HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Jacques Martin Fired V2.0

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-18-2011, 02:58 AM
  #26
LeBlondeDemon10
BlindLemon Haystacks
 
LeBlondeDemon10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,117
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
i've defended martin time and time again, and even though he made some stupid decision, i feel the habs were better off with him. gauthier deserves far more blame than JM. this team over achieved the last few years and he was a big reason why.

at the end, i don't really care whether he stayed or not. my guess is the habs will fail, hard. the good news is: no more 'fire martin' in every ****ing post.

my prediction: we suck even more, and miss the playoffs altogether.
.

Yeah, I agree. It was not Martin's fault that Markov signed a huge contract when the money could have been used for a more reliable defenseman like the Wiz or Hammer. It was not Martin's fault that he had to dress a number of rookie d-men. It was not Martin's fault that Gomez was washed up. It was not Martin's fault that there was a lack of size on this team. I thought he was great in developing the younger players that actually could play (Patches, Subban and Desharnais). He helped Price develop into the goalie he is today. Eller was starting to bust out. He created a system that got the MOST out of this team. I think the team will rue the day that they pulled the plug too early on Martin. He was a steady guiding force.

I predict Gauthier is gone if they don't make the playoffs. Then we have a new GM who will want to bring in his own coach...and here we go again.

LeBlondeDemon10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 04:27 AM
  #27
WhiskeySeven
Mr. Worldwide
 
WhiskeySeven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 15,399
vCash: 500
This team was molded to Jacques vision. He wanted Lapierre gone, he wanted SKost gone, he didn't want fighters, etc. He got exactly what Gauthier could possibly, reasonably give him but he just didn't evolve with the team. You instill the defense and then work on opening up. Jacques refused to. It's his fault and I blame the loss of the room, the ****** PP, the terrible TERRIBLE hockey all on him.

The games we've had the displeasure of witnessing have been trashy hockey. Boring dump-and-changes, dirty goals. The only highlights we'd have were Carey Price saves and the two epic Cammalleri one-times a year. ********.

Jacques played moneyball tactics when he should've trusted his players to play real possession hockey. He'll be good on a lower-end team but until then we have to deal with how badly he ruined a lot of the egos in the room. Talented egos tied to (what now appears to be) bloated, unmovable contracts.

Go to hell Jacques, thanks for nothing.

WhiskeySeven is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:08 AM
  #28
Stan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 580
vCash: 500
I don't like the timing of this move. I think JM was our best chance of making and playoffs and making a run. I think if there was going to be a change, it should have been sweeping and happened at the end of the season. I'm left quite worried about the direction of this team moving forward. I was overall happy about the moves PG had made (Price vs Halak, even getting Kaberle...although I thought he could have made a better deal) and thought JM was doing alright with what he had. Overall, I was happy that the organization had some stability. I think this is a step back.

Stan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:14 AM
  #29
GordonGraham
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,935
vCash: 500
How come PG pulled the trigger saturday morning a few hours before a game when he had all of friday to so?

GordonGraham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:26 AM
  #30
Nashy
The Honey Badger
 
Nashy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,468
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
I think the habs don't have any better option available right now so RC till the end of the season. If somone perfect hits the market (e.g Lindy Ruff ) I think they will snatch him up.



Yes what a waste it is to sign your best dman. What kind of a lynchmob would have been outside the bell had he not signed him and Markov regained form on another team? He made a decision with the available facts. Maybe he lost this gamble who knows. Markov could come back and be dominant and you would skulk away into the shadows wouldn't you?

Easy there fella.

Until Markov returns and plays a game, it was a terrible signing. Even upon his return, if he doesn't get back to his previous level of play it will be a questionable signing.

The fact that JM had this team with their super soft D even close to a playoff spot is remarkable.

I have no problem with Martin being fired, it's the lack of any sort of a plan that concerns me. The whole interim thing is a crock.

This reeks of doing something, simply for the sake of saying that you did something.


Last edited by Nashy: 12-18-2011 at 10:44 AM.
Nashy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:32 AM
  #31
Miller Time
Registered User
 
Miller Time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,322
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
i've defended martin time and time again, and even though he made some stupid decision, i feel the habs were better off with him. gauthier deserves far more blame than JM. this team over achieved the last few years and he was a big reason why.

at the end, i don't really care whether he stayed or not. my guess is the habs will fail, hard. the good news is: no more 'fire martin' in every ****ing post.

my prediction: we suck even more, and miss the playoffs altogether.
careful there MD... with post like that, you'll get lumped into the "bashers" category pretty quickly around these parts.

Miller Time is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:35 AM
  #32
RaMMuT
Tank Nation 2012
 
RaMMuT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Palestine
Posts: 1,084
vCash: 500
Are you guys happy that jacques is gone now? 99% of you were when they announced it

Watch us miss the playoffs this year...b00k it !!!

