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2011-12 All Purpose Kings Trade Rumors and Proposals Thread II

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Old
01-08-2012, 11:04 PM
  #376
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I have to wonder, if we are looking at MSL, who are we trading?

Johnson?
I'm thinking JJ, Bernier, ++

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01-08-2012, 11:05 PM
  #377
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Originally Posted by Kingurentai View Post
I'm thinking JJ, Bernier, ++
yea.... no thanks.

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01-08-2012, 11:07 PM
  #378
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I don't know if this sounds crazy or not, but I know Lombardi likes former Flyers...

Flyers in desperate need of defenders, overloaded on offense
Kings in desperate need of offense, pretty packed defensively

Just throwing that out there.

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01-08-2012, 11:07 PM
  #379
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
Personally (no one will like it) I would trade Drew Doughty. I look at it this way This way, Realistically how many points is Drew going to put up ?

So far he is on his way to having another 40-50 point season, that's at 7M dollars.

Drew nets you any Sniper on any team basically. Probably a Elite Sniper + prospects +picks. You get that 7m Dollars out of your cap. I love Drews D game, But D is not winning any Cups without Offense. The Kings have plenty of D depth. And Drew so far is not providing the offense the Kings need from him. Between Jack+Drew+SCuds+Mitchell the Kings have about 20 Million Dollars tied up in Defense.

Just a thought.

This, and no, not Nash.

Of course, having said that, who do you get with Doughty? Keep in mind, you want him far away as possible, and no idea if/when the realignment comes, that doesn't mean Dallas....

Doughty for Vanek plus Kassian, maybe?

Doughty for Lucic plus ???

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01-08-2012, 11:08 PM
  #380
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Originally Posted by Kingurentai View Post
I'm thinking JJ, Bernier, ++
Bernier definitely makes sense but adding JJ's just too steep.

Maybe, Bernier, JW, Amart?

Edit: We did get hosed on the Halpern/Purcell deal, so, there's a chance we may overpay again.


Last edited by The Black1963: 01-08-2012 at 11:13 PM.
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01-08-2012, 11:11 PM
  #381
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Penner for Knuble. Done.

Washington might have to add for salary

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01-08-2012, 11:11 PM
  #382
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Originally Posted by jml87 View Post
I don't know if this sounds crazy or not, but I know Lombardi likes former Flyers...

Flyers in desperate need of defenders, overloaded on offense
Kings in desperate need of offense, pretty packed defensively

Just throwing that out there.
Yeah, we've already had JVR for JJ discussion as well as Read + for Voynov + discussions on the main board.

Flyers and the kings definitely do make good trade partners.

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01-08-2012, 11:13 PM
  #383
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Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
This, and no, not Nash.

Of course, having said that, who do you get with Doughty? Keep in mind, you want him far away as possible, and no idea if/when the realignment comes, that doesn't mean Dallas....

Doughty for Vanek plus Kassian, maybe?

Doughty for Lucic plus ???
with erhoff and meyers i doubt sabres need DD

lucic+ for DD LOL that + better be seguin

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01-08-2012, 11:26 PM
  #384
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jml87 View Post
I don't know if this sounds crazy or not, but I know Lombardi likes former Flyers...

Flyers in desperate need of defenders, overloaded on offense
Kings in desperate need of offense, pretty packed defensively

Just throwing that out there.
JJ for JVR.

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Old
01-08-2012, 11:37 PM
  #385
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MSL is a Selenne-type player. I'd dangle Bernier+ for him.

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01-08-2012, 11:53 PM
  #386
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Originally Posted by bobafettish View Post
with erhoff and meyers i doubt sabres need DD

lucic+ for DD LOL that + better be seguin
LOL I was leaving work, just throwing out names...

Realstically, there isn't much out there that you would trade Doughty for straight up....

a SIGNED Parise
Kane
Toews
Stamkos
Malkin
Ovechkin
Giroux
Tavares
Duchene
Hall
Nugent Hopkins

And pretty much every single player on that list, will not get traded, so while trading Doughty sounds interesting, what you have to get back in return to make it worth it, just ain't out there.

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Old
01-09-2012, 12:45 AM
  #387
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funky View Post
If that is true, my faith in D.L is getting shakier as days go by
If what is true? Lombardi saying he wouldn't do the Palffy trade? I don't know if he definitively said that he wouldn't have made the trade, but he certainly didn't seem in favor of it. The first three years or so he criticized our previous managements and their unwillingness to retain their first round picks, draft, and develop their own talent. He would always bring up the Palffy deal, among others, as examples of what has gone wrong in the past, and how he is different. He stopped using the example, and conveniently we got better and Jokinen took a big step backward, but he would still defend his point, that in the past, our first round picks rarely played for us, and we would often trade them away for "top" talents who would fizzle out or leave shortly thereafter and provide no long term gain, always looking for the quick fix, win now, solution.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I have to wonder, if we are looking at MSL, who are we trading?

