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If Leino, Gerbe, Myers, Tropp and Ennis return, who is gonna play?

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Old
12-27-2011, 09:25 AM
  #26
HarryNealesGarden
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McNabb goes back; I really think Kassian stays. They can keep him on the roster and be under the cap, though only barely. My lines are:

Vanek-Hecht-Poms
Ennis-Roy-Stafford (they looked great when Ennis was back)
Adam-Leino-Kassian (looked awesome)
Gerbe-Goose-Boyes (remember how good this line was?)

Regehr-Myers (Lindy wants this, it's happening)
Sekera-Ehrhoff
Leo-Weber
Grags

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12-27-2011, 09:29 AM
  #27
Zip15
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
So what makes the McNabb decision more intriguing? The definition you gave could easily be used to describe Kassian
I haven't really liked Kassian's game for the last week or so. I hesitate to use the word "invisible," but there have been large swaths of particular games or stretches of games where I haven't noticed him doing anything. Also, I think he's definitely not winning a numbers game when Pominville, Stafford, and Boyes are all playing better than him.

In sum, I just don't think there's an argument that Kass has been playing better than any of those other three RWs of late (and including Boyes' play just prior to his injury), while I do think McNabb has been better than at least one of the top-6 (Weber).

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12-27-2011, 09:32 AM
  #28
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Answer - Whoever isn't traded to make room?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
So what makes the McNabb decision more intriguing? The definition you gave could easily be used to describe Kassian
McNabb's both strong in pinning his check along the wall and also a punishing hitter every night. Kassian could use some more polish in how he initiates every night by comparison. Now, does that polish come here or down on the farm? It might fire him up to have him head back down for a time until they can clear a roster space for him that isn't injury-based. It is Regier we're talking about, making continental drift look quick by comparison. Kassian's strength is undeniable and his ability to shield the puck along the wall is a thing of beauty, both things that the NHL team needs. It's up to Regier to clear the space for him.

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Old
12-27-2011, 09:40 AM
  #29
HarryNealesGarden
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Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
Answer - Whoever isn't traded to make room?



McNabb's both strong in pinning his check along the wall and also a punishing hitter every night. Kassian could use some more polish in how he initiates every night by comparison. Now, does that polish come here or down on the farm? It might fire him up to have him head back down for a time until they can clear a roster space for him that isn't injury-based. It is Regier we're talking about, making continental drift look quick by comparison. Kassian's strength is undeniable and his ability to shield the puck along the wall is a thing of beauty, both things that the NHL team needs. It's up to Regier to clear the space for him.
I believe they can keep him on the roster and be under the cap assuming everyone else is returned to Rochester, no?

I look at it this way - when the playoffs roll around, and you could choose to have one of McNabb or Kassian in the lineup... Aren't you picking Kassian every time? The big, strong body down low we have been missing compared with a home-run-potential d-man - the defenseman's gaffes have much greater potential for harm. Our D got massacred by Philly's forechecking last year; I don't want to have McNabb out there in a Game 7 facing that.

Kassian, on the other hand, could be the physical force we need in a long series. Leave him up, let him take his bumps, send McNabb down for more seasoning and comfort getting the living hell forechecked out of him.

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12-27-2011, 09:46 AM
  #30
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The whole reason Kassian didnt start the year with the team was due to the cap and the fact we had a full team. Now unless they make a trade to move some people off the roster there isnt room with everyone healthy. I want him to stay but in the short term i think hes going back, as well as McNabb and the roster goes back to what we started the season with. I think they have forced darcy into a trade tho, and will see them finish the year up here.

Plus I really liked the boyes-roy-stafford line and that puts a very solid #3 of kass-adam-leino

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12-27-2011, 09:51 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryNealesGarden View Post
I believe they can keep him on the roster and be under the cap assuming everyone else is returned to Rochester, no?

I look at it this way - when the playoffs roll around, and you could choose to have one of McNabb or Kassian in the lineup... Aren't you picking Kassian every time? The big, strong body down low we have been missing compared with a home-run-potential d-man - the defenseman's gaffes have much greater potential for harm. Our D got massacred by Philly's forechecking last year; I don't want to have McNabb out there in a Game 7 facing that.

