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Is Kovalev still a priority???

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09-19-2004, 07:53 PM
  #1
Mooch
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Is Kovalev still a priority???

With the lock-out things may be different for the Habs now concering Kovalev......Note: This is long, only if your bored attempt to read


First off, Kovalev is 31, and with no hockey most likely for the whole season this year...he will be 32 coming into next season. So basically that means that hes got another year after that untill he gets out of his prime, based on the fact that between 27-33 is prime in the nhl. Thats not to say he wont perform after that, but he will certainly decline to some extent. Anyways, the point of this thread is not about wheter Kovalev will perform after his prime or not. Rather, its about wheter there will be room for him after the lock-out.

The reason i bring this up is because, our prospects will be one year further in developement on year from now. As its been mentioned, Hossa will most like be in the roster due to not being able to be sent down without being picked up by another team. Perezhogan, as expected by Habs managemnt, was ready to play this year, but cant due to his actions last season in the ahl. Non the less he was ready to play, so id say its fair to assume he will most likely have a roster spot availible after the lock-out.

Higgins has also developed well, and after next season, theres very little doubt that he too will be ready to play. Hes very good defensivley, has the nhl size and strength, and has more than decent speed. So, id say its also fair to assume that he could be ready after the lock-out with another full year of developement.

Now to Pleks,another guy whos done very well in the ahl. He too could be ready to play after another season of developement. Hes more of a quesion mark then lets say Perezhogan and Higgins in terms of being ready, but hes got a chance and shouldnt be left out of the equation considering the season he had last year.

Finally, Kostitsyn. Many have said that he has the offensive skills, speed, and size to play in the nhl, but just needs to polish up on his defensive game. Well with a full year in the ahl, he could very well be ready next season, especially when you consider that hes our most talented prospect.

Now obviuosly not all these guys will make it, due to the fact that you just cant bring in that many prospects on a play-off bound team, but i could see atleast 3 guys coming in.

Personally, in no particular order, id say......

Kostitsyn, Perezhogan, Higgins and Hossa may be on the team next year up front, where Hossa and Higgins could split time on the third line or battle for that spot. So that means 3 spots will have to be left open, simple math...right! So, now adding Koavel back into the equation, where does he fit in after another year??

You have to consider the fact that we are in a youth movement. Sure it would be great to have a guy like Kovalev, but we have to start developing our young talent sooner or later, and hopefully sooner!

So lets say those three above were to make the team next year, our lines would be something like.......

Kostitsyn, Koivu, Zednik
Perezhogan, Ribs, Ryder
Higgins/Hossa, Bonk, Bulis
Begin, Pleks?/Ufa, Ward

Theres just gona be no room. Unless of course most of the prospects we have falter, but it doesnt seem that way so far.......


So whats gona happen with Kovalev now, will gainey drift away from the idea of signing him, because when you put it all into prospective, roster spots are quickly filling up................

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09-19-2004, 07:59 PM
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There's a frezze on signing players now that the lockout is in place from what I read.

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09-19-2004, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal
There's a frezze on signing players now that the lockout is in place from what I read.
Really, for how long. Untill lock-out ends??

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09-19-2004, 08:16 PM
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Personally i think this is a good topic u bring up mooch. Gainey has all sorts of options he can make. I am almost positive he won't sign kovalev if the lockout is 1 year.

You say we have Kostitsyn, Higgins, Hossa and Plekank...that is more than enough offence we need from our young guys. Gainey should give them all playing time on the big club and so who does good and bad. After that gainey will have the decision to make on who to keep because personally i think we should not have more than 2 rookies on the team.

Why don't we trade one of our prospects that didn;t do too well with the big club for help and defense and goalie prospects. I personaly think we need to get a good goalie prospect becasue danis isnt looking good.

