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2011-12 All Purpose Kings Trade Rumors and Proposals Thread II

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Old
01-10-2012, 01:44 AM
  #526
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Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
All I gotta say is Dean, do not trade for Semin. That guy was pretty much invisible tonight. What a waste of talent. He could be a yearly 40+ goal scorer if he would put in a solid effort on a nightly basis.
He is the anti-DL player. We need not worry about that.

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01-10-2012, 01:44 AM
  #527
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Originally Posted by Josh Deitell View Post
Check out #17 on this list and look at some of the guys he's ahead of: http://www.eliteprospects.com/league...ame=&order=PPG

Fleury, Kariya, Selanne, Malkin, Sundin, etc. The only active player with a better clip is Marty St. Louis and IIRC they've been regular linemates for that squad.
I wonder how many wingers have scored more goals than Rick Nash in the NHL over the past 5 seasons? Can't be many.

He's one the best power forwards in the game and is well on his way to a 500+ goal career. All the while playing on offensively anemic teams. It's amazing how much he gets crapped on around here. If Rick becomes available (not that unrealistic IMO), Lombardi should be all over it.

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01-10-2012, 01:49 AM
  #528
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
I wonder how many wingers have scored more goals than Rick Nash in the NHL over the past 5 seasons? Can't be many.

He's one the best power forwards in the game and is well on his way to a 500+ goal career. All the while playing on offensively anemic teams. It's amazing how much he gets crapped on around here. If Rick becomes available (not that unrealistic IMO), Lombardi should be all over it.
Since the lockout, 34 forwards have a higher PPG average than Rick Nash. Fifteen of those 34 forwards are centers.

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01-10-2012, 09:31 AM
  #529
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
The Kings need to do something. They cant score goals. Murray or Sutter it doesnt matter. The problem lies with the lack of a dynamic offensive player like Hemsky. The cost would probably be a first round pick and Voynov. If you guys are ok with the status quo and taking your chances then fine, but if you want Lombardi to do something for THIS season, then Hemsky makes a lot of sense. And it is very possible that he would re-sign with the Kings imo.
Hemsky can't score goals either. He has three this year. At that pace if he played a full season he'd reach nine goals. Not to mention he's not even putting up points either really, been pretty much invisible all year, is made of glass, and is a UFA to be. We would be foolish to pay a 1st and Voynov for him.

I could see us tossing him an offer in the off-season in hopes of him turning it around in a different city.

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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Why all the love for Tangradi? He's 2 days younger than Hickey who is considered a bust of HF despite making the AHL AS team after battling back from injuries. Put Hickey on an avg. AHL offensive team and he's got 25 pts. in 38 games.
Don't count me as a Hickey buster. I like Hickey and think he still has an NHL future, just not 4th overall worthy.

I support Tangradi because I feel he'll turn out to be a solid third line forward and we could really use someone with hims size (6'4, 220) on our lower lines. Lossing Handzus and Simmonds really shows this. I'm not expecting Tangradi to be anything great, but a solid 10-15 goal, 25-40 point forward on the 3rd line with size and the willingness to use it is a missing object from our line up. Plus he wouldn't cost as much as other, more proven player but given he's 23 in a month, he's also closer to being ready than other prospects. If we are out of it, I'd be happy with a Stoll for Tangradi type deal.

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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Clifford will get into double figures. Kopitar will start scoring on a goal per game pace
Considering how they played last night, can you post this before every game?

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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
The Kings are too good to be sucking up the elite forwards at the draft. The only way that works, and arguably it doesnt, is if you are getting lottery picks, for years. In a row.

Lombardi has been making moves to win now, so going back to a draft and wait strategy isnt likely, nor should it be.
While most elite forwards do go in the top five or so (in terms of top three scorers in the NHL) plenty of elite forwards go outside of lottery picks. Our top two are Kopitar and Richards and one went 11th, the other 25th overall. You don't need to be a high drafting team to get elite guys and really, we don't need a Taylor Hall or RNG to be elite. If we got the wing equivalent of Kopitar (minus the month long annual MIA) we'd be more than happy.

