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The 2011 Double-A Draft (sign-up, roster, picks, everything)

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Old
12-19-2011, 06:19 AM
  #176
Hobnobs
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We pick:

Tim Cheveldae, G



Rick Zombo, D


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Old
12-19-2011, 08:12 AM
  #177
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
what??? there's no playoffs? what the ****?
There will be a Double-A Draft playoffs then.

Finish drafting Wednesday.
Finish line-up roster post with one captain ("C") and two alternates ("A") Thursday.

Vote on format by posting here which option you'd like:

OPTION A: 1 vs. 4, 2 vs. 3 two round playoffs.
OPTION B: 3 vs. 6, 4 vs. 5 first round, three rounds in all.

And who can collect votes the Friday before Christmas?


Last edited by VanIslander: 12-19-2011 at 08:20 AM.
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Old
12-19-2011, 08:18 AM
  #178
Jafar
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I think every GM who took the time to pick 25 players deserve a chance to defend themselves.I say option B but keep it short none the less.

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12-19-2011, 11:00 AM
  #179
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HC Krylya Sovetov select Brooks Laich C/LW a player that can play center or wing , good defensively with good offensive numbers with some physical play.



Dennis Wideman D


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Old
12-19-2011, 11:01 AM
  #180
tony d
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Alan Haworth Centre and Doug Halward Defenseman



Some stats on Haworth:

- 4 50 point seasons
- 400 Points in 524 games
- Good 2 way player

More on Haworth can be found here:

http://washingtoncapitalslegends.blo...n-haworth.html

Doug Halward:



Some stats on Halward:

-293 points in 653 games
-2 Seasons with 50 or more points
-33 Career PP Goals

More on Halward can be found here:

http://canuckslegends.blogspot.com/2...g-halward.html

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Old
12-19-2011, 12:22 PM
  #181
seventieslord
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Regina selects D/RW Lou Nanne. Nanne was probably taken too early in the past but now I think he’s fallen even beyond where he should. Nanne was perhaps hockey’s last true switch hitter, who went from forward to D on a pretty regular basis.



Nanne was primarily a defenseman but for the 1972 and 1973 seasons was considered a winger. In the seasons that he was primarily a defenseman, Nanne averaged about 19.32 minutes a game. As a forward, he averaged 42 points a season. Because neither season was entirely black or white, there is bound to be some overlap there.

Nanne was said to have “made shot blocking an art”. I like Nanne as a spare because, primarily, he can fill in on the wing if need be, but also because of his shot blocking. Reason? I have Garth Boesch, one of hockey’s all-time great shot blocking specialists. Boesch’s flaw is that he had a short career. In an all-time context, that may manifest itself in the form of injuries or inconsistency. Nanne will always be there to step in, in case of that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey, 1972-19787 editions
started career as a defenseman but moved to RW last year and flourished there... captained US Olympic hockey team in 1968... effective checker and was first moved up because of his ability in that department... but he turned into a pretty good scorer too... very popular player with fans... versatile... was voted club's top blueliner two years ago... one of North Stars' most popular players... also plays some RW... good team man adept at killing penalties of motivating sluggish PP...
--------------------------

Next, Regina selects Denis Herron, G.

My analysis of the excellent save percentages Herron posted throughout his career was posted here last year in the undrafteds thread. Herron was an outstanding “bad team goalie”, perhaps on par with guys like Gilles Meloche, though obviously lacking his longevity. Herron led the NHL in sv% twice with a very strong Habs squad, but being given the chance to be a “good team goalie” he did not thrive as expected.

Interestingly, Herron had four separate seasons where he earned more than token recognition in award voting:

1976: Where he was 7 th in AS voting among goalies with 3 voting points 1979: Where he was 7 th in Hart voting with 7 voting points 1980: Where he was 5 th in AS voting among goalies with 20 voting points 1982: Where he was 9 th in AS voting among goalies

Throw in that Herron shared the 1981 Vezina and 1982 Jennings, and was top-5 in minutes in 1976, 1978 and 1979, and 5 th in sv% in 1977, and there’s a 7-year period where Herron figured pretty prominently in the league’s goaltending pecking order each year. In this period, Herron was 7 th in games and minutes, and out of the 27 goalies with 150+ games, Herron’s sv% was tied for 5 th with Tony Esposito, behind only Dryden, Resch, Parent and Billy Smith.

Here is what I said last year:

Quote:
With the #87 pick in A2010, The Broder's Annex Marauders are pleased to select:

Dennis Herron, G



I really flip flopped here. With my last chance to select a goalie in this draft, I wanted to make sure I was taking the best guy. I think I got him.

I started by looking at Billy Hague, but he was actually awful with a stacked Ottawa team, allowing many goals in cup matches that should have been easy and much more lopsided. I was set on Murray Bannerman, who had a couple good sv% finishes and was in two all-star games. But then Herron caught my eye. He doesn't have Bannerman's solid playoff record. But he did play 173 more regular season games and post even more impressive save percentages for a couple bad teams. I don't really care that he won two Jennings as that's a team award, but I will show you he was Montreal's best goalie when there. Herron's career was far from perfect, but he shone as an excellent "bad team goalie" and a decent "good team goalie".

