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Hawks 2011-12 Rumor , Speculation , Trade Proposal , etc thread

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Old
12-27-2011, 10:06 AM
  #126
RayP
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Eric Staal is even north of Nash at $8.25.

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12-27-2011, 11:39 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
They couldn't afford to lose him and his game has sagged the last couple years. Look at Eric Staal, same cap hit or close to it. Those bottom feeders can't afford to lose their top guys.
I wouldn't call the Canes bottom feeders ,, Outside of this year

They usually ice pretty solid teams and are in the playoff hunt all year

Staal until this season was regarded as one of the best C's in NHL

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12-27-2011, 11:43 AM
  #128
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Eric Staal is even north of Nash at $8.25.
Until the emergence of Skinner ,, Staal was the face of Canes franchise and there best player

Also helped them win a cup ,,, Safe to say they were happy to overpay him

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12-27-2011, 02:40 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
I wouldn't call the Canes bottom feeders ,, Outside of this year

They usually ice pretty solid teams and are in the playoff hunt all year

Staal until this season was regarded as one of the best C's in NHL
Yeah, they were an average-ish team that had guys from that Cup team that made them dangerous in the playoffs. But with the lack of revenue coming in, it looks like they're cutting payroll and they'll lose a lot if they don't get good returns for Ruutu and Gleason or get them resigned. It was wrong of me to call them bottom feeders but what's going on down there was inevitable just based on how horrible they are doing financially.

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12-27-2011, 03:53 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
Yeah, they were an average-ish team that had guys from that Cup team that made them dangerous in the playoffs. But with the lack of revenue coming in, it looks like they're cutting payroll and they'll lose a lot if they don't get good returns for Ruutu and Gleason or get them resigned. It was wrong of me to call them bottom feeders but what's going on down there was inevitable just based on how horrible they are doing financially.
Getting Gleason and Ruutu would be great. I wonder which players would be the one to go seing as the Hawks are currently at the 23 man limit (actually at 24 with Carcillo on IR). Figuring Pirri will be sent back to Rockford when Carcillo is ready to play - that still means 2 players would have to be removed from the roster in order to add Gleason and Ruutu.

Right now the Hawks are carrying 8 d-men (and 13 forwards), with Scott being one of the 8. If the Hawks move O'Donnell and Lepisto, to add Gleason and Ruutu, then they will carry only 7 d-men (and 14 forwards). Or maybe they trade one of the forwards along with Lepisto or O'Donnell - which forward would it be? With Bickell's re-emergence the last couple games playing with Stalberg - and Brunette's productivity on the PP - it seems to me Frolik is the odd man out - except that he has a multi year contract left (@ $2.3M)and has not been scoring so he can't look very attractive to other teams. Maybe Kruger gets sent down and Ruutu takes the 2C spot?

Querstions ... questions ... questions

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12-27-2011, 04:00 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by EbonyRaptor View Post
Getting Gleason and Ruutu would be great. I wonder which players would be the one to go seing as the Hawks are currently at the 23 man limit (actually at 24 with Carcillo on IR). Figuring Pirri will be sent back to Rockford when Carcillo is ready to play - that still means 2 players would have to be removed from the roster in order to add Gleason and Ruutu.

Right now the Hawks are carrying 8 d-men (and 13 forwards), with Scott being one of the 8. If the Hawks move O'Donnell and Lepisto, to add Gleason and Ruutu, then they will carry only 7 d-men (and 14 forwards). Or maybe they trade one of the forwards along with Lepisto or O'Donnell - which forward would it be? With Bickell's re-emergence the last couple games playing with Stalberg - and Brunette's productivity on the PP - it seems to me Frolik is the odd man out - except that he has a multi year contract left (@ $2.3M)and has not been scoring so he can't look very attractive to other teams. Maybe Kruger gets sent down and Ruutu takes the 2C spot?

Querstions ... questions ... questions
I think you'd try to move Brunette in a deal since he has what amounts to an expiring contract (doubt Carolina would want to take on any long term salary).

Kane-Toews-Rutuu
Sharp-Kruger-Hossa
Bickell-Bolland-Stalberg
Carcillo-Mayers-Frolik
Scott

Keith-Seabrook
Hjalmersson-Leddy
Gleason-Montador
O'Donnel-Lepisto

Crawford
Emery

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Old
12-27-2011, 04:06 PM
  #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
Yeah, they were an average-ish team that had guys from that Cup team that made them dangerous in the playoffs. But with the lack of revenue coming in, it looks like they're cutting payroll and they'll lose a lot if they don't get good returns for Ruutu and Gleason or get them resigned. It was wrong of me to call them bottom feeders but what's going on down there was inevitable just based on how horrible they are doing financially.
They lost 7M last year (There are other incomes not counted towards NHL revenue) ,,, THat is not doing horrible financially

A playoff run into 2nd round would wipe that away

They have stable ownership (Majority stake) and have lowered payroll til they fine another owner to buy large stake in team after there previous #2 owner passed away

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12-27-2011, 04:08 PM
  #133
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If you could get Carolina to take Brunette (or Frolik) in a deal for Gleason and Ruutu, you'd still have a little more than $3 mil to go after another player.

