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#35|Dec. 27, 2011|Flyers at Lightning |7:30 p.m. ET

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Old
12-27-2011, 11:55 PM
  #651
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i thought Read was one of our better players tonight. Garon did stone him on a couple of great chances.

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12-27-2011, 11:56 PM
  #652
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Yeah, Read is clearly a good player. I'd just like to see him work on finding the back of the net. I don't know how likely that is, though, because he's pretty old

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12-28-2011, 12:07 AM
  #653
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Eh, disagreed. Jagr has at least finished several of those chances, and so had Giroux. Read screws it up almost every time.
Like I said, I love Jagr, but those chances over the past 3-4 weeks have been piling up and they haven't been getting "finished".

Read is still shooting @ a higher % than Jags for the season.

And again, I love Jagr, but his one timers on the powerplay lately have been dreadfully bad... worse than anything I've seen from Read.

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12-28-2011, 12:12 AM
  #654
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Maybe someone can clear this up for me cause I really hope there's a logical answer...but why do we keep shooting the puck on goal without any interference in front??? Happened like 5 times tonight on the power play alone and about 8-10 times overall at MSG. I know Garon was giving up some rebound chances but he nabbed almost every shot that he had a clear sight on.

Also, it must be thrilling to be a Lightning fan (1-3-1 ; 11 icings ; and they're just a sub-par team at best). oh well, Garon had an amazing game tonight. We kind of helped his cause though with the embarrassingly high amount of missed opportunities.

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12-28-2011, 12:13 AM
  #655
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Originally Posted by nitroglycerin View Post
Just saw 1st goal. Puck did not deflect off anyone. 100% sure.

Blaming JJ and Clements for confusing fans.
It absolutely did, off of Z. Look again. You can see it change direction and flutter.

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12-28-2011, 12:15 AM
  #656
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Originally Posted by kimmofan44 View Post
did you guys see bryz's stats on 4 goal games, only 13 last year and 14 the year before on 69 starts each season. he's already got 10 this season, somethings not right... maybe he's injured?? those numbers don't make sense,there has to be something going on. plus did you guys hear the f bomb he dropped during the post interview?
Whats going on is that he plays for the Flyers now, and we play crap defense.

When guys rotate, we leave Stamkos wide open. Recipie for success.

We can get ANY goaltender in the league and its going to be similar. Bob sometimes looks great, because he has GREAT lateral movement (Bryz has none, never did)...so he makes a save he shouldn't. But he plays very small in the net and overplays, so he's going to get beat by routine stuff.


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12-28-2011, 12:25 AM
  #657
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Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
It absolutely did, off of Z. Look again. You can see it change direction and flutter.
I hate to break it to you, but I have a DVR and I super slow-moed the CSN slow-MO (so I was basically going frame by frame), and the puck was fluttering before it got to Z. It never changed directions, never changed the direction of fluttering, etc.

The puck went right by Z's stick, but it never "deflected". The puck maintained the same angle and same rotation that it had off of the Lightning player's stick.

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12-28-2011, 01:01 AM
  #658
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Originally Posted by sandlansd View Post
I hate to break it to you, but I have a DVR and I super slow-moed the CSN slow-MO (so I was basically going frame by frame), and the puck was fluttering before it got to Z. It never changed directions, never changed the direction of fluttering, etc.

The puck went right by Z's stick, but it never "deflected". The puck maintained the same angle and same rotation that it had off of the Lightning player's stick.
thats what i thought all along.. it was already fluttering before and after it cross's the area of Z's stick.

ps seeing Lavi's initial facial reaction to being asked about Bryz tonite tells me everything i need to know about were "the team" is on his performance since being signed..

bring on Bob.

im done being nice nice with capn universe.. 51M$ is WAYYY to much coin to fork over and then have to hand hold a player.. no one wanted to hold Leightons hand when he was performing ******...and he was making chump change compared to Bryz's fantastic cap hit.

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12-28-2011, 01:31 AM
  #659
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A team that lets people alone in front of the net like this Flyers team has for the past couple of years will not win a Stanley Cup. It doesn't matter how good or bad of a goalie you have, it just is not going to happen.

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12-28-2011, 05:46 AM
  #660
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Originally Posted by sandlansd View Post
Like I said, I love Jagr, but those chances over the past 3-4 weeks have been piling up and they haven't been getting "finished".

Read is still shooting @ a higher % than Jags for the season.

And again, I love Jagr, but his one timers on the powerplay lately have been dreadfully bad... worse than anything I've seen from Read.
was that joke?if so its pretty bad one

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12-28-2011, 05:53 AM
  #661
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Originally Posted by BringBackStevens View Post
I watched one team badly out chance the other and still lose by 4 goals.