His career basically had three phases:

1. The bad team phase.

I'll start in 1975 as Herron only played 23 games in the two seasons prior. He played just three games with Pittsburgh before heading to Kansas City. Newly-released sv% statistics show that Herron greatly outperformed his teammates, with a .896 sv%. The other two combined for a mark of .881.

Rightfully so, Herron took over as the starter for KC, and played the 4th-most minutes in the league. His .889 sv% was one point out of the top-10 and considerably greater than the combined mark of his understudies: .853. Think about that: .853!!!

Herron actually escaped back to Pittsburgh as a free agent, and though they were a decent team, they were a doormat compared to the titans in this imbalanced league. He played behind Dunc Wilson, but did outperform him from a sv% standpoint: .910 to .906. Herron was 5th in the NHL in sv% this year.

Much like in KC, his performance earned him the starter's role the following season. Herron played the 5th-most minutes in the NHL and posted a .901 sv%, the league's 8th-best. Where would the Pens have been without him? Well, with the other three Pittsburgh goalies combining for a .837 sv%, I'm guessing last overall.

1979 was another solid season. Herron played the 5th-most minutes in the league and posted the 9th-best sv%: .892. Understudy rookie Greg Millen performed OK, but not at Herron's level.

2. The good team phase.

Herron is a bit of a "fall guy" for this period. When people look back at the Habs of the early 1980s and their inability to keep the destiny going after Dryden's retirement, Herron is named as a culprit.

Now, this was a very strong defensive team that could boost its goalies' sv%, and I don't want to give Herron too much credit for finishing 1st in the NHL in sv% in both 1980 and 1982 while playing just the 2nd-most minutes in the team's rotation. But what I do want to give him credit for is that, on an aggregate level, he was Montreal's best goalie from 1979-1984:

Herron: 86 GP, .901
Rest of team: 260 GP, .887 (best was Sevigny's .894 in 101 GP)

I included the 1984 season for the larger sample size, though Herron was well into his last phase by then.

3. Another bad team phase.

Herron then went to the lowly pens to help them "earn" the right to draft Mario Lemieux. (He was traded for a draft pick that became A draft cut Nelson Emerson) His 1983 season was a complete write-off and we'll just leave it at that.

In 1984, however, Herron managed to post an .885 sv% for the league's worst team, good for 9th in the NHL. I think this is extremely impressive! Are there any comparables to this? I will find out for you shortly.

In 1985, he was getting old at 32, but kept pace with the Pens' team average at least.

During his 2nd Pens' tenure, they used the same 3 goalies all three full seasons that he played. How do you think he performed compared to them? I bet you already know.

Herron: .869
Rest of team: .862

OK, comparables. I looked at the period of 1973-1986, Herron's whole career. I took a look at all goalies who played 1800+ minutes in any given season. Herron had three of the 30 lowest win% seasons. (.330 or worse) - His 1976 season with Kansas City when he had a .889 sv%, is the highest posted by a bad team goalie in this 14-year period. His 1984 season with Pittsburgh (.885) was 4th, and the only time any goalie with a win% .330 or lower was top-10 in sv%. His 1985 was also a decent showing at 11th on the list, with an .875.

Other goalies to show up multiple times in this lowly-30 list and where their sv% ranked:

Herron: 1st, 4th, 11th
Meloche: 4th, 8th, 9th
Low: 27th, 28th, 29th
Plasse: 2nd, 14th
Millen: 15th, 24th.

One more number crunch: On this list, goalies other than Herron who had win% less than .330, had a combined sv% of .870. Herron's cumulative sv% in his 3 worst win% years? .884.

Herron's work did earn him some All-star recognition, but not in the years he probably deserved it most. He was 5th in 1980, 7th in 1976 (but with just 3 votes), and 9th in 1982 (but with just 2 votes) - In the heaviest platoon era, he consistently outperformed the other goalies on his team, all the way through his career. How much worse than Dan Bouchard is he? Was he just Gilles Meloche with less longevity?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1976
compiled a respectable 3.75 GAA with Scouts... "I want lots of work"... Coach Bep Guidolin: "He's an eager, aggressive kid."... Assistant GM Baz Bastien: "The kid has guts."... admits weaknesses include lack of concentration for full game, roaming from net and not controlling rebounds... style has been described as "semi-acrobatic".
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1978
worked 34 games for Pittsburgh and was team's top goalie... In spite of suspect defense, Herron and Dunc Wilson carried bulk of goaltending and managed to finish 7th in team average... His size was what the Pens originally didn't like but they have since found that little guys can do a big job...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1979
with his slight build, Denis has trouble convincing people he really is an athlete... Scouts claimed he was too skinny to play for them... at one point they tried to build him up with a diet of milkshakes but he developed kidney stones... Herron says his weight presents no problem for him...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1980
admits to being more of a "flopper" who relies more on quick reflexes than positional goaltending... hard to believe the way this skinny athlete can scramble around the crease carrying 35+ pounds of equipment... a perrennially slow starter, he was challenged for the starting job by Greg Millen early and probably will be again...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1985
deserves Purple Heart for wounds received in action while playing for so many losing teams... 12-year veteran who endured many 50-shot games for Kansas City... faced an average of 32 shots a game last season... better goalie than his career 136-178-73 record shows.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1986
generally did not play as well last year as when the team was absolutely defenseless in front of him in 1983-84, but he had his moments... still the best the Penguins have...personable veteran of 12 NHL seasons...


