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Old
12-01-2011, 04:55 PM
  #26
OilerFan2457
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Originally Posted by HossTheBoss View Post
At this time, I doubt Chicago has any interest in moving McNeill. If he is moved, it'll be in a package for an impact player.
I understand, its just he's an Edmonton boy, big 2 way centre, and RH shot. All things I like....

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12-01-2011, 09:25 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Eager is worthless ,, Lets be honest half the time with Hawks we were *****ing about him not being physical and taking stupid penalties

And that last sentence ,, Really? Offer the Oilers garbage and a decent prospect for there up and coming franchise player
First of all, he came here asking for McNeil. Second, I wouldn't call Stalberg garbage at all. I think he gets a lot of unwarranted hate around here, but regardless of that, I think he might just fit in the Oilers lineup a little better than he does ours. There's also that matter of the " + ??" and if I implied that the ?? should be something small then my mistake. I was just trying to say that if we wanted Hall we would certainly need to offer up something else- I just didn't know what because it would certainly be more than we were comfortable with parting with.


Oilerfan, if Hall's off the table that's all good- was just tossing ideas around. As for our specific needs, I think they go something like this:

1a) Physical 2nd/3rd line winger. If it's something that can score a bit, that's good, but mostly we need someone to be doing what Bickell should be doing. Using his size, making hits, crowding the net.
1b) Defender... I think probably a stay-at-home type... I think around 4th/5th defenseman. Most of all the guy just needs to be reliable- break up plays, clear out pucks from in front of the net, keep opposing forwards out of our goalie's grill. Our current pairings give up way too many breakaways, and our goaltenders give up a lot of goals because our defenders let forwards hang out right in the crease. We've got Leddy/Hjammer/Montador that are sort of collectively 3/4/5 depending on their performance any given night. Honestly if we could get another guy similar to Hjammer I'd be very very happy.
2) Upgrade LW in our top 6. We've had Stalberg, Carcillo, Brunette, Frolik even at one point if I recall correctly all take turns in the top 6 and none of them really get it done like we need them too. We need a LW that belongs in the top 6... guy with a bit of size and strong on the puck is preferable. as we have plenty of smallish skill guys currently.

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Old
12-02-2011, 01:46 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by zytz View Post
First of all, he came here asking for McNeil. Second, I wouldn't call Stalberg garbage at all. I think he gets a lot of unwarranted hate around here, but regardless of that, I think he might just fit in the Oilers lineup a little better than he does ours. There's also that matter of the " + ??" and if I implied that the ?? should be something small then my mistake. I was just trying to say that if we wanted Hall we would certainly need to offer up something else- I just didn't know what because it would certainly be more than we were comfortable with parting with.


Oilerfan, if Hall's off the table that's all good- was just tossing ideas around. As for our specific needs, I think they go something like this:

1a) Physical 2nd/3rd line winger. If it's something that can score a bit, that's good, but mostly we need someone to be doing what Bickell should be doing. Using his size, making hits, crowding the net.
1b) Defender... I think probably a stay-at-home type... I think around 4th/5th defenseman. Most of all the guy just needs to be reliable- break up plays, clear out pucks from in front of the net, keep opposing forwards out of our goalie's grill. Our current pairings give up way too many breakaways, and our goaltenders give up a lot of goals because our defenders let forwards hang out right in the crease. We've got Leddy/Hjammer/Montador that are sort of collectively 3/4/5 depending on their performance any given night. Honestly if we could get another guy similar to Hjammer I'd be very very happy.
2) Upgrade LW in our top 6. We've had Stalberg, Carcillo, Brunette, Frolik even at one point if I recall correctly all take turns in the top 6 and none of them really get it done like we need them too. We need a LW that belongs in the top 6... guy with a bit of size and strong on the puck is preferable. as we have plenty of smallish skill guys currently.
1a)/1b) Not really sure we have anything your looking for. I don't want to undermind you by trying to sell a Ryan Jones/Theo Peckham/Eager/Barker type as I don't think any of them upgrade anything you you got as for 2) Again the only thing we got that only kinda fits that description, other than than the size part, would be Omark/Gagner(playing LW is not a common occurrence)

Maybe its not such a good match of needs/wants

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Old
12-02-2011, 08:30 AM
  #29
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hey what about Paajarvi + Smid for McNeill + Lalonde + Bickell/Draft pick?

