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The 2011 Undrafteds Thread

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Old
01-15-2012, 10:30 PM
  #101
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second wave coming, and 1st coach:

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Old
01-15-2012, 10:31 PM
  #102
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George Allen, LW/D



George Allen is #2 on the GP leaders for available players with 339, and when you consider that he played when the schedule was 48-50 games long, that is about as impressive as Lorne Ferguson's record - perhaps more. Plus, Allen was an above average player in the NHL, and was a swingman.

Typically I like to use swingmen as spares, but Allen's overall resume is too strong to keep him out of the starting lineup. Allen actually earned percentage scores of 70, 51, 50, and 41, which is better than a lot of already selected players from this era. He did it from the wing too, which makes him a hotter commodity.

Plus, hockey-reference.com actually says Allen was a defensemen in the 1940, 1942, 1943 and 1946 seasons. I can't vouch for the accuracy of this, but I think they had to get it from somewhere. I believe the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, that he played some defense those years. His defensemen point% scores would be 124, 79, 75 and 71 which seems a little out there. He also didn't get any all-star votes and it's hard to believe that a defenseman that prolific wouldn't at least get something. So I think he was viewed primarily as a forward. Even if he didn't play D a lot and he's not a "true" swingman, it does mean that he was stronger offensively than he looked.

In Allen's four best seasons he ranked 24th, 30th, 32nd, and 39th in scoring. He also played a very impressive 41 playoff games, scoring 19 points, making the finals with the 1944 Hawks (3rd in team playoff scoring) and the 1947 Habs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calgary Herald
Thompson paired Rookies xxx and George Allen with Centre Cully Dahlstrom, which gave him a rugged combination and one which thrives on heavy going.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Gazette
...and Left-wingers Doug Bentley, xxx, and George Allen. Those men played the kind of fast, aggressive hockey that made Chicago one of the league's "gold mines" last year, when 288,315 customers gave Chicago second place...
Thanks to Bring Back Scuderi for finding a couple of quotes I couldn't have been bothered to find (really disillusioned with Google News lately)

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Old
01-15-2012, 10:31 PM
  #103
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R.J. Umberger, C/RW



Umberger might be a bit of a surprise pick here. Heading into this season he has 274 points in 474 games. But 474 games is not a very short time once you're down to pick #2000. On a per-game basis, Umberger is one of the best even strength scorers out there. When comparing him to some other centers who had more points thanks to longer careers, like Adam Creighton, Steven Reinprecht, German Titov, Mike Comrie, or to shorter career guys with nice per-game figures like Todd Elik, Jan Hrdina and Kip Miller, he brings a lot more to the table than they do, and it compensates for his lack of "offensive longevity" compared to them.

Umberger is 6'2" and 220 lbs, can also play the wing, he is highly competitive, responsible in all three zones, gritty, wears the A, and had a really nice 2008 playoff with Philadelphia, with 10 goals (4th in the league) and 15 points (10th in the league). He's having a slow 2012 season, but his 18 points have leapfrogged his career numbers over another 16 undrafted players, and he's getting a lot closer to the top echelon of that list faster than you might think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2006-07
made the most of his opportunity, scoring 20 goals and playing a strong two-way game. spent the season alongside Carter, forming an impressive tandem of youth, size and speed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2008-09
Bounced back from a nightmarish 2006-07 season to nearly double his points and improve his +/- by 32. His 8-goal performance against Montreal in the second round, countered by a career-low 13 goals in the regular season, suggest Umberger is streaky.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2009-10
Statistically, Umberger slipped from his 2007-08 career season with Philadelphia, but statistics do not track intangibles. The Ohio state product is a warriod, picking his team up when down with much-needed sandpaper. he scored three og the team's seven playoff goals last spring.
Quote:
Originally Posted by McKeen's 2001-11
contributed a career-best 55 points and one of the steadier performances for hte jackets last season... strong, multi-purpose forward is a powerful skater with good hands, effective when driving hard to the net and activating his quick, heavy shot... can be a handful 1-on-1 due to prodigious upper body strength and some slick moves... could show better poise and awareness in possession... still prone to dropping his head when handling the puck and setting up his shots... self-driven and fiercely competitive - yet that inner fire doesn't always transfer to the ice... generates intermittent bursts of physical aggression mixed with intensity lapses where he stops moving his feet and watches the game... certainly not lacking in courage or toughness...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2001-11
a decent hitter and capable in the faceoff circle, he is used on both special teams. A bit over his head on the top line, but as a secondary producer, the versatile forward is sound.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Prospectus 2010-11
... defensively, he already blocks more shots than any Blue Jackets forward. He might never live up to the potential of a first rounder, but he'll continue to have a productive career.


Quote:
Originally Posted by McKeen's 2011-12
delivered a solid performance, contributing in all areas while hitting a career high in points for the second straight year... thrived upon a move to the wing...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2011-12
may have been the only blue jacket to have met or exceeded expectations... a key player on both special teams and decent on faceoffs, though mosty used on the wings. his importance to the team was reflected in the fact he led all Columbus forwards in ice time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Prospectus 2011-12
despite a gritty, shot-blocking style and a nasty hit from Brad Marchand, he has played in 246 straight games and achieved a career-high 57 points on his way to being named team MVP by blue jackets fans. Umbergar anchors the retooled 2nd line and was called upon to kill penalties and play defensively responsible hockey... Being a good PP option with an ever-increasing ES scoring rate, Umberger is a classic two-way forward like Ryan Kesler.

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Old
01-15-2012, 10:31 PM
  #104
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Mark Parrish, RW



Parrish just scored goals, a quite decent amount of them. In his 722 NHL games, he put in 216 of them, most among available players. His 387 points are 3rd among available players. Parrish's 80 career PP goals are 11 more than the next highest currently available. At the "A" level, he would be a great sniper to have.

Parrish scored 20+ goals six times in the dead puck era. He got into the all-star game in 2002, when he had 30 goals, just two goals out of the top-20.

I saw Parrish as more or less a one-dimensional player but he was regarded highly enough to take a shot at the rotating Wild captaincy, in February-April and the playoffs in 2007, and then November of the following season.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 2004
with his good speed and reads, Parrish is able to wriggle past such top defenders as Brian Leetch for scoring chances. He is a goal scorer by skill and nature. He goes to the net hard because he knows he has to score to stay in the lineup. Parrish has terrific hands and a great shot, and he has started thinking like a finisher. He will get a lot of 1st unit PP time. He does some of his best work around the front of the net. He loves to score. Parrish is a player who goes in streaks and slumps. that is Parrish's pattern, and he needs to snap out of it to take his place among the game's top goal scorers. He's just entering his prime, but consistency continues to elude him.


Parrish doesn't have great size, but he doesn't avoid the high-traffic areas. He is not afraid of anything or anybody. Parrish works all the dirty areas in the attacking zone, and not just around the net, either. He will absorb a blow just to chip the puck in safely rather than make a high-risk play. His defensive awareness has improved.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McKeen's 2005-06
gritty, opportunistic sniper with quick hands... lacks blazing pace and great defense, but boasts a hard, accurate shot and is extremely dangerous around goal due to his great puck perseverence and a knack for negotiating congested traffic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2007-08
has always had a nose for the net and the instincts to be in the right place at the right time. He loves to mix it up in traffic and find the garbage around the net, or find the open ice to unload his shot. He's a bit of a defensive liability, which limits his icetime with the game on the line.

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Old
01-15-2012, 10:32 PM
  #105
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Tom Edur, D



Edur has a really short career and a really strange career path, too. As a 19-21 year old, he played three seasons in the WHA, scoring 96 points. Then he joined the NHL.

In the NHL, Edur had two excellent seasons for a couple of weak Colorado and Pittsburgh teams. He was the #1 for Colorado in 1977 (there was a guy who had 0.4 minutes more, but played 55 games o Edur's 80) with 23.85 minutes a game, and then in 1978 after starting out as Colorado's #3 behind Beck and Van Boxmeer, he went to Pittsburgh and was immediately their #1, getting more minutes than Burrows and Stackhouse (26.05 per game). He finished with 55 points, good for 10th among defensemen and a percentage score of 70.