Last edited by seventieslord: 12-26-2011 at 01:54 PM.
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Old
12-19-2011, 02:26 PM
  #182
Rob Scuderi
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Boo I wanted Herron and Halward today.

G Wayne Stephenson and D Dan McGillis



x2 ASG
x1 SC Champ
x1 OG Bronze Medal, played in two additional WCs
Honoured Memeber of Manitoba Hockey HOF

x1 Top 10 GAA (4th)


634GP
20:44 TOI

Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord
Dan McGillis kind of flew under the radar for a long time, but he had a pretty good career. Available icetime numbers show him to be a #3 defenseman for most of his career, usually on pretty good teams like the Flyers. McGillis led the league in hits one season, and when he got PP time, he proved his worth in the offensive zone by finishing in the top-15 among defensemen in points twice. He had good size – 6’3”, 220 lbs – and liked to use it. He was even 14th in Norris voting in 2001. In many ways he was a poor man’s Robert Svehla – just as physical, a little bigger, but not as good or consistent offensively.


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Old
12-19-2011, 02:36 PM
  #183
tony d
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Need some advice here: Thinking of moving Haworth to my 1st line centre position and having gratton as my 4th line centre, any thoughts?

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Old
12-19-2011, 03:25 PM
  #184
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The Engineers draft Tuomo Ruutu, the rugged left winger who scored his first goal with the national team in the final against Canada at the 2004 World Cup of Hockey and followed that up with an impressive 23-goal, 44-point NHL rookie season in Chicago 2004-05. In his best five NHL seasons he averaged over 40 points per season. Internationally, he scored 6 goals in the gold-medal winning 2011 World Championships, and had 6 points in each of the 2007 and 2008 worlds, winning silver and bronze. He scored a goal on the 2010 Olympic Bronze-medal winning team.



Quote:
He competes hard and is not afraid of the rough going. In fact, he enjoys stirring up opponents. Plays with both skill and confidence. Can both set up plays or finish them. Skates well and can line up at any forward position.
http://forecaster.ca/hockeynews/hockey/player.cgi?2418

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Old
12-19-2011, 03:28 PM
  #185
BillyShoe1721
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Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
The Engineers draft Tuomo Ruutu
Also much more worthy of being drafted than his brother. He brings similar grinding and agitating abilities to the table, but to a lesser degree than Jarkko. But, his vastly superior offensive game more than makes up for that.

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12-19-2011, 04:10 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
Also much more worthy of being drafted than his brother. He brings similar grinding and agitating abilities to the table, but to a lesser degree than Jarkko. But, his vastly superior offensive game more than makes up for that.
Depends on how you are going to use them. I want a mean and dirty fourth line wwhich suits Jarkko better than Tuomo. If I wanted a pure energy line with a bit offense then yes, Toumo is indeed the better choice.

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Old
12-19-2011, 04:19 PM
  #187
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Michigan selects:

Rich Pilon, D



Joey Kocur, RW


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Old
12-19-2011, 07:53 PM
  #188
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No idea how Jarkko went ahead of Tuomo....

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Old
12-19-2011, 07:57 PM
  #189
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The Engineers select D Tapio Levo




2x SM-liiga Best Defencemen
19 points in 45 WC games
5 points in 6 Olympic games
4 points in 9 Canada Cup games

New Jersey Devils Legends:
Quote:
When the Colorado Rockies spent a lot of time and money to bring Tapio Levo to the NHL, many NHL scouts predicted he could be one of the very best European imports in league history. At 26 he was a veteran of European hockey. With his slick mobility and incredible puck skills, many felt that Levo would be as good as Finnish legend and Calgary Flame's all star. Pekka Rautakallio.

On the ice Levo felt at home. He had an impressive 9 goals and 22 points in just 24 games in his rookie season. The worst part was the 26 year old rookie suffered several various injuries that kept him out of half of the season.

Like many Finnish players of the early 1980s, Levo's stay in North America was short. Once his contract expired he bolted back to Europe and escaped the New Jersey swamp lands .He continued to play in his hometown with Assat Pori until the end of the decade.


Last edited by Hedberg: 12-19-2011 at 08:09 PM.
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Old
12-19-2011, 08:17 PM
  #190
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Tapio Levo was team captain for nine years in the Finnish league and captained team Finland to the gold-medal game in the 1980 Olympics, scoring 5 points himself. The defenseman played 152 games for the national team, scoring 3 points in the 1976 Canada Cup and one in the 1981 Canada Cup. He scored goals in five world championships, his best being 4 goals in each of the 1981 and 1983 tourneys, impressive for a blueliner. He is a member of the Finnish Hockey Hall of Fame.

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Old
12-19-2011, 11:38 PM
  #191
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bring Back Scuderi View Post
D Marc Staal ]
I like this one. I hope Staal comes back soon, so he can go back to being a top-10 defenseman in the NHL, which he emerged as last season.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya select Alex Burrows RW

Don't expect him to provide any offense without the Sedins, but he will make a good greaseball agitating 4th liner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Always good to see a fellow Newfoundlander picked, Cleary has stepped up his career the past few seasons, next to Keith Brown Cleary is probably the best player this province has ever produced.
He is a case study in how moving to an excellent supporting environment with great coaching staff and player development can work wonders for a player.

