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Bob Gainey now with the team

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:32 PM
  #76
Young Gun
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**** who would want gainey back, jesus from bad to worst, its' what makes this team go in the wrong direction...**** bob gainey

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:33 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
The most irrealistic of posters around here have never come to terms with the imperative ownership puts on management and simply ignore it because it doesn't fit their bias. Be angry at ownership and the NHL for this imperative of 'win now'.
Please add the "unbiased" poster in the same category as the "best man available" or "best player available". Category of "things that don't exist". Everybody has an opinion on something that makes them biased. You and others have had the greatest of opinion of Gainey and this present management. Which you are absolutely entitled you, yet, it doesn't make you less bias. At one point, unless you never have an opinion on something, the day you start expressing, you become bias. And again, there's nothing wrong with that. It just what it is. Just like the best man available and best plaeyr available who, unless we are talking about a CLEAR winner which is in the category of the exceptionals, you are only the best depending who you talk to.

As far as the present win now attitude, yes, of course, people wants to win now. Yet, a great management is able to combine both. Win now AND build a foundation to win later. 'Cause the "later" we're talking about today.....will be the future "now". Boston build a team to go far, and then decided to trade Kessel for the future. And they won NOW without Kessel, and might win later with the future.

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12-22-2011, 09:37 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Ford Prefect View Post
I agree wholeheartedly. This guy is a winner. Period. Took the North Stars to the Stanley Cup, won another as GM of the Dallas Stars (as well as another Stanley Cup berth, and six straight division titles). Saying nothing of the 5 cups he won in this city. He's a legitimate Hall of Famer who was so good at what he did players on BOTH sides of the Atlantic thought he was the best player in the world. So good they made an award to recognize his achievements.

I understand that there is a lot of discontent over some of his personnel decisions. I get it, I don't like the composition of this team either. It's fine to be critical of his decisions, but do so with a modicum of decorum. This organization is the standard when it comes to class in this (or any) league, and that is due to people like Beliveau, Richard, and GAINEY. Some of you little pukes hiding behind your monitors need to learn a little history. And respect.
having class and respect doesn't put up 2 points...**** gainey and the old boys club

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:43 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Please look at the Hamilton roster which won that Cup.


Besides Price and Lapierre, not much to write home about
I'll be a little more broad and look at the players who suited for the bulldogs that year.

Halak
Price
Chipchura
Lapierre
Kostitsyn
D'agostini
O'Byrne
Desjardins
Danis
Grabovski

Which doesn't take into account Latendresse who wasn't AHL eligible or Sergei Kostitsyn who had a playoff run of his own with the london knights.

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:44 PM
  #80
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for all u guys screaming fire PG n BG right now,with who exactly do we replace them with ? the next GM in place needs to know hes **** cuz believe it or not will have no choice to be sellers this year,this team is getting worst every game.Were not making the playoffs come deadline i better see Gill Cammy Akost ( if not resign ) Gionta Kaberle Campoli all gone,grab younger players + picks and go big draft day

but is there any good GM's out there to replace ours if it does happen before the season ends ? dont know much about the gm's available tbh

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:44 PM
  #81
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Sal 4 GM.

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:46 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Gainey must be respected as a human being and as a HOFamer. No question.

His DG moves are questionable, almost every single of them.
Like trading Balej and a 2nd for Kovalev? Like trading Garon for Huet and Bonk? Like trading Rivet for Gorges and a 1st (Pacioretty)? Like having faith in Price when all the chicken littles had already given up on the young goalie? For allowing Trevor Timmins to build very solid prospect depth despite the Habs never bottoming out?

All GMs make mistakes but Gainey brought credibility and stability to this organization after a very dark period. Gainey's biggest mistake may have been not surrounding the Centennial years team with the right veterans and off-ice antics contributed to to the kids melting down and a sudden dramatic turnover of the roster. It's too bad we didn't have leaders like Gill, Gionta, Moen around as veterans to complement that team.

I'd welcome Bob back in a heartbeat. Very strong man...doesn't give a rats ### about what the media and ignorant fans say. Doubtful that he would have had knee-jerk reaction of firing Martin. We could certainly do a lot worse than Bob Gainey as GM....whether temporary or long-term.