More impressively: In 1977, Edur finished with a +14 on Colorado. Adjusted +/- formulas say that, on average, a player playing the entire 1977 season with Pittsburgh should be -36, giving Edur an adjusted +/- of +57 for that season, one of the highest of all-time. Check out Colorado for this season and how much Edur's +14 sticks out:

http://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CLR/1977.html

Sometimes you see that with offensive specialists playing sheltered minutes, but this was their #1 defenseman.

How impressive is this? Just 32 players in history have had a season stronger than that in adjusted +/-: Bobby Orr (X5), Bobby Clarke (X3), Wayne Gretzky (X2), Mario Lemieux (X2), Eric Lindros (X2), Marcel Dionne (X2), Paul Kariya (X2), Teemu Selanne (X2), John LeClair (X2, thanks Lindros), Gordie Howe & Frank Mahovlich together, Borje Salming & Ian Turnbull together, Charlie Simmer & Dave Taylor together (thanks Dionne), Mike Bossy & Bryan Trottier together, Mark Howe & Brad McCrimmon together, Milan Hejduk and Peter Forsberg together, Larry Robinson, Jason Allison, Chris Pronger, Al MacInnis, Jaromir Jagr, Jarome Iginla, Thomas Vanek, Alex Ovechkin, Vincent Damphousse & Ron Francis (1995 lockout year, the extrapolations involved create more extreme results) and Lowell MacDonald, strangely.

Basically, that's a whole bunch of high-end ATDers, a couple of MLDers, and Lowell MacDonald.

In 1978 as well,. adjusted +/- says that an average player playing 20 games in Colorado and the rest in Pittsburgh should be -27, but he was +1, leading to yet another outstanding adjusted +/- score/. Edur, in his short time in the NHL, was doing something right. During that season, he was traded straight up for Dennis Owchar. Owchar played about the same minutes as Edur in both cities, but finished with a -61 that season.

Then, he left hockey to study Christianity. The end.

one interesting point: probably in hopes that he would reconsider, Edmonton used up one of their expansion draft picks on Edur, a full year after he announced his retirement.

Check this out:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
This is Tom Edur. He was a promising defenseman just coming into his own when he, at age 23, walked away from the game.

Edur had oodles of promise. In 1973 as a 17 year old Edur, along side notable teammates Mike Palmateer, Bruce Boudreau and Mark and Marty Howe, helped the Toronto Marlies capture the Memorial Cup.

His fine performance at the Memorial Cup led the WHA Cleveland Crusaders to offer the underaged junior a 3 year, $250,000 contract, stealing him before the NHL had a chance to draft him a year later. The Boston Bruins did draft him in 1974, but he remained in Cleveland for the duration of his contract.

Edur was emerging nicely with the Crusaders. By the final year of his contract the 20 year old rearguard tallied 35 points and impressively compiled a +14 rating on a horrendous defensive team.

Despite increasingly feeling comfortable on the ice, he was uneasy off of it. He was said to be shocked and disillusioned with the pro-hockey lifestyle, particularly the drinking and promiscuity. He tried to accept it, and forced himself to indulge in it, once claiming to be drunk every day for a month.

In 1976-77 Edur jumped to the NHL. He joined the Colorado Rockies, being reunited with his former Cleveland coach Johnny Wilson. He was named as Colorado's best defenseman that first season in Denver, but early the next season he was traded to Pittsburgh, again following Wilson.

Edur was really coming into his own for the remainder of the season with the Penguins. He scored 10 goals and 55 points, the 11th most of all NHL defensemen. The 23 year old's career seemed ready for take off. But that is when Edur grounded his career, walking away from the game in the summer of 1978.

Prior to training camp Edur informed the Penguins he was going to retire. He had become a devoted Jehovah's Witness, and wanted to fully commit to his new found faith. The Penguins offered him a new contract complete with a big raise and the blessing to sit out Sunday games.

But Edur did not return. He explained his decision in an interview for a 1979 issue of MacLean's magazine.

"I quit hockey - but not because I don't love the game. I do. My dream had been to become a National Hockey League player. I can still remember when I was about ten years old and faithfully watching my favorite hockey team on TV. Sometimes, when their games were on radio, I'd fall asleep listening to them in bed."

"But serving Jehovah, the Most High God, is not just a one-day-a-week affair. It is a "way of life. Hockey is also a full-time career. You have to be dedicated to it, playing and practicing all the time. And now I was dedicated to Jehovah. (Matthew 16:24) To play as a professional and at the same time try to serve Jehovah would, I felt, be like having two masters-something or someone would be bound to suffer. So I let the team know I was quitting professional hockey."

I'm not really sure what happened to Tom Edur after he left hockey. He appears to have initially become a Jehovah's Witness pioneer, spreading the word of God. I'm not sure if he became involved in any other career. Apparently he had been completing a bachelor's degree from the University of Toronto while he was still playing.
The Penguins meanwhile joked in Sports Illustrated that they were receiving two miracles from God as compensation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey, 1977-1979 editions
an offensive stylist... one of the few right-shooting defensemen in the league... excels on the point on the PP...

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Old
01-15-2012, 10:32 PM
  #106
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Stephane Quintal, D



There is a lot to like about Quintal. He is the all-time leader in games by available defensemen with 1037 - 50 more than the next guy. And he didn't "just" play a lot of games; he was a useful player: he averaged 19.84 minutes a game over that many games. He was huge: 6'3" and 231 pounds. And he was tough, and a willing fighter. He played a tough, but clean game. With so many of his PIMs coming from his 126 NHL fights, he took just 0.68 minutes in penalties per game otherwise. And in his last 5 full seasons, NHL teams paid him $11.9M, when a player making the league average over this time would have earned 8.0M. (sources: http://www.dropyourgloves.com/Player...px?Player=3708 , http://www.andrewsstarspage.com/inde...91/105-2008-09)

Downsides: He may not have received as much icetime on better teams. Though his teams were not terrible, they were pretty mediocre: on average, 8% worse than average. And, he was a very slow skater.

Career icetime stats actually don't flatter Quintal because he was a little-used depth player through the 1992 season. But from 1993-2004, he played 853 games with an average of 21.00 minutes a game. A player with numbers like that, should not be available right now. That is considerably better than Marc Bergevin, for example.

Over the course of his career as a full-time NHLer, Quintal's ice time rank on his team was 5, 1, 3, 3, 1, 4, 4, 4, 1, 5, 5, 4. The best season he had was 1996-97, where he anchored the blueline for a 77-point Montreal team that made the playoffs and lost in round 1 to the Devils. The other two times he was a #1 was for the 1994 Jets and the 2001 Hawks - in other words, he was not a player capable of being a #1 defenseman on a team that would go anywhere. He was a very strong #3/4 for the majority of his career, though.

Quintal was also a strong penalty killer. He was on the ice approximately 41% of the time for his teams on the PK, and they were 2% better than average.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Alamanac 1996-97
Quintal, once primarily known as a ruffian, is big and strong. And, he has cleaned up his act significantly. He now plays a smart, conservative, and frequently mean-spirited style. He'll still drop the gloves once in a while, but only to settle an old score, he doesn't need to prove himself in that regard anymore. Last year, he proved plenty brave by taking on Eric Lindros. A good leader... solid veteran who will play hard, tough hockey and rarely lose the focus of his assignment. He protects his end of the ice and clears opponents away from the slot with whatever means necessary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 1996-97
plays with pain. stay at home defensive rearguard. never backs down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1997-98
Quintal's game is limited by his lumbering skating. He has some nice touches, like a decent point shot and a good head and hands for passing... fortunately, Quintal is aware of his flaws. He plays a smart positional game and doesn't get involved in low-percentage plays... he takes up a lot of ice with his body and his stick,.. slow, but strong on his skates... thrives on contact and works hard along the boards and in front of the net. he hits hard without taking penalties and is tough and a willing fighter...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 1997-98
voted by the local press as the team's unsung hero last season... dependable... plays within his limitations... respected presence... knows how to use his body... won't back off even against the league's toughest customers, even more so if a smaller teammate is being roughed up.

