HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Toronto Maple Leafs
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Ron Wilson needs to be fired! 4 years of Failure.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-22-2011, 07:48 PM
  #351
ForSpareParts*
agreement
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 5,904
vCash: 500
my hexes sometimes work out for the leafs!


ForSpareParts* is offline  
Old
12-22-2011, 07:53 PM
  #352
thepatient
Registered User
 
thepatient's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 622
vCash: 500
give that man an extension

thepatient is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 08:41 AM
  #353
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EazyB97 View Post
There usually is a lot of talent on Olympic teams, they weren't the 2nd most talented team though. They overachieved and you seem to be ignoring that. You've even gone as far as to suggest Babcock's system was the way Canada beat the US, when it was much closer than it should have been given the gap in talent.
says who? says you? I suppose one can argue that Canada is was also not the most "talented/skilled" team as the Russians usually take that award. But on the International stage, I would say that each of Russia, Czech, Canada, Sweden, USA and even Finland to some extent have very little to choose between them for great players..it usually comes down to depth. Canada really excels at depth. I mean the calibre of Canadian players that DON'T make the squad is sick. I believe Canada is the only nation that could realistically ice two teams who could contend for medals. As far as top level talent goes however, not alot to choose between nations which is why there usually isn't a heavy favorite for these tournaments.

hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 09:04 AM
  #354
EazyB97
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 27,943
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
says who? says you? I suppose one can argue that Canada is was also not the most "talented/skilled" team as the Russians usually take that award. But on the International stage, I would say that each of Russia, Czech, Canada, Sweden, USA and even Finland to some extent have very little to choose between them for great players..it usually comes down to depth. Canada really excels at depth. I mean the calibre of Canadian players that DON'T make the squad is sick. I believe Canada is the only nation that could realistically ice two teams who could contend for medals. As far as top level talent goes however, not alot to choose between nations which is why there usually isn't a heavy favorite for these tournaments.
Says pretty well every hockey analyst around. If you believe otherwise you were in a very small minority or simply ignorant to the views at that time. They weren't picked by many to medal and definitely not to give Canada the run they did.

Canada was the favourite and likely had the most talent with the best player in the world (Crosby) and easily the deepest roster.


Last edited by EazyB97: 12-23-2011 at 09:10 AM.
EazyB97 is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 12:29 PM
  #355
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by agreement View Post
tonight:

the leafs cannot score on the PP.

and they are getting scored on in the PK.



bye bye leafs. this season:

This post is ****ing priceless.

smoke meat pete* is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 12:59 PM
  #356
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EazyB97 View Post
Says pretty well every hockey analyst around. If you believe otherwise you were in a very small minority or simply ignorant to the views at that time. They weren't picked by many to medal and definitely not to give Canada the run they did.

Canada was the favourite and likely had the most talent with the best player in the world (Crosby) and easily the deepest roster.
FORWARDS: David Backes, Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan, Chris Drury, Patrick Kane, Ryan Kesler, Phil Kessel, Jamie Langenbrunner, Ryan Malone, Zach Parise, Joe Pavelski, Bobby Ryan, Paul Stastny.

DEFENSEMEN: Erik Johnson, Jack Johnson, Mike Komisarek, Paul Martin, Brooks Orpik, Brian Rafalski, Ryan Suter.

GOALTENDERS: Ryan Miller, Jonathan Quick, Tim Thomas.

Red = Superstar or superstar potential
Blue = Young and high ceiling potential players
Bolded= Some of the best role players in the NHL

I think that you musn't know alot about hockey if you think that that roster with 2 of the top 5 goaltenders in the world to anchor it shouldn't be considered a viable team to win GOLD at the 2010 Olympics. Its tough to call is my point because all the major hockey powers could win any given tourney. The days of Canada or Russia being the heavy favorite are over.


Last edited by hockeyfanz: 12-23-2011 at 01:08 PM.
hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 01:55 PM
  #357
thewave
Registered User
 
thewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 8,817
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
FORWARDS: David Backes, Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan, Chris Drury, Patrick Kane, Ryan Kesler, Phil Kessel, Jamie Langenbrunner, Ryan Malone, Zach Parise, Joe Pavelski, Bobby Ryan, Paul Stastny.