That way it gives us that size/skill combo on the LW in MPS and we get our bottom pairing Defensive D-Man in Smid who is still has a lot of potential and wasn't there talk of us trying to get him last year at the trade deadline but instead we ended up with Campoli

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12-02-2011, 05:54 PM
  #30
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Swap McNeill for Paajarvi or Ganger?

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12-02-2011, 05:58 PM
  #31
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I'm not a huge fan of swapping prospects until you have a pretty good idea of the kind of players they are. I'd rather see the hawks hold on to mcneil for awhile and see what kinda player he becomes.

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12-02-2011, 06:04 PM
  #32
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Paajarvi has the potential to be a Hossa clone. He's huge, fast, and has pretty slick hands. Would be a hell of a mentor for him and we can continue our Swedish connection.

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Old
12-03-2011, 07:06 AM
  #33
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Paajarvi would be great and would fix a need. Give them Bickell and McNeill

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Old
12-03-2011, 05:00 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by brtriad View Post
Paajarvi has the potential to be a Hossa clone. He's huge, fast, and has pretty slick hands. Would be a hell of a mentor for him and we can continue our Swedish connection.
Why does everyone keep comparing Paajarvi to Hossa? I'm sorry, I've seen him play 7-9 times since joining the league and I just don't see it. He's a smaller Stalberg, with better hands and slightly better hockey sense.. neither can finish. He has potential, but he doesn't have potential to be as good as Hossa is/was and certainly doesn't play as physical a game.

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12-03-2011, 05:18 PM
  #35
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Hossa was not always the finely tuned two-way specimen he is today. In terms of size, skill, hockey sense, and work ethic, they're very similar players.

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Old
12-03-2011, 10:24 PM
  #36
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Not sure why we'd trade McNeill at this point... I think he has just as high of an upside as Pirri/Kruger at this point and has a much higher work ethic. At the very worst, we have a solid/hard-working 3rd line center to replace Bolland or Kruger. He's a good prospect to have and I have to admit that I'm rooting for him ever since he fell in the draft and admitted he was a Hawks fan.

No need to trade him unless we can package him with a somewhat decent (anyone less in value than Bolland) player to get a 2nd line center. McNeill strikes me as the kinda guy who will progressively get better as he grows older. It just seems like he has a Toews-like drive.... but maybe I'm wrong.

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Old
12-03-2011, 11:06 PM
  #37
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Do you think he is currently better than Kruger? Sure his body type is the exact type of center we could use --I thought we lucked out to get him at #18... He is exactly what they need to center the Kane -- Sharp line, but I view him as more than a year away from NHL ready.

I would think he takes the standard 2 1/2 years before he sticks. The Blackhawks organization is respected for not rushing prospects. Beach has taken time to develop. Saad has not they allowed him to make the team. I thought they kept Morin in the AHL to long last year but cap issues may have been part of that decision. Overall I like how they run prospects.

We will make a trade and upgrade the defense. You know this as well as I do. In order to get something good a blue chip prospect is likely to go.

I think most fans want to keep these three prospects in this order Saad, McNeill, Morin. Pirri probably is most likely to be traded. I was happy when we got McNeill, but after seeing him at prospects camp he was far behind Saad. I also thought and still think Pirri is a full year or two ahead of McNeill.

I really don't want to wait 2 years for McNeill because I think we are one solid defenseman and one physical forward (doesn't have to be a scorer) from being a top three team in all of the NHL.

My two prospects available would be McNeill & Pirri. You have to give to get.

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Old
12-04-2011, 10:56 AM
  #38
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no, McNeill is not as good as Krüger right now...

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12-11-2011, 10:49 AM
  #39
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We are thin at center both on the big club and throughout the organization. We were lucky to get McNeil at 18. If he becomes the guy he is capable of he could be a fixture at #2 behind Jonny for years to come. Two guys at center who play hard, play both ends, can take the grind, are good in the dot...he's potentially just what we need. Saad and McNeil would be the two guys I would not be willing to deal. Not even for fun.