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12-27-2011, 04:09 PM
  #134
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Most likely IMO, we'd trade away one or two of Bickell, Frolik, Brunette or Lepisto as a part of a package for whoever we acquire. We're not sending Kruger anywhere and I doubt we waive anyone else.

If not, we probably trade Lepisto or Brunette to a team who's injured for picks.

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12-27-2011, 04:30 PM
  #135
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I doubt Bruno will be moved. Bruno is one of Q's guys and I don't see him supporting any trade that sends Bruno away. Also Bruno hasn't played badly this year when his line mates have been complimentary players. He looks god awful with the kids, because Toews and Kane play a high speed precision game. But when he was on a line with Mayers, Kruger, or even Hossa for a time, he looked good and was able to play to his strengths and create some scoring chances. Lets not forget that Bruno is on pace for 18 goals with limited ice time. I agree with the idea that he shouldn't be on the top line, but I don't believe he should be traded or scratched.

The most likely roster player to be moved has to be Frolik. He is still relatively young, signed to a decent contract, and can be a solid top 9 player for a lot of teams. I doubt Lepisto gets moved because I doubt anyone would want him and if they did they would just grab him off waivers when the Hawks do make a trade for a d-man.

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12-27-2011, 04:34 PM
  #136
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How about Frolik + 2 prospects (Saad, Morin, Olsen, Pirri protected) + conditional 1st round pick (becomes a 2nd round pick if neither resign with the Hawks) for Gleason and Rutuu?

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12-27-2011, 04:38 PM
  #137
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Not sure I want to move Bickell. Stalberg's improvement this season makes me want to give bickell the rest of this season to see if he can figure out his role in the NHL. If not, then trade his ass.

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Old
12-27-2011, 04:40 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
Not sure I want to move Bickell. Stalberg's improvement this season makes me want to give bickell the rest of this season to see if he can figure out his role in the NHL. If not, then trade his ass.
And yet you want to dump a much younger player in Frolik

So 2 26 yr olds you say give as much time as possible to see if they can figure it out but 23 yr old ,,, Get out of Chicago

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12-27-2011, 04:57 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
And yet you want to dump a much younger player in Frolik

So 2 26 yr olds you say give as much time as possible to see if they can figure it out but 23 yr old ,,, Get out of Chicago
I understand your point, but we have other players who can step into into Frolik's role if he is moved. We don't have anyone who can replace what Bickell or Stalberg potentially bring to the table.

Also I doubt we would go after both Rutuu and Gleason, because the package would probably be rather large. If we go after just Gleason it would probably cost us Frolik, an early pick but not our first, and a middle prospect, depending on how highly Bowman and the Canes value Frolik. If you go after both I bet the Canes ask for one of our top prospects instead of two lesser prospects and I doubt that is a trade we would like to make.

My wishlist for players Bowman should target is: Gleason, Grossman (DAL), Mark Stuart (WIN), and Beauchemin (ANA) for defense and Rutuu, David Jones (COL), Kostitsyn (MTL), Stempniak (CGY), and Korpikoski (PHX) as forwards.

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12-27-2011, 05:00 PM
  #140
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I understand your point, but we have other players who can step into into Frolik's role if he is moved. We don't have anyone who can replace what Bickell or Stalberg potentially bring to the table.

Also I doubt we would go after both Rutuu and Gleason, because the package would probably be rather large. If we go after just Gleason it would probably cost us Frolik, an early pick but not our first, and a middle prospect, depending on how highly Bowman and the Canes value Frolik. If you go after both I bet the Canes ask for one of our top prospects instead of two lesser prospects and I doubt that is a trade we would like to make.

My wishlist for players Bowman should target is: Gleason, Grossman (DAL), Mark Stuart (WIN), and Beauchemin (ANA) for defense and Rutuu, David Jones (COL), Kostitsyn (MTL), Stempniak (CGY), and Korpikoski (PHX) as forwards.
Who would step into Frolik's role?

Clearly not Ben Smith who was beyond brutal this year ,, Morin is a top 6 talent with skating issues and needs to work on his D

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12-27-2011, 05:03 PM
  #141
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I understand your point, but we have other players who can step into into Frolik's role if he is moved. We don't have anyone who can replace what Bickell or Stalberg potentially bring to the table.

Also I doubt we would go after both Rutuu and Gleason, because the package would probably be rather large. If we go after just Gleason it would probably cost us Frolik, an early pick but not our first, and a middle prospect, depending on how highly Bowman and the Canes value Frolik. If you go after both I bet the Canes ask for one of our top prospects instead of two lesser prospects and I doubt that is a trade we would like to make.

My wishlist for players Bowman should target is: Gleason, Grossman (DAL), Mark Stuart (WIN), and Beauchemin (ANA) for defense and Rutuu, David Jones (COL), Kostitsyn (MTL), Stempniak (CGY), and Korpikoski (PHX) as forwards.
I really doubt Winnipeg will trade Stuart... seems like they really like him there. But I would **** myself if we got him. I love his game and would be absolutely perfect on this team. Hopefully Bowman can weasel Chevy into trading him.