RaMMuT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:39 AM
  #33
coolasprICE
Registered User
 
coolasprICE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,491
vCash: 500
RaMMut, **** hitting the fan is a beautiful, beautiful thing

it's exactly what this organization needs.

It'll stink for awhile, and then force change.

I have faith we have a proactive pres./owner who won't have any more to do with mediocrity.

coolasprICE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:42 AM
  #34
Captain Smurf
Naively Optimistic
 
Captain Smurf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Thornhill, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,364
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RaMMuT View Post
Are you guys happy that jacques is gone now? 99% of you were when they announced it

Watch us miss the playoffs this year...b00k it !!!
I want us to miss the playoffs this year. Time to clean house and that guarantees it. Have a high pick in a deep draft and draft a top prospect.

Captain Smurf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 10:50 AM
  #35
otto bond
Registered User
 
otto bond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,986
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Smurf View Post
I want us to miss the playoffs this year. Time to clean house and that guarantees it. Have a high pick in a deep draft and draft a top prospect.
and be in 9th place...that the way to go about it!

otto bond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 11:21 AM
  #36
OneSharpMarble
Registered User
 
OneSharpMarble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,436
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nashy View Post
Easy there fella.

Until Markov returns and plays a game, it was a terrible signing. Even upon his return, if he doesn't get back to his previous level of play it will be a questionable signing.

The fact that JM had this team with their super soft D even close to a playoff spot is remarkable.

I have no problem with Martin being fired, it's the lack of any sort of a plan that concerns me. The whole interim thing is a crock.

This reeks of doing something, simply for the sake of saying that you did something.
He had no option with Markov, between a rock and hard place. JM did nothing special relying on Price to save his ass constantly, Cunneyworth has the same gameplan more or less.

What is remarkable is how this team of veterens can't play a powerplay. Is that one aspect that our superstar ex coach for got about? Another remarkable thing is how the whole team is essentially snake bitten offensively, JM really getting the most out of his players I guess.

OneSharpMarble is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 11:38 AM
  #37
Captain Smurf
Naively Optimistic
 
Captain Smurf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Thornhill, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,364
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by otto bond View Post
and be in 9th place...that the way to go about it!
Ugh, I hope not. Feels weird to say, but I'm hoping that we do what we normally do on the Holiday "fill other team's arenas so they actually make money" road trip and stink it up. That way we'll be so out of the race that Molson pulls the plug on the season.

Captain Smurf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 11:52 AM
  #38
donghabs98
Moderator
 
donghabs98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Halifax
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,805
vCash: 93
i am hoping to make it

i was just waiting for that one day that everyone is healthy
that one day that seems to never come

donghabs98 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 12:08 PM
  #39
JLP
La Sainte-Flanelle
 
JLP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,910
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
i am hoping to make it

i was just waiting for that one day that everyone is healthy
that one day that seems to never come
We can hope and dream but it's probably not going to happen. Today, 29/30 teams have injuries.

JLP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 12:32 PM
  #40
MasterDecoy
Carlos Danger
 
MasterDecoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Beijing
Posts: 10,753
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
careful there MD... with post like that, you'll get lumped into the "bashers" category pretty quickly around these parts.
wouldn't that be ironic

MasterDecoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 12:35 PM
  #41
Erik Estrada
Registered User
 
Erik Estrada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,771
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RaMMuT View Post
Are you guys happy that jacques is gone now? 99% of you were when they announced it

Watch us miss the playoffs this year...b00k it !!!
We were lined up to miss the playoffs with a terrible draft position to boot. Anything else is better...

Erik Estrada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 12:38 PM
  #42
PunkinDrublic*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sutton,Qc-Sudbury,On
Posts: 8,283
vCash: 500
OMG we fired JM...

We can't make the playoffs now !

PunkinDrublic* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 01:21 PM
  #43
Ollie Williams
Registered User
 
Ollie Williams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,066
vCash: 356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigger77 View Post
Don't worry, the next coach will suffer the exact same fate. It's just too bad we were in a position to fight through these injuries and actually create long term stability in this organization and they ****ed it up. Idiots.
This. Teams where the coach is the problem will have immediate improvements in the games that follow. We didn't get that effect when we canned Carbo and won't in the next games either after letting go of JM simply because the coach was not the problem.

PG had to do something to make himself look like he's doing things and this was one of those things. A new coach however won't fix Cammy's eye sight to hit the net, won't make Gomez's cap hit disappear and won't bring back Markov earlier than expected either.

Like previous coaches before him, the new one will face the hammer of a broken on-ice product. Remember, both Julien and Vigneault were Habs coaches at one point and when the material was provided they got somewhere.

Ollie Williams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 01:57 PM
  #44
Habanero514
Registered User
 
Habanero514's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 236
vCash: 500
I hope the next coach of the Habs will be Larry Robinson. Of this coaching team, i'd keep Pierre Groulx.