Id say we trade plekank and get a goalie prospect because plekank is way too small for the NHL and he wont produce

Then i say gainey should put hossa and higgins on the team and mainey of u say Kostitsyn needs only one year in the AHL but why rush him when he is considered our best prospect and we dont really need him now

and then in a couple of years you have lambert and urqhart coming, so you gotta make some room and you have to sign some UFA's it can't be all prospects

that is my 2 cent

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09-19-2004, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsFanFromPEI
Personally i think this is a good topic u bring up mooch. Gainey has all sorts of options he can make. I am almost positive he won't sign kovalev if the lockout is 1 year.

You say we have Kostitsyn, Higgins, Hossa and Plekank...that is more than enough offence we need from our young guys. Gainey should give them all playing time on the big club and so who does good and bad. After that gainey will have the decision to make on who to keep because personally i think we should not have more than 2 rookies on the team.

Why don't we trade one of our prospects that didn;t do too well with the big club for help and defense and goalie prospects. I personaly think we need to get a good goalie prospect becasue danis isnt looking good.

Id say we trade plekank and get a goalie prospect because plekank is way too small for the NHL and he wont produce

Then i say gainey should put hossa and higgins on the team and mainey of u say Kostitsyn needs only one year in the AHL but why rush him when he is considered our best prospect and we dont really need him now

and then in a couple of years you have lambert and urqhart coming, so you gotta make some room and you have to sign some UFA's it can't be all prospects

that is my 2 cent
Agreed with most of what you say, except Pleks. Hes stronger than Ribs, and has more speed.....add to that hes got the skill. So why cant he make it again.....................


Last edited by Mooch: 09-19-2004 at 09:02 PM.
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09-19-2004, 09:02 PM
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I dont think we should sign kovy. I dont know if he really wants to play here and i'd rather give Higgins, Pleks,Hossa or Kastitsitsyn some spots. We have the best young guys in the league PLAY THEM!!!!

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09-19-2004, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERIK HABSFAN
I dont think we should sign kovy. I dont know if he really wants to play here and i'd rather give Higgins, Pleks,Hossa or Kastitsitsyn some spots. We have the best young guys in the league PLAY THEM!!!!
Lol, while i dont no if thier the best(feeling a bit optimistic today ) i agree they should be played sooner rather than later!!

Welcome aboard by the way!!

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09-19-2004, 09:12 PM
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Very good topic indeed....

We also have to consider that we may have players that will have played professional hockey at a level that might be equivalent to the AHL next year, so players that will strive in the AHL this year are even more likely to succeed at the NHL level the following year....

As mentionned before guys like Higgins, Plekanek, Hossa, Perezhogin, Kostsitsyn, Milroy will all challenge for a regular spot.... Which makes me think that the likes of Bulis, Sundstrum and to a lesser extent zednik and Ribeiro will have to keep there feet moving pretty quick to remain in the lineup.

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09-19-2004, 09:19 PM
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To tell you the truth, I dont really care as long as it makes the team better short term and long term. Problem is, Kovalev probably wouldnt sign for 1 year or 2, so I'd say that if the lock out lasts that long, dont resign him.

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09-19-2004, 09:21 PM
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yes we have some of the best young talent BUT let BG and Julien bring them along at the right pace. I don't want to ruin any of them. If it's done right 5-7 realy good prospects will form a great core for a run at the cup in 2-3 years. If the habs a lucky, one or two will emerge as real stars but the important part I feel is that the rest will evolve as top 2nd and third line guys making the habs a true contender for a long time. I don't want a one trick pony, I want an overall well balanced club that will be realy hard to beat night after night. If Kostitsyn and Perz end up at 35-40 each but the rest produce 20-30 each then that club would be awesome.

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09-19-2004, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsaku
To tell you the truth, I dont really care as long as it makes the team better short term and long term. Problem is, Kovalev probably wouldnt sign for 1 year or 2, so I'd say that if the lock out lasts that long, dont resign him.
Ya thats true. He most likely will want a 3 year contract, so id say the best thing is to forget him if he wants 3 yeats after a full lock-out........