Kassian, on the other hand, could be the physical force we need in a long series. Leave him up, let him take his bumps, send McNabb down for more seasoning and comfort getting the living hell forechecked out of him.
If I'm comparing McNabb to the other defensemen on the team, in his own zone specifically, I'd put his "gaffe-worthiness" below that of just about everyone not named Regehr at this point. Isolating it down to just the "bottom 3" of Gragnani, Weber, and McNabb, he's shown to be significantly smoother than the other two at the moment. Could that change? Sure -- assign him then. But right now, he's getting all situations and performing well while doing so and adding a physical element that they were sorely lacking.

I'd like Kassian in a playoff series. Right now though, is it worthwhile to have him getting limited minutes if the roster is fully healthy ahead of him if there is no trade(s) to open up top 9 ice time? I'd rather he go back to 1st PP time and being the offensive leader for the Amerks than get spot duty with the big club. Send him down with this significant taste of what it takes, tell him to work on consistency shift-to-shift (like they already haven't) and they will make room for him soon. Wind him up, turn him loose and get back on the phone to find a new home for someone else.

This of course pre-supposes that they actually manage to stay healthy long enough to sort this out. No guarantees there...

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Old
12-27-2011, 09:51 AM
  #32
Tyler2829
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Haven't we maxed out our cap space already (or close to it) due to the callups?

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12-27-2011, 09:54 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I haven't really liked Kassian's game for the last week or so. I hesitate to use the word "invisible," but there have been large swaths of particular games or stretches of games where I haven't noticed him doing anything. Also, I think he's definitely not winning a numbers game when Pominville, Stafford, and Boyes are all playing better than him.

In sum, I just don't think there's an argument that Kass has been playing better than any of those other three RWs of late (and including Boyes' play just prior to his injury), while I do think McNabb has been better than at least one of the top-6 (Weber).
While he hasn't been as noticeable physically (i wonder why ). I still think he's displayed a "belongs in the lineup" ability to dominate a forecheck, and that skill set is critical throughout the lineup.

I think you can flip one of those 3 RWs to left wing (like they did last night), and then keep Kass in the top 9 where he belongs.

Vanek-Hecht-Poms
Stafford-Roy-Boyes
Leino-Adam-Kassian (this line was dominant when it was together)

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Old
12-27-2011, 09:56 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyler2829 View Post
Haven't we maxed out our cap space already (or close to it) due to the callups?
Yes, they've been burning LTIR cash for some time, which only kicks in once they hit the cap ceiling. Cost is one of the reasons I think they retain MAG. He's got the cheapest hit on the blueline of anyone.

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Old
12-27-2011, 09:56 AM
  #35
HarryNealesGarden
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Originally Posted by Tyler2829 View Post
Haven't we maxed out our cap space already (or close to it) due to the callups?
Not entirely. With all the people on LTIR they're still in OK shape cap-wise. Enough room (I think) for one more ELC guy on the roster assuming everybody goes back to Rochester except that guy.

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12-27-2011, 09:59 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
Yes, they've been burning LTIR cash for some time, which only kicks in once they hit the cap ceiling. Cost is one of the reasons I think they retain MAG. He's got the cheapest hit on the blueline of anyone.
Then main issue is that they can't add salary for any trade, I think. If they want to buy at the deadline someone with a decent-sized hit has to get shipped out.

That was always assumed to be Boyes but with the way he's been playing, I don't see how you can't keep the guy.

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12-27-2011, 10:01 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
Yes, they've been burning LTIR cash for some time, which only kicks in once they hit the cap ceiling. Cost is one of the reasons I think they retain MAG. He's got the cheapest hit on the blueline of anyone.
Hey, remember all those lopsided "Sabres need cap space" trades on the trade board? Those are about to come back with a vengeance :

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12-27-2011, 10:24 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by omglolnub View Post
Hey, remember all those lopsided "Sabres need cap space" trades on the trade board? Those are about to come back with a vengeance :
True that. Granted, if they can talk Pegula into it, there is also the option of "Kotalik"-ing a deal where they ship out their NHL level salary for a future (say a pick) and someone elses bad contract and then promptly waive the bad deal down to Rochester. Few teams are going to be in a position to take on salary without sending some back, so this is where Terry's deep pockets again could be an asset in order to make a move.

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12-27-2011, 10:43 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
While he hasn't been as noticeable physically (i wonder why ). I still think he's displayed a "belongs in the lineup" ability to dominate a forecheck, and that skill set is critical throughout the lineup.