Now that Ryder is picked, I would say Ryder's better.

Quote:
Great pick seventies with Nelson Emerson, I remember his case for being picked being argued last year a little, just a really good player. I was going to pick him today if he was still available.
Yeah, and it was me arguing against him, too. This was following the A draft, and I think most of the offensive RW I selected there are gone now. I saw him as a complementary 2nd liner, but I really didn't even realize he had 70+ points twice. 70-point seasons, as I'm sure you've also noticed, have grown pretty rare!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya select Jay McClement C



McClement is a solid all-around player who is also a great addition to our PK unit.He is also a great faceoff man , especially when shorthanded.
But has he really done enough to distinguish himself?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya select: Karlis Skrastins D

over 20 minutes averaged over 800 games, an ironman and shot blocking king. Very worthy pick. Hard not to like the guy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya Sovetov select: Dan Girardi D a good defensive defenseman playing insane minutes since the day he entered the league.He is currently playing 27 minutes a night on the Ranger squad.

I like this one, too.

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12-20-2011, 12:23 AM
  #192
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Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
The Engineers draft Gord Lane, a stay-at-home defenseman who was a three-time leader in PIMs for Washington, winning the most improved award from the franchise the year before the NYI signed him to bring a much needed grit and toughness to the back end ("the missing piece" coach Arbour would later say), so Lane became a role-playing contributor to a Stanley Cup dynasty playing the lion's share of all four cup postseason victories with significant playoff PIMs (set an NHL then-record number in the 1980 postseason, led the team in PIMs in two of the four cup-winning playoff years) and two decent regular season +/- seasons. He was paired with Langevin and at least one championship season with Morrow (1980-81). He actually scored 17 points in the four Stanley Cup postseasons, significant in showing he was on the ice throughout the dynasty years. If he had had more full regular seasons he'd have been drafted much earlier this year. But there's no mistaking his playoff role mixing things up on the blueline AND playing decent defensively! A quality role-playing third pairing defenseman! At worst he's a quality 6/7 guy for certain game situations.




http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...p?player=13295


http://islanders.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=465544


http://pucknhockey.com/2010/08/15/nh...ort-gord-lane/
The thing about Lane is, he averaged just 16.4 minutes per game, over just 539 games. I think just Paul Laus, Dave Hutchison and Pierre Bouchard averaged less, among players selected to this point. On the other hand, he played for a stacked Isles team with not a lot of room on the blueline. A guy like Craig Muni overcame that though, averaged 18.5 minutes for 900 games, and was a #4 on three cup winners. (which is why I rejoiced that we got it right and took him first!)

Lane, it appears, was the #6 in 1980 (regular season #7, but the #3 guy in minutes, Jean Potvin, didn't play a playoff games and I am not sure why), the #6 in 1981 (he was the #7 after McEwen was acquired late in the season, but stepped in after Persson went down in the 7th game, http://www.hockeydraftcentral.com/1974/74214.html), the #7 in 1982 (he played fewer minutes per game than Potvin, Morrow, Persson, Langevin, McEwen and Jonsson, and they missed a combined 59 games and he played 51, makes perfect sense - but the #6 in the playoffs because of an injury to Persson and perhaps because Jonsson was redundant?), and a #6 in 1983 (he was a co-#7 with Boutilier in the regular season, the two combined for 73 games, and the top-6 missed 75 combined) but was obviously preferred over Boutilier in the playoffs and moved up when Langevin got injured and McEwen was probably redundant)

It's really hard to say what that means in an all-time context, being the #6 defenseman on four straight cup winners in a 21-team league. Had Lane proven the ability to be a top flight player on a lesser team, caught in a numbers game in New York, things would be different. But he was just a #6/7 for three straight years on an awful Capitals team before coming to the Isle. Indeed, the best thing you can say about Lane is that he played in all those playoff games and the team won, and I though I do mean it as a backhanded compliment, it's still somewhat a compliment.

Tommy Albelin might be a better comparison than Muni, who, to me, is in another stratosphere. Albelin was on two cup winners with legendary defense corps. He was just the #6 for them, too. But he was also the #2-4 on a number of bad teams. And he was an NHL-caliber player for twice the time period and almost double the games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bring Back Scuderi View Post
RW Pentti Lund and LW Andrew Ladd







208 points in 402GP
x2 SC Winner
Lund is one of the hardest players to judge. The Calder season isn't really that impressive, it's really that 1950 playoff that does it for us. he led in goals and points, lost the cup in a crushing game 7 OT, and most importantly, shut down the rocket. Without those 12 games, I don't think anyone ever selects him. With those 12 games, he could be a MLD fill in, or maybe still a B-league, "what-if" kind of guy. Your guess is as good as mine.

Ladd was a guy I really hoped would make his debut here. He's got a 30-goal season, a year as a captain and cups with two teams as a role player. Not too bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Michigan Wolverines selects:

Tommy Albelin, D

Amazing stat about Albelin:

445 career games played for playoff teams, 16.42 minutes per game.
510 games played for non-playoff teams, 20.73 minutes per game.

Exhibit A in why it is important to look at the context of minutes played. When comparing defensemen based on the minutes their coaches gave them, the strength of the team is so important.