Johnson?
Eh, they may ask for JJ + Bernier, but that would be too much. I consider MSL a little more than Iginla, because I envision him to be a little cheaper, with a much more reasonable cap hit. The problem that arises though, is he isn't a sniper, he is a decent goal scorer, but he has also benefited from some good surrounding casts (not to take away from MSL at all, he is absolutely an elite talent, and the best long-term player on the team, at least he was for a long time that is), but he is more of a playmaker now in his career, with the job of setting up Stamkos. Iginla is the goal scorer, he would be the guy we are setting up, but MSL is a guy that will be doing the setting up and then tapping in 20 in the process. We would still have to rely on our own internal talent to accomplish an increase in goal scoring production.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingurentai View Post
I'm thinking JJ, Bernier, ++
That's astronomical. I would laugh while I was hanging up my Blackberry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jml87 View Post
I don't know if this sounds crazy or not, but I know Lombardi likes former Flyers...

Flyers in desperate need of defenders, overloaded on offense
Kings in desperate need of offense, pretty packed defensively

Just throwing that out there.
That is likely. There probably was truth to those rumors that we talked to them after the trade freeze and we may have played with the idea of JVR for JJ. Of course, GM's are always bouncing ideas off each other, and if we have heard of it, that usually means that the deal either broke down or is being put on the backburner, but it does make sense conceptually. I would be open to the move, but as always, cautious about dealing a Johnson that has proven himself offensively under our system, minus player or not, for a player that has known to be inconsistent since his draft year, but he is looking really good right this very moment...

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
MSL is a Selenne-type player. I'd dangle Bernier+ for him.
I'm open to that idea, as long as the + wasn't major. Though, I hope Dean is kicking the tires for maybe a better fit/solution.

It is interesting to ponder what it is like for Lombardi around now. Who knows about his job status, only AEG and maybe Lombardi truly knows what is happening in that regard, but things will be interesting to say the least as we enter into these next two months. Lombardi was never one to panic and forfeit his plan even in the face of his own demise, but obviously something has to be done, all the while, this off season has potential.

Dean is probably struggling with himself right now, fighting his inner demons I am sure offers are starting to arise now as teams know more or less their respective positions, but I wonder if Dean is waiting and banking on that blockbuster (i.e. Parise) to open up. If he risks waiting, he could lose his job, but if he splurges early, he could risk missing out on the true piece that could put us over the top personnel wise (outside of the work needed to the system).

It is an interesting thing to watch to say the least. In all likeliness, Lombardi sticks to his slow & steady guns, especially after the Penner trade, and refrains from the quick fix and looks for the "right fit" home run trade at the deadline, or they go all or nothing at Parise in the offseason.

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Old
01-09-2012, 01:03 AM
  #388
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
If I'm looking to make a shakeup, I would consider Kopitar+ for Vanek+.

I'm not sure what else Buffalo is looking for to get their team going.

Maybe Vanek and Stafford for Kopitar + ?? Would they take Penner as an expiring contract? Do they need defense?
Buffalo needs everything, and would be willing to trade anyone not named Myers, Vanek, and Pominville. Now I'm not saying they wouldn't trade those guys if it was a blockbuster for Kopitar, but if I have learned anything about Darcy Regier over the past 14 years is that he won't trade his core. He overvalues his players way too much.

I think Reiger wants to move either Roy or Stafford. Can't move Roy unless getting a center back.

Maybe a trade around Jack Johnson and Stafford?

Only problem with trading with Buffalo is they have literally no cap room.

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Old
01-09-2012, 01:51 AM
  #389
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Trading Doughty would be a monumental mistake

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Old
01-09-2012, 02:02 AM
  #390
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Yep. Within a year we'd see a defenseman putting up 60-70 points and be completely befuddled as to what we were thinking. Drew is going to be dynamite, give him a coach that doesn't believe in 80's-90's style hockey and this team would benefit in the largest way.

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01-09-2012, 02:30 AM
  #391
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Yep. Within a year we'd see a defenseman putting up 60-70 points and be completely befuddled as to what we were thinking. Drew is going to be dynamite, give him a coach that doesn't believe in 80's-90's style hockey and this team would benefit in the largest way.
I don't buy that personally, Drew put up 60 points under Murray.

He is now about to have back to back 40-45 point seasons. I feel letting Sean OD go is still a big mistake (personally) Sean OD seems like the only guy willing to wrangle in Drew (when he is not playing HIS game).

I was just thinking of selling High, If Drew goes Two more season of only putting up 40-50 Points at 7m Dollars. Every GM is thinking he is the next Dion, No Elite sniper coming back the other way in a trade(If you want to move him). Just spare Roster players and parts.

