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McDonagh vs Subban

View Poll Results: Who would you rather have in your top four?
P.K. Subban 229 42.25%
Ryan McDonagh 313 57.75%
Voters: 542. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-26-2012, 09:57 PM
  #276
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Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
It's fun to play "what if" but McDonagh is actually doing it. It's hard to dispute a +24 as a defense man who plays 25-26 minutes a night against the other teams top forwards.

No one here is disputing that Subban is better offensively. Although this season, it isn't by much. A mere 8 points separate the two. But the differential in defense is astronomical in my opinion.

One of the biggest reasons the NYR's defense has been as strong as it has been through sections of the year is primarily because of the Girardi/McDonagh pairing. McDonagh has played a significant role in the Rangers tentative first place position.

I know MTL fans might be bitter because McDonagh was acquired for Gomez, but to compare the two defensively just doesn't make sense to me. McDonagh's game is vastly under appreciated on the forum. There are few 20-22 year old defense men that I'd take over McDonagh at this point, and Subban isn't one of them.
I guess this is the type of word usage that confirms that not even a slight form of agreement will be reached here.

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03-26-2012, 11:45 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
I think McDonagh has a ton of offensive potential. He shows flashes of brilliance on the ice. Beyond that, he is one of the best skating defense men in the NHL. I think McDonagh will peak around 40-50 points per season while being an elite shut down defense man.
This post is a joke, prepare to be heavily disapointed.

I see this thread has turned into a Rangers fans circle jerk and the overrating of McDonagh.

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03-27-2012, 09:24 AM
  #278
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
This post is a joke, prepare to be heavily disapointed.

I see this thread has turned into a Rangers fans circle jerk and the overrating of McDonagh.
Give me a break. The kid is a master of the ice. Everywhere he goes he is a winner, ever since he won "Mr. Hockey" (best hockey player) in the state of Minnesota, which produces more NHL talent than any other state in the country, by far.

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03-27-2012, 09:32 AM
  #279
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Originally Posted by 651 View Post
Give me a break. The kid is a master of the ice. Everywhere he goes he is a winner, ever since he won "Mr. Hockey" (best hockey player) in the state of Minnesota, which produces more NHL talent than any other state in the country, by far.
That's gold. David Fisher was also "Mr. Hockey" and look how he turned out. Saying things like master on the ice and everywhere he goes he is a winner really doesn't mean anything at all. He had a bad WJC and was fading away as a prospect in our depth chart before the trade happened. There's really no substance to your post just a bunch of Wrah-Wrah nonsense that speaks more of the Minnesota hockey program than it does about McDonagh. You really believe hes going to be a 50 point defenseman?


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03-27-2012, 09:38 AM
  #280
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
That's gold. David Fisher was also "Mr. Hockey" and look how he turned out. Saying things like master on the ice and everywhere he goes he is a winner really doesn't mean anything at all. He had a bad WJC and was fading away as a prospect in our depth chart before the trade happened. There's really no substance to your post just a bunch of Wrah-Wrah nonsense. You really believe hes going to be a 50 point defenseman?
It really isn't that outlandish to say. I doubt that he'll ever be a consistent 50 point defenseman, but McDonagh has a wealth of untapped skill. He'll walk around several players once a game and fire some rifles, it's just that he lacks finish right now. Who's to say it doesn't develop anymore?

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03-27-2012, 09:41 AM
  #281
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
It really isn't that outlandish to say. I doubt that he'll ever be a consistent 50 point defenseman, but McDonagh has a wealth of untapped skill. He'll walk around several players once a game and fire some rifles, it's just that he lacks finish right now. Who's to say it doesn't develop anymore?
Now I've seen it all. People are actually defending that outlandish claim? This thread is FULL of homers.

I'll tell you what, if McDonagh can reach 50 points, Subban is going to be a 80 pt defenseman one day.

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03-27-2012, 09:46 AM
  #282
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
Now I've seen it all. People are actually defending that outlandish claim? This thread is FULL of homers.

I'll tell you what, if McDonagh can reach 50 points, Subban is going to be a 80 pt defenseman one day.
Provide an argument more stable than "OMG HOMERS!!11" if it is so outlandish, then.

