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Derek Roy

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Old
12-29-2011, 10:46 AM
  #101
Gliff
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Originally Posted by HiddenInLight View Post
All the Duck fans offering quantity for quality deals are amusing after reading the Ryan and getzlaf threads.
The difference is that most of those threads are not started by Ducks fans.

Also a Buffalo fan said he would be interested in a prospect + our second. We ddint just pull that out of our *****.

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12-29-2011, 10:47 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
I can't agree with you there. If Ales Hemsky is an injury concern so is Derek Roy. If you add up his past two seasons, you get just over 70 games. You need to go to 3 years ago before you get to a full season. Talented? Yes, A leader? NO. Injury issues? YES, and that's probably what's been holding him back this year because he's not up to his nearly PPG status and it definitely hurts his value. When healthy, he's normally Buffalo's best player, Vanek included.
He's had one traumatic injury that cost him most of 2010-11, otherwise he's been very healthy. Since the lockout, he's played 75 or more games in every season except for last year. He's not injury-prone, and he's certainly not in Hemsky's zip code for being injured.

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12-29-2011, 10:51 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by r0bert8841 View Post
Why would Detroit give up Flip for Roy? Their is no need for that. Detroit doesn't make trades for the sake of trading.

For Roy they would probably offer something around Tatar + Kindl + picks. I can't see them offering anymore, maybe Hudler if your interested.
And Buffalo is stocked with young wingers and defensemen, so they wouldn't make that deal. I think Sheahan would be a must in any deal for Roy. Buffalo was interested in Sheahan that draft year, and there were reports that they were visibly dismayed when Detroit drafted him.

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12-29-2011, 10:53 AM
  #104
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Roy has to net somthing similar to what Mike Richards got, so basically a top prospect + roster player + 2nd or 3rd.

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12-29-2011, 11:07 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Roy has to net somthing similar to what Mike Richards got, so basically a top prospect + roster player + 2nd or 3rd.
Roy's a solid hockey player, but I think there's a gap in value between him and Richards (Richards having more, of course). Richards was signed for many years at a pretty reasonable cap hit for what he brings; Roy is signed at a great cap hit, but he's UFA after next season and I'm guessing that after years of being underpaid relative to his production he's going to want a more long-term deal (5+ years) at a cap hit close to his next year's salary ($5.5m) for his next contract. There'd be a real risk for any acquiring team that he may be gone after 2012-13, whereas Richards is signed through 2019-20. I get that there's risk in those long-term deals, as well, especially at the back-end, but LA was getting many of Richards' prime years, too.

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12-29-2011, 11:10 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Roy has to net somthing similar to what Mike Richards got, so basically a top prospect + roster player + 2nd or 3rd.
not really... more like a better version of what the Penner trade returned (a 1st, a high prospect, conditional 3rd).

Penner had one more year on his deal, like Roy does...

Buffalo should be looking at a 1st round pick, a prospect better then Teubert (and at the center position), as well as a 3rd piece (of more value then a 3rd)

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12-29-2011, 11:17 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
not really... more like a better version of what the Penner trade returned (a 1st, a high prospect, conditional 3rd).

Penner had one more year on his deal, like Roy does...

Buffalo should be looking at a 1st round pick, a prospect better then Teubert (and at the center position), as well as a 3rd piece (of more value then a 3rd)
I still like the idea of Kruger + McNeill/Pirri + Beach.

I think Roy would thrive in Chicago in a properly cast role as a center with a high amount of offensive zone starts while Toews and Bolland do the heavy defensive lifting. Chicago would be able to exploit matchups for him that Buffalo can't--because he's the only top-6 center on the roster--or won't--because they rarely play him with Vanek anymore.

Buffalo gets two good young centers in Kruger and McNeill/Pirri, plus a mean winger in Beach. Seeing Kassian and Beach in the same top-9 would be a thing to behold.

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12-29-2011, 11:19 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I still like the idea of Kruger + McNeill/Pirri + Beach.

I think Roy would thrive in Chicago in a properly cast role as a center with a high amount of offensive zone starts while Toews and Bolland do the heavy defensive lifting. Chicago would be able to exploit matchups for him that Buffalo can't--because he's the only top-6 center on the roster--or won't--because they rarely play him with Vanek anymore.