Albelin lasted a long time which is awesome. He proved to be a very good depth defenseman, but probably a very below average #2-4 when given that chance.

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Old
12-20-2011, 01:06 AM
  #193
seventieslord
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Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya Sovetov select Mario Lessard G ( yes another goalie , he finished 1st in wins and had a 2nd all-star team selection with the kings )

...not a fan. Not sure what he did to get that 2nd all-star spot. He played a lot of minutes and was 10th in sv%. wheeeee.....

over his career he actually averaged 3 sv% points below the league average. If he shone really brightly in his short career that would be different, but I don't think he did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Backup Goalie Rick Wamsley





Rick Wamsley boasted a 204-131-46 career record during his NHL career, he ranks 66th all time in NHL wins.

More on Wamsley can be found here:

http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...p?player=18405
Wamsley kinda snuck up on me here. I can't believe he had 204 wins. Over the course of 407 games, he averaged 3 sv% points above the league average. Pretty decent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
The Engineers draft Jan Klapac, the right winger on the Holik brothers' line. Klapac played in seven world championships between 1964-1973, including the 1972 gold medal win over the Soviets. He represented Czechoslovakia in three Olympics, most notably scoring 15 points in 10 games in the 1972 Olympics, tying Holik and Nedomansky for the team lead. As well, he finished 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 6th in Czechoslovakian league scoring.



http://www.chidlovski.com/personal/1...c/cssrbiof.htm
30 points in 51 major international games. Pretty solid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bring Back Scuderi View Post
C Matt Cullen and D Terry Carkner



x7 40 points
x1 SC

The versatile two-way center will center my fourth line and get time on the special teams. Cullen will see some PK time and possibly play point on the second PP. He should fit perfectly between two physical players in Ladd and Corrigan.



The rugged rearguard will play on my third pairing with Virta and see PK time. Virta was undersized and putting him with the tough Carkner should help him thrive. Terry's also a cousin of current Ottawa Sen Matt Carkner.
Carkner is a pretty standard double tough 3rd-pairing guy. 108 career fights (almost a winning record). Peaked as a #2 defenseman on the 1991 Flyers. Was a #3 in 1993, and a #4 in 1989, 1009 and 1992. He was only a #6 for a Strong detroit team for 2 years, but then took more of a leadership role in Florida, ranking #3 in their cinderella season, and again when they went to round 2 in 1997. He finished off his career a depth player again.

1989 (#4 on a surprising semifinalist) and 1996 (#3 on a surprising finalist) are his crowning moments. Other than that he only got into 13 other playoff games, toiling for mediocre (but rarely truly bad) teams.

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Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post
The Engineers select LW Randy Cunneyworth



Penguins Legends


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As soon as he was hired I knew it would call attention to what a solid 4th liner he would be. I was considering him all along!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya Sovetov select Paul Gaustad C , a tough gritty two-way center
with good leadership.

has he really done enough yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
We pick:

Tim Cheveldae, G



Rick Zombo, D

Always liked Zombo. He was a pretty highly valued defensive guy for a while.

Cheveldae was maybe the Cechmanek of a decade earlier. He was top-5 in wins three straight times and got some hype, but never even top-10 in sv%, and actually averaged 3 sv% points below the league average over those years (-6 points on his career). He's a strange one because his hype at the time doesn't seem to match his personal performance analyzed in retrospect. Maybe we didn't realize at the time, that this was the start of a 22-year trend of Detroit making their goalie look better than he actually was?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
HC Krylya Sovetov select Brooks Laich C/LW a player that can play center or wing , good defensively with good offensive numbers with some physical play.



Dennis Wideman D

I knew/hoped it was time for Laich to get taken in a lower draft. a real salt of the earth good guy, hopefully he builds on his solid start. (I think he can play RW too)

Wideman - I was skeptical, but having reviewed his production and his TOI (he is NOT just some #5 guy who gets points from his PP time!) I have to admit he is ready for this level.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Alan Haworth Centre and Doug Halward Defenseman



Some stats on Haworth:

- 4 50 point seasons
- 400 Points in 524 games
- Good 2 way player

More on Haworth can be found here:

http://washingtoncapitalslegends.blo...n-haworth.html

Doug Halward:



Some stats on Halward:

-293 points in 653 games
-2 Seasons with 50 or more points
-33 Career PP Goals

More on Halward can be found here:

http://canuckslegends.blogspot.com/2...g-halward.html
Halward was definitely a guy I was going to take early in the A.

Haworth: definitely one of the better offensive centers left, particularly on a per-game level - but are you sure he was that good defensively? He killed just 2% of penalties in his career. That one little line from Pelletier is a start, but can it be built on?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bring Back Scuderi View Post
Boo I wanted Herron and Halward today.

G Wayne Stephenson and D Dan McGillis



x2 ASG
x1 SC Champ
x1 OG Bronze Medal, played in two additional WCs
Honoured Memeber of Manitoba Hockey HOF

x1 Top 10 GAA (4th)


634GP
20:44 TOI
You know I like McGillis. Probably just as valuable as Halward, just in different ways, obviously.

Stephenson, I was really surprised to see had two ASGs. Turns out the dude was 3rd in all-star voting in 1976, and 7th in 1978.