The power play and lack of finish was an issue, too. But bryzgalov has been so bad that it's the way larger issue right now
wonder how you watch the game then, yes we outplayed tampa badly in 1st, 2nd period too, but did you watch what was our defence doing at those recieved goals?
Lilja backskating with nobody, just backskating while 2 meters away from him was free player who got the puck and scored, even team mate was showing him he has player there, but he didnt care, i dont think tampa let us have such chance to score once..
so yeah we had pressure, but with completely not working defence, there for 12 shots and 5 goals.. go figure and dont say its all on Bryz.
If we had another goalkeeper hed get mby one of those goals, but no more say what ever you want, but thats reality
first goal? screened and then deflected shot, how do you think goalkeepers catch such shots? with pure luck if puck hits them, and Bryz is completely out of it, theres no way you can react to such thing, but i suppose everyone who is bashing Bryz here did try to be goalkeeper in hockey, and know what they are talking about, right? right?

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12-28-2011, 07:01 AM
  #662
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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
All those chances amounted to one goal. If Bryz played excellent we still would have lost. The issue is not that we are getting bad goaltending. Its that we're playing bad defense and getting mediocre goaltending.

It isn't Bryz's fault that on three of the goals there was a man within 5 feet of the crease that was completely unchecked, or that on 2 of those goals it was Stamkos standing there by himself.

Bryz was brought here to be steady. To make all the routine saves, and some spectacular ones. He is not doing that right now, and he needs to be better. But there is only so much one person can do, and even if he had been playing well we still would have probably lost the last few games.
Again, I'll respond to the "it isn't his fault" argument with: bryz was brought here to be an elite goalie. Not for us to be trying to figure out whether it was "his fault" after every game.

He's been far from good enough. Infact he's been a lot closer to awful.

The way this team is constructed, this level of play is unacceptable if the cup is the goal

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12-28-2011, 07:17 AM
  #663
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Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
It absolutely did, off of Z. Look again. You can see it change direction and flutter.
It did not. Saw it in the morning again.

I think they are going to blame HBO for destruction. I already see it.
Flyers fans are not going to feel sorry for Bryzgalov. It is difficult to like him and cheer for him.


Last edited by Kaktus*: 12-28-2011 at 07:24 AM.
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12-28-2011, 07:33 AM
  #664
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Originally Posted by Xegiie
wonder how you watch the game then, yes we outplayed tampa badly in 1st, 2nd period too, but did you watch what was our defence doing at those recieved goals?
Lilja backskating with nobody, just backskating while 2 meters away from him was free player who got the puck and scored, even team mate was showing him he has player there, but he didnt care, i dont think tampa let us have such chance to score once..
so yeah we had pressure, but with completely not working defence, there for 12 shots and 5 goals.. go figure and dont say its all on Bryz.
If we had another goalkeeper hed get mby one of those goals, but no more say what ever you want, but thats reality
first goal? screened and then deflected shot, how do you think goalkeepers catch such shots? with pure luck if puck hits them, and Bryz is completely out of it, theres no way you can react to such thing, but i suppose everyone who is bashing Bryz here did try to be goalkeeper in hockey, and know what they are talking about, right? right?
My point was not that we would have won this game with a better goalie. My point is that Bryz 's play is a huge issue for the team moving forward.

As for the goals in particular, goals 1 and 5 were not acceptable goals for a top end goalie to allow. Goal 1 was NOT deflected and he had a clear sight of the puck. A top goalie MUST stop that. The 5th goal, you need your elite goalie to stop an unscreened wrist shot from the circle in which he has time to square up for.

That's without getting into the other ones which would have been much more difficult, but you would still hope he played better. The big rebound on the first Stamkos goal comes to mind.

So maybe its 2 - 1 or 3 - 1 instead of 4-1 late in the game. That could have changed how the game was played and who knows, maybe they press more and bury one. That's not really the point though. The point is that Bryz has consistently been outplayed by opposing goaltenders. That is not acceptable. If it was, we should have just rolled with Bob. Its very hard to believe Bob or almost anyone else could have posted up a worse stat line than Bryz has.

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12-28-2011, 08:30 AM
  #665
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Bolts fan.
Bizarre game to say the least. I fully expected you guys to stomp us again. Garon decided to play out of his mind and the Defense actually showed up in front of him. I read earlier in the thread that someone thought Kubina was badass. Just to clear it up, last night was his best game of the year. Ever since he got rocked in the playoffs last year he's looked pure awful.

I wish, for your sakes, JVR/Simmonds/Briere would stop being passengers. Simmonds did almost nothing but chirp all night. Smart of him to get Brewer to sit for 5minutes with him, even better that he knocked him down. Just a brain dead decision by Brewer, but a great response by the Lightning to cover with only 4 D.

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12-28-2011, 08:37 AM
  #666
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Bryzgalov has been awful. I know for a fact that he's not this bad of a goalie, but what concerns me is that he simply may not be the goalie we need. I cannot think of even a single game where "he stole that one for us" applies... compare that to our competition, a guy like Thomas seem to be able to say that once a week.