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:47 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by PATCHESx67 View Post
for all u guys screaming fire PG n BG right now,with who exactly do we replace them with ? the next GM in place needs to know hes **** cuz believe it or not will have no choice to be sellers this year,this team is getting worst every game.Were not making the playoffs come deadline i better see Gill Cammy Akost ( if not resign ) Gionta Kaberle Campoli all gone,grab younger players + picks and go big draft day

but is there any good GM's out there to replace ours if it does happen before the season ends ? dont know much about the gm's available tbh
I'd rather Molson than PG, he's that bad. At least Gainey on interim basis is better. Stockpile picks and rebuild. Do trades like rivet for gorges and pacioretty and leave after.

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:48 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by PATCHESx67 View Post
for all u guys screaming fire PG n BG right now,with who exactly do we replace them with ? the next GM in place needs to know hes **** cuz believe it or not will have no choice to be sellers this year,this team is getting worst every game.Were not making the playoffs come deadline i better see Gill Cammy Akost ( if not resign ) Gionta Kaberle Campoli all gone,grab younger players + picks and go big draft day

but is there any good GM's out there to replace ours if it does happen before the season ends ? dont know much about the gm's available tbh
Right now, the timing is super bad.

And Gauthier created that situation by himself by firing Martin at tyhe wrong time too.


+ the language debate...


Just awful decisions and timing.

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12-22-2011, 09:51 PM
  #85
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yes i woudlnt mind BG stepping back in for the rest of the season and just sell for younger players and picks,i just hope they dont start selling our farm to grab old vets to help us make the playoffs like every year

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:57 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by PATCHESx67 View Post
yes i woudlnt mind BG stepping back in for the rest of the season and just sell for younger players and picks,i just hope they dont start selling our farm to grab old vets to help us make the playoffs like every year
Thing about gainey in interim basis=he's not trying to save his job. Pierre Gauthier on the other hand might try to.

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Old
12-22-2011, 09:59 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Please add the "unbiased" poster in the same category as the "best man available" or "best player available". Category of "things that don't exist". Everybody has an opinion on something that makes them biased. You and others have had the greatest of opinion of Gainey and this present management. Which you are absolutely entitled you, yet, it doesn't make you less bias. At one point, unless you never have an opinion on something, the day you start expressing, you become bias. And again, there's nothing wrong with that. It just what it is. Just like the best man available and best plaeyr available who, unless we are talking about a CLEAR winner which is in the category of the exceptionals, you are only the best depending who you talk to.

As far as the present win now attitude, yes, of course, people wants to win now. Yet, a great management is able to combine both. Win now AND build a foundation to win later. 'Cause the "later" we're talking about today.....will be the future "now". Boston build a team to go far, and then decided to trade Kessel for the future. And they won NOW without Kessel, and might win later with the future.
Do you understand the fallacy in this? Firstly, it's the same thing the Habs did with Halak, and secondly, they didn't win now solely because of that trade. The two most important factors in that team were Chara and Thomas. One big ticket UFA, one goalie drafted. Like I said before, given opportunities at a given moment, and the outcome is decided by the players who chose, not the other way around, and from all accounts, Gainey (and PG) tried to sign many big ticket UFAs, and got what he could with the opportunities he had in that regards, and in the end, when you can't draft high, the UFA market is the single most important opportunity to improve a team.

Don't lecture me on bias either, and acting as if there aren't differences in degrees of subjectiveness/objectiveness when people ignore/reject/deny what is a known fact, a logical, rational outlook that considers what is most relevant to the subject, business, and the outlook, money/profit. High levels of subjectivity are displayed when people do not incorporate all the known facts of the subject they are analyzing and rather fill the void with emotional/ego-based reactions. The way to have less bias is objectivity, and that begins by focusing on every aspect of a subject, not just the simplistic comparisons of 'the bottom line'.

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Old
12-22-2011, 10:02 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by PATCHESx67 View Post
yes i woudlnt mind BG stepping back in for the rest of the season and just sell for younger players and picks,i just hope they dont start selling our farm to grab old vets to help us make the playoffs like every year
Just like when Bob had a chance to trade some players at the deadline in our 100 th anniversary year and then let 8 FREE AGENTS walk for NOTHING!

Just like when Bob traded for the untraceable contract like Gomez and threw in McDonough and Higgins. Every team laughed at us then and is STILL laughing at us 3 YEARS later.

That Bob Gainey????


GIMME ME A FREAKIN BREAK!!!!!!!!!

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Old
12-22-2011, 10:04 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
Like trading Balej and a 2nd for Kovalev? Like trading Garon for Huet and Bonk? Like trading Rivet for Gorges and a 1st (Pacioretty)? Like having faith in Price when all the chicken littles had already given up on the young goalie? For allowing Trevor Timmins to build very solid prospect depth despite the Habs never bottoming out?

