HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Los Angeles Kings
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

[Hammond] LA Kings Have Hired Darryl Sutter As New Head Coach

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-20-2011, 01:13 PM
  #551
DryIslandBartender
KCCO
 
DryIslandBartender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 3,394
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
That and he was probably tired of watching the same guys get a pass from Murray over and over again when they were not doing what they were told to do.
This.

I'm sure the vets are looking forward to seeing some guys get an ass chewing when they eff up. As a fan, I am looking forward to some postgame rants from Sutter, none of the same 'compete', 'shot mentality' coach speak we had from Murray.

DryIslandBartender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 01:15 PM
  #552
KINGS17
Smartest in the Room
 
KINGS17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 20,049
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BerniernextRoy View Post
This.

I'm sure the vets are looking forward to seeing some guys get an ass chewing when they eff up. As a fan, I am looking forward to some postgame rants from Sutter, none of the same 'compete', 'shot mentality' coach speak we had from Murray.
I am definitely looking for some accountability on the power play especially. Guys that like to hold onto the puck for 5 seconds at the point before winding up and firing a shot that gets blocked can take a seat for the next PP.

KINGS17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 01:33 PM
  #553
Duc620
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 931
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
Maybe. He's worked under coaches like this before though like Hitchcock and Laviolette, so maybe he just prefers that style?

My favorite quote was this one from the blogger Mike Chen:

"His structure and attention to detail are second-to-none as a coach (his actions as GM...well, let's leave that out for now), but his unwillingness to change when the context evolves is his fatal flaw. He may take his boat to the head of the pack, but when heavy winds knock down his sails, he'll go down with the ship rather than find a solution."

If you change the word coach to GM, that describes DL perfectly.
Which is good if history predicted the future. But it doesn't. There are too many variables. History can be a good teacher and a guide.
But it's not a leash, a jail, or even a determining factor in real life.

The reality is that Lombardi finally got the coach he wanted five years ago on the day he started. That's all this is about.

Duc620 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 01:54 PM
  #554
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,803
vCash: 500
Lombardi and his penchant for reflecting on his San Jose days are going to cost him his job. The Sharks never won a Cup and still can't, but yet he treats his time there like he did something phenomenal.

Same with former Flyers...the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975. So stop copying them as well. I like the bigger bodies, but the Flyers even today look nothing like the Kings.

Johnny Utah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:01 PM
  #555
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Lombardi and his penchant for reflecting on his San Jose days are going to cost him his job. The Sharks never won a Cup and still can't, but yet he treats his time there like he did something phenomenal.

Same with former Flyers...the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975. So stop copying them as well. I like the bigger bodies, but the Flyers even today look nothing like the Kings.
I don't necessarily disagree with your premise but I don't think DL hires and signs/trades for those players because he delusional and thinks Philly/San Jose are the pinnacles of the league but more out of familiarity with the players/personnel. I don't think that is different than a lot of people in any profession. That doesn't change the issue at hand but I guess I disagree that he hires or signs players because they were once with what you or I think he perceives as elite franchises in Philly/San Jose.

Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:05 PM
  #556
DryIslandBartender
KCCO
 
DryIslandBartender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 3,394
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Lombardi and his penchant for reflecting on his San Jose days are going to cost him his job. The Sharks never won a Cup and still can't, but yet he treats his time there like he did something phenomenal.

Same with former Flyers...the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975. So stop copying them as well. I like the bigger bodies, but the Flyers even today look nothing like the Kings.

Two franchises that have been consistent winners going back a decade or so. How can you not want to follow that model?

DryIslandBartender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:28 PM
  #557
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,803
vCash: 500
What about the Bruins, Penguins, Hawks, or Red Wings....they aren't consistent winners? They just won the last 3 cups.

Finishing 1st overall in standings and getting eliminated in rounds 2 and 3 over and over again doesn't make you a successful franchise.

Johnny Utah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:32 PM
  #558
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
What about the Bruins, Penguins, Hawks, or Red Wings....they aren't consistent winners? They just won the last 3 cups.

Finishing 1st overall in standings and getting eliminated in rounds 2 and 3 over and over again doesn't make you a successful franchise.
Going back 4 years ago and Boston, Chicago and Pittsburgh weren't consistent winners. Chicago won its first cup in like 50 years in 2010 and Boston won their first since the 70's I believe. And who would you like Lombardi to sign/trade/hire from those organizations? That was your original point with San Jose and Philly.

Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:35 PM
  #559
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,803
vCash: 500
I don't want him to retread anyone, I want us to build our own winners. Draft young players, teach them to win and hire young, NEW coaches, not recycling guys who have had MODERATE success elsewhere.

Johnny Utah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:38 PM
  #560
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Boston prior to 2011:

2009/10 Lost in round 2
2008/09 Lost in round 2
2007-08 Lost in round 1
2006-07 Out of Playoffs
2005-06 Out of Playoffs
2003-04 Lost in round 1
2002-03 Lost in round 1
2001-02 Lost in round 1
2000-01 Out of Playoffs
1999-00 Out of Playoffs

DL should have been picking from their cherry tree years ago!

Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:42 PM
  #561
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
I don't want him to retread anyone, I want us to build our own winners. Draft young players, teach them to win and hire young, NEW coaches, not recycling guys who have had MODERATE success elsewhere.
I don't disagree with that but it really has nothing to do with Philly or San Jose. Like I said before, I don't think it is a matter of him trying to emulate those franchises because they are successful but more like he is familiar with people he worked with before.

DL just put his ass on the line for a guy who does not have a very good track record of goal scoring which is without a doubt the Kings biggest issue. Sutter might have short term success but it is unlikely he finds long term success with the team which means DL is probably on his last legs.

BTW.. while I was on the "new blood" bandwagon for coach, Chicago and Boston both won the Cup with retread coaches.

Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 02:52 PM
  #562
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Also, people want the Kings to emulate successful franchises. Since Johnny made the point of calling the last 4 Cup winners consistent winners, have a look at their histories. Chicago looks kinda similar to the Kings pre-2009:

1997-98 Out of Playoffs
1998-99 Out of Playoffs
1999-00 Out of Playoffs
2000-01 Out of Playoffs
2001-02 Lost in round 1
2002-03 Out of Playoffs
2003-04 Out of Playoffs
2005-06 Out of Playoffs
2006-07 Out of Playoffs
2007-08 Out of Playoffs

They then brought in a retread coach that "had moderate success elsewhere" and he lead them to the conference finals followed by a SCF victory. Sounds to me like the Kings are following that plan outside of getting the 1st overall picks that Chicago got.

Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 03:04 PM
  #563
Whiskeypete
Registered User
 
Whiskeypete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Chicago
Country: United States
Posts: 2,578
vCash: 500
The DL countdown clock has officially begun. Start a thread, "the DL & DS death pool". How long will TL and AEG give them is the big question?

Whiskeypete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 03:50 PM
  #564
Maynard
Registered User
 
Maynard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,269
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Maynard
I don't think DL is counting on Sutter's x's and o's to get the scoring going. I think he's looking at the talent on the roster and counting on Sutter to kick them in the ass, make them accountable and the scoring will HAVE to pick up.

Maynard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 03:52 PM
  #565
Duc620
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 931
vCash: 500
There's a reason some coaches get to 1,000 games with multiple playoff appearances with different franchises. And it's not just familiarity.

I remember when Crawford was considered a "brilliant young motivator and tactician" with Colorado.

Duc620 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 03:57 PM
  #566
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 40,476
vCash: 500
Sutter has only been fired once, and that decision was not made by the General Manager but ownership. He left Chicago to tend to his family and also relieved himself of coaching duties to take over as General Manager duties with Calgary. I don't necessarily consider him a retread in the same sense of Terry Murray who has been around (and fired) a number of times during his coaching career.

Ziggy Stardust is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 04:08 PM
  #567
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,803
vCash: 500
Sutter didn't win a cup in coaching 3 teams and the Flames fans were ready to crucify him as GM were his awful deals. Now, he hasn't coached in 5 years and no one in the NHL was after him for any kind of job. Typical LA Kings.

Johnny Utah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 04:22 PM
  #568
kingsfan
Yes my liege!
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,558
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Lombardi and his penchant for reflecting on his San Jose days are going to cost him his job. The Sharks never won a Cup and still can't, but yet he treats his time there like he did something phenomenal.

Same with former Flyers...the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975. So stop copying them as well. I like the bigger bodies, but the Flyers even today look nothing like the Kings.
Not disagreeing here really, but, outside of hiring Sutter and signing Scott Thornton, what has DL done to mirror his SJ days?

Also, Philly may not have won a cup since 1975, but they've been to the cup finals six times since then and been to the semi-finals a lot more times. We have made it past the 2nd round once. Ever. I'll gladly mirror that frnachises success over our own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
I don't want him to retread anyone, I want us to build our own winners. Draft young players, teach them to win and hire young, NEW coaches, not recycling guys who have had MODERATE success elsewhere.
I didn't want a retread either, so I do agree with you there, but leave the drafting out of this since it really makes no sense what you said. "Draft young players, teach them to win..." Really? Does anyone not try to do this? Who are the Kings drafting that aren't young and what are they teaching them in your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Sutter didn't win a cup in coaching 3 teams and the Flames fans were ready to crucify him as GM were his awful deals. Now, he hasn't coached in 5 years and no one in the NHL was after him for any kind of job. Typical LA Kings.
Once again, not on the side of DL on this hire, but can't we give the guy a chance to coach a game first before we lambast him? The guy has been to the third round of the playoffs more times than the LA Kings have. The last team he coached he had a winning percentage of .600 over two seasons and came within a win of getting the Stanley Cup. And he did that with a team that many posters here, Flames fans included, think was less talented then the current LA Kings. As well, keep in mind the only reason he wasn't coaching the last five years is that four of them he was concentrating on being a GM. Do you really think, based on what he did in Calgary, that he wouldn't have coached at some point in the last five years if he wasn't stuck in an office as a GM?