I watch the kid play every game. I doubt hes a 50 point defenseman bit the skill is most definitely there. Whats so outlandish about that? People get so personally offended by opinions. Get over it. Jeez.

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03-27-2012, 09:56 AM
  #283
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
Provide an argument more stable than "OMG HOMERS!!11" if it is so outlandish, then.

I watch the kid play every game. I doubt hes a 50 point defenseman bit the skill is most definitely there. Whats so outlandish about that? People get so personally offended by opinions. Get over it. Jeez.
Why do I have to provide an argument that he won't reach 50 points? It's outlandish for a reason, because he isn't a two way defenseman. Never was, and never will be. He's not counted on to provide offense, but to play well in his zone and prevent goals. This is what I'm talking about when I say you guys are overrating the heck out of him. The most points he's ever scored was in high school with 45, so unless you want to base your prediction on something that happened against 16 yr old kids, the most points he's ever gotten as a defenseman is his current pace on one of the best teams in the east with 27.

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03-27-2012, 09:59 AM
  #284
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
Why do I have to provide an argument that he won't reach 50 points? It's outlandish for a reason, because he isn't a two way defenseman. Never was, and never will be. He's not counted on to provide offense, but to play well in his zone and prevent goals. This is what I'm talking about when I say you guys are overrating the heck out of him.
He is a two way defenseman so your argument is based on a complete fallacy.

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03-27-2012, 10:01 AM
  #285
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
He is a two way defenseman so your argument is based on a complete fallacy.
Two way defensemen get powerplay minutes, especially on one of the worst PP's in the league. So no, he isn't a two way defenseman.

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03-27-2012, 10:05 AM
  #286
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Two way defensemen get powerplay minutes, especially on one of the worst PP's in the league. So no, he isn't a two way defenseman.
Richards/Del Zotto play almost the entire powerplay. So, again, fallacy.

You're not very good at this.

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03-27-2012, 10:08 AM
  #287
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
Richards/Del Zotto play almost the entire powerplay. So, again, fallacy.

You're not very good at this.
They play the entire powerplay because you don't have other options. Richards on the point speaks volumes about your defense. Del Zotto is the only offensive defenseman you have, the rest are mostly stay-at-home types. If I'm bad, you're terrible at this. Especially since you think Wayde Simmonds is "arguably" better than Subban. That's all I need to know about your opinion really.

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03-27-2012, 10:19 AM
  #288
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Originally Posted by 651 View Post
Give me a break. The kid is a master of the ice. Everywhere he goes he is a winner, ever since he won "Mr. Hockey" (best hockey player) in the state of Minnesota, which produces more NHL talent than any other state in the country, by far.
Lol Mr.Hockey. Go look at past winners.

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03-27-2012, 10:43 AM
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
It really isn't that outlandish to say. I doubt that he'll ever be a consistent 50 point defenseman, but McDonagh has a wealth of untapped skill. He'll walk around several players once a game and fire some rifles, it's just that he lacks finish right now. Who's to say it doesn't develop anymore?
EDIT: I misread the first sentence of your post.

McDonagh will be a special player for sure.

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03-27-2012, 01:51 PM
  #290
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
That's gold. David Fisher was also "Mr. Hockey" and look how he turned out. Saying things like master on the ice and everywhere he goes he is a winner really doesn't mean anything at all. He had a bad WJC and was fading away as a prospect in our depth chart before the trade happened. There's really no substance to your post just a bunch of Wrah-Wrah nonsense that speaks more of the Minnesota hockey program than it does about McDonagh. You really believe hes going to be a 50 point defenseman?
Ohhh, did I touch a nerve there?

Sure, there are PLENTY of Mr. Hockey kids that came and went (flash in pan) but it's still a relevant achievment.

And I will NOT shy away from saying Minnesota hockey IS superior to any other in the Union, bar none, far and away. You should thank our great state for all we've done for the game and continue to do. We should actually secede from the nonsense of the USNDP et al and their want to discredit us. MN alone could produce a team worthy of contending for Gold at any "championships," but eh, whatever.

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03-27-2012, 01:53 PM
  #291
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Lol Mr.Hockey. Go look at past winners.
LOL, go look at past players who didn't achieve it and still are all stars in the NHL.