I think you can flip one of those 3 RWs to left wing (like they did last night), and then keep Kass in the top 9 where he belongs.

Vanek-Hecht-Poms
Stafford-Roy-Boyes
Leino-Adam-Kassian (this line was dominant when it was together)
Maybe, but then is your 4th line Ennis-Goose-Gerbe?

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12-27-2011, 10:53 AM
  #40
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send mccormick and ellis down to rochester wont that solve the cap problem?

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12-27-2011, 10:53 AM
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McNabb has been arguably our best defenseman. There is no way he gets sent back. If they don't keep him, they are not icing the best team they can, and that would be disgraceful.

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12-27-2011, 10:59 AM
  #42
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McNabb has been arguably our best defenseman. There is no way he gets sent back. If they don't keep him, they are not icing the best team they can, and that would be disgraceful.
I think Lindy using him on the powerplay shows he wants him to stay up. If Lindy was planning on sending him back down when Myers is healthy, I don't think he gives him any time on the second unit. That paired with Gragnani being demoted and Lindy not starting Weber in the beginning of the season says to me McNabb is staying.

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12-27-2011, 11:01 AM
  #43
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Maybe, but then is your 4th line Ennis-Goose-Gerbe?
my 4th line is 1 of Gerbe/Ennis and 1 of Ellis/Kaleta/McCormick... along with Goose

Gerbe and/or Ennis are there to keep pressure on the top 9, If anyone in the top 9 is playing terribly, they are there to step up.

I think Kassian has shown he belongs, I think he brings qualities we lack, I don't think sending him down because of roster space is acceptable... if his PLAY makes the case for sending him down, so be it.... but right now, that's not the case.

Gerbe, love him, but he was playing terrible before he was injured. Ennis has had great moments wrapped around extended periods of poor play.

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12-27-2011, 11:03 AM
  #44
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McNabb has been arguably our best defenseman. There is no way he gets sent back. If they don't keep him, they are not icing the best team they can, and that would be disgraceful.
McNabb has been very impressive... but no need to exaggerate.
McNabb still has a lot of learning to do. See his shift before taking the high sticking penalty: He is strong on the puck, and has very good offensive instincts, and he plays PHYSICAL... However, when the opponent establishes a forecheck, and the Sabres enter a zone defense, he gets lost... He just needs more time to develop in that regard.

With that said, keep him in the lineup.

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12-27-2011, 11:12 AM
  #45
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The whole reason Kassian didnt start the year with the team was due to the cap and the fact we had a full team. Now unless they make a trade to move some people off the roster there isnt room with everyone healthy. I want him to stay but in the short term i think hes going back, as well as McNabb and the roster goes back to what we started the season with. I think they have forced darcy into a trade tho, and will see them finish the year up here.

Plus I really liked the boyes-roy-stafford line and that puts a very solid #3 of kass-adam-leino
Kassian didn't make the team out of camp because he wasn't good enough. No other reason.

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Old
12-27-2011, 11:14 AM
  #46
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send mccormick and ellis down to rochester wont that solve the cap problem?
I would say Ellis has been the best forward over the last 3 games. You notice him just about every shift, and he's outworking everyone. Keep him up as long as he plays like he has lately.

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12-27-2011, 11:14 AM
  #47
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Here's what I'd do:

Vanek-Adam-Poms
Boyes-Roy-Stafford
Ennis-Leino-Kassian
Gerbe-Gaustad-Hecht

Myers-Regehr
McNabb-Ehrhoff
Leopold-Sekera

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Old
12-27-2011, 11:19 AM
  #48
Jame
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Kassian didn't make the team out of camp because he wasn't good enough. No other reason.
other reason : cap space
other reason : roster space

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Old
12-27-2011, 11:22 AM
  #49
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Here's what I'd do:

Vanek-Adam-Poms
Boyes-Roy-Stafford
Ennis-Leino-Kassian
Gerbe-Gaustad-Hecht

Myers-Regehr
McNabb-Ehrhoff
Leopold-Sekera
burying Hecht on the 4th line doesn't seem very honest...

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Old
12-27-2011, 11:23 AM
  #50
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highly doubt Lindy separates Regehr/Sekera. he's matching them against other teams best players and they are doing a hell of a job. Would be a huge mistake to split them up imo.

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