Buffalo gets two good young centers in Kruger and McNeill/Pirri, plus a mean winger in Beach. Seeing Kassian and Beach in the same top-9 would be a thing to behold.
Agreed, wouldn't mind seeing that trade happen.

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Old
12-29-2011, 11:20 AM
  #109
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Roy to Florida for Bjugstad, Florida's 1st and a player like Matthias or Santorelli?

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Old
12-29-2011, 11:22 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
And Mike Green played 49 games last year and a full season the year prior. This year, he's screwed up.

Brad Boyes & Derek Roy
for
Vinney Lecavalier

Add picks on either side as necessary.

At least Buffalo has a leader and Tampa gets back a #2 center, another decent forward and financial relief. A 7m cap hit isn't the end of the world with a rising cap. A 10m dollar salary is an issue for a team that doesn't make any money and poor owners.
The actual salary isn't an issue, but the cap hit is. 7.7 million is too rich for my blood. If I'm moving Roy it's for guys who are going to give a great bang for the buck

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12-29-2011, 11:24 AM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I still like the idea of Kruger + McNeill/Pirri + Beach.

I think Roy would thrive in Chicago in a properly cast role as a center with a high amount of offensive zone starts while Toews and Bolland do the heavy defensive lifting. Chicago would be able to exploit matchups for him that Buffalo can't--because he's the only top-6 center on the roster--or won't--because they rarely play him with Vanek anymore.

Buffalo gets two good young centers in Kruger and McNeill/Pirri, plus a mean winger in Beach. Seeing Kassian and Beach in the same top-9 would be a thing to behold.
I'm pretty sure Beach wasn't even on their draft board that year. I don't think they'll suddenly change their mind on him and want to bring him in. The kid is a headcase.

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Old
12-29-2011, 11:26 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
I'm pretty sure Beach wasn't even on their draft board that year. I don't honk they'll suddenly change their mind on him and want to bring him in. The kid is a headcase.
Same thing could be said about Kassian, but he brings a lot of what our top 6 has been missing. Also not sure how you know what their draft board looked like.

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Old
12-29-2011, 11:28 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
I'm pretty sure Beach wasn't even on their draft board that year. I don't think they'll suddenly change their mind on him and want to bring him in. The kid is a headcase.
You're complaining about the third piece in a three-piece deal. Fine, change Beach to a 2nd or Brandon Saad. The principals of the deal remain the same.

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Old
12-29-2011, 11:35 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
So you want a guy who from 2007-08 through 2010-11 averaged a shade under a point/game (.93 ppg), plays all three phases, and plays the position with the highest market value, but you don't want to put any of the Big Three on the table, nor do you want to offer two of your top four prospects? That negotiation isn't going to last long.

Realistically--and ignoring the fact that Anaheim should be bolstering its forward pipeline, not weakening it--Buffalo would probably want a package around Holland + Etem/Palmieri + Bonino.



If its Palmieri, then deal.

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12-29-2011, 11:36 AM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by is the answer jesus View Post
Same thing could be said about Kassian, but he brings a lot of what our top 6 has been missing. Also not sure how you know what their draft board looked like.
It's easy deduction. The sabres had a top 11; Myers was drafted 12th but was the last of the top 11 available. Therefore, one player was drafted before Myers that they didn't have rated. Many scouts said they wouldn't touch Beach. It seems he's the most likely one to be left off.

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12-29-2011, 11:44 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Difficult to put a package together from NJ.

Sabres are going to want a young center (either young NHLer showing top 6 ability, or very high end prospect).... along with atleast a 1st rounder and another prospect (forward)

Sabres have no interest in Defensemen pro or prospect or NHL wingers
Would you have interest in Josefson/Tedenby?

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12-29-2011, 11:45 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
It's easy deduction. The sabres had a top 11; Myers was drafted 12th but was the last of the top 11 available. Therefore, one player was drafted before Myers that they didn't have rated. Many scouts said they wouldn't touch Beach. It seems he's the most likely one to be left off.
Having him a tier below the top-11 =/= unwillingness to have him in your organization under any circumstances. You don't know the organization's reasoning on these matters. Maybe they did think he was too much of a loose cannon--though they went and drafted Kassian a year later even though it sometimes looks like the lights are on but nobody's home with Zack--or maybe they just didn't think he was on the same level as those top-11 players (which is actually correct). But that doesn't mean they want nothing to do with the kid.

