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Trade Proposal Thread 2.0 - Never Trust A Man With Two First Names Edition

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:04 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
I've watched Stepan since HS. He will not be an 80 point player. Sorry.

The MAX he will hit is ~70. He just is not talented enough to hit more than that unless something crazy breaks his way (i.e. he plays with the next Gretzky).
He is certainly talented enough to hit 80 in his prime. Not necessarily consistently but in his best season(s), yes.

If the ducks are looking to move ryan, we have enough pieces to do so without moving stepan.

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11-30-2011, 06:04 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
the question is...can we still get Parise in the offseason

/greedy


hypothetically if you could do Dubinsky, erixon, mza, CT, a first, blah blah blah for Ryan then somehow get Parise in with a magic wand...could you imagine this club next season...

Ryan - Stepan - Gaborik
Parise - Richards - Callahan
Kreider - Anisimov - Hagelin
Rupp - Boyle - Prust

Staal - Sauer
MCD - Girardi
MDZ - Eminger

Henrik
Biron


excuse me, i have to change my pants.
Season's over, just give us the Cup. Of course this is probably a pipe dream with the cap going down.

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11-30-2011, 06:05 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Yeah, thank God we won't move a potential 1st line tweener (Stepan will never be a true #1 center) for a true top line power winger. THANK GOD.
Stepan will never be a true #1 center?

To quote you from two posts up...Based off of what? hopes and dreams?

Doesn't get much more hypocritical than that.

You like Ryan more than Stepan. That's cool. Opinions aren't facts.

I think Stepan is going to have a better career, and I bet Stepan even outscores him (points) as early as this year.

Stepan already creates more out of nothing on his own than Ryan does. Ryan is a great COMPLEMENTARY winger. He's not nearly as physical as he could be with his size and weight, and he's not as consistent as he could be in getting scoring chances. Stepan is also much better defensively.

There's no question Ryan is the better natural goal scorer and a proven producer, but you're acting like he's Eric Lindros in his prime, some power forward living legend. Get real, Jon.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:05 PM
  #154
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would you guys bite on anisimov, dubi and thomas?

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:05 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
Season's over, just give us the Cup. Of course this is probably a pipe dream with the cap going down.
let me dream damn you!!

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:06 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by Puckface NYR View Post
He is certainly talented enough to hit 80 in his prime. Not necessarily consistently but in his best season(s), yes.
Sorry. Just not going to happen. He's very, very talented. But there is a massive, massive difference between the 45 points he put up his rookie year, the ~45 points he is on pace to put up this year, and 70-80 points. Stepan is likely going to be a 65-70 point player. Something I've believed for years now.

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11-30-2011, 06:06 PM
  #157
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Want nothing to do with this bad-kneed, product of his linemates bum.



But seriously, my most preferred offer would be Anisimov, Erixon, 1st and prospect not named Kreider if need be. If that trade were to happen the Rangers are a damn serious threat. Robert Stevenson is a very good player and will really round out our top 6. This is the move Torts and Sather keep talking about when they think they are ready to go for the cup.

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11-30-2011, 06:06 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by bleedblue94 View Post
would you guys bite on anisimov, dubi and thomas?
Yes.

i mean....what more is there to say beyond yes? its more than id like to give up ideally, but id do it.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:06 PM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
the question is...can we still get Parise in the offseason

/greedy


hypothetically if you could do Dubinsky, erixon, mza, CT, a first, blah blah blah for Ryan then somehow get Parise in with a magic wand...could you imagine this club next season...

Ryan - Stepan - Gaborik
Parise - Richards - Callahan
Kreider - Anisimov - Hagelin
Rupp - Boyle - Prust

Staal - Sauer
MCD - Girardi
MDZ - Eminger

Henrik
Biron


excuse me, i have to change my pants.
lol, sather probably gonna have to pray when it comes to the day stepan, AA, sauer, mcdonagh want to ask for an extension

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:07 PM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue94 View Post
would you guys bite on anisimov, dubi and thomas?
You mean would they bite? I would do that in a second.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:07 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue94 View Post
would you guys bite on anisimov, dubi and thomas?
I'd bite, but i think they'd certainly want some sort of d coming back.