I was actually surprised he got to 328 games, I thought he was a shorter-term guy than that. In case you are wondering, he averaged 3 sv% points above the league average in that time, buoyed mostly by his outstanding 1976 performance in Parent's absence. Sans that season, he'd be a career -1. Still, when guys with career minuses and shorter careers are being taken (no, not the only way to judge a goalie) he doesn't look bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Michigan selects:

Rich Pilon, D



Joey Kocur, RW

You can do better.

Pilon was a career 16.9 minute guy over 631 games, all played for brutal teams. He had just one playoff performance. On an average team he may not have even been a regular in the lineup.

The guy I'm taking tomorrow is a very wealthy man's version of Pilon.

Much better than Paul Laus, though, and a good fighter.

Kocur, I could show you a few guys who could fight just as well but were better hockey players. If you have to take a goon, there were better options. BUT, you could have done a hell of a lot worse too!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Depends on how you are going to use them. I want a mean and dirty fourth line wwhich suits Jarkko better than Tuomo. If I wanted a pure energy line with a bit offense then yes, Toumo is indeed the better choice.
I don't know, I think that better players can go gown the lineup and that typically makes them better by default. Tuomo could probably play Jarkko's game just as well as Jarkko does, the only thing is that he's grossly overqualified for it at the NHL level. At this level, I can see him thriving in it.

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12-20-2011, 01:08 AM
  #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
Lund is one of the hardest players to judge. The Calder season isn't really that impressive, it's really that 1950 playoff that does it for us. he led in goals and points, lost the cup in a crushing game 7 OT, and most importantly, shut down the rocket. Without those 12 games, I don't think anyone ever selects him. With those 12 games, he could be a MLD fill in, or maybe still a B-league, "what-if" kind of guy. Your guess is as good as mine.
Yeah I initially jotted Lund's name down last draft but there's just not a lot out there on him. I was unaware of his playoff exploits until this draft started up which is what made me go back to him. Shutting down the Rocket for a full series, while still contributing offensively, is such a nice claim to fame but that's all he really has.

After the '50 playoffs he had a weak regular season in 50-51 and got traded. Then in that 51-52 year he took a stick to the eye and his career almost ended. He made it back for one more year in the NHL but after that he was done. I'd like to think his eye injury ruined his chances of getting back to that '50 form (11 pts in 12 playoff games and only allowing one goal to Richard while shadowing him throughout the series) but I'd need to find some info about that injury aside from it being "serious" to have any idea if it's accurate or not.

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12-20-2011, 01:21 AM
  #195
Jafar
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About Jay McClement , you can read this http://nhlhotstove.com/top-10-penalt...in-the-league/

He's a PK minute eater and his team finished very high in PK with him as their top PK forward.

About Paul Gaustad , I don't really kno hat to answer.In my opinion he has done enough to be deserving of a bottom 6 role here.He is a 6-5 212 lbs monster , he is known for being a great lockerroom guy , Lindy Ruff thinks the world of him , he's a very good defensive and gritty/physical player , he's willing to drop the glove with some real tough fighters , he scored 10 goals in the last 4 years meaning he can chip one here and there and he's been playing for 7 years.

About Dennis Wideman , It could be interesting to see his in-team ranking ( n1 , n2 , n3 ... ) Maybe his defense is underrated after all without saying he's a defensive champ.I'm actually wonderng if he's better than Joe Corvo.

About Brooks Laich , when I looked at Brooks Laich , he kept on surprising me.In fact he's pretty underrated and should have been picked before I did , he's got no true qeaknessess having good offense , defense , physical game , he can play special teams and everything tend to say hes a great lockeroom guy.

-----------------------------------------------------------

About my team , I didn't even looked the other teams size but I think I can comfortably say that my team will be the biggest and tallest in the league.

My line up will probably change , but as he is in the first page this is the H.R. sizes:

(6-0 185) (6-0 180) (6-0 204)
(6-1 210) (6-0 177) (6-2 209)
(6-2 200) (6-1 205) (6-2 225)
(6-1 199) (6-5 212) (6-0 186)( Ryder)
(6-1 212) (6-3 197)
(6-3 210) (6-1 210)
(6-2 208) (6-1 206)


Last edited by vecens24: 12-20-2011 at 11:54 AM. Reason: 4 posts in a row from an infracted user
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12-20-2011, 07:26 AM
  #196
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Thanks for the feedback seventies, I'm thinking of moving Haworth to my 1st line and moving Gratton down to my 4th line. What are your feelings on this? Anyone else who has any thoughts on this are welcome to share those as well.

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12-20-2011, 08:43 AM
  #197
Hobnobs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
Always liked Zombo. He was a pretty highly valued defensive guy for a while.

Cheveldae was maybe the Cechmanek of a decade earlier. He was top-5 in wins three straight times and got some hype, but never even top-10 in sv%, and actually averaged 3 sv% points below the league average over those years (-6 points on his career). He's a strange one because his hype at the time doesn't seem to match his personal performance analyzed in retrospect. Maybe we didn't realize at the time, that this was the start of a 22-year trend of Detroit making their goalie look better than he actually was?

Pilon was a career 16.9 minute guy over 631 games, all played for brutal teams. He had just one playoff performance. On an average team he may not have even been a regular in the lineup.