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12-29-2011, 11:58 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by njdevils3034 View Post
Would you have interest in Josefson/Tedenby?
From a Sabres POV I think its Henrique or bust with NJ. There are far better options that could be had than josef/teden

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12-29-2011, 11:58 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by njdevils3034 View Post
Would you have interest in Josefson/Tedenby?
I don't think either player has a high enough ceiling to make the deal appealing to Buffalo.

NJ isn't a good fit (since they aren't putting Henrique or Zajac in play)

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12-29-2011, 11:59 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
It's easy deduction. The sabres had a top 11; Myers was drafted 12th but was the last of the top 11 available. Therefore, one player was drafted before Myers that they didn't have rated. Many scouts said they wouldn't touch Beach. It seems he's the most likely one to be left off.
For all we know it could have been Filatov. Even if Beach wasn't as highly rated by Darcy and our scouts as Myers, what does that have to do with anything? Beach holds no value because we wanted Tyler Myers more?

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12-29-2011, 12:01 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I still like the idea of Kruger + McNeill/Pirri + Beach.

I think Roy would thrive in Chicago in a properly cast role as a center with a high amount of offensive zone starts while Toews and Bolland do the heavy defensive lifting. Chicago would be able to exploit matchups for him that Buffalo can't--because he's the only top-6 center on the roster--or won't--because they rarely play him with Vanek anymore.

Buffalo gets two good young centers in Kruger and McNeill/Pirri, plus a mean winger in Beach. Seeing Kassian and Beach in the same top-9 would be a thing to behold.
I'm not that high on Kruger or Pirri.

Mcneil, Beach, 1st ?

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12-29-2011, 12:08 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I'm not that high on Kruger or Pirri.

Mcneil, Beach, 1st ?
I don't love that value as much because I think Chicago will be picking between 25-30, so that 1st will take a bit more time to develop. I think it just comes down to I value Kruger higher than most, and I also like Pirri a lot--he's got 31 pts in 28 AHL games as a 20-year-old (Luke Adam numbers) and he plays center every game (unlike Luke).

The big thing is that I'd want at least two young centers back from Chicago if we're giving up our only top-6 center.

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12-29-2011, 12:19 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I don't love that value as much because I think Chicago will be picking between 25-30, so that 1st will take a bit more time to develop. I think it just comes down to I value Kruger higher than most, and I also like Pirri a lot--he's got 31 pts in 28 AHL games as a 20-year-old (Luke Adam numbers) and he plays center every game (unlike Luke).

The big thing is that I'd want at least two young centers back from Chicago if we're giving up our only top-6 center.
Me too... I haven't seen much of Pirri, so I'll trust your judgement there. Not impressed with Kruger this year. He's really passive, and hasn't displayed much skill in the handful of games I've seen this year.

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12-29-2011, 12:19 PM
  #124
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I can't agree with you there. If Ales Hemsky is an injury concern so is Derek Roy. If you add up his past two seasons, you get just over 70 games. You need to go to 3 years ago before you get to a full season. Talented? Yes, A leader? NO. Injury issues? YES, and that's probably what's been holding him back this year because he's not up to his nearly PPG status and it definitely hurts his value. When healthy, he's normally Buffalo's best player, Vanek included.
lol, what the hell are you talking about? you do realize that we're in December, right? NOBODY has fully played the 2011-12 season yet. If you add up the past 2 seasons, nobody has played over 115-120 games. Roy missed half a season with a single injury. The main reason why his production is down this year is because he has played most of the year with Stafford (down year) and one of Leino (10 pts in 29 GP), Ennis (5 pts in 15 GP) or Gerbe (12 pts in 29 GP), as opposed to playing with Vanek as usual.

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12-29-2011, 02:22 PM
  #125
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I still like the idea of Kruger + McNeill/Pirri + Beach.

I think Roy would thrive in Chicago in a properly cast role as a center with a high amount of offensive zone starts while Toews and Bolland do the heavy defensive lifting. Chicago would be able to exploit matchups for him that Buffalo can't--because he's the only top-6 center on the roster--or won't--because they rarely play him with Vanek anymore.

Buffalo gets two good young centers in Kruger and McNeill/Pirri, plus a mean winger in Beach. Seeing Kassian and Beach in the same top-9 would be a thing to behold.
I agree. I could see roy getting back up in the mid 80 point range with that talent around him. He just doesn't mesh well with our top talent of vanek and pominville and still gets around a ppg.

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