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03-27-2012, 02:29 PM
  #292
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Originally Posted by 651 View Post
Ohhh, did I touch a nerve there?

Sure, there are PLENTY of Mr. Hockey kids that came and went (flash in pan) but it's still a relevant achievment.

And I will NOT shy away from saying Minnesota hockey IS superior to any other in the Union, bar none, far and away. You should thank our great state for all we've done for the game and continue to do. We should actually secede from the nonsense of the USNDP et al and their want to discredit us. MN alone could produce a team worthy of contending for Gold at any "championships," but eh, whatever.
As a hockey fan from Canada, I say hats off to the hockey program in Minnesota and the state's overall dedication towards hockey. If more regions in the US displayed half the amount of passion to hockey, this great sport wouldn't be relegated behind basketball, NASCAR and other so-called sports.

But all this makes no difference with the debate here: Subban is the more desirable asset with higher upside. Two things seem to go against Subban in this poll's results (notwithstanding the Rangers' overall stellar performance as a team this year): (1) McDonagh seem to rally US fans because of his origins and his definite future presence on US national teams, and (2) non-Habs fans irrational hate towards Subban (and still referring to his lack of defensive awareness, which is absurd).

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03-27-2012, 02:34 PM
  #293
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
They play the entire powerplay because you don't have other options. Richards on the point speaks volumes about your defense.
Are you really that dense? You have no idea what you're talking about. Richards has manned the point of the PP for his entire career and this year is no exception.

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03-27-2012, 03:14 PM
  #294
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Are you really that dense? You have no idea what you're talking about. Richards has manned the point of the PP for his entire career and this year is no exception.
Plus we rarely play DZ on the PP anymore either. We have Gabby in position like Stamkos

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03-27-2012, 03:18 PM
  #295
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Originally Posted by Clipitar View Post
As a hockey fan from Canada, I say hats off to the hockey program in Minnesota and the state's overall dedication towards hockey. If more regions in the US displayed half the amount of passion to hockey, this great sport wouldn't be relegated behind basketball, NASCAR and other so-called sports.

But all this makes no difference with the debate here: Subban is the more desirable asset with higher upside. Two things seem to go against Subban in this poll's results (notwithstanding the Rangers' overall stellar performance as a team this year): (1) McDonagh seem to rally US fans because of his origins and his definite future presence on US national teams, and (2) non-Habs fans irrational hate towards Subban (and still referring to his lack of defensive awareness, which is absurd).
It's the just the way we're structured - the coldest state in the Union (lower 48, by far), the large Scandinavian (most in America, by far), German, European-Americans in general, and just a general history that embraced the game. I give props to all the other players from the States that I love to watch (Kane, Miller, Thomas, etc.) and I am honestly just puling everyone else's chain about our superiority about it.

I think Suban is a great player, and as I've mentioned already, rehash this thread in five years and then we shall see who is more elite.

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03-27-2012, 04:18 PM
  #296
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Originally Posted by 651 View Post
It's the just the way we're structured - the coldest state in the Union (lower 48, by far), the large Scandinavian (most in America, by far), German, European-Americans in general, and just a general history that embraced the game. I give props to all the other players from the States that I love to watch (Kane, Miller, Thomas, etc.) and I am honestly just puling everyone else's chain about our superiority about it.

I think Suban is a great player, and as I've mentioned already, rehash this thread in five years and then we shall see who is more elite.
To think both could have been paired together on Montreal's top unit for the next decade...

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03-27-2012, 04:22 PM
  #297
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People think McDonagh having a 50 point season at some point in his career is outlandish? He certainly has the potential and the skill to do so. I wouldn't rule it out by any means. Is it likely, maybe not, but it's a scenario that shouldn't be scoffed at right away. The guy has tremendous awareness all over the ice, including the offensive zone.

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03-27-2012, 05:25 PM
  #298
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To think both could have been paired together on Montreal's top unit for the next decade...
**** you Bob Gainey.

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03-27-2012, 09:16 PM
  #299
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The skill is oozing from McDonagh right now!

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03-27-2012, 09:33 PM
  #300
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The skill is oozing from McDonagh right now!
No doubt. Beautiful late game assist and then they had him out there the last minute.

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