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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Getting rid of Stoll would be a huge mistake. One of the best if not the best FO men in the league, one of the better shoot out players in the league, can pk, pp is very versatile. You dont trade players like that. Unless you are Kevin Lowe. Nuff said.
If you are out of the playoffs and he's a UFA, yes you do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DP View Post
Adam Hall could be a nice bottom 6er for the playoffs, wouldn't cost much. Good face-off and pk, but doesn't help the scoring problemsMaybe a bigger deal with TB involving Panik or Carter Ashton can be done.
Adam Hall + Tampa Bay = Jeff Halpern 2.0. So what do we offer, Bud Holloway and a 3rd? Or is Oscar Moller the one we give up on who scores in Tampa?

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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
When I started posting here this summer there were about two people that were unhappy with Lombardi. Now you would have to look long and hard to find two people that are happy with him.
Blatant bad post. There have always been more than two people unhappy with DL. PSP and tomd are the token two but there's been plenty others as well. The volume has just picked up since we are having a far less than expected season. That happens with all fanbases.

Btw, count me in as a fan who is overall happy with DL. I think that brings us to five in this thread now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
the summer 2012 draft is all about forwards, specifically wingers. if he drafts any C, D or G above the 5th round he needs to be ***** slapped. this draft they can't go with BPA regardless. it needs to be BWA on each pick. LA needs to stockpile forwards the way they have with D and G so far.
This is just silly. You don't draft guys by position. You never know what your needs will be when these guys get to the NHL, especially anyone drafted outside the first round as they will likley need a minimum of two years, more likely three, to reach the NHL. We could load up on wingers in 2012, just like you said, only to see Toffoli, Kitsyn, Vey and Schumacher all busting forward and playing lights out while DL has also signed a winger and Brown is still around. Where do these wingers play then?

I'm not saying that will happen, but it could, see what happened with our defense? I don't think DL purposely drafted just defensemen, but he added Hickey and Doughty and Forbort, while having Voynov come out to be unexpectedly better than imagined as well as Martinez jumping out of nowhere. Add in Scuderi and Mitchell signings and the tarde for Johnson and suddenly it's a cluster****.

You draft BPA and f you have holes, you trade to fill them. The trading to fill is where DL is not managing the assets well. He shouldn't have left Hickey to sit in the minors like this, he should have flipped him for a winger by now, or another defenseman.

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Originally Posted by Tikkanen View Post
I wouldn't mind acquiring Prospal AND Pahlsson from Cbus. 2 pending UFA's but I think Prospal would put up numbers with Kopitar and Pahlsson is a great 3rd liner, maybe pending UFA's for pending UFA's?
Been supporting Prospal for a while. Not ideal, but if there is no other options out there, he could still bring a boost to the scoring and likely not cost an arm and a leg. Pahlsson would be of interest too, depending on the cost.

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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
The same could be said of Johnson.

Nash is legit though. He just needs a change of scenery. Playing for Columbus for 9 years, with no hope on the horizon, will break the spirit of any player.
You'd think $7.8 million would help mend that spirit. For what he brings, Nash is not worth that cap hit and he isn't bringing as much of what he does bring when compared to past years. Add in his price tag (in terms of assets to acquire him) and pass for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Deitell View Post
Check out #17 on this list and look at some of the guys he's ahead of: http://www.eliteprospects.com/league...ame=&order=PPG

Fleury, Kariya, Selanne, Malkin, Sundin, etc. The only active player with a better clip is Marty St. Louis and IIRC they've been regular linemates for that squad.
Any chart that places Andrew McKim above Khalamnov, the greatest Russian of all-time arguably, gets a massive pass from me, sorry. Canada has had to many stat padder games over the year for that to be worth much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
You can show me all the stats you like, I have two eyes. The Guy is a massive floater in Columbus. While Columbus has been a poor team forever, Nash has not been part of the solution either.

Penner had good stats too before becoming a King. Nash would need to really dazzle to justify giving up half the farm for him. Cause what I have seen in Columbus is not worth it (Cap hit as well).