He sucks as a GM. We get it. He likely also sucks as a brain surgeon. We aren't asking him to be a brain surgeon just like we aren't asking him to be a GM. We are asking him to kick a little ass and make this team win. He's done that in the past. Let him coach at least one game before we all fly down his back.

kingsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 04:30 PM
  #569
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maynard View Post
I don't think DL is counting on Sutter's x's and o's to get the scoring going. I think he's looking at the talent on the roster and counting on Sutter to kick them in the ass, make them accountable and the scoring will HAVE to pick up.
I agree here but I don't think he'll be getting much better results than Terry Murray ever did in the way of scoring. At least his track record doesn't suggest that. I guess stranger things have happened and even getting to the Kings to score in the upper 2/3's of the league should make them a playoff team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Sutter didn't win a cup in coaching 3 teams and the Flames fans were ready to crucify him as GM were his awful deals. Now, he hasn't coached in 5 years and no one in the NHL was after him for any kind of job. Typical LA Kings.
Sutter is the coach, not the GM. What he did as a GM is irrelevant.

I made this point earlier and you've conveniently ignored it. You said Boston and Chicago are consistent winners implying the Kings should follow their model and not that of the Flyers/Sharks. I don't really remember a hiring war for the retread coaches Quenville or Julien who both had NHL careers before winning the Cup with their respective teams. Who would you have liked the Kings to hire and why do you think they would perform any better than what they brought in?

Here is a nice brief thread with comments from both Blues and Blackhawks fan re: Quennville's hiring in Chicago.

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=562457

Quennville lead some really good Blues teams to nothing, did the same with Colorado and then won a Cup with Chicago.

EDIT: My main point in all of this, and it isn't directed at you personally, this whole business of winning is more of an art than a science. We all sit here and spout off from the peanut gallery as if we have better ideas when in reality there is a lot of luck involved in winning a Cup. All I have ever asked of the Kings management/ownership is giving us a competitive team each year that makes the playoffs and has a chance. I don't think there is a Wizard of Oz out there that holds all the secrets to assembling a Cup winning team.


Last edited by Buddy The Elf: 12-20-2011 at 04:38 PM.
Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 04:49 PM
  #570
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 11,270
vCash: 500
Look at a team like the Florida Panthers. They finished 15th in the eastern conference last year and currently sit in 3rd in the Eastern conference after spending the summer signing and trading for players who where largely depth players or cast-offs from other teams. Now who knows how they will finish but I don't think I've seen a single post on this board suggesting that is how you build a winning team. There is no secret recipe here. People love to bash DL at every opportunity they get when in reality he isn't doing much different than a bulk of the league including some of the former Stanley Cup contenders and winners. Maybe some of the others have a better eye for drafting talent, signing talent or developing talent. Maybe the Kings weren't piss poor for long enough to acquire the high end talent like Chicago or Pittsburgh acquired through plenty of miserable years. There are a lot of "what if's" and few black and white answers in all of this.

I personally think that Sutter might be able get more out of the Kings than Terry Murray but how much more is the real question. I think along with a coach that can maximize what is on the roster, DL needs to add more depth to the bottom 6 for that coach to work with. People that want to criticize DL's lack of success should really look at how piss poor the Blackhawks and Penguins were before winning a Cup and how mediocre Boston was.

Buddy The Elf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 05:37 PM
  #571
kingsfan28
Its A Kingspiracy !
 
kingsfan28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Earth
Country: United States
Posts: 21,392
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
The DL countdown clock has officially begun. Start a thread, "the DL & DS death pool". How long will TL and AEG give them is the big question?
If we miss the playoffs, BOTH are gone, bank on it.

kingsfan28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 05:47 PM
  #572
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,803
vCash: 500
The Panthers also hired a new, young coach who everyone has been talking about the past 1-2 seasons as a potential solid NHL coach.

Johnny Utah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 05:52 PM
  #573
Whiskeypete
Registered User
 
Whiskeypete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Chicago
Country: United States
Posts: 2,578
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan28 View Post
If we miss the playoffs, BOTH are gone, bank on it.
we shall see. i think it will be next season someplace in the March - May timeframe, whether they make the playoffs or another early round exit.

if this tanks i would rather see it sooner than later. my biggest fear is DL is going to make some stupid moves trying to save his job, that will kill us down the road for years.

Whiskeypete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 05:55 PM
  #574
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,803
vCash: 500
I used to think of Lombardi as a very "shrewd" GM, he would never make as many moves as local GM's like Murray or Wilson and when he did they were usually good, BUT recently he has, and it shows, because they haven't been good.

Penner, Moreau, Smyth.....Not good.

Johnny Utah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-20-2011, 05:58 PM
  #575
kingscups
MBML
 
kingscups's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Anaheim, CA.
Country: United States
Posts: 1,191
vCash: 500
Any word on assistant coaches/staff staying or going? Especially ones with the last name Kompon?

kingscups is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:12 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2016 All Rights Reserved.