All GMs make mistakes but Gainey brought credibility and stability to this organization after a very dark period. Gainey's biggest mistake may have been not surrounding the Centennial years team with the right veterans and off-ice antics contributed to to the kids melting down and a sudden dramatic turnover of the roster. It's too bad we didn't have leaders like Gill, Gionta, Moen around as veterans to complement that team.

I'd welcome Bob back in a heartbeat. Very strong man...doesn't give a rats ### about what the media and ignorant fans say. Doubtful that he would have had knee-jerk reaction of firing Martin. We could certainly do a lot worse than Bob Gainey as GM....whether temporary or long-term.
Gainey doesn't give a rats ass about what the media and fans are saying? So it was really his idea to get Brière and Lecavalier? The trade for Balej for Kovalev? Or do you mean the "Pick one of Hossa-Plekanec-Bajej for Kovalev? Sure end result is Balej, I'd blame the Rangers for not picking the right guy. The Huet trade was good. And so the MaxPac one. Great we have 2 good trades. 'Cause let's not forget, as good as the Kovalev trade was...we are talking about Kovalev the punk are we? The showman Kovy who was no good and we couldn't get rid of sooner?

And don't forget that when Gainey left, he said he was out of it. He was past his time and he couldn't follow anymore. HE SAID IT. Not me. But you'd take him back? 'Cause he's now back in this? How does that happen?

Gainey build a team, destroyed it, and build another one. A new one who still has tons of things to proove if they ever can. Great man, great captain, one of the best. But a guy who has been playing in teams who had the greatest of mix from skills to toughness and can't acnowledge that this is still a need in this era, does not deserve to come back. And especially him, it's unacceptable. He lived it. He knows it works. Geez, HE WAS EVEN ONE OF THEM. He had this perfect blend of skills and toughness. But no. Let's filled this team with everything BUT what was a proof of success in his era and amongst the best of teams in our era. But...but...but....there's the Wings? If you don't have the pure talent of the Wings, you can't be the Wings. We never had. Which means that recipe is bogus. Yet, amongst that recipe, while there are no fighters on that team, you had Frenzen, Zetterberg, and other guys who were tough as nails who were extremely hard to contain à la Datsyuk. Who the **** was our Datsyuk. So Gainey had a great theory. A theory that he was never able to make it reality. And instead of admitting it and trying to think outside the box....he pursued it with Gomez-Gionta-Cammy. Made no sense then. Makes no sense now.

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Old
12-22-2011, 10:04 PM
  #90
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Who knows, maybe Bob stepped down two years ago to finally work on getting his grade 10. Maybe he's ready to take another jab at this new NHL thing.

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12-22-2011, 10:08 PM
  #91
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Cammy would float
Can someone explain this ty.

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12-22-2011, 10:14 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Young Gun View Post
having class and respect doesn't put up 2 points...**** gainey and the old boys club
so, what you're saying is, you have no clue what these two words mean.

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Old
12-22-2011, 10:19 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Do you understand the fallacy in this? Firstly, it's the same thing the Habs did with Halak, and secondly, they didn't win now solely because of that trade. The two most important factors in that team were Chara and Thomas. One big ticket UFA, one goalie drafted. Like I said before, given opportunities at a given moment, and the outcome is decided by the players who chose, not the other way around, and from all accounts, Gainey (and PG) tried to sign many big ticket UFAs, and got what he could with the opportunities he had in that regards, and in the end, when you can't draft high, the UFA market is the single most important opportunity to improve a team.

Don't lecture me on bias either, and acting as if there aren't differences in degrees of subjectiveness/objectiveness when people ignore/reject/deny what is a known fact, a logical, rational outlook that considers what is most relevant to the subject, business, and the outlook, money/profit. High levels of subjectivity are displayed when people do not incorporate all the known facts of the subject they are analyzing and rather fill the void with emotional/ego-based reactions. The way to have less bias is objectivity, and that begins by focusing on every aspect of a subject, not just the simplistic comparisons of 'the bottom line'.
Unless you are a member of the team, please tell me what you know to be facts? Unless you decide what is a fact. And the day you decide to proclaim it, is the day you have an opinion on what a fact is for you.

