-offs, so while Pavelski is a bit higher, Roy has taken a lot more of them as well. So I don't know about "light-years". Miller is an elite talent, and while Niemi is solid, Miller gives them a guy in net who can steal games all on his own.
Still zero incentive for the Sharks to do this deal. Miller a great goalie but his cap hit is too much. Why would we increase our cap by $3.3m. It would just worsen our situation. We need to allocate more salary to 3rd line forwards (who deserve them). Not to the goalie position.

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11-30-2011, 01:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
What about just Miller/Roy for Pavelski/Niemi? I realize Pavelski is better, but "light-years"? Roy has a career 0.81ppg, Pavelski, 0,71. It's not huge, but it's true. Roy can play center, or the point on the power-play, can play the wing, and kills penalties. He's winning just about 55% of his face-offs, so while Pavelski is a bit higher, Roy has taken a lot more of them as well. So I don't know about "light-years". Miller is an elite talent, and while Niemi is solid, Miller gives them a guy in net who can steal games all on his own.
The second issue beyond what GI said is that Roy is more about assists. The Sharks have 3 guys for setup (JT, Clowe, Havlat) they have 3 snipers. Pavelski is primarily a sniper for the Sharks. Roy is a good player, so is Pavelski. The swap would screw up the Sharks. There are two second line centers for whom I would not swap Pavelski although their values are about equal (contract, age, production). Those two are Weiss and Roy.

I agree that Miller is well ahead of Niemi, but the salary would mess up the structure of the deal.

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11-30-2011, 01:22 AM
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Sharkway Drive
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Why would we want Brad Boyes back? I don't think he would fit on our 3rd line that well.
Just a guy who can provide scoring pop to the third line. Hecht would be more ideal.

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11-30-2011, 01:31 AM
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Just a guy who can provide scoring pop to the third line. Hecht would be more ideal.
Hecht's had a concussion most of the year. I'd be nervous trading a 2nd for him. If he could be had for less, I'd be interested.

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11-30-2011, 01:37 AM
  #20
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What's wrong with getting Boyes? He can easily pot 20 goals. He can step up to the top 6 when needed. The only issue is how's his skating.

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11-30-2011, 01:43 AM
  #21
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What's wrong with getting Boyes? He can easily pot 20 goals. He can step up to the top 6 when needed. The only issue is how's his skating.
Awful. TM would go crazy trying to fit him because he is practically useless for the Sharks except as a top 6.

I wouldn't want Hecht because he is really tailing off but he is of a type that would be useful.

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11-30-2011, 02:01 AM
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Yeah that is a big fat no for me. Murray is a monster and I like him where he is and Pavelski is a gold mine for the team, and potentially future captain.

As for Miller, I don't know what hes like right now so I have no opinion there

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11-30-2011, 02:17 AM
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As for Miller, I don't know what hes like right now so I have no opinion there
Personality wise, I definitely prefer Niemi and I wouldn't be surprised if the players feel the same way. Not to single out Miller since the majority of the goalies in the league do it, but sometimes when he lets in a goal, he lifts his arms up in disgust like he's blaming his teammates. Again, probably less than a handful of goalies don't do this, but Niemi is one of them. I've yet to see him complain to his teammates, or even complain to the refs.

Miller is definitely superior to Niemi skill-wise though.

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11-30-2011, 08:15 AM
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What's wrong with getting Boyes? He can easily pot 20 goals. He can step up to the top 6 when needed. The only issue is how's his skating.
Boyes hasn't potted 20 goals since 2008-09 and he's not on pace to do it this year either. I don't know where you got the idea that he can easily do it. His playoff performance, although brief, is also not impressive.

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11-30-2011, 09:46 AM
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I think he meant Andrew Murray!

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