Dubinsky/Anisimov
McIlrath/Erixon
1st rounder


Seems to me the best bet.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:07 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by rangers4ever2007 View Post
lol, sather probably gonna have to pray when it comes to the day stepan, AA, sauer, mcdonagh want to ask for an extension
nah, we'll just sign Parise to a 150 year contract worth 100 million dollars, all paid in the first year lol.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:09 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
I've watched Stepan since HS. He will not be an 80 point player. Sorry.

The MAX he will hit is ~70. He just is not talented enough to hit more than that unless something crazy breaks his way (i.e. he plays with the next Gretzky).
Hahaha this is such a joke. You are so blinded by your own arrogance.

You KNOW Stepan will never score more than ~70 points BECAUSE YOU WATCHED HIM IN HIGHSCHOOL?

Damn, I bet the Rangers are emailing you every day begging you to be their head scout with crystal ball abilities like that!

Come ON. This is getting absurd.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:09 PM
  #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
Stepan will never be a true #1 center?

To quote you from two posts up...Based off of what? hopes and dreams?

Doesn't get much more hypocritical than that.
Based off of me watching the kid a hell of a lot more than anyone else on here. He's never had true #1 center potential. When we drafted him I figured he'd be more of a 2nd line guy based on what I saw of him at SSM. His play at Wisconsin opened the door for him to be an elite 2nd liner/very mediocre top liner.

His absolute, positive top end potential is a guy slightly below that of the current Brad Richards. You know what that would be? A 65-70 point center who can dish the puck, has a solid shot, etc.

But I know nothing about the guy. I was only one of two people on here praising the pick from the beginning. I should probably go watch him play more

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:12 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Based off of me watching the kid a hell of a lot more than anyone else on here. He's never had true #1 center potential. When we drafted him I figured he'd be more of a 2nd line guy based on what I saw of him at SSM. His play at Wisconsin opened the door for him to be an elite 2nd liner/very mediocre top liner.

His absolute, positive top end potential is a guy slightly below that of the current Brad Richards. You know what that would be? A 65-70 point center who can dish the puck, has a solid shot, etc.

But I know nothing about the guy. I was only one of two people on here praising the pick from the beginning. I should probably go watch him play more
I respect your insight but the arrogance in this post is really over the top. Many of us have watched him in college and almost all of us watch him every game in blue.

You're acting like because you watched him play 5 years ago in high school that you have a better grasp than anyone else judging his talent level now.

You do realize michael jordan was cut from his high school basketball team. Not saying that there isn't a benefit to watching him in high school but it's really not relevant to this conversation.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:12 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Yes.

i mean....what more is there to say beyond yes? its more than id like to give up ideally, but id do it.
it seems in the discussions its a thing where its either anisimov or dubi. thats why i ask. would people be ok moving both and a good prospect. we would possibily have to add another prospect or pick but i think that is something that could be a good starting point. i wonder if a guy like vtank has any value around the league at all as a prospect?

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11-30-2011, 06:13 PM
  #167
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I see Stepan as an upgraded version of Zajac, anyone agree?

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:14 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by bleedblue94 View Post
it seems in the discussions its a thing where its either anisimov or dubi. thats why i ask. would people be ok moving both and a good prospect. we would possibily have to add another prospect or pick but i think that is something that could be a good starting point. i wonder if a guy like vtank has any value around the league at all as a prospect?
yeah, but you removed a # 1 draft pick from the equation. with our scouting department, i trust our guys to make that a valuable pick for the organization.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:15 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Based off of me watching the kid a hell of a lot more than anyone else on here. He's never had true #1 center potential. When we drafted him I figured he'd be more of a 2nd line guy based on what I saw of him at SSM. His play at Wisconsin opened the door for him to be an elite 2nd liner/very mediocre top liner.

His absolute, positive top end potential is a guy slightly below that of the current Brad Richards. You know what that would be? A 65-70 point center who can dish the puck, has a solid shot, etc.

But I know nothing about the guy. I was only one of two people on here praising the pick from the beginning. I should probably go watch him play more
Did I tell you to go watch him more?

You're acting like players always and only progress on a linear path, and never make big strides or advances that make them skyrocket or plummet.

You're also acting like if someone has seen every single game a player has played since he was in diapers, they can automatically predict with exact certainty how many points they will or won't produce ten years into their NHL career.