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01-15-2012, 10:32 PM
  #107
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Jorma Valtonen, G



Valtonen was a mainstay on the Finnish national team for the entire 1970s, plus the 1984 Olympics. He had a ridiculously long domestic career, playing from age 18-41 in the top Finnish league (1964-1987) with the exception of one year in the relegation division, three in Italy and one in Germany.

It's tough to figure who was better between he and Urpo Ylonen. Domestically, Ylonen was winning all those top goalie awards, and league MVP awards. Internationally, they turned to Ylonen more.

- 6th all-time among goalies with 61 career international games
- 15th all-time in international wins (23-30-8)
- Top goalie at the 1972 World Championships

- Downside is that he never medalled at any event, but tough to do with Canada, USSR & Czechs dominating


It's not that he wasn't decorated domestically too. He was. In 1971, 1972, and 1980 he was the Finnish league's top goalie, and in 1972 he was player of the year. (Ylonen had five top goalie awards and three MVPs)

What it looks like, is the 3-year older Ylonen was Finland's go-go guy throughout the 60s and then Valtonen took over from there. Ylonen, in a late career renaissance, took over for Valtonen at the 1976 Olympics and the 1978 Worlds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by goaliespub.com
Jorma Valtonen was born on December 22, 1946 in Turku, Finland. During his long career as a goalie in Finland, he represented TPS Turku, RU-38 Pori (national champion 1967), Ässät Pori (national champion 1971), Jokerit Helsinki (national champion 1973) and FoPS. While playing abroad, Valtonen started for our local SerieA Team HC Gardena in the season1975/76 leading it to the championship victory! He also played for Alleghe (Italy) and EHC München (Germany) and was the first finnish goalie to be invited at NHL-training camps (Toronto Maple Leafs and Pittsburgh Penguins) in the early 70‘s. Over the course of suiting up for 232 national team games for Finland, „Valtsu“ participated 9 times in the IIHF World Championship tournaments between 1970 and 1979. In the 1972 tournament in Prague, he took home an individual honour, winning the IIHF Directorate Best Goalkeeper Award. He also was a three-time participant in the Olympic Winter Games (1972, 1980 and 1984) and in the 1976 Canada Cup. He was inducted in the Finnish Hockey Hall Of Fame in 1989.

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01-15-2012, 10:32 PM
  #108
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Andy Murray, Coach



Murray stands out for a few reasons at this point:

- His 738 career NHL games coached is the highest among all available.
- His win% of .537 is also the highest among coaches with 500+ games coached
- This means his 333 career NHL wins are far ahead of the next-highest remaining
- He received some Adams consideration: 2nd in 2009, and 5th in 2000.
- He also has six years' experience as an NHL assistant coach, going to the finals with Minnesota in 1991.
- His international record is also excellent, 26-4-5, with three world championship golds, 1997, 2003, 2007
- He is now in the IIHF HOF as a builder.
- I think all the best international coaches are recognized, the guys remaining just blend into a mush

Murray now coaches the Western Michigan Broncos, a college team:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlive.com
“I think everybody is feeling, ‘Oh boy, it must be a big adjustment from pros to college,’ but it only is if you have a different kind of coaching style. I think my style is one that works at different levels. It’s all about communication.”
WMU senior captain Ian Slater said the Broncos have been soaking up every soft-spoken word that comes out of their coach’s mouth. “Blashill was young, and I don’t want to say aggressive, but he spoke what was on his mind,” Slater said. “Coach Murray is going to sit back and think, ‘Why did you say this?’ or ‘Why did you do this play?’ He has a real approachable attitude. When Coach Murray speaks, you listen. He’s not always saying something, but when he’s saying something, no matter how soft or subtle, the room is quiet.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlive.com
Andy Murray has received one of the highest honors for his work in the sport of hockey.

The first-year Western Michigan University coach has been inducted into the International Ice Hockey Federation Hall of Fame.

Murray is a member of the 2012 class in the Builders category, along with Pavel Bure, Phil Housley, Raimo Helminen and Milan Novy.

“It’s a great honor,” Murray said. “It’s pretty humbling for me. It’s recognition of that fact that I’ve been surrounded by some pretty good people for a lot of years in other great coaches and great players. You’re kind of humbled to realize you’re recognized as the coach. Really, it’s the players who are the people that make the difference.

“It’s a reward for coaches who work hard, which I think I work at my profession. It’s pretty gratifying. I’m going in with some pretty special people.”

Murray, a native of Souris, Manitoba, coached Team Canada to three IIHF World Championships in 1997, 2003 and ’07. He is the only non-Russian head coach in IIHF history to win three championships for his country.

The longtime NHL coach is the ninth Canadian coach to be inducted into the IIHF Hall of Fame and 23rd Canadian overall.

Murray said hockey has always been his way of life.

“It’s allowed me to never have to have a real job,” he said with a laugh. “I want to keep fooling people as long as I can. I just like coaching and being around people and thinking you’re making a little bit of a difference.

“I think how you measure your life is how many other people you’ve helped and I’d like to think I’ve helped a few people along the way. An awful lot of people have helped me.”
Murray led Team Canada to a record six Spengler Cups, an annual hockey tournament in Davos, Switzerland.

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01-20-2012, 01:00 AM
  #109
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As I slowly recover from a servere viral infection that made the wife and I feel like we were knocking on death's door, I finally bring to you the 3rd wave: a lineup of six players, plus two multi-positional spares I am quite proud of (perhaps the last true "F/D" players worthy of all-time consideration at any level)

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01-20-2012, 01:01 AM
  #110
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Rich Sutter, W



No doubt Rich was the 6th-most talented of the Sutter brothers. But that doesn't mean we should ignore him forever. Sutter was a great role player who scored 315 points in 874 NHL games - and 279 of them were at even strength, 6th-most among all available players.

Rich was the 3rd-most combative of the Sutters, with Brian being a runaway #1, Duane 2nd, Ron and Brent in 4th/5th and Darryl a distant 6th. Rich had 114 recorded career fights with a known record of 23-15-8. He had agitating qualities and was a serviceable penalty killer: 22% for teams 10% better than average. Rich averaged 12.95 minutes a game over a nice long career and topped 11 goals and 25 points nine times each, topping out at 20 goals and 42 points, with no PP time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1986-87
Sutter is an average skater in terms of maneuverability and balance, but he does have a good snap to his stride and can accelerate well. He is not a very good puckhandler, nor is he an exceptional stickhandler or passer. Sutter does have a good sense of the game and its flow and can read plays pretty well. That vision and anticipation makes him a good checking and defensive forward but he has been unable to translate those skills into goal scoring capabilities. Sutter will score his goals from around the net in scrambles or whatever other mischief he can create.

The physical game is what Sutter is all about. Sutter is what is euphemistically called a "chippy" hockey player. This means he starts at questionable and moves quickly into dirty. He hits whatever he can find, usually the opposition's meeker players, and gets his stick into anyone bigger than he is. Sutter won't fight even though he causes all sorts of calamaties, and that frustrates the opposition too. (editor's note, funny that they say that since he had 23 fights that season, 3rd on the team behind Tocchet and Brown)

Rich, the other half of the Sutter twins, is even more pugnacious than his brother Ron. He is a disturber of a world class order, hitting after the whistle ad doing whatever else he can to distract the opposition and get them off their game. He and his brother are known to NHLers as Spear and Slash. His PIM total is huge, but Rich, like his brother Duane, does things that get his team stirred up. He is a very excitable player and he does get on the nerves of his teammates because of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1987-88
Rich is not a big guy, so he definitely deserves credit for his willingness to be physical, and it should also be noted that he is moderating his running around in search of victims. That makes him a more effective player... though he missed his brother Ron, Rich's excellent work habits eventually got him into the swing of things. He's an honest hockey player.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1991-92
Sutter can make plays, but simple plays... he has only average thought processes in terms of seeing the ice; he likes to keep it deep in the attack zone and keep it simple. Sutter does not create opportunities off the rush, he makes them off the forecheck. He gets himself in position to score, but isn't a great finisher. Sutter is not an agile skater, but he's strong. He has the ability to forecheck because of his persistence. And at the other end, what he lacks in quickness in the defensive zone, he makes up for with smarts.