I wouldn't be all too upset cause I would give him a chance. But boy would he need to play wayyyyyyyyyyy Better as a King. Plus he would have no excuses here (Kopitar would be his Center).
Pretty much my thoughts as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
All I gotta say is Dean, do not trade for Semin. That guy was pretty much invisible tonight. What a waste of talent. He could be a yearly 40+ goal scorer if he would put in a solid effort on a nightly basis.
I'd take Semin as a UFA in the off-season. He's not a DL type of player, but if he signed cheap in hopes of turning his career around, and we didn't have better options, I'd pick him up on a one-year deal. If he's on, Semin is exactly what we need.

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01-10-2012, 10:10 AM
  #530
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Since the lockout, 34 forwards have a higher PPG average than Rick Nash. Fifteen of those 34 forwards are centers.
I didn't say points. I said goals.

Nash is one of the best goal scoring wingers in the game.

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01-10-2012, 11:45 AM
  #531
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Parise article on this coming summer and FA

http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2...ney_matte.html

ďFor me thatís probably the biggest thing,Ē Parise said. ďThe money is definitely important. Thatís real life, letís face it. Iím not going to say itís not. Thatís realistic. But most important for me is being competitive and having a chance to win the Stanley Cup.Ē

Kings need to get into the second round this year, only helps their cause selling ZP on LA as a destination

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01-10-2012, 12:15 PM
  #532
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Semin is a invisible and was a healthy scratch this year, Carter is oft injured and was a healthy scratch this year. Forget it.

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01-10-2012, 12:36 PM
  #533
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Vermette can be had pretty cheaply(though he doesn't help the top 6). Right now there isn't much available that truely makes sense(cost+production). I think LA plays January out before they really start to consider targets.

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01-10-2012, 12:49 PM
  #534
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Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2...ney_matte.html

ďFor me thatís probably the biggest thing,Ē Parise said. ďThe money is definitely important. Thatís real life, letís face it. Iím not going to say itís not. Thatís realistic. But most important for me is being competitive and having a chance to win the Stanley Cup.Ē

Kings need to get into the second round this year, only helps their cause selling ZP on LA as a destination
The nice thing about this is a lot of players are going to start coming here based on who we have and how young they are.

As it stands I think the Kings are in the very early stages of being a competitor year after year. A guy like Parise might see that and say..."ya know, I want in on this right as it starts to happen." Figuring he'll maximize his chances of earning at least one cup on a team that is growing into what could be a multi-cup contender.

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01-10-2012, 01:24 PM
  #535
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Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
The nice thing about this is a lot of players are going to start coming here based on who we have and how young they are.

As it stands I think the Kings are in the very early stages of being a competitor year after year. A guy like Parise might see that and say..."ya know, I want in on this right as it starts to happen." Figuring he'll maximize his chances of earning at least one cup on a team that is growing into what could be a multi-cup contender.
Devils' Zach Parise: Money matters, but Cup chances are key to new deal

Quote:
Parise's father, J.P., was also quoted as saying: ďHe's overly loyal, and he's not going to rush into anything. He's always loved the New Jersey Devils. He's been extremely loyal to the organization, to his teammates. But this is business now.Ē

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01-10-2012, 02:37 PM
  #536
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Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
The nice thing about this is a lot of players are going to start coming here based on who we have and how young they are.

As it stands I think the Kings are in the very early stages of being a competitor year after year. A guy like Parise might see that and say..."ya know, I want in on this right as it starts to happen." Figuring he'll maximize his chances of earning at least one cup on a team that is growing into what could be a multi-cup contender.
You forgot to add (on the East Coast) to your post....

Parise is not coming out West. Only way I see that, is if Dean offers Parise Big time Bucks.

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01-10-2012, 02:38 PM
  #537
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
I didn't say points. I said goals.

Nash is one of the best goal scoring wingers in the game.
In terms of goals, Nash ranks 12th on that list of highest goal scoring players since the lockout. Then again, Simon Gagne also ranks 19th on that list, ahead of guys like St. Louis, Perry, and Parise. Too bad he can't stay healthy...

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01-10-2012, 03:28 PM
  #538
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If we can't get an impact player at the deadline then I would like to get Radim Vrbata.

I have been watching him since he was an Avalanche.

He really got better when came to Phoenix. I really LOVE his game. He will fit well with LA.