Nobody's impressed that you watched him in highschool, man. You're like the kid whining that you were listening to the new popular band before anyone else was. Give it up, already. We come here for discussion. We don't come here to hear Jon's Undisputable Facts of Hockey.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:16 PM
  #170
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People realize that all of these players that are both knocking on the door of the NHL and playing with the Rangers now can not all play with the Rangers long-term right? Would you rather hold onto Dubinsky and lose him when his contract is up? How about MDZ?

Also, just as an FYI to everyone:

Bobby Ryan doesn't play on the Ducks #1 PP unit. Perry-Getzlaf-Selanne

Bobby Ryan does not ALWAYS play with Getzlaf and Perry at even strength.

Bobby Ryan would be one of, if not THE best forward the Rangers have on their entire roster.

Dubinsky + Erixon/MDZ + MZA + 2nd '12

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:18 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by Puckface NYR View Post
I respect your insight but the arrogance in this post is really over the top. Many of us have watched him in college and almost all of us watch him every game in blue.

You're acting like because you watched him play 5 years ago in high school that you have a better grasp than anyone else judging his talent level now.

You do realize michael jordan was cut from his high school basketball team. Not saying that there isn't a benefit to watching him in high school but it's really not relevant to this conversation.
Jon's inbox must be overflowing with emails from Glen Sather begging him to be the Rangers head scout, since he can predict with scientific certainty a players NHL career by just watching him in highschool. Jon also listened to your favorite band before you did.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:20 PM
  #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
Hahaha this is such a joke. You are so blinded by your own arrogance.

You KNOW Stepan will never score more than ~70 points BECAUSE YOU WATCHED HIM IN HIGHSCHOOL?

Damn, I bet the Rangers are emailing you every day begging you to be their head scout with crystal ball abilities like that!

Come ON. This is getting absurd.
And you've yet to offer up anything.

Stepan has never projected to be an 80 point 1st line center. Ever. His draft year, he was seen as a 60 point guy at his top end. Solid 2nd line center. He pretty much developed as I expected through college and looks to have a little bit of a better top end potential.

Think only about 5-10 points, but 5-10 points over 60 points is a massive difference (something you and others have some insane problem realizing).

He just does not have the skating and shot to be more than a 1st/2nd line tweener type. There's nothing wrong with that, but players do have a limit. He does not have unlimited potential (no matter what crap you'll surely try and peddle).

Having watched a kid develop like I have, I think I am certainly qualified to say how I think he'll continue to develop. The more you watch a player, the more you can analyze just how much better they get at each step. It's a huge advantage having watched someone play HS hockey. I wish I could focus on stuff like that now (zero time). You get a real connection with a player when you can follow them from the ground up like that.

Stepan has done nothing this year that leads me to believe he has higher potential than a 65-70 point center. He's progressing just as he should and has not made some massive leap that he wasn't expected to. The big difference we should begin to see is him getting more confident with his passing and shooting the puck less. His goals should plateau around 25 goals max, since he'll simply be passing more and have less chances to shoot the puck.

His ideal season is probably going to be about 20-25 goals matching up with 40-45 assists. Would love to see him hit a nice peak of 25/45 (which is 70 points).

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:22 PM
  #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
Jon's inbox must be overflowing with emails from Glen Sather begging him to be the Rangers head scout, since he can predict with scientific certainty a players NHL career by just watching him in highschool. Jon also listened to your favorite band before you did.
Look, kid. I know you've been around here for a year now and think you know everything. But I've had a very, very good track record when it comes to American players over the years. I understand that you would have absolutely no clue as to anything about that (mainly because I no longer post my top Americans list nor have any real chance to analyze more than a few players a year compared to what I used to).

Posts like this are highly annoying. The obnoxiousness that oozes from your post is infuriating. Must be nice to post on the board for a year or two and think you know everything about everyone!

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:25 PM
  #174
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Just so everyone understands, there were 9 players in the entire NHL last season with 80 points or over.

9.

Stepan will not be one of those 9, and there is nothing wrong with that. Being a 60-65 point player slots him in as a 1st line center on most NHL teams.

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11-30-2011, 06:27 PM
  #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
Just so everyone understands, there were 9 players in the entire NHL last season with 80 points or over.

9.

Stepan will not be one of those 9, and there is nothing wrong with that. Being a 60-65 point player slots him in as a 1st line center on most NHL teams.
Didn't you know? He will easily be better than Ryan. He has 85 point upside. You know. It's so common to hit those numbers.

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