A confrontational player, Sutter finishes every check emphatically. He goes to the net hard. He drives the puck deep, then fights through checks to get it back. Rich works every shift, every game, which you would expect from any Sutter. He is not gifted with great skills; in fact, he may be the least-skilled of the brothers. But he understands his limitations and makes up for those shortcomings with the family's characteristic relentlessness and desire. And from all outward appearances, anyway, he did a god job of handling the fact that his big brother coaches the team. it did not seem to become an issue in the dressing room. Sutter is good in the room. He plays hurt and, given the style he plays, that is often.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1992-93
Sutter shines defensively, because he reads plays well and is a relentless forechecker who will hound a puck carrier to distraction... Rich plays bigger than his size. He is annoying, pesky and always in your face. He takes the body on every shift... despite his lack of touch, he will provide anything else his team needs in the way of effort in whatever department his talent allows him to contribute.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Almanac 1993-94
Like any Sutter, Rich will do all the things that remind you of the family reputation. He';s an excellent checker, a relentless skater and a tireless worker. He knows the game inside and out. An old-fashioned player in a modern game, Sutter yaps at opponents and hacks their arms and legs, trying to intimidate with trash. He is clearly at the bottom of the family totem pole in terms of talent. He has the gene for dedication, hard work, chippiness and belligerence... despite his limited offensive talent, he is a character player - the kind any coach would love to have on the team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1993-94
Sutter endures on his grit and work ethic. He is alert to game situations, and will be on the ice at crunch time when the team needs a lead protected... he takes "smart" penalties and creates PP chances for his team by keeping his legs moving as he works to get in scoring position. You never have to worry about Sutter being ready to play. His intensity is a constant.

Sutter plays with the arrogance of a player at least 4 inches taller and 25 pounds heavier. He is annoying to play against, always in your face and yapping. He'll take whatever piece of a player he can to distract them. If knocked down (which he often is by bigger players) he'll bounce right back up and get into the play.

We thought Rich would drop right off the blues depth chart after coach Broan left. Instead, he played even better, becoming a reliable checking winger who brings a spark to his shifts. Our lesson is learned - we'll never underestimate a Sutter again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1994-95
He can be a catalyst to lift his team's bench or help calm things down when the action gets heated on the ice. His offensive contributions will be meagre, but he ranks high in character and leadership.

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01-20-2012, 01:01 AM
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Dean McAmmond, LW/C



McAmmond is a classic "tweener", a poor-man's Brendan Morrison or Daymond Langkow from an ATD perspective. A slightly lesser version of Marty McInnis. He was pretty good offensively, but not great. He was also pretty decent defensively, but not great. He had the willingness to get his nose dirty but was too small to be very effective physically. He had the speed and forechecking ability to be a solid pest but he didn't have the mentality for it. He was just a solid, honest player for a good long time. So it takes this long in the drafting process before we get to the point where we can find a definite spot for him.

McAmmond was a 14.59 minute per game forward for a nice long period of 996 games over 17 seasons. In his 1996-2006 prime, he typically occupied the #6 spot on his team for ice time among forwards. McAmmond was a natural center who played there for his first few NHL seasons before moving to LW on a mostly permanent basis through 2003. From 2004-2010 he was about half wing and half center, taking between 300 and 800 faceoffs a year, usually 3rd-6th on his team in faceoffs. His lack of proficiency in faceoffs (usually around 44%) was probably a big reason why he didn't stick as a permanent center.

McAmmond's 448 points are the most among available players, by a 45-point margin. He didn't exactly get there pretty though. He played 996 games to get there, 5th-most among availables, and two of the players ahead of him are being picked here (not that being useful enough to play 996 NHL games is a bad thing, at all) There is no real standout offensive season on his resume: Two seasons with 50-51 points, and nine seasons with 27-37 points. However, McAmmond didn't get a lot of PP time and was a consistently decent ES scorer. His 329 career ES points are 32 more than any other available player has. (he had 10 seasons with 20-33 ESP)

Also, although his teams had a 0.92 GF:GA ratio throughout his career, his own ratio was an impressive 1.08.

McAmmond was not a true standout in any one area but his overall package is impossible to ignore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1998-99
McAmmond's chief asset is his speed. He has excellent acceleration and quickness, and uses his speed to forecheck and force the play. He works the boards and the corners; he is effective in open ice as well because of his skating... he handles the puck well in traffic and has good vision to see developing plays. He is unselfish and passes the puck well on the forehand and backhand. He also has a nice shot in tight. He has needed some time to adjust to NHL tempo and now moves the puck more crisply.


McAmmond is feisty and aggressive. He isn't very big but he creates a ruckus in the offensive zone with his tenacity. He will stick his nose in just about anywhere and he can be very irritating to play against. He drives to the net with authority, often right past bigger defenders.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 2003
McAmmond is more of a give-and-go kind of player. He is most comfortable with forwards who like to play that style and not with forwards who like to hang onto the puck... he uses his speed better when he doesn't have to try to figure out where his linemates are going with the puck.
Quote:
Originally Posted by McKeen's 2005-06
proved an invaluable piece to calgary's run in 03-04, successfully shifting to center during Conroy's injury absence and enjoying a strong run before season-ending surgery to repair a bulging disc... smooth, explosive skater with good puckcarrying skills... valued for his versatility and responsible two-way play but has never developed the finishing skills to fully capitalize on the numerous chances his world-class speed creates... usually more involved and physical as a centerman.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2006-07
perfect in a third line role or subbing as a top-6 forward. He can line up either at center or wing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2007-08
carved a niche for himself in Ottawa with stellar two-way play and a terrific postseason effort. At 34, McAmmond is the fastest player on the youthful Senators and always gives 100%.


Last edited by seventieslord: 01-20-2012 at 01:10 AM.
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01-20-2012, 01:04 AM
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Keith Jones, W



Given that this guy retired less than a decade ago and was a pretty notorious player for a few years, I am really surprised that no one has ever given him a shot as an MLD/AAA/AA bottom 6 pest and grinder.

Jones did just about everything well. He had limited finesse skills but with hard work he managed to score 258 points in 491 games. He was physical, solid on his feet, responsible defensively, an agitator and was willing to drop the gloves (29 career fights, but yikes, a 1-8-10 career record, .316). About the only things he didn't do were kill penalties and score at a consistent top line level.

Jones played mostly RW but occasionally switched to the left. He averaged 14.22 minutes a game in his relatively short career. He was a key cog on very strong teams (11% above average). From 1994-2000 he scored just below or well over half a point per game, but his year by year totals don't look great because in that period he had GP totals of 57, 40, and 23. At his best (but not always) was a Scott Hartnell-style scoring line glue guy so he should transition pretty fine into a bottom-6 role here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1994-95
Jones took a step forward last season from a spare 4th liner to a winger on the checking line come playoff time... Jones is a sparkplug. He likes to make things happen by driving to the front of the net and taking a defenseman with him. His skating is adequate, and he uses quick bursts of speed to power himself to and through the traffic areas. He has decent hands, is an eager finisher and plays well at both ends of the ice. Jones keeps the game simple, and does his job.


The Caps threw Jones on the ice whenever the team or the crowd needed a lift. He is energetic and uses his size well. He needs more experience, of course, but is tough and willing to pay a physical price. The caps could use another couple of players like him. He isn't the biggest player on the ice, but there are nights when you come away thinking he is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1997-98
No sooner did Jones, a grinder by trade, arrive in Colorado than he had a vision of himself as a better hockey player. Without abandoning any of the principles that had helped him establish himself with the offensively uninspired capitals, Jones discovered the joys of scoring and playmaking. Jones doesn't have the greatest hands in the world and he'll never be confused with Peter Forsberg, but he has a good shot... He isn't very creative, but his efforts churn up loose pucks for teammates smart enough to trail in his wake. Jones is the antithesis of a natural scorer, because everything he accomplishes is through effort.