Some of Vbrata goals on video....









Last edited by Telos: 01-10-2012 at 03:35 PM.
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01-10-2012, 03:38 PM
  #539
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I want Lee Stempniak or PA Parenteau!

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01-10-2012, 03:49 PM
  #540
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
In terms of goals, Nash ranks 12th on that list of highest goal scoring players since the lockout. Then again, Simon Gagne also ranks 19th on that list, ahead of guys like St. Louis, Perry, and Parise. Too bad he can't stay healthy...
Kings need a goal scoring winger. So that's what I'm focusing on.


Top goal scoring wingers since the lock out (headed into this season)

1: Alexander Ovechkin (301)

2: Jarome Iginla (235)

3: Ilya Kovalchuk (230

4: Dany Heatley (219)

5: Thomas Vanek (151)

6: Rick Nash (143)

7: Simon Gagne (122)

7: Marian Gaborik (122)

7: Marian Hossa (122)

10: Patrick Marleau (119)

11: Jeff Carter (115)

11: Zach Parise (115)

13: Alexander Semin (112)

14: Phil Kessel (98)

15: Jonathon Cheechoo (93)

Out of those top players, who has the most upside left? Healtey and Gagne are shells of their former selves. Ovechkin, Kovalchuk and Semin haven't been nearly as effective playing on non run-and-gun all out offenses. Iginal, Hossa, and Marleau are all geting older.

Nash, Vanek, Carter and Parise should be Deans top targets. Kessel and Gaborik obviously arent' going anywhere.

Another note about Nash; he averaged 37 goals per season while playing under Hitchcock, who employs a defense first system similar to ours.

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01-10-2012, 03:57 PM
  #541
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
You forgot to add (on the East Coast) to your post....

Parise is not coming out West. Only way I see that, is if Dean offers Parise Big time Bucks.

I read somewhere that the difference in "nights spent on the road" for a West Coast vs an East Coast player is something like 100 road nights (west) vs 20 road nights.

Think about spending one third of your nights away from home - not to mention all the rest of the aggravating things about travel. The payoff (contract) would have to be pretty big to make up for that. And that's even before you start thinking about "elite teams".

Looks like the West Coast will have to grow their players and hold him under long term contracts or trade for them. I doubt very much that Thornton, for example, would ever elected to go to San Jose, even as a free agent.

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01-10-2012, 04:17 PM
  #542
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I read somewhere that the difference in "nights spent on the road" for a West Coast vs an East Coast player is something like 100 road nights (west) vs 20 road nights.

Think about spending one third of your nights away from home - not to mention all the rest of the aggravating things about travel. The payoff (contract) would have to be pretty big to make up for that. And that's even before you start thinking about "elite teams".

Looks like the West Coast will have to grow their players and hold him under long term contracts or trade for them. I doubt very much that Thornton, for example, would ever elected to go to San Jose, even as a free agent.
Re-alignment and a more balanced schedule will help this some, but who knows if it will be enough.

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01-10-2012, 05:49 PM
  #543
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We need a generate-a-goal-a-game player. That means we need a guy who can score a ton AND makes other players on our team better/start scoring again.

Semin, if he's trying, can do that. Nash, I think can not. Thus at least for the Kings, I don't consider those two guys similar guys to fill our needs. Semin is a guy who can play with a Gagne (if he comes back) or a Williams plus a Stoll and instantly have all three guys scoring .8 to 1 point a game. Semin would make an over-powered 2nd liner...if he wants to play. Obviously I'd take Parise over both those guys...heck in the cap era and in the Kings position, I'd take 1 Parise over Nash AND Semin together.

And I did say needs, plural. Last year we lost almost two lines of players and replaced them Richards and some rookies. Stoll went down two notches it seems, we lost Smyth, Handzus, Simmonds and Williams is down a notch as well. No wonder we lost so many games when Richards went down earlier this year. We'd be in Yakupov territory if it wasn't for JMFQ. (Yeah I said it, he's the one guy on this team that deserves it. ) And we lost the one guy who was supposed to step in to our bottom six and contribute too in B Schenn.