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12-11-2011, 11:31 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose vasko View Post
We are thin at center both on the big club and throughout the organization. We were lucky to get McNeil at 18. If he becomes the guy he is capable of he could be a fixture at #2 behind Jonny for years to come. Two guys at center who play hard, play both ends, can take the grind, are good in the dot...he's potentially just what we need. Saad and McNeil would be the two guys I would not be willing to deal. Not even for fun.
Thin at center on club? Let's see what our players are capable of

Toews: #1C
Kane: #1/2C
Sharp: #2C
Bolland: #2/3C
Kruger: #3/4C (#2C?)
Mayers: #4C
(Smith: #4C?)

Not a lot of teams can boast similar versatility.

Thin at center in organization?

1. Pirri (PPG, AHL)
2. Mcneill (PPG+, WHL, WJC-potential)
3. Danault (PPG+, QMJHL, WJC-potential)
4. Kayes (15pts/18games, NCAA Hockey East)

Again, most competitive teams don't have multiple prospects capable of this.

Basically, I'm not buying this "thin at center" businses.


Last edited by Sevanston: 12-11-2011 at 11:38 AM.
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Old
12-11-2011, 12:22 PM
  #41
moose vasko
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Originally Posted by Sevanston View Post
Thin at center on club? Let's see what our players are capable of

Toews: #1C
Kane: #1/2C
Sharp: #2C
Bolland: #2/3C
Kruger: #3/4C (#2C?)
Mayers: #4C
(Smith: #4C?)

Not a lot of teams can boast similar versatility.

Thin at center in organization?

1. Pirri (PPG, AHL)
2. Mcneill (PPG+, WHL, WJC-potential)
3. Danault (PPG+, QMJHL, WJC-potential)
4. Kayes (15pts/18games, NCAA Hockey East)

Again, most competitive teams don't have multiple prospects capable of this.

Basically, I'm not buying this "thin at center" businses.
Reality check.

Real NHL centers: Toews, Bolland, Kruger (?)
NHL wingers who can/might fill in at center: Sharp, Kane, Mayers, Smith (?).

Solid center prospects: McNeil
Center/wing prospects (bottom 6): Kayes, Danault
Undersized but encouraging: Pirri

But hey, believe whatever you want.

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12-11-2011, 01:04 PM
  #42
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Your preference that they play wing doesn't preclude the fact that they are all very capable at playing center.

Sharp playing #2C instead of LW didn't seem to stop us from winning the Cup.

As for the prospects, only time will tell, but I think you're underestimating Danault and Pirri.

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Old
12-11-2011, 01:28 PM
  #43
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not every team has Crosby/Malkin/Staal or Datsyuk/Z/Filppula


we are fine at C.

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12-11-2011, 02:46 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
not every team has Crosby/Malkin/Staal or Datsyuk/Z/Filppula


we are fine at C.
Of course, you do realize the Hawks, Wings and Pens make up 3 of the last 4 Stanley Cup winners (with the other team Boston, also being loaded at center). Being fine and being ready to win the Stanley Cup are different things.

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12-11-2011, 04:51 PM
  #45
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Of course, you do realize the Hawks, Wings and Pens make up 3 of the last 4 Stanley Cup winners (with the other team Boston, also being loaded at center). Being fine and being ready to win the Stanley Cup are different things.
I think our center depth is good enough to win the Stanley Cup, its better than it was our Cup year with the addition of Kruger and new found versatility of Kane. I also wouldn't sell K.Hayes short in terms of prospect status either, although I personally think his skills play better at wing than center, but this is the best our center depth has been throughout the org in years.

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Old
12-11-2011, 06:56 PM
  #46
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Of course, you do realize the Hawks, Wings and Pens make up 3 of the last 4 Stanley Cup winners (with the other team Boston, also being loaded at center). Being fine and being ready to win the Stanley Cup are different things.
Of course, you do realize the Hawks won the Stanley Cup with Toews, Sharp, Bolland as the top three centre's. At any time Sharp can go back to centre and we'd have the exact same top 3 centres as when we won the Cup. The only difference between that year and this year is that Marcus Kruger would be the 4th line centre in that situation, not Madden.. and personally, given where they were/are in their careers, I think Kruger is an improvement.

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12-11-2011, 07:37 PM
  #47
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Toews, Sharp, and Bolland were good enough down the middle to win it all when Buff, Ladd, and Versteeg were all playing wing (pretty well as I recall). I'm not sure Stalberg, Frolik, and Smith bring quite as much to the table.

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Old
12-12-2011, 07:51 AM
  #48
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and we can't make any trades


right now, our C depth is fine and nothing to worry about

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