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09-19-2004, 09:57 PM
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I think it all depends on how hard Kovalev will work during the lockout. If you remember last year Gaborik didn't attend training camp in 2002 (unsigned at the time) he had a terrible season. If Kovalev doesn't play till say (jan if the lockout is resolved) I would expect the same from him. I think it would be smart for us to go with a player that is playing and is devoted to the game, rather then someone who's taking a break (Selanne, if he doesn't retire).

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09-19-2004, 10:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
I think it all depends on how hard Kovalev will work during the lockout. If you remember last year Gaborik didn't attend training camp in 2002 (unsigned at the time) he had a terrible season. If Kovalev doesn't play till say (jan if the lockout is resolved) I would expect the same from him. I think it would be smart for us to go with a player that is playing and is devoted to the game, rather then someone who's taking a break (Selanne, if he doesn't retire).
Ok lets say Kovalev is ready, and trains.

But at the same time, it looks as if three prospect will earn a spot next season. Then what??

Do we forget Kovalev, thats the scenario im trying to bring up......

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09-19-2004, 10:24 PM
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I think we could definetely use Kovalev (if he trains and plays well) regardless of our prospects. They will definetely not be of Kovalev's calibre. If anything has to happen, we should get rid of Zednick. As I do believe that some of our prospects could become better then him (given the time). I'm not sure weither that will be right after the lockout has been solved though. My point is that, Kovalev (potential 75+pts) is a much bigger need then Zednick (maxing at 60pts). A positive thing could come from trading Zednick (2nd draft pick maybe?).

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09-19-2004, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
I think we could definetely use Kovalev (if he trains and plays well) regardless of our prospects. They will definetely not be of Kovalev's calibre. If anything has to happen, we should get rid of Zednick. As I do believe that some of our prospects could become better then him (given the time). I'm not sure weither that will be right after the lockout has been solved though. My point is that, Kovalev (potential 75+pts) is a much bigger need then Zednick (maxing at 60pts). A positive thing could come from trading Zednick (2nd draft pick maybe?).
I wouldnt trade Zednik, he may not produce much in the regular season, but hes very valuable in the playoffs. Hes a beast in the playoffs, and isnt that when you need your players to show up.....when it counts.

Last two playoff runs......

2003-04 11 games 3g 3a 6p +7
2001-02 4 games 4g 4a 8p +3

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09-19-2004, 10:29 PM
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Yes Alexei Kovalev is still very much a priority to Bob Gainey.

This poster seems to be acting like this labour situation, and the strong possibilty of no season at all, is sudden news.

I assure you, Bob Gainey (and the rest of the NHL for that matter) knew there was strong chance LAST September that this year would get washed out. As a result EVERY decsion he's made has been made with the assumption (or acknowledgement) that this year could be canceled.)

So clearly, when he offered Alexei a contract in June, he was well aware of what lay ahead.

So I find it odd that you know he made a contract offer to Alexei, yet you ask this question now. What has changed since June?

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09-19-2004, 10:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FerrisRox
Yes Alexei Kovalev is still very much a priority to Bob Gainey.

This poster seems to be acting like this labour situation, and the strong possibilty of no season at all, is sudden news.

I assure you, Bob Gainey (and the rest of the NHL for that matter) knew there was strong chance LAST September that this year would get washed out. As a result EVERY decsion he's made has been made with the assumption (or acknowledgement) that this year could be canceled.)

So clearly, when he offered Alexei a contract in June, he was well aware of what lay ahead.

So I find it odd that you know he made a contract offer to Alexei, yet you ask this question now. What has changed since June?

I really dont know how gainey was thinking then or what he was thinking.

Perhaps he was thinking something would be resolved, i dont know.......

He did mention many times he would do business like usual, so.....

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09-19-2004, 10:40 PM
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If the lock-out is long (we loss 2004-2005 season...), then, i think we should stop trying to sign Kovalev.

If the lock-out is short, i think that Kovalev could help us a lot.

Good question Mooch.