That's all I was thinking. I hope Drew proves me wrong (so the Kings Benefit) but so far he is not worth his salary( and this season it's killing the Kings).

Shoot, Drew is on pace to barely make 40 points this season , that has to change in a quick way.


Last edited by damacles1156: 01-09-2012 at 02:36 AM.
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01-09-2012, 03:32 AM
  #392
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I don't buy that personally, Drew put up 60 points under Murray.

He is now about to have back to back 40-45 point seasons. I feel letting Sean OD go is still a big mistake (personally) Sean OD seems like the only guy willing to wrangle in Drew (when he is not playing HIS game).

I was just thinking of selling High, If Drew goes Two more season of only putting up 40-50 Points at 7m Dollars. Every GM is thinking he is the next Dion, No Elite sniper coming back the other way in a trade(If you want to move him). Just spare Roster players and parts.

That's all I was thinking. I hope Drew proves me wrong (so the Kings Benefit) but so far he is not worth his salary( and this season it's killing the Kings).

Shoot, Drew is on pace to barely make 40 points this season , that has to change in a quick way.
I doubt it has anything to do with OD. He was new in the NHL and he was excited. I think Scuderi and Mitchell do a fine job talking to him.

As for his contract, what did you want? For him to continue his contract saga longer? I didn't. I don't know why fans are against
Drew so much. Especially when the whole team is underperforming. He still has a lot to learn and that comes with age. But, I have no doubt in my mind we will see that Drew. I already saw him this season. But, he just isn't consistent enough right now.

Kings fans or fans in general love to hate Drew. "welp, he got his money" "LOLZ, HE's OVerweight" Like what idiotic statements. It's like have some common sense.

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01-09-2012, 10:12 AM
  #393
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Originally Posted by Kingurentai View Post
I'm thinking JJ, Bernier, ++
Maybe if Marty was 20 then I'd do that but he's not.

Wow 1,000th post!

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Old
01-09-2012, 10:46 AM
  #394
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There was a quote somewhere that DL said he wouldn't have done the Palffy deal. I wonder if he'd have traded Rob Blake had he been the GM back then like Taylor did?
Yep, that joker said it was the wrong deal for the Kings at the time. Seriously Dean has no appreciation for skilled goal scores.

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Old
01-09-2012, 10:57 AM
  #395
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Some of you have lost your mind. Trade Doughty? Give JJ, JB, + for an aging MSL??? Really????

You have to realize, this team isn't going to get better until the players that we HAVE can start scoring. Bringing (and removing) one or two guys is not going to solve all the problems over night. One guy can not carry a team.

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01-09-2012, 11:36 AM
  #396
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
Bernier definitely makes sense but adding JJ's just too steep.

Maybe, Bernier, JW, Amart?

Edit: We did get hosed on the Halpern/Purcell deal, so, there's a chance we may overpay again.
I'm not saying I like it, but I would think something like that (ie overpayment) is what it is going to take.

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01-09-2012, 11:40 AM
  #397
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Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
Yep. Within a year we'd see a defenseman putting up 60-70 points and be completely befuddled as to what we were thinking. Drew is going to be dynamite, give him a coach that doesn't believe in 80's-90's style hockey and this team would benefit in the largest way.
Drew's biggest problem is himself. He was playing his best hockey when he was humble and working for his big payday. It might take him a year or two to figure it out but I think he will be a good player. I really think it would have been better for him to sign a 2-year ~$5m cap hit deal instead of the big deal he held out for. Of course, DL presumably didn't want that either but I believe it would have gave him an incentive to focus and work hard.

Say what you want about Jack Johnson's play, when he makes a mistake or takes a stupid penalty, I never see a cocky grin on his face.

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01-09-2012, 11:52 AM
  #398
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Originally Posted by Telos View Post
Obviously in my mind, you are completely missing the point of my arguments, and in yours I am missing the point of your arguments. Let's just leave it at that. I don't have time for this and am tired of flooding the board with nonsense. You are beginning to take this too personally. I should have realized it sooner and apologize that I allowed the frivolity to continue this long.
Agreed. And not personal at all. It' was a good discussion. I understood your points, just not in agreement with them is all. Still on the same side at the end of the day. Go Kings!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
If I were to make the perfect bottom six lineup based on 2012 free agents (excluding the names I mentioned above), I would go with the following group:

Moen-Hecht-Dvorak
Prust-Pahlsson-Tootoo

Other potential candidates to consider for bottom six roles:
Gaustad
Moore
Asham
Glass
Wellwood
Nielsen
If it were me, I'd go with
Moen-Gaustad-Nielsen
Clifford-Pahlsson-Tootoo

(I'd keep Clifford in from our team, sorry )

With Stoll, Lewis, Richardson and Hunter off the payroll (Westy would be the 13th forward) we likely wouldn't have to add significantly to our payroll to add these guys.