As far as who made it possible for Boston, yep Chara and Thomas were great parts to it. Thomas was not a Bruins draft pick but it doesn't matter. Yet, they had some great contribution by Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand all great draft picks who were not picked that high. And add the Horton trade who we all known was a steal by Chiarelli at the time, and you do get a great recipe for success. But they were able to get the RIGHT UFA in due time, not go on a shopping spree because they HAD to get rid of Koivu and others and had to pick what was there, they picked accordingly and were strong enough to part with one hell of a goal scorer, something most "experts" in here said that they were going to miss big time. Mind you, they were at 1 goal of being right.....but that's not what history will remember.

And again, objectivity is a great word. But tough to actually use it. Yet, who decides that you are objective or not? If I tell you that you are not objective, you are proclaiming it's me that is dishonest and who only wants to bash the organization based on me being biased. How can you auto-proclaimed yourself as the objective person in a debate when you automatically has to choose a side at some point. I have a hard time believing who's objective in a debate when confronted to a GM's resume, some people just have the hardest of time mentioning the wrong moves he has made......So the guy was THAT perfect? But then usually when people replied to me "I've never said he was perfect..." they still can't mention his wrong moves....I don't see objectivity in this.

Oh and there's no lecture in any of this. It's how I see things. Not sure where I told you that you shouldn't view it the way you want.

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12-22-2011, 10:23 PM
  #94
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Cammy would float
I don't know whether to agree with you because he's a lightweight or to disagree because he's dead weight.

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12-22-2011, 10:23 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Gainey doesn't give a rats ass about what the media and fans are saying? So it was really his idea to get Brière and Lecavalier? The trade for Balej for Kovalev? Or do you mean the "Pick one of Hossa-Plekanec-Bajej for Kovalev? Sure end result is Balej, I'd blame the Rangers for not picking the right guy. The Huet trade was good. And so the MaxPac one. Great we have 2 good trades. 'Cause let's not forget, as good as the Kovalev trade was...we are talking about Kovalev the punk are we? The showman Kovy who was no good and we couldn't get rid of sooner?
Actually I would disagree this was a good trade. Huet was playing phenomenal until we started the Price carousel, and even then we played decent. In addition, this was the most dominate season we had in over a decade, yet we moved the guy who had a significant contributor to our success, to rely on a kid who hadn't even played a season in the NHL.

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12-22-2011, 10:23 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Unless you are a member of the team, please tell me what you know to be facts? Unless you decide what is a fact. And the day you decide to proclaim it, is the day you have an opinion on what a fact is for you.

As far as who made it possible for Boston, yep Chara and Thomas were great parts to it. Thomas was not a Bruins draft pick but it doesn't matter. Yet, they had some great contribution by Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand all great draft picks who were not picked that high. And add the Horton trade who we all known was a steal by Chiarelli at the time, and you do get a great recipe for success. But they were able to get the RIGHT UFA in due time, not go on a shopping spree because they HAD to get rid of Koivu and others and had to pick what was there, they picked accordingly and were strong enough to part with one hell of a goal scorer, something most "experts" in here said that they were going to miss big time. Mind you, they were at 1 goal of being right.....but that's not what history will remember.

And again, objectivity is a great word. But tough to actually use it. Yet, who decides that you are objective or not? If I tell you that you are not objective, you are proclaiming it's me that is dishonest and who only wants to bash the organization based on me being biased. How can you auto-proclaimed yourself as the objective person in a debate when you automatically has to choose a side at some point. I have a hard time believing who's objective in a debate when confronted to a GM's resume, some people just have the hardest of time mentioning the wrong moves he has made......So the guy was THAT perfect? But then usually when people replied to me "I've never said he was perfect..." they still can't mention his wrong moves....I don't see objectivity in this.

Oh and there's no lecture in any of this. It's how I see things. Not sure where I told you that you shouldn't view it the way you want.
Habs have drafted just before them Maxwell, Urquhart and White.

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12-22-2011, 10:26 PM
  #97
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Habs have drafted just before them Maxwell, Urquhart and White.
and how many passed on Halak, Subban, Pacioretty?

hindsight is always 20/20


and if we are going to hire a new GM, I'd vote for Jim Nill of the wings, he was a scout before too so he has an understanding on spotting talent and as GM of Grand Rapids, knows a little about develloping that talent

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12-22-2011, 10:39 PM
  #98
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Maybe he's the one calling the shots now. But Serge Savard is very close with Molson...

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12-22-2011, 10:43 PM
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For **** saks, Price couldn't even score a goals./..,....wait, what, sorry Gomez should have been there, we need goals.....**** again, I give up!

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12-22-2011, 10:46 PM
  #100
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Gainey will have a walk near Lake Winnipeg with Michael Cammalleri
LOL!!! Thanks needed that

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