Jones finishes every check in every zone, and sometimes runs around a bit, but he is becoming more responsible defensively. Jones loves the game and knows what he has to do to stay in the lineup.... No one deserves success more than the hard-working Jones.

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01-20-2012, 01:05 AM
  #113
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Milan Chalupa, D



From 1975-1985, Chalupa was one of Czechoslovakia's top defensemen. He was a regular on the national team, scoring 26 points in 84 games in 12 major tournaments, and he had a strong 11-year career in the Czech leagu, with 97 points and 377 PIMs in 279 games, plus unknown stats in his first 4 seasons (1974-1977).

In Chalupa's 12 tournaments, he won gold twice, silver/2nd seven times, and bronze/3rd twice. His 5th place finish at the 1980 Olympics was the worst he ever did. Chalupa was also a four-time Czech league champion (1974, 1982, 1983, 1984)

What separates Chalupa from some other "played a lot of international games" picks, is that he was recognized as a very strong player in his home league for a while too.

In 1984 he was 11th in the Golden Hockey Stick voting for the top player in all of Europe. And in the Czech league he ranked 7th in 1983 (1st among defensemen) and was rated the top defenseman. In 1984, he was voted 3rd among all players, and tops among defensemen. No other defenseman received significant votes.

This, coupled with his tenure on the national team (as well as a perusal of their rosters yearly), is a very good indication that he was always a top-2 or 3 defenseman on the Czech national team, particularly following 1978, Oldrich Machac's last year with the team.

In the 1985 season he tried his hand in the NHL, but thanks to injuries, (Missed part of 1984-85 season with pulled groin, an injury suffered during Detroit's Nov. 6, 1984, game vs. Montreal. He did not return to action until Detroit's Dec. 9, 1984, game at Washington. ... Missed remainder of 1984-85 season with re-aggravation of groin injury, suffered during Detroit's Dec. 12, 1984, game at Chicago) was little-used by Detroit over 14 games, scoring 5 points. He then went and played six more seasons in Germany.

Quote:
Originally Posted by loh.net
Chalupa was a teen star in his native Czech Republic and joined the elite Jiskra Havlickuv junior team at the age of just 13 in 1966. He remained with the club for six years, developing into a strong defensive star.
Note that Chalupa was a junior player for SEVEN seasons, starting at age 13 in a league full of 18-19 year olds.

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01-20-2012, 01:05 AM
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Arnold Kadlec, D



TDMM covered this one pretty well. A recap:

Individual:
Czech Golden Hockey Stick: 9th (1981), 8th (1984)
European Golden Stick: 10th (1981)
Canada Cup All-Star (1981)
24 points in 64 International games
247 points in 457 Czech league games

Team:
One gold, 3 silvers, 2 bronze/3rd in major men's tournaments

Just the face that he was a factor in golden hockey stick voting twice, makes him a solid pick here. The fact that he turned up in the voting for all of Europe once thanks to an outstanding best-on-best tournament is the icing on that cake.

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01-20-2012, 01:05 AM
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Doug Favell, G



Favell played 377 games which isn't a lot until you consider that a lot of them were in the few years following expansion, where jobs were still pretty limited and platoons were common. Favell's record at stopping the puck is too good to ignore, though. Over his career he averaged 5 sv% points over the league average while helping get Philadelphia to respectability through the early 1970s.

- Top-10 in sv% 5 times (5th-1968, 7th-1971, 8th-1972, 3rd-1973, 4th-1974)
- short playoff career but also averaged 3 points above average in career
- from 1968-1973, Flyers' sv%: Parent .922, Favell .917, others .901
- 6th in all-star voting in 1978. one point behind teammate Parent, whose sv% he actually outperformed this time
- 4th in minutes in 1972, 9th in 1971

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
Doug Favell is best known for being the Flyers original goalie along with the legendary Bernie Parent. the two provided strong goaltending in the expansion Flyers formative years. Unfortunately for Favell, after 6 seasons with the Flyers, Doug was traded prior to the Flyers winning their two Stanley Cups in the mid 1970s.

Born on April 5, 1945 in St. Catharines, Ontario Doug was picked up by the Philadelphia Flyers in the 1967 NHL Expansion Draft from the Boston Bruins organization. Doug had never played for the Bs but had put up impressive performances in 2 years with the Bruins farm teams.

Doug had a great rookie year, slightly better than Parent even. He recorded a career best 2.27 GAA and 4 shutouts in 37 games. He had a 15-15-6 record. Parent on the other hand had a similar year - 16-17-5 with 2.48 GAA and 4 more shutouts.

Doug struggled the next two years as Parent became the starting goalie, playing in most of the games. Favell saw little playing time over those two years, playing in just 36 contests, winning only 7.

Doug got to be the full time starter in 70-71 when Bernie Parent was traded midway through the year. He had another good year He finished the year with a 16-15-9 record. In 71-72. He played in 54 games, recording a 2.80 GAA and a career high 5 shutouts along with a 18-25-9 record. In 1972-73 Favell had a career high 20 wins against 15 losses and 4 ties, with a 2.83 GAA and 3 shutouts.

That proved to be Favell's final season in Philadelphia. Favell proved to be a good goalie, but not a great goalie. The Flyers were becoming a strong contender but were not getting the spectacular goaltending needed to take the Flyers to new heights in the playoffs..

Favell was traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs, ironically to complete the trade which saw the Flyers reacquired Bernie Parent. Favell played two decent years with the Leafs. In the meantime the Flyers won the next two Stanley Cups without him.

Prior to 76-77, Doug joined the Colorado Rockies, a new team that formed out of the old Kansas City Scouts. Doug was between the pipes for the Rockies first win on October 5, 1976. Otherwise highlights were few and far between in Denver. Favell won only 21 games in 3 seasons with the awful Rockies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey
made a remarkable comeback from a severed Achilles tendon to beat Bernie Parent out of the regular goaltending job last year... a happy-go-lucky guy... carefree guy with a quick sense of humour... mod, glib, popular... credits Gerry Cheevers for improving his ability to cover angles by giving him an off-season tip... has developed into one of the league's most proficient netminders... depends on reflexes, flops to the ice more than most netminders... witty, refreshing guy... heartbroken when traded, but quickly adjusted... had an erratic but generally successful career in Philadelphia... stardom predicted for him has never materialized... has shown flashes of brilliance but has lacked consistency... often plagued by injuries... popular with fans... completed comeback last season with respectable campaign that helped team into playoffs for the first time... beat flyers twice during season, then was exceptional despite Philadelphia's victory of opening round series... career was spotted by injuries, but now a durable goalie.

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01-20-2012, 01:08 AM
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Mathieu Dandenault, D/RW



Dandenault is a really underappreciated player, and he and my other spare were easily the two most interesting players to research. Dandenault was hockey's last true swingman, able to switch seamlessly from forward to defense multiple times, on a regular basis throughout his career. He played 13 seasons, and in just two of them he was exclusively a D-man, and in just three he was exclusively a forward. The others were very mixed.

Using official numbers from 1998-on, and estimates from 1996 and 1997, I can tell you Dandenault played 868 NHL games and 12,661 minutes for a total of 14.59 minutes a game.

If you view him as a forward, his 203 career points look pretty poor for a guy playing 14.59 minutes. And if you view him as a defenseman, his 14.59 minutes a game look pretty poor, even on a really strong team like the wings. But he had two separate careers that occurred at the same time, one as a forward and one as a defenseman, and neither were poor.