The guy I'm taking tomorrow is a very wealthy man's version of Pilon.

Much better than Paul Laus, though, and a good fighter.

Kocur, I could show you a few guys who could fight just as well but were better hockey players. If you have to take a goon, there were better options. BUT, you could have done a hell of a lot worse too!



I don't know, I think that better players can go gown the lineup and that typically makes them better by default. Tuomo could probably play Jarkko's game just as well as Jarkko does, the only thing is that he's grossly overqualified for it at the NHL level. At this level, I can see him thriving in it.
Cheveldae is better than Chechmanek. He's solid but not spectacular. He does his job as a goalie and stops pucks. His worse trait imo was that he occasionally had down periods which really took a toll on his overall stats.

Pilon is my dirty mean guy on the last pairing. He blocks shots and he clears the crease Im not expecting him to do anything else.

Kocur is probably the most feared enforcer to ever have entered a hockey rink. That, plus he actually was a good (in the enforcer on the 3rd-4th line sense) hockey player makes him a good fit for my 4th line.

Ruuttu - Oddleifson - Kocur will get minimal minutes but will be out there to intimidate and agitate. I think they will do that better than anyone elses line in this draft.

Toumo can provide what Jarkko provides to some extent but hes not as strong as Jarkko nor is he as irritating.

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12-20-2011, 09:39 AM
  #198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bring Back Scuderi View Post
After the '50 playoffs he had a weak regular season in 50-51 and got traded. Then in that 51-52 year he took a stick to the eye and his career almost ended. He made it back for one more year in the NHL but after that he was done. I'd like to think his eye injury ruined his chances of getting back to that '50 form (11 pts in 12 playoff games and only allowing one goal to Richard while shadowing him throughout the series) but I'd need to find some info about that injury aside from it being "serious" to have any idea if it's accurate or not.
There's a long story about Pentti Lund in Jääkiekkolehti 10/2002

about eye-injury:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pentti Lund
Menin kuitenkin varsin pian jäälle, enkä tunnustanut, että silmävamma oli niin paha kuin se todellisuudessa oli. Näin toisella silmällä vain vähän valoa, mutta ajattelin, että voin silti jatkaa uraani.
" I returned to ice quite soon and didn't confess how bad my eye injury really was. I only saw some light on my other eye, but I though I could still continue my career"

about last NHL-season:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pentti Lund
Olin kauden alla aika hyvässä kunnossa, mutta valmennusleirillä selkäni kipeytyi ja jouduin olemaan pari viikkoa sivussa otteluista. Selkä vaivasi jatkossakin jonkin verran, mutta pelasin kuitenkin 54 ottelua ja niissä kertyi 17 (8+9) tehopistettä.
"I was in quite good shape before season started, but at the training camp I hurt my back and I missed couple weeks. I had some back problems during season, but I still played 54 games and got 17 (8+9) points."

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12-20-2011, 11:33 AM
  #199
seventieslord
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Regina finishes off the squad with:

Bryan Marchment, D.



Marchment played 926 NHL games and 83 more in the playoffs. Not known for his offense, of course, he was a physical and defensive defenseman. He was most important to his team when he was an Oiler from 1995-1998, averaging well over 20 minutes with them, but for his career he averaged 18.15 minutes.

Marchment kept opponents on edge because you never knew if you were going to be the next victim of one of his famous knee-on-knee hits, for which he was suspended a dozen times. Marchment was either very dirty or very careless, but it made him a feared and despised player. In a recent article at *******************, Marchment was listed at #48 on the 101 most despised sports figures of all-time. Hockey players on the list, top to bottom, were Tikkanen, Bertuzzi, C.Lemieux, Marchment, Avery, Crosby, Chelios and McSorley.

Stats: As mentioned, Marchment averaged 18.15 minutes for 926 games. He is 6th in GP by available defensemen, and 11th in playoff GP. He managed to post a carer positive adjusted +/- but because he wasn’t a high minute guy, this may not be relevant. Marchment was actually not used on the PK very often: 25% is less than his share as a defenseman. Among the 34 available 710+ game defensemen, Marchment is one of five with 24-25% PK usage. His teams did kill penalties at an average level. With just 5% PP usage, his total special teams usage is easily the lowest among comparable defensemen, making him more of an “even strength specialist”. Indeed, beginning in 1994, Marchment was #1 on his team in ES TOI in four of five seasons. He did back up his dirty/careless play with fights, engaging the opponent 117 times in his career, with a reported record of 24-27-25.

The Garth Butcher of the AA draft, perhaps? Actually, there is no way Butcher is two full drafts better than Marchment:

- Both basically lasted at the NHL level just as long
- Butcher averaged about a minute more but his teams were worse and easier to get minutes on; this is about a wash.
- Both were defensive "even strength specialists" who led their defense corps in ES ice time on multiple occasions.
- Both averaged 16 adjusted ESPPG per season
- Butcher killed more penalties but to slightly worse team results; his usage does indicate he was likely better though
- both fought over 100 times in the NHL
- the point of agitation is to get a mental edge and take opponents off their game, Marchment was arguably just as effective at that.

Parker MacDonald, LW/C.