Habanero514 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 02:02 PM
  #45
Habs10Habs
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Habs10Habs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 52,367
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybeans View Post
I hope the next coach of the Habs will be Larry Robinson. Of this coaching team, i'd keep Pierre Groulx.
It would be nice, but I don't think Robinson could handle the pressure of being a head coach in Montreal.

Habs10Habs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 02:06 PM
  #46
donghabs98
Moderator
 
donghabs98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Halifax
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,805
vCash: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybeans View Post
I hope the next coach of the Habs will be Larry Robinson. Of this coaching team, i'd keep Pierre Groulx.
i would hire him as a assistent coach to workk with our young defensemen

donghabs98 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 02:17 PM
  #47
Krnage
Registered User
 
Krnage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Fermont
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,015
vCash: 500
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/ws/eBayISAPI....:L:LCA:CA:1123

Last paper written by Jacques Martin as coach

Krnage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-18-2011, 02:21 PM
  #48
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 33,335
vCash: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Smurf View Post
I want us to miss the playoffs this year. Time to clean house and that guarantees it. Have a high pick in a deep draft and draft a top prospect.
Wouldn't be a bad idea, long term is exactly what we would need. If we keep sucking we can also move a lot of players at the deadline and add even more picks

Habs 4 Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-19-2011, 02:08 AM
  #49
MasterDecoy
Carlos Danger
 
MasterDecoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Beijing
Posts: 10,753
vCash: 500
if lindy ruff becomes available - and if the sabres keep floundering like that it might just happen, would it be ok for me to say i don't want him because he's never won anything?

MasterDecoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-19-2011, 10:26 AM
  #50
McSorleyStick
DECIMA-TING
 
McSorleyStick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: 221B Baker Street
Posts: 15,732
vCash: 500
Montreal Canadiens: Gauthier fired the wrong guy, says Jack Todd


By JACK TODD, SPECIAL TO THE GAZETTE December 19, 2011 8:39 AM


0


Story
Photos ( 2 )


On the hot seat: Canadiens GM Pierre Gauthier's first problem during the offseason will be dealing with the NHL salary cap. The good news is that the cap next season will be close to the current $56.8 million. The bad news is that the Habs already have nearly $46 million committed to 14 players.

More Images »

On the hot seat: Canadiens GM Pierre Gauthier's first problem during the offseason will be dealing with the NHL salary cap. The good news is that the cap next season will be close to the current $56.8 million. The bad news is that the Habs already have nearly $46 million committed to 14 players.
Photograph by: John Kenney, The Gazette

MONTREAL – So, it’s a week before Christmas and Pierre “The Grinch” Gauthier decides to fire his coach. How do we feel about this? To quote Dr. Seuss: Stink. Stank. Stunk.

Gauthier, a Grinch so grumpy he makes Scrooge look like Santa, fired Jacques Martin to save his own hide. He fired the wrong guy. The right one would be the man Gauthier looks at when he shaves his sideburns up above his ears every morning.

By firing Martin, Gauthier reinforced the impression that the once-noble Canadiens are a floundering franchise in desperate need of a little stability. Since that now iconic Stanley Cup in 1993, the Canadiens have gone through Jacques Demers, Mario Tremblay, Alain Vigneault, Michel Therrien, Claude Julien, Guy Carbonneau, Bob Gainey (twice), Martin and (now) Randy Cunneyworth, who has a title only Grinch Gauthier could dream up: Interim Head Coach Until the End of the Season.

I’m not saying the Habs coaching job has become a revolving door, but Kim Kardashian’s husbands have better job security.

Fans always want a coaching change. It’s often the worst possible decision. Resident statistician Tim Mell comes up with these numbers for my favourite former Habs coach, Claude Julien: In the five years since New Jersey fired him, the Devils have won 10 playoff games. In the six years since the Canadiens fired him, they have won 19 playoff games.

And in four seasons in Boston, Julien has won 33 playoff games and a Stanley Cup.

Like assistant Perry Pearn before him, Jacques Martin was fed to the sharks Saturday to protect Gauthier’s hide. It might be a popular firing with the Canadiens faithful – who never cottoned to Martin’s conservative style – but that doesn’t mean it was right.

I am never a fan of firing a coach in mid-season, but this firing seems extreme. Despite a raft of problems, from Andrei Markov’s injury to Mike Cammalleri’s lack of production, Martin had his team only two points out of a playoff spot and the Canadiens had won two out of three before he was canned.

Since Martin’s firing, I’ve heard some ridiculous comments, including one radio type babbling about how the coach had to be fired because he promised a puck-possession game and didn’t deliver. (And here I thought it was all about winning games and going deep into the playoffs.)