Using information provided to me by Detroit fans, the McKeen's and Sports Forecaster guides, the TOI file that I often refer to, positions listed on hockey-reference.com, Dandenault's game log on NHL.com, the total GP by other Detroit defensemen in each season, and various statistical indicators (shooting percentage, assists per goal, TOI and points per on-ice goal) I was able to piece this together just about as well as anyone could:

Year GP min min/GP Pts F GP F min F min/GP F Pts D GP D min D min/GP D Pts
1996 34 369 10.85 12 34 369 10.85 12 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
1997 65 859 13.22 12 35 400 11.43 7 30 459 15.30 5
1998 68 684 10.06 17 68 684 10.06 17 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
1999 75 1138 15.17 14 21 227 10.81 6 54 911 16.87 8
2000 81 986 12.17 18 68 770 11.32 15 13 216 16.62 3
2001 73 1175 16.10 25 17 197 11.59 7 56 978 17.46 18
2002 81 1354 16.72 20 15 196 13.07 4 66 1158 17.55 16
2003 74 1415 19.12 19 0 0 #DIV/0! 0 74 1415 19.12 19
2004 65 896 13.78 12 25 238 9.52 6 40 658 16.45 6
2006 82 1528 18.63 20 0 0 #DIV/0! 0 82 1528 18.63 20
2007 68 1096 16.12 8 10 103 10.30 2 58 993 17.12 6
2008 61 679 11.13 14 61 679 11.13 14 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
2009 41 482 11.76 12 37 409 11.05 11 4 73 18.25 1
Career 868 12661 14.59 203 391 4272 10.93 101 477 8389 17.59 102

So Dandenault played 391 games as a 10.93 minute RW, scoring 101 points (21 per 82 games) and 477 games as a 17.59 minute defenseman, scoring 102 points (18 per 82 games).

Either career, taken separately, would not be that impressive. But they happened at the same time, to the same player.

In other words, if Dandenault was never converted to D, it's reasonable to conclude he may have lasted the same 868 games and scored 224 points. If he had that career, he'd be drafted by now, when you consider that he did it mostly buried on the depth chart of the strongest team in the league, on average 16% better than average (that weighted average includes his 4 habs years, the Wings were closer to 128% while he was there). Dynasty role players are popular here, and with fairly good reason.

On the other hand, if he played his whole 868-game career as a 17.59 minute D-man, scoring 186 points, that is approximately Ken Klee territory, and Klee is one of the better defensemen to escape mention in these threads. Klee played just slightly more games, and slightly more per game, but only for average teams. Dandenault's record as a defenseman, if extrapolated over 868 games, should be considered better, which would make him worthy of selection exclusively as a defenseman right around the A draft or now. (please note that the only reason I consider 17.59 minutes a game a decent average is because of the team he was on. 17.59 minutes on average teams is NOT good). Don't forget that he's played 83 playoff games and contributed to three Stanley Cups.

The fact that he seamlessly interweaved these two careers into one is a positive for Dandenault, not a negative. But the impact it makes on his blended career numbers, if you ignore the context, appears negative, and that's why he hasn't been drafted to be a serviceable AAA/AA/A spare player. He should have been.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Almanac 1996-97
if you like high speed skating, mad dashes for the net, and a rocket launcher for a shot, then Dandenault is your type of player... in part time duty, he played very well for Scotty Bowman, who has never been easily impressed... Dandenault's weakness is the Red Wings' strength. Though he has all the makings of a solid NHL talent, he has to play his way past several established veterans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 1996-97
enthusiastic RW, whose feet are almost as swift as they are huge, hung around the team for the whole season... watched his fair share of games from the press box... Bowman likes him because he plays in both ends of the rink...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 1997-98
entering this season, the sophomore forward had never played as much as a shift on defense. After a few weeks, he was moved back to the blueline and turned into a sizaeable rearguard with rushing ability. The kid has highs and lows, being tentative for long streaks after bad mistakes. Bowlam let the experiment last for a few months until he acquired Larry Murphy. Expect him to dress for every gae and to roam up and down the right wing when he gets the call.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 1999-2000
one of the brightest lights during a playoff run gone awry was the emergence of Dandenault as a regular. has adapted well to the blueline and should improve at his new position. On a scale of 1-10, Dandenault's speed is a 15. He has also quickly learned to play his position and rarely looks like an ex-forward out there...Scotty Bowman has hit a home run with this pet project.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2000-2001
one of the league's fastest skaters and the wings' most versatile player... drafted as a RW, now spends most of his time on the blueline. Either way, he needs to make an impact soon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2001-02
after several seasons of bouncing back and forth between forward and defense, Dandenault appears to have settled into a role as a top-four blueliner in Detroit. The six-year pro has exceptional speed for a blueliner and is learning the intricacies of the position with the support of veteran talent on the roster... by the end of the season, he'd become one of Detroit's top four blueliners. Scotty Bowman's gamble has apparently paid off.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2002-03
The speedster's days as a forward may be a thing of the past. One of the legacies Scotty Bowman leaves behind is his converson of Dandenault to the blueline. He is maturing into a solid, all-around defender.
Quote:
Originally Posted by McKeen's 2002-03
versatile ex-winger spent the entire year on the blueline and played his best hockey during the playoffs, thriving on a solid third pairing with Steve Duchesne... an explosive skater and good outlet passer, he plays tough, responsible defense and has steadily learned how to exploit his exhilarating speed and acceleration in all three zones. Has continued to mature into a solid, two-way player.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2003-04
has made a permanent transition to the blueline.
Quote:
Originally Posted by McKeen's 2005-06
had a trying 03-04 season that saw him shunted to forward for a while though he ended the campaign as a steady defenseman after returning from a broken foot... speedy, hardworking swingman isn't much of a physical deterrent but is a persistent and responsible defender with great recovery powers thanks to his world-class skating... brings coveted speed and versatility.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2006-07
earned mixed reviews in his first season in Montreal. brought along terrific speed and loads of postseason experience. While he didn't handle the heavy workload very well, he was able to finish 3rd in +/-.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2007-08
struggled last season and even saw action as a 4th liner down the stretch. Mobility has never been an issue, though he doesn't make the most of his gifts in the offensive zone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sports Forecaster 2008-09
after spending most of his first two seasons in Montreal playing defense, Dandenault switched to energy line winger last year. He was in and out of the lineup in the second half, future with the club is in doubt.

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01-20-2012, 01:08 AM
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Lindy Ruff, LW/D



Ruff is another player whose career path can be described in almost the exact same way that Dandenault's was, although they were very different players. I could almost use the exact same wording:

Ruff was hockey's 2nd last true swingman, able to switch seamlessly from forward to defense multiple times, on a regular basis throughout his career. He played 12 seasons, and in just two of them he was exclusively a D-man, and in just four he was exclusively a forward. The other six were very mixed.

Using TOI estimates from 1980-1991, I can tell you Ruff played 691 NHL games and 10,299 minutes for a total of 15.82 minutes a game.

If you view him as a forward, his 300 career points look pretty poor for a guy playing 15.82 minutes. And if you view him as a defenseman, his 15.82 minutes a game look pretty poor, even on a strong team like the Sabres. (who were 8% better than average throughout his career) But he had two separate careers that occurred at the same time, one as a forward and one as a defenseman, and neither were poor.

With Iain Fyffe's help, using information provided to me by Buffalo fans, the TOI file that I often refer to, positions listed on hockey-reference.com, the total GP by other Buffalo defensemen in each season, and various statistical indicators (shooting percentage, assists per goal, TOI and points per on-ice goal) I was able to piece this together just about as well as anyone could:

Year GP min min/GP Pts F GP F min F min/GP F Pts D GP D min D min/GP D Pts
1980 63 965 15.32 19 0 0 #DIV/0! 0 63 965 15.32 19
1981 65 941 14.48 26 35 420 12.00 18 30 521 17.38 8
1982 79 1458 18.45 48 30 420 14.00 25 49 1038 21.18 23
1983 60 858 14.31 29 30 330 11.00 20 30 528 17.61 9
1984 58 961 16.58 45 58 961 16.57 45 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
1985 39 605 15.52 24 39 605 15.51 24 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
1986 54 841 15.57 32 54 841 15.57 32 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
1987 50 850 17.00 20 15 210 14.00 8 35 640 18.29 12
1988 77 1325 17.20 25 0 0 #DIV/0! 0 77 1325 17.20 25
1989 76 1345 17.70 22 10 120 12.00 6 66 1225 18.56 16
1990 56 687 12.27 9 48 540 11.25 8 8 147 18.42 1
1991 14 92 6.55 1 14 92 6.57 1 0 0 #DIV/0! 0
Career 691 10928.797 15.82 300 333 4539 13.63 187 358 6389 17.85 113

So Ruff played 333 games as a 13.63 minute LW, scoring 187 points (45 per 80 games) and 358 games as a 17.85 minute defenseman, scoring 113 points (25 per 82 games).