Also, if Holloway is ready to come back, or we are willing to bring up someone like CLiche or Nolan to augment the 4th line, I'd pass on Pahlsson and do this:

Moen-Nielsen-Clifford
Tootoo-Gaustad-random farm kid (Holloway/Nolan/Cliche/etc.)

I'm surprised that you didn't pencil inWellwood Ziggy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
Something tells me that Calgary will become our newest trading partner. Adding grit and skills of Iginla and Bourque could be the identity this team needs.
I expect at the very least we'll either sign a former Flame in UFA or we'll trade for a prospect that Sutter loved. Most coaches do put in a good word for one of their own from their last organization. Thankfully it can't be another Cloutier.

Could we see the return of Olli Jokinen to LA?

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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
No panic button here but we brought in Richards and Gagne so we can make a push for the cup. If not this year, then when? Those 1st round picks you speak of may not be ready for 4 or 5 years. By then, our roster may have already been dismantled.

Either we go all in for the cup or not. There's no half-assing it.
The nice thing about how our core is, there's no one who is past their prime, and outside of Quick, they are basically all signed long term. If we elect that we need to wait a year, we can afford to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I'm pretty sure Iginla will make a bigger impact than marginal difference. And as for your "twilight of his career" statement, I wonder for how many years has Selanne heard that.

We gave up a 1st, a 3rd and Teubert for Penner. We're basically giving up the same for Iginla as we did for Penner.

To me, this deal's a slam dunk for the kings.
Selanne isn't the rule. Also, your later examples of Arnott and Jagr aren't much better. Arnott on pace for about 42 points after a 34 point season last year. Jagr is a freak who will be a Hall of Famer.

I'm not saying Iggy won't be a dynamite player at 40, but the odds are against him.

As for Penner, A) That was clearly an overpayment, and B) When we did that deal we had a lot more in the pipeline. We have lost the three assets we traded to get Penner, as well as Holloway and Moller, and a few our other younger talents, like King and Kozun, haven't met expectations this year. We are a lot thinner now than we were at the time. Go back and read threads on the Penner deal when it happened to see how much Kings fans thought we were stacked at the time. We aren't now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Boston had Bergeron, Marchand, Krejci, Rask, Boychuk, McQuaid come up through Providence, as well as Caron, Hamill and Kampfer who have all appeared in games with the Bruins. If you include them, that's nine players having gone through their minor league club.

Detroit with Hudler, Filppula, Kronwall, Howard, Helm, Abdelkader, Kindl, Emmerton, and Ericsson. That's nine players.

Philadelphia with Giroux, Read, van Riemsdyk, Rinaldo, Bobrovsky, Bourdon, Zolnierczyk.

Pittsburgh with Orpik, Kennedy, Letang, Engelland, Vitale, Despres, Lovejoy.

The Rangers have done remarkably well with Callahan, Del Zotto, Anisimov, Dubinsky, McDonagh, Girardi, Hagelin, Bickel, Sauer having all gone through their player development program that are currently on the pro roster.

That's just focusing on some of the top teams, not having looked at other clubs such as St. Louis, Dallas, Chicago, San Jose, etc.
this was in reply about how LA only developed 6 guys through the farm and became regulars. As such, you should really only use guys that also went through the farm and became regulars on their teams. Some of these players didn't, such as Bobrovsky in Philly, while others like Hagelin and Read barely had a cup of coffee in the minors. Hard to credit Read's development on 11 games in the AHL or Hagelin for 13 games in the AHL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
If the Kings wouldn't go after Martin St. Louis if he was available, then I have lost all confidence in Lombardi's judgement in talent. If a player like him is available, it is his due diligence to pursue him. MSL is a rare talent and an elite winger. Something the Kings haven't had since Ziggy friggin' Palffy.
I guess it depends on what the asking price is. That said, after the Purcell/Halpern deal I can understand him being a bit gun shy to deal with Tampa Bay, who will likely be asking the moon for a guy who has spent over a decade in Tampa like MSL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie to Brownie View Post
Maybe if Marty was 20 then I'd do that but he's not.

Wow 1,000th post!
If Marty was 20 again, he'd be free as an undrafted college kid!

And congrats on 1,000!

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01-09-2012, 12:57 PM
  #399
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Stoll+ to Pitt
for
Tangradi


Last edited by Fat Elvis: 01-09-2012 at 01:09 PM.
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01-09-2012, 01:15 PM
  #400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DP View Post
Stoll+ to Pitt
for
Tangradi
I would be up for that, depending on the +. Still wouldn't change the fact that we need another top 6 forward, but it would at least give us an immediate asset for the future who can play now.

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