The majority of people in here understand that career numbers mean jack squat. So most are going to agree that he's a HOFer.
I'm not so sure it's a slam dunk with the selection committee though. They love their career stats, so I could see St. Louis getting left out for a few years until there's enough of an outcry.
Good post - I agree. That's why I said he has to hit 1000 points to be a true lock. If not, who knows what the committee does? He's not from a high profile market like Neely, so you won't see a high profile media campaign to get him in.
St. Louis should get in, in my opinion. Over 800 points, a Cup, and plenty of post season hardware. Until this year he's had a remarkably injury free career and he may have a couple more good seasons in him.
Also a great story of perseverance and hard work to get to where he is as a small guy. Vinny may wear the C but St. Louis is the heart and soul of Tampa.
You also can add his strong defensive play into account. I don't know his Selke voting record off by heart, but it can't be too bad. Plus the Lady Byng voting record certainly can't hurt him, maybe not help him a whole lot but playing a clean game despite not being a perimeter player goes for something.
Oh yeah, the guy wasn't a wimp either. Last year in the playoffs he loses a couple teeth and basically shakes it off. This is a Lady Byng winner by the way
He rarely ever is not in the game. He makes stuff happen and plays hard every single game on both ends of the ice. Unlike quite a few star players, he doesn't ever disappear or not make an impact on games where he doesn't get any points.
St. Louis is a HHOFer. There is no doubt at this point. He is one of the very best players of his era. He cemented his induction with another extremely strong season last year. If he retired today he is going to make the HHOF.
It's kinda funny how the #2 and 3 guys Iggy and Marty are treated as locks while everyone else in the top 9 are big questions marks to many people. Just food for thought.
Well no doubt Thornton is in. Iginla I would think most people induct him by now but there are still the ones who can't overlook his lack of playoff experience. St. Louis is 3rd. Alfredsson is 4th and I would put him at no worse than a fence sitter at this point. Eventually it will get harder and harder to forget about Hossa since he is still playing wonderful hockey on a wonderful Cup caliber team.
That leaves Richards, Kovalchuk, Lecavalier and Heatley.
Richards has been a consistently good player for a while. There are guys who pull for Turgeon or Nicholls so he has hope. I don't like him in the HHOF though.
Kovalchuk has too many warts against him. Lack of a playoff career, perennial loser wherever he goes (WJC, Olympics, Atlanta, New Jersey), the perception of being selfish and not very good defensively. 500 goals or not I don't like his chances right now.
Lecavalier would be a guy you assumed would be inducted in 2007, but what a fall from grace from an otherwise supreme talent.
Heatley has fallen so hard as well. Looked like an all-time great earlier in his career. Along with Spezza should shoulder a lot of the blame for the 2007 final loss. In a way he's like the Kate Gosselin of hockey - too much baggage.
I think this is the bottom line argument for St. Louis: outside of Jagr and possibly Kariya, St. Louis is the best puck-moving and playmaking winger in the last 20 years. He could turn a fringe NHL centre into a 20-goal scorer. His pucks skills, stick-handling, skating creativity, flair, hockey sense and on-ice vision make him a threat to score whenever he's on the ice. And he's a dangerous threat to score, too. It's just that in the last few years, he's been asked to be the playmaker.
The other point is: What are the "yeah, but..." arguments associated with St. Louis? The HHOF committee is largely guys who played, coached and managed the game at the highest level. They aren't pre-occupied with stats; they don't give a damn what the media thinks. (Note: If you think there are "media selections" in the HHOF, you probably don't realize the regard, or lack there of, that most HHOF selection committee members have for the media). In St. Louis' case, the only "yeah, but..." argument is that he might not hit lofty career numbers. I think he'll hit 1,000 points, since he doesn't have the wear-and-tear that most players have. He only played 69 games before his 25th birthday, and he only has two deep playoff runs. But he won't hit 1,200 points, or the 1,500 that represents sure-fire induction.
But his lack of gawdy career numbers will be offset by the fact that he has been such a dazzling player, a gifted playmaker, a guy who has been consistently an elite player for most of a decade (with the exception of 2005-06), and that he was a key player on a Stanley Cup champion.