Either career, taken separately, would not be that impressive. But they happened at the same time, to the same player.

In other words, if Ruff was never converted to LW, it's reasonable to conclude he may have lasted the same 691 games and scored 218 points as an 18-minute D-man. If he had that career, he'd be likely drafted by now, when you consider that he did it mostly in the #4-6 slot on one of the strongest teams in the league, on average 8% better than average. Imagine a 691-game, 18 minute, 218-point scoring defenseman from the 80s who was big and tough. Would you have picked him by now? Of course you would have!

On the other hand, if he played his whole 691-game career as a 13.63 minute LW, scoring 388 points, while being big, tough, and ready to brawl, that would make him a poor man's Curt Fraser, Randy Burridge, Bill Flett, or a better Sergio Momesso or Garry Howatt. Imagine a 691-game, 14 minute, 388-point scoring LW from the 80s who was big and tough. Would you have picked him by now? Of course you would have!

The fact that he seamlessly interweaved these two careers into one is a positive for Ruff, not a negative. But the impact it makes on his blended career numbers, if you ignore the context, appears negative, and that's why he hasn't been drafted to be a serviceable AAA/AA/A spare player. He should have been.

Ruff was 6'2", 201 lbs, and fought 108 times in the NHL. The results of 43 of these fights are documented, and his record is listed as 8-22-13, so... at least he was willing! Here are some quotes from those who remember him as a fighter at www.dropyourgloves.com:

Quote:
Belongs in the Jim Peplinski, Wally Weir category of players: not the greatest fighter, but tough and gutsy and a good teammate... Rarely shied away from the top fighters, which perhaps he should have, considering the results... was entertaining fighter...
Quote:
Originally Posted by sabresalumni.com
Lindy Ruff had a reputation as a rough, tough defenseman while skating for the Lethbridge Broncos of the WCJHL from 1977 to 1979. He appeared headed for draft-day greatness until he broke his thighbone during his final year of junior. As such, many clubs backed off from the idea of picking up the big rearguard, classifying him as an unknown commodity.

The Buffalo Sabres, however, chose defenseman Mike Ramsey in the first round and then took what they considered to be a chance on Ruff in the next round. And their risk paid dividends when, at the start of the 1979-80 campaign, Sabre defenders Jerry Korab and Jim Schoenfeld went down with injuries. Ruff jumped onto the Sabres' blueline as an underager and made such an impression that he earned himself a permanent NHL job for the next 12 seasons.

The team's management was immediately impressed with Ruff's leadership qualities and his willingness to step his game up, particularly on a physical level when the club wasn't performing well. In 1983-84, he was moved up to play three seasons of left wing. After a time, he couldn't decide which position he liked best, the blueline or a forward line. Ultimately he claims to have enjoyed the variety of both worlds.

Near the end of Ruff's tenure with the Sabres, he was appointed the team's captain. He continued his strong leadership and solid defensive play until his trade to the New York Rangers in 1989. With the Rangers, Ruff patrolled the blueline until age and injuries slowed him down. In 1991-92, he got his first and final ticket to the minors where he skated for the Rochester Americans of the AHL and the San Diego Gulls of the IHL where he retired in 1993.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1986-87
Ruff is an average skater, pretty much just cruising up and down the ice, though he does get a little jump into his first couple of strides. He is not a good puckhandler and really has no vision of the ice and when he goes into a corner he has not anticipated what he will do with the puck if he wins it. Ruff will never blow you away with his shot and is unlikely to score from any place other than the edge of the crease. He picks up rebounds and shovels them home and is also good for a deflection or two.

Lindy is a conscientious backchecker, very concerned with his defensive play and disciplined enough to stay on his wing and not create any openings by leaving the zone too soon. He is aided in the defensive zone by his experience as a defenseman and understands what angles are all about so as to keep his man from the puck.

The physical game - Ruff is. He's big and strong and wills tand in the crease and dare a defenseman to move him. Ruff will bang around effectively in the corners, hitting hard enough and often enough to jar the puck loose from opposing defensemen. He is aggressive and will take pokes at people if need be, as he is unafraid to fight. Ruff also applies himself physically in the defensive zone, where he will rub out an opposing winger along the boards.

He's a good leader, showing the way by example and doing whatever is necessary on the ice. Ruff is also versatile and his ability to play defense gives the sabres a little added flexibility with the lineup.

Lindr Ruff lives up to his name. He is a big, rough, tough type of player.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1989-90
10 tough seasons and their attendant injuries have slowed Ruff down... if he wins the puck during a foray into the corner, the bet Ruff will do with it is a blind pass to the slot... is aggressive and will take pokes at people when he has to stand up for the team... injury record is a direct result of his play, rather than an indication of any fragility on his part. Ruff counters the injury problem by staying in great condition... a great team player, and he knows when it's necessary to assume leadership in the locker room or on the ice so as to produce the best effect for the club... Ruff also helps himself stay around through his versatility, his ability to play either forward or defense as required... Hard work is all he knows.

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01-20-2012, 05:15 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
Dean McAmmond, LW/C



McAmmond is a classic "tweener", a poor-man's Brendan Morrison or Daymond Langkow from an ATD perspective. A slightly lesser version of Marty McInnis. He was pretty good offensively, but not great. He was also pretty decent defensively, but not great. He had the willingness to get his nose dirty but was too small to be very effective physically. He had the speed and forechecking ability to be a solid pest but he didn't have the mentality for it. He was just a solid, honest player for a good long time. So it takes this long in the drafting process before we get to the point where we can find a definite spot for him.

McAmmond was a 14.59 minute per game forward for a nice long period of 996 games over 17 seasons. In his 1996-2006 prime, he typically occupied the #6 spot on his team for ice time among forwards. McAmmond was a natural center who played there for his first few NHL seasons before moving to LW on a mostly permanent basis through 2003. From 2004-2010 he was about half wing and half center, taking between 300 and 800 faceoffs a year, usually 3rd-6th on his team in faceoffs. His lack of proficiency in faceoffs (usually around 44%) was probably a big reason why he didn't stick as a permanent center.

McAmmond's 448 points are the most among available players, by a 45-point margin. He didn't exactly get there pretty though. He played 996 games to get there, 5th-most among availables, and two of the players ahead of him are being picked here (not that being useful enough to play 996 NHL games is a bad thing, at all) There is no real standout offensive season on his resume: Two seasons with 50-51 points, and nine seasons with 27-37 points. However, McAmmond didn't get a lot of PP time and was a consistently decent ES scorer. His 329 career ES points are 32 more than any other available player has. (he had 10 seasons with 20-33 ESP)

Also, although his teams had a 0.92 GF:GA ratio throughout his career, his own ratio was an impressive 1.08.

McAmmond was not a true standout in any one area but his overall package is impossible to ignore.
McAmmond is one of those players who would have favoured greatly by post-lockout systems where speed is the most important commodity. Perfect fit for the fast skating Oilers in the late 90s where he used to skate with Marchant iirc.

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01-30-2012, 10:15 PM
  #119
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Larry Jeffrey, LW



Jeffrey was a tough grinder who survived a pretty decent length of time in the exclusive O6 NHL. He finished with 368 games and 38 more in the playoffs, which was 247 and 31 as of expansion. Those totals are among the leaders for available players, but they are not mind blowing, either. The reason is injuries. Jeffrey was really balls to the wall, and this cost him games. In the 1962-1967 seasons, he played 247 NHL games and 120 in the minors, meaning he missed approximately 113 scheduled games with a variety of injuries. He retired in 1969, probably with a lot more to give, if not for his battered body (the 1969 car accident was the icing on the cake)

Jeffrey was a "good team" role player, not just some scrub sticking with a bad team. In the 6 seasons in which he played at least 40 games, his teams had a win% of .550, .507, .621, .536, .608 and .589. He went to three Stanley Cup finals, losing with Detroit in the first two, and winning with the Leafs in 1967.