We don't need a Thomas, but we definitely need quite a bit more than we're getting.

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12-28-2011, 08:44 AM
  #667
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At this point if Bob is going to give us more consistency, he should be in net. Bryz is and will be our #1 going forward but until he gets more comfortable and confident in his play, we can't afford him giving up these momentum shifting goals. While there are some defensive lapses that lead to some of these chances, I just haven't been impressed with Ilya's fundamentals. His stick position when he goes down is awful. He goes down extremely quickly. His rebound control lately has been suspect. And out of the two goalies, I think Bob does a much better job tracking the puck and getting himself in as good a position as possible to make a save.

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12-28-2011, 09:18 AM
  #668
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At this point if Bob is going to give us more consistency, he should be in net. Bryz is and will be our #1 going forward but until he gets more comfortable and confident in his play, we can't afford him giving up these momentum shifting goals. While there are some defensive lapses that lead to some of these chances, I just haven't been impressed with Ilya's fundamentals. His stick position when he goes down is awful. He goes down extremely quickly. His rebound control lately has been suspect. And out of the two goalies, I think Bob does a much better job tracking the puck and getting himself in as good a position as possible to make a save.
I couldn't agree with this more. Bob just has a quicker and more accurate jump on the puck. You can see urgency and awareness in his play, whereas sometimes Bryz just seems like he's too cool to make an effort (see the last goal in the Ranger's game last Friday).

And by the way, there was no way Harry Z touched that puck and deflected it. That was just a terrible goal.

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12-28-2011, 10:14 AM
  #669
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Whats going on is that he plays for the Flyers now, and we play crap defense.

When guys rotate, we leave Stamkos wide open. Recipie for success.
+ Ninety Thousand

All one need do is answer this: when is the last time the Flyers had a good goaltender, one who wasn't routinely ripped by fans?

Prepare to dig deep...

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12-28-2011, 10:19 AM
  #670
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A team that lets people alone in front of the net like this Flyers team has for the past couple of years will not win a Stanley Cup. It doesn't matter how good or bad of a goalie you have, it just is not going to happen.
Agreed.

It is easy to be great like Garon when you can see every shot and rebounds don't find opponents standing alone on the doorstep.

Last night, left alone 1 on 1 with goalie:

US: Hartnell, Hartnell, Read

THEM: Stamkos, Stamkos, Lacavalier

Gee I wonder how we lost that.

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12-28-2011, 10:30 AM
  #671
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Originally Posted by Icedog2735 View Post
At this point if Bob is going to give us more consistency, he should be in net. Bryz is and will be our #1 going forward but until he gets more comfortable and confident in his play, we can't afford him giving up these momentum shifting goals. While there are some defensive lapses that lead to some of these chances, I just haven't been impressed with Ilya's fundamentals. His stick position when he goes down is awful. He goes down extremely quickly. His rebound control lately has been suspect. And out of the two goalies, I think Bob does a much better job tracking the puck and getting himself in as good a position as possible to make a save.
Right now Bryz has the rebound control of a needy girl dumped by her boyfriend, the lateral movement of a tree sloth, and he goes down quicker than a strumpet...

He just looks lost in a black hole...

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12-28-2011, 10:31 AM
  #672
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Agreed.

It is easy to be great like Garon when you can see every shot and rebounds don't find opponents standing alone on the doorstep.

Last night, left alone 1 on 1 with goalie:

US: Hartnell, Hartnell, Read

THEM: Stamkos, Stamkos, Lacavalier

Gee I wonder how we lost that.
I think everyone is on the same page here. Not all of the goals last night were on Bryz. That said, he definitely isn't helping the team out there at all.

Example: On the deflected Downie goal, it was an awful bounce that contributed to the goal, but that doesn't change the fact that Bryzgalov off was brutally out of position and couldn't even attempt the acrobatic, potentially game-changing save that other top goaltenders will sometimes make. Furthermore, one of Stamkos's goals last night came off a terrible rebound.

The defense has lapses that cost us huge last night and recently, but a top tier goaltender has to bail out his defenders on occasion just as the defenders have to bail out a goalie on occasion.

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12-28-2011, 10:48 AM
  #673
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSFL0vFaQVM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzSi7i2ioF0
why you heff to be mad


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12-28-2011, 11:59 AM
  #674
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Agree with most. From the few lowlights I saw from last night, the defense was as watertight as a volleyball net, but our high-price Cosmo-not in net isn't doing what he's being richly paid to do.

"Holmgren, we have a problem."

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12-28-2011, 12:32 PM
  #675
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Bryz is one of the better goalies in the league when he is playing in a good system that doesn't only thrive on offensive pressure. It seems like when he gives up a goals he loses his confidence and it goes into the next game.

What we need is a better system and I am sure Bryz will return to top form. Or they just need to really tighten up in this system (which they haven't since it has been here)

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