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Old
12-27-2011, 05:07 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
And yet you want to dump a much younger player in Frolik

So 2 26 yr olds you say give as much time as possible to see if they can figure it out but 23 yr old ,,, Get out of Chicago
woah woah woah. I never said I want to dump frolik yet. I've been advocating giving him brunette's top line minutes to see if they can get him going.

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12-27-2011, 05:22 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Who would step into Frolik's role?

Clearly not Ben Smith who was beyond brutal this year ,, Morin is a top 6 talent with skating issues and needs to work on his D
If the Hawk trade for another top 6 LW then Frolik becomes expendable. He isn't cracking the top 6 and if a trade happened then Bickell and Stalberg would be on the third line, which would mean he isn't in the top 9. While you are correct that Smith didn't look great in his limited time with the Hawks, he was at least competent defensively. Not a world beater, but not a liability either. So if Frolik is being pushed down into a fourth line role, I believe between Carcillo, Bruno, and Smith we could effectively negate the effects that losing him would have on the squad.

Stalberg and Bickell are harder to replace given their skill sets. We don't have anyone ready to replace what those two can bring to the lineup when they are playing well.

I didn't mean to make it sound like Frolik wouldn't be missed or is unimportant. Just that given the current make up of the team and what I would expect the line to look like if a trade is made for a top 6 forward, I think Frolik's contributions are easier to replace internally than what Stalberg or Bickell bring to the table.

EDIT: And I know its a long shot that Stuart is moved, but I think we could put together a compelling package for him if the Jets fall out of the race and sell at the deadline. Like I said its my wishlist and I'll be unrealistic if I want to.

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12-27-2011, 05:25 PM
  #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Who would step into Frolik's role?

Clearly not Ben Smith who was beyond brutal this year ,, Morin is a top 6 talent with skating issues and needs to work on his D
Quote:
Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
woah woah woah. I never said I want to dump frolik yet. I've been advocating giving him brunette's top line minutes to see if they can get him going.
Ben Smith may have been brutal with in limited action with the Hawks but he can't possibly be any worse than Frolik has been per minutes played.

If a trade involves current players on the roster - Brunette and Frolik are the two I would give up first. Then Carcillo.

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12-27-2011, 05:35 PM
  #145
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I don't think Carcillo will be traded. I think a good reason why we brought him in was to have a physical presence in the playoffs and to have a guy who will stick up for the team. He hasn't done much of it this season but at least we know he's willing.

Brunette is my favorite to go because he just doesn't fit our team but I don't think he has much value around the league. Teams aren't going to want to take his 2 million dollar tag for little in the way of value. His deal expires after this season so that might be a plus but I don't think Q wants to see him out the door. I think he becomes a healthy scratch in the playoffs unless he turns it up.

Frolik probably has the best value of the 3 but I can't see us trading him after signing him to a 3 year contract. He was good in the playoffs last year and I'm assuming that the staff thinks he can do the same this year. But again, not much in the way of value considering his offense isn't there and he has a 2+ mil contract for 2 more years after this.

I think Bickell is on his way out. Cheap contract for one more year, scored 17 goals last year, he's big... granted his production isn't outstanding but that's a good combination for a team who is out of the playoffs but isn't really rebuilding. Winnipeg and Carolina are teams I could see being interested in him.

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Old
12-27-2011, 05:46 PM
  #146
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How about Frolik + 2 prospects (Saad, Morin, Olsen, Pirri protected) + conditional 1st round pick (becomes a 2nd round pick if neither resign with the Hawks) for Gleason and Rutuu?
I would like this deal, but Carolina would probably be looking for an expiring contract. Frolik gets $2.3M for two more years after this season. At his current scoring pace (5g + 5a), he is no bargain for that contract - especially with a couple years left. Obviously the hope is for him to get back to the 20 goal seasons he had 2 and 3 years ago but he hasn't shown anything to date that would lead a team to want to take him off the Hawk's hands. I like him as a player - he plays good defense, can PK and always gives a good effort, but he needs more than his projected 11 or 12 goals to justify $2.3M.

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12-27-2011, 06:18 PM
  #147
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Gleason would be nice, but Bryan Allen would be a decent consolation prize.

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12-27-2011, 06:28 PM
  #148
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How about Frolik + 2 prospects (Saad, Morin, Olsen, Pirri protected) + conditional 1st round pick (becomes a 2nd round pick if neither resign with the Hawks) for Gleason and Rutuu?
Would not give up Saad. I don't care if they deal the others.

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12-27-2011, 08:40 PM
  #149
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Would not give up Saad. I don't care if they deal the others.
Giving up a guy like Pirri or Morin for a rental is tough. Pirri is almost a point a game in the AHL this year, I'm not moving him for a rental. Morin I could part with though.

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12-27-2011, 08:53 PM
  #150
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I think we have other prospects that we could afford to trade over Morin, Pirri or Saad. None of them should be traded for a rental. Rensfeldt is the player I'd look at packaging up.

However, if we're getting back a 2nd line center or top 4 defenseman signed to another couple of years I don't think I'd mind as much.

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