MacDonald is probably the 2nd-best available pre-expansion NHL player offensively. I picked him over another guy because he is a legitimate two-position player. A quick look through the seasons on hockey-reference.com and you can see that he was a LW and a C with equal frequency, and with equal results. MacDonald was top-10 in goals and assists in separate seasons, and was 12th /16th in points those years. MacDonald is a four-time cup finalist with Detroit (61, 63, 64, 66) . In all, MacDonald posted four seasons with a % score of 50+, which is tough to find in any player right now, even post-expansion.

what I said last year:

Quote:
MacDonald was a journeyman forward who was fortunate enough to play with Delvecchio and Howe for a season – 1962-63, when he finished 5th in goals and just out of the top-10 in points. Two years after that, he made his mark as a playmaker, putting up 33 assists, good for 10th in the league. He never won a cup, but he went to four finals with Detroit – 1961, 1963, 1964, and 1966. He finished with 323 points in 676 games and 28 more in 75 playoff games.

It may look like MacDonald's offensive exploits are unimpressive - and they are, compared to the guys who were already drafted. But MacDonald's three 30+ point seasons prior to expansion (actually, 46+ points each) are the 2nd-most among available players and no one else put up three 40+ point seasons prior to expansion. In fact, just five who put up two are available!

In his three best seasons, he finished 11th, 16th, and 21st in points.

MacDonald was nothing special physically or defensively, but was a good complementary offensive player for a while, at a time when there were just 18 jobs for such players.
Chris Simon, LW.



Simon was a fearsome psycho of a player, but also a pretty effective scoring line glue guy and finisher. In the B draft I posted some tables showing Simon’s superiority, in a number of ways, compared to a number of “goons” who had already been drafted. Simon was 19 th in goals in 1999, and was an elite fighter, one of the top-5 of his day. He was such a good fighter that most guys just stopped fighting him. Since my lineup isn’t exceptionally tough I thought it would be a good idea to be able to put a guy like this in there occasionally.

Quote:
Chris Simon, LW

- 6'3, 233 lbs
- In a 7-way tie for 19th in the NHL with 29 goals (2000)
- 7 10-goal seasons between 1996 and 2007, excellent for an enforcer
- 305 points in 782 games
- 17 points in 75 playoff games
- 79-20-21 fight record, exclusively against top NHL heavyweights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1996-97
In many ways, the prototypical NHL 4th-line winger. Has made his reputation with his toughness, but has shown an added dimension in his ability to make plays that result in points... Simon gets a lot of room, which gives a player with modern skills more time to make a play... what he doesn't get is a lot of icetime... unless he improves his skating, he'sll spend a lot of time on the bench... has decent hands for a big guy, but all of his success comes in tight. If he gets a regular shift, he will answer the questions about his consistency... Simon is as tough as they come and has a wide streak of mean. He has already established himself as a player who can throw them when the time comes, and opponents have to keep a wary eye on him, because they never know when he's going to snap...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 2001
Few players have made such a stunning transition from goon to first-line forward. Like Rick Tocchet and Bob Probert before him, Simon has developed into a rare blend of toughness and scoring touch... Simon made his reputation as a brawler, but has always had some moves where he would deke an opponent and score with an honest to goodness snap shot... Simon has had to improve his skating, and he has... now he has great confidence in his shot... Difference is now that he doesn't go looking for fights. He doesn't have to prove himself as a battler. He will pick his spots. Players never know when he is going to snap, which is pretty scary... isn't as easily goaded into going off with some fourth liner. He unleashes some clean, mean shoulder hits on the forecheck.... after Kolzig, was probably the team's MVP. Simon is truly an inspiration for players with size and raw skill who want to make themselves into something more.
THE PROVERBIAL "TOUGH GUY WHO CAN PLAY"

Simon is in a class by himself as far as AA/A/B-level enforcers go. he earned more icetime and produced significantly more offense than other recently mentioned thugs. He did not take more non-fighting penalties than the average thug, despite more icetime. He also was the best fighter:

Name Career high goals 10-goal seasons avg TOI, career Fights win%NFPIM/10minTOI
Simon 29 7 12.11 129 .7461.25
Barnaby 19 5 11.97 250 .3611.31
Nilan21410.37310.6152.09
McClelland 12 4 9.34 195 .5511.27
Buchberger 20 3 13.17 255 .3660.65
Domi 15 3 9.74 333 .6611.85
King 11 2 9.7 229 .5061.07
Brashear 11 1 10.55 278 .7141.15
T.Hunter 11 1 8.79 240 .5822.72
Kocur1619.01262.7841.54
Avg w/o Simon153.610.29263.5711.51

Although he had the fewest fights (this was due to his dominance as a fighter), Simon ranks 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd, and 4th out of 10 in the other 5 categories of skilled goonness.


Last edited by seventieslord: 12-29-2011 at 03:12 AM.
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Old
12-20-2011, 12:30 PM
  #200
Jafar
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HC Krylya Sovetov select James Arthur Link Coach



James Link was the coach and athletic trainer of the Kenora Thistles during the team's three Stanley Cup challenges in 1903, 1905, and 1907. He was born in Rat Portage, Ontario, Canada.

In 1907, James Link coached Kenora to the Stanley Cup Championships , the smallest city ever to win the Stanley Cup. He was also member of the Rat Portage Rowing Club. Link died March 21, 1964 in Vancouver, British Columbia

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