DEFENSEMEN: Erik Johnson, Jack Johnson, Mike Komisarek, Paul Martin, Brooks Orpik, Brian Rafalski, Ryan Suter.


GOALTENDERS: Ryan Miller, Jonathan Quick, Tim Thomas.

Red = Superstar or superstar potential
Blue = Young and high ceiling potential players
Bolded= Some of the best role players in the NHL

I think that you musn't know alot about hockey if you think that that roster with 2 of the top 5 goaltenders in the world to anchor it shouldn't be considered a viable team to win GOLD at the 2010 Olympics. Its tough to call is my point because all the major hockey powers could win any given tourney. The days of Canada or Russia being the heavy favorite are over.
Could even argue: Callahan + Rafalski as bolded and nobody would put up much fuss.

thewave is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 01:59 PM
  #358
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
Maybe someone should reference the Olympic prediction thread to see what people thought.

smoke meat pete* is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 02:13 PM
  #359
thewave
Registered User
 
thewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 8,817
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynrehab View Post
Maybe someone should reference the Olympic prediction thread to see what people thought.
People think a lot of things. People also never thought Montreal would be in the cup in 1993 let alone win it 4 games to 1. That's half the problem in hockey, people listen to what people think to much. It's just like a polling system in the media. Someone will pick up on something someone discussed and everyone will jump on board if they feel they can sell it.

As for the Leafs and Wilson, well, the same things happen against the same sorts of teams repeatedly. The PK stays the same no matter who is swapped out for players. That is quite telling especially when looking back over 4 years worth of trends patterns let alone how obvious it is on the ice.

If the media all said Reimer is the best Goalie in the world would you believe them? If they told you the sky was brown would you believe them? If they told you Wilson is the Leafs #1 Star would you believe them?

Many questions...Many observations...Many stats but...and not to sound cheesy but literally on any given day they mean nothing in sports.

thewave is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:14 PM
  #360
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by theremedial View Post
Could even argue: Callahan + Rafalski as bolded and nobody would put up much fuss.
I agree...Rafalski was a pretty decent defenseman...pretty under-rated for the most part. And Ryan Malone is a good gritty bottom 6 player (on Team USA) as well. The Americans as much as I hate to admit it, will be a thorn in Canada's side going forward. They will give Canada fits more than any other nation because they pretty much play the same brand of hockey.

hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:35 PM
  #361
Darcy Tucker
Registered User
 
Darcy Tucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Vaughan, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,404
vCash: 500
anyone else think theremedial and hockeyfanz are the same person??

Darcy Tucker is online now  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:37 PM
  #362
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Tucker View Post
anyone else think theremedial and hockeyfanz are the same person??
No more than you and EazyB97 being the same person. You're welcome.

hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:39 PM
  #363
Darcy Tucker
Registered User
 
Darcy Tucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Vaughan, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
No more than you and EazyB97 being the same person. You're welcome.
im welcome for what

Darcy Tucker is online now  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:41 PM
  #364
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynrehab View Post
Maybe someone should reference the Olympic prediction thread to see what people thought.
TBH Rehab, my point is the Olympics is very hard to predict. The teams are so close. I remember Nagano where Canada finished 7th? And the year the US finished 8th and trashed their hotel rooms. It only takes one critical loss and you're done. And when the teams are so close its quite possible to have anybody win the tournament. Its the same in World Cup of Soccer where any one of 5 or 6 nations could win in any given year.

hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:43 PM
  #365
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Tucker View Post
im welcome for what
I dunno...you held up the "help" sign. I just helped you. You're welcome.

hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 03:48 PM
  #366
T M L
The Big Smoke
 
T M L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: T.O
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,875
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepatient View Post
give that man an extension
Yes, 3 wins in the last 10 games justifies this!


You have to look at the overall picture, not on a 1 game basis.