The truth is that Martin is a solid, if uninspiring, coach, and firing him was the desperate act of a desperate general manager who has been frantically trying to get this team on track after betting the farm that Andrei Markov would be healthy and that Scott Gomez, at long last, would be productive.

More than ever, the Canadiens appear to be a floundering franchise, with Gauthier manoeuvring desperately to protect his own skin – bouncing Pearn, trading Jaroslav Spacek in order to take on Tomas Kaberle’s weighty contract, failing to deal with the Gomez mess, making a complete hash of the Markov situation, now firing Martin.

Like a gambler who has already thrown away the car and the savings account, Gauthier has now tossed the family home into the kitty. The way he’s going, Youppi! might be the next victim.

Gauthier has also put Cunneyworth in an untenable position, a guy with an interim title and high-school French expected to succeed in the league’s toughest job?

Truth is, all the people who say the Canadiens coach shouldn’t have to speak French are wrong. Radio and TV rights-holders need their sound-bites and they won’t settle for Larry Carriere for long. The Réjean Tremblays of Quebec might swallow this for a month or two, but the instant things go bad, they’re going to blame the anglo. With that, a pressure-packed job becomes virtually impossible – especially when the GM behaves as though the Bell Centre is the Kremlin, circa 1955, and he’s the head of the KGB.

The most bizarre aspect of Gauthier’s obsessive secrecy is that it’s so often counter-productive, as it was during the California trip, when Martin was left to tell reporters he didn’t know where Markov was after the club learned the defenceman would need yet another knee surgery.

Obviously, Martin knew. Just as obviously, he was under orders not to reveal anything. What, pray tell, was the purpose of that? Brian Burke talks to the media constantly. Banters with them, curses them out, tells them his thoughts. It doesn’t hurt his operation of the Toronto Maple Leafs one bit and it takes at least some of the pressure off his team – pressure Gauthier puts squarely on his coach by acting as though stonewalling the media is his first priority before everything else, winning included.

So, what is Gauthier’s long-term strategy now, other than trying to keep his job? So far, he has made one excellent decision during his tenure as GM: when it came to Jaroslav Halak vs. Carey Price, he got it right. Throw in another very good decision, the signing of Erik Cole.

Beyond that, Gauthier has proven adept at minor tactical adjustments during the season, such as picking up James Wisniewski after Markov went down last season. But he has been singularly inept when it comes to hanging on to his own talent – letting Dominic Moore go, and Roman Hamrlik, and Wisniewski, and the useful Jeff Halpern.

What is more troubling is that Gauthier doesn’t seem to have a long-term strategic plan. He alienated Josh Gorges with his negotiating tactics, failed to sign Carey Price long-term, and backed himself into a terrible corner with the fat, long-term contracts of Markov, Kaberle, Gomez, Cammalleri and Brian Gionta – a total cap hit in excess of $28.5 million for next season for only five players

Of those five, two (Markov and Gomez) aren’t playing. One (Gionta) is hurt and has eight goals this season to go with a minus-5. Another, Cammalleri, has turned from a cannon into a popgun. And the last, Kaberle, represents an enormous gamble, although he has looked more like the smooth-skating power-play quarterback we remember from Toronto than the discombobulated mess he was in Boston.

The only choice for Cunneyworth, as it was for Martin, is to keep playing Carey Price night after night and hope that the franchise goaltender can somehow drag a 13-20 team into the playoffs. But Price himself has shown signs of overwork: He has given up nine goals in his last two games, and although he has often carried this team his overall numbers are middle-of-the-pack: a 12-17 record, a save percentage of .915, a goals-against average of 2.38.

I still don’t believe this team will make the playoffs. Even if it does, it’s likely to be one series and out, against the likes of Boston or Philadelphia. Then it will be time for Geoff Molson to clean house, beginning with Gauthier. The Grinch slid into this job through the back door, with a handoff from Bob Gainey that precluded a public search for the best candidate.

Next time around, Molson has to find the best man for the job. (Hint – it isn’t Pierre Gauthier.)

Heroes: Jacques Martin, Hal Gill, Louis Leblanc, David Desharnais, Erik Cole, Max Pacioretty, Josh Gorges, Dainius Zubrus, Patrik Elias, Ilya Bryzgalov, Christopher Hitchens, Vaclav Havel, New Zealand’s cricketers &&&& last but not least, Santa Claus – because right now, we need him more than ever.

Zeros: Barry Bonds, Mike Milbury, Don Cherry, James Harrison, Todd Graham, Tim Tebow, James Harrison, Ozzie Guillen, Jeffrey Loria, David Samson, the Miami Marlins &&&&& last but not least, Pierre “The Grinch” Gauthier – who has a funny way of wishing a guy a Merry Christmas.

jacktodd46@yahoo.com

© Copyright (c) The Montreal Gazette

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...#ixzz1gzjT1xHQ

McSorleyStick is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:01 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.