For our first line, we need to think outside of the box. We don't need a Nash on that line since we're assuming Kopitar will be on the first line. Well what kind of player makes Kopitar "go?" I think we need a power forward kind of guy, either a RJ Umberger, Martin Hanzal or maybe a Chris Stewart or Evander Kane kind of guy (not that you'll get Kane ever). In other words we need a Ryan Smyth kind of player to create just enough space for Kopitar to go nuts and skate to the net with the puck. That guy has to be a goal scoring threat himself, a big body and push people around, thus drawing bodies away from Kopi. Penner was supposed to be that guy (thus the early 1st line of Penner/Kopitar/Williams last year that seemed to have a bit if immediate chemistry).

I think our bottom six will get helped just from pushing some of our better players into the third line and us perhaps dealing a couple of extra guys.

- R
.><.

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01-10-2012, 06:14 PM
  #544
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If we sign Parise that would mean 3 players signed over 21 million. Is that good?

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01-10-2012, 06:19 PM
  #545
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If we sign Parise that would mean 3 players signed over 21 million. Is that good?
Add Quick to that with his 7M cap as some are guessing and you have 28M for 4. Even better.

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01-10-2012, 06:24 PM
  #546
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I highly doubt Quick gets $7M. I could see him getting $5M, which is what Tim Thomas got from Boston and he has achieved far more than Quick has.

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01-10-2012, 06:28 PM
  #547
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It's just a small provocation, we talked about his cap hit couple of days ago. I don't think he will get 7M but he will have at least 5M. In any case, the top players will have a big share of the cake. Which is ok as long as they are the top players.

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01-10-2012, 06:31 PM
  #548
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
I highly doubt Quick gets $7M. I could see him getting $5M, which is what Tim Thomas got from Boston and he has achieved far more than Quick has.
Most said the same thing about Drew, including me.

Remember that Quick has another year to play before his contract is up. Maybe he waits until 7/1/13 to cash in. If he has back-to-back seasons like the first half of this one, he could easily cash in huge.

Most hope he gets $5 million, but if he gets a Vezina or Hart "nomination" this season, he could easily ask for Doughty money.

Quick at least signed very reasonable 2nd contract. This will be his third contract.

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01-10-2012, 06:31 PM
  #549
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I did some number crunching on capgeek with how the Kings would look if Quick did carry a cap hit of $5M and with an additional $6.8M spent on a Parise (rough estimate of what he may get, which is the same cap hit as Kopitar).

Without any additional signings, meaning an open spot at 4th line C and with 20 signed players on the roster, the Kings payroll would be a little over $60M. The cap will likely go up again, so that leaves the Kings in excess of $4M to fill out the rest of the roster.

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01-10-2012, 06:34 PM
  #550
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
I did some number crunching on capgeek with how the Kings would look if Quick did carry a cap hit of $5M and with an additional $6.8M spent on a Parise (rough estimate of what he may get, which is the same cap hit as Kopitar).

Without any additional signings, meaning an open spot at 4th line C and with 20 signed players on the roster, the Kings payroll would be a little over $60M. The cap will likely go up again, so that leaves the Kings in excess of $4M to fill out the rest of the roster.
Don't forget that Quick is signed for next season at just $1.8 million.

Kings could throw some money on some one year deals next season to help fill out the bottom six. Mitchell is the only one I wouldn't mind seeing Dean re-sign. Maybe Fraser, he's been solid as the 4th line center.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Telos View Post
Would absolutely love to get Carter.



As far as Parise, I don't see the Kings as a legitimate Stanley Cup Contender, at least enough to convince him to travel West. I don't see $6.8 million being enough.

Quote:
Parise told The Star-Ledger today that money will be a significant consideration when negotiations for a new contract begin, but his feeling about whether the Devils have a legitimate chance to eventually win a Stanley Cup will probably be the overriding factor.

“For me that’s probably the biggest thing,” Parise said. “The money is definitely important. That’s real life, let’s face it. I’m not going to say it’s not. That’s realistic. But most important for me is being competitive and having a chance to win the Stanley Cup.”
http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2...ney_matte.html


Last edited by Sydor25: 01-10-2012 at 06:40 PM.
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