T M L is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 04:30 PM
  #367
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
TBH Rehab, my point is the Olympics is very hard to predict. The teams are so close. I remember Nagano where Canada finished 7th? And the year the US finished 8th and trashed their hotel rooms. It only takes one critical loss and you're done. And when the teams are so close its quite possible to have anybody win the tournament. Its the same in World Cup of Soccer where any one of 5 or 6 nations could win in any given year.
Want to know a secret?

smoke meat pete* is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 04:45 PM
  #368
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
...I picked the Americans to do well, on the backs of Ryan Miller.

smoke meat pete* is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 04:47 PM
  #369
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Tucker View Post
anyone else think theremedial and hockeyfanz are the same person??
No, hockeyfanz has more than one catchphrase.

smoke meat pete* is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 04:49 PM
  #370
AlmightyPO
Registered User
 
AlmightyPO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Kingston
Country: Canada
Posts: 790
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynrehab View Post
...I picked the Americans to do well, on the backs of Ryan Miller.
Didn't most people think they would do well?

AlmightyPO is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 04:59 PM
  #371
dystemper
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 978
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlmightyPO View Post
Didn't most people think they would do well?
yes.

dystemper is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 05:04 PM
  #372
leafsfuture
Registered User
 
leafsfuture's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,547
vCash: 500
Saying Wilson needs to be fired doesnt mean hes a bad coach.

Like in any sport, the mental aspect of the game is absolutely crucial, and if the players lose the coach, or the coach develops biases, it may be time to change things up

leafsfuture is online now  
Old
12-23-2011, 05:21 PM
  #373
EazyB97
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 27,943
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
FORWARDS: David Backes, Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan, Chris Drury, Patrick Kane, Ryan Kesler, Phil Kessel, Jamie Langenbrunner, Ryan Malone, Zach Parise, Joe Pavelski, Bobby Ryan, Paul Stastny.

DEFENSEMEN: Erik Johnson, Jack Johnson, Mike Komisarek, Paul Martin, Brooks Orpik, Brian Rafalski, Ryan Suter.

GOALTENDERS: Ryan Miller, Jonathan Quick, Tim Thomas.

Red = Superstar or superstar potential
Blue = Young and high ceiling potential players
Bolded= Some of the best role players in the NHL

I think that you musn't know alot about hockey if you think that that roster with 2 of the top 5 goaltenders in the world to anchor it shouldn't be considered a viable team to win GOLD at the 2010 Olympics. Its tough to call is my point because all the major hockey powers could win any given tourney. The days of Canada or Russia being the heavy favorite are over.
Nice list, now do it or every Olympic team and consider how those players were viewed at time.

It's cute you want to dismiss this as simply my opinion, but ideas the consensus at the time. Most people had them out of the medals.

Tim Thomas lost his job that year, a top 5 goaltender now and the year before but that was an off year for TT.

High ceiling players are great for the future, doesn't mean much for a 3 week tournament that happened almost 2 years ago. They weren't awful but they were viewed as a young team expected to finish out of the medals by most experts.


Last edited by EazyB97: 12-23-2011 at 05:46 PM.
EazyB97 is offline  
Old
12-23-2011, 05:40 PM
  #374
Darcy Tucker
Registered User
 
Darcy Tucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Vaughan, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dystemper View Post
yes.
not as well as the Russians, Swedes, Czechs and team Canada tho. USA was an afterthought and at the time had very few established stars outside of Parise and Miller. Wilson did a great job with them. If you guys want to downplay your home-team coach taking underdogs to a Silver medal and one goal from Gold then thats your perogative.

Darcy Tucker is online now  
Old
12-23-2011, 05:43 PM
  #375
bjtkyo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 615
vCash: 500
I just hate the incredible fallacy of "he's a good coach, so we should keep him."

Plenty of great coaches, the best of all time, had to move teams because they were fired or not extended. Just because Wilson is a decent coach doesn't justify keeping him if he's not a good fit. Versteeg is a good player, but wasn't fitting in with Toronto and wasn't doing a great job.

bjtkyo is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:35 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.