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09-19-2004, 11:56 PM
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[QUOTE=Mooch]
Kostitsyn, Koivu, Zednik
Perezhogan, Ribs, Ryder
Higgins/Hossa, Bonk, Bulis
Begin, Pleks?/Ufa, Ward
QUOTE]
That is how I see the thing to

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09-20-2004, 05:44 AM
  #20
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[QUOTE=komisakick ass]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Kostitsyn, Koivu, Zednik
Perezhogan, Ribs, Ryder
Higgins/Hossa, Bonk, Bulis
Begin, Pleks?/Ufa, Ward
That isn't a playoff team. I think everyone is a little premature on Kostitsyn's advancement to the NHL. At least one more year, however bringing three rookies into the fold all at once could be deadly. I'd still sign a scoring winger, and then keep down or trade one of Higgins or Hossa, in my opinion Hossa. That way we don't have a rookie on pretty much every line. Just my cent and a half.

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09-20-2004, 06:00 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERIK HABSFAN
I dont think we should sign kovy. I dont know if he really wants to play here and i'd rather give Higgins, Pleks,Hossa or Kastitsitsyn some spots. We have the best young guys in the league PLAY THEM!!!!
Kovy has said the he wants to play for the habs, why not signe him?

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09-20-2004, 07:47 AM
  #22
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I think I'm with most people when I say sign him. Of the current crop, Alex is by far the best fit. He brings a dynamic that others don't (regardless of production last season). No other unsigned player brings the combination of speed, size, and skill that Alex does. I'd also add that he's the historically the best playoff performer of the bunch too.

It does get interesting if the whole year is lost though. Mooch does bring up an interesting thing. If certain things go the way of the owners during the labour stopage, signing Alex could become a less attractive option. I'm not just talking about a cap either. What if the UFA age is dropped? Say the league decides to drop it to 29 (a la Burke's suggestion). A whole new group of players could become options.

I can see a situation where Gainey has a nice dilemma to ponder next Summer. Who do I take? Alex isn't going anywhere. There is no rush to sign him. At this point it's in Gainey's best interest to hold his cards close to his vest.

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09-20-2004, 08:45 AM
  #23
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I say sign him anyway. Here's my reasons :

1- It's almost a sure thing that at least one or two of our prospects won't turn out to be as good as we tought, even if they all make it to the NHL.
2- At least one or two of all the prospects in the organisation will need extra year(s) of developpment.
3- Injuries. I prefer to have a hangry Pleks starting in the minors for his 4th year, waiting for a vet to get the inevitable injurie or starting to fade. Plek (or another) will then come in MTL and will produce right away.
4- You'll always need good vets to be a real contender.
5- The habs lack good puck-moving d-men and size/grit up front. A prospect and/or a vet (that we could replace by a "ready" prospect) could serve as trade bait for fixing these holes. If Kots and/or Perez are ready, can you imagine what we can have in a trade if we put together something like Zednik, Hossa and Pleks? I know it sounds too big, but it could bring in what the team needs to get to the final, and we still would have the likes of Perez, Kosts, Chip, Higgs...
6- Kovalev's good and spectacular. We'll need that after a long lock-out...

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09-20-2004, 09:18 AM
  #24
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actually, you've stated that Higgins has teh NHL size and speed so he has a chance of making it, well higgins stands at 5'11" no?

IMO, 5'11 isn't NHL size but thats not something we can do anything about at this moment. I think taht Pleks is more NHL ready as well and he has more size than Higgins IMO.

Pleks is as short but is built like a tank. Kinda like Cube.

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09-20-2004, 09:24 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace2000
actually, you've stated that Higgins has teh NHL size and speed so he has a chance of making it, well higgins stands at 5'11" no?

IMO, 5'11 isn't NHL size but thats not something we can do anything about at this moment. I think taht Pleks is more NHL ready as well and he has more size than Higgins IMO.

Pleks is as short but is built like a tank. Kinda like Cube.
Pleks is a little bit bigger than Higgins but that doesn't indicate that he's tougher and more nhl ready than Higgins which imo is more ready than Pleks.

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