Jeffrey had two decent 28-point seasons at the NHL level. But he was not usually an offensive factor. With 107 points in 137 career minor league games, Jeffrey did have some offensive upside but the league was in a state where a second-rate player like him would never get the chance to show his stuff.

It's worth noting that after expansion, Jeffrey was on the Rangers, a very strong team in the "old" division, much more impressive than hanging on with the North Stars or Seals.


Quote:
Larry Jeffrey was a solid two-way left winger who played nearly 400 NHL games despite chronic knee woes. His ability to soldier on was remarkable considering the relatively primitive sports injury treatments that were available forty years ago.
The native of Goderich, Ontario played three seasons with the OHA's Hamilton Red Wings. It was in junior that he suffered a severe charley horse that prevented him from bending his leg properly. He kept playing and ended up putting tremendous strain on his knee ligaments and joints in the ensuing years.

In 1961-62, he debuted with the Detroit Red Wings and looked fairly solid with eight points in 18 matches. He spent the bulk of the season with the WHL's Edmonton Flyers where he averaged nearly a point per game. He played 53 and 58 games for Detroit over the next two seasons. The highlight of his career in Motown was scoring seven points when the team reached the final in 1964.

Jeffrey was sent to Toronto in May 1965 in the same deal that involved Marcel Pronovost and Andy Bathgate. In 1966-67, he played 56 games for Toronto in the regular season then played six in the playoffs before getting hurt. The Maple Leafs won the Stanley Cup that year and, fittingly, Jeffrey was on crutches for the team picture when they were presented their prize.

By the start of the 1967-68 season, Jeffrey was with the New York Rangers. Over the next two years he played his last 122 NHL games. He retired after suffering another injury at the training camp of the AHL's Cleveland Barons in 1970.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
Larry Jeffrey was a hard-nosed, defense- first left winger throughout the 1960s with Detroit, Toronto and NY Rangers. However he rarely came close to playing a full NHL season due to a series of knee injuries that first started in junior hockey.

While playing junior hockey with the Red Wings affiliate in Hamilton, Jeffrey suffered a severe charley horse that prevented him from even bending the joint.

"It just kept causing me problems every year after that. Probably because in those days they didn't have the equipment to look after severe injuries," suggested Jeffrey. "They had a shower and a hose and that was your whirlpool-type thing. You held the hose to cause stimulation to the charley horse."

Later, adhesions developed on his leg. The Wings brought Jeffrey to Detroit to have them primitively broken.

"One doctor got my shoulder and held me, the other got on my leg and just literally grabbed it and bent it with his weight. They gave me a mild sedative. I remember everything about it. When he gave my knee the pressure, it was just like breaking bones. It was very painful. I heard the cracking. I thought they broke my leg rather than the adhesions. I thought it was a rather cruel way of doing it."

When Jeffrey turned professional, he was shocked that the NHL teams had very little in the way of top sports medicine facilities. Instead he was tested for several different braces for his leg.

"I really look back now and I was like a guinea pig, trying out all these different braces, sending me to hospitals, having the knee drained and cortisone put in to go out and play that night."

Over the years Jeffrey would go under the knife 9 times, and his knee continued to give him problems throughout his life. He has no bad feelings for the game or the NHL though.

"I'm disappointed they didn't look after my knee properly, but I have no hard feelings. I have a lot of good memories of playing in the National Hockey League," he said. Most notably several winning seasons in Detroit and being part of Toronto's 1967 Stanley Cup winning team.

Ironically, Jeffrey came closest to playing a full season in his last year in the NHL. He appeared in 75 games in 1968-69, but clearly his best days were behind him. He had just one goal and 6 assists.

Jeffrey was released by the Rangers but the Cleveland Barons gave him a chance in the 1969-70 training camp. However the hard luck Jeffrey suffered another blow to the knee, forcing him to retire.

Larry Jeffrey returned to his 127 acre farm near his hometown of Goderich, Ontario upon the completion of his hockey career. There he raised cattle and a few racing horses. At different times he owned and operated a concession stand and a successful ad specialties business. He also did some scouting for NHL Central Scouting.


Last edited by seventieslord: 02-03-2012 at 10:09 AM.
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01-30-2012, 10:16 PM
  #120
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Scott Thornton, C/LW





There is a lot to like about Thornton. First of all, at 6'3", 220 lbs, he was huge. He lasted a really long time in the NHL, playing 12.63 minutes per game. He had 285 career points, so he was nothing special offensively, although he did explode for 26 goals in 2002. Keep in mind that he peaked in the dead puck era and received no PP time, so his offense was decent considering. He was a great role player, working the corners and playing a very tough physical game.

Based on faceoff stats, Thornton approximately split time in his career between C and LW, playing mostly center until 1998 and mostly LW after that. On faceoffs he averaged about 52% so he did well. He was a willing fighter, with 107 career bouts and a recorded record of 33-21-21 (.580)

Thornton spent some time as a role player on some great teams (getting to round 2 five times) but also on some terrible ones (missing the playoffs six times)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
One player I watched come from junior hockey and into the NHL was Scott Thornton. The Toronto Maple Leafs drafted the Belleville Bulls hulking center 3rd overall in 1989.

The reason? At about that time I had a huge man-crush on Calgary's Joel Otto. A physically dominant, extraordinary defensive center with incredible size and great faceoff ability. Every team wanted Otto. And, I believed, Toronto had drafted the next one when the draft Thornton ahead Stu Barnes and Bill Guerin.

Thornton went on to become a bit of a poor-man's Otto rather than the next dominant defender. He was outstanding on faceoffs. He played with a different variety of toughness - he was never chippy or cheap. He was a real solid player, though prone to both injuries and bad penalties.

Though he had decent skating ability - strong and balanced - he was not fast. He was smart positionally on the defensive side. Offensively he never really was a threat, except for one season in San Jose where he played a lot of left wing alongside his superstar cousin, Joe Thornton. Many people would expect more offensive production from a 3rd overall draft pick - one who was traded as a key part of the trade to Edmonton for Grant Fuhr. But I certainly would not consider him a disappointment.

In fact, even though he was a favorite of mine, even I was actually quite surprised to realize he survived parts of 17 NHL season, totalling nearly 1000 regular season games. He spent a long time in obscurity on 4th lines in Toronto, Edmonton, Montreal, Dallas, San Jose and Los Angeles. It all added up to a very decent National Hockey League career.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1999
Thornton's best asset is his faceoff ability. He is outstanding on draws, especially in the defensive zone, and matches up against just about any centre in the league when it comes to winning puck battles. If Thornton doesn't win a draw outright, he uses his musle to tie up the opponent and work the puck to a teammate. he uses his toughness to get rid of a defender, then has good hands when he works in tight to get his scoring chances. Thornton is by no means a sniper, and even though he has concentrated more on the defensive aspects of the game, he is able to convert a scoring chance when the opportunity presents itself... Thornton is a good skater, not overly fast, but no plodder. He is strong and balanced on his feet and hard to knock off the puck. He is alert positionally. If one of his defensemen goes deep in on the attack, Thornton will be the forward back covering for him.


Thornton is a big, solid, defensive centre, a young Joe Otto but with better mobility. Tough without being chippy or taking bad penalrites, he can play against just about any big number one centre in the league. Thornton will never be a major point producer, but he will fill a steady checking role for the team in many seasons to come. Thornton is the kind of reliable, defensive forward any team could use for a serious Stanley Cup run. Because he never delivered on his offensive promise, he may be viewed as a failure, but he delivers in other areas.

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01-30-2012, 10:16 PM
  #121
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Tie Domi, RW



Domi should be selected by now if for no other reason than everyone in the hockey world knows who he is. Playing as a key role player in the biggest market in the league for so long makes him a high profile player in history. On www.dropyourgloves.com, Domi has more "loves" than anyone I can see aside from Probert, and he has more "hates" than anyone but Brashear, Bertuzzi, Avery and Jarkko Ruutu. But to be fair, there is a lot more to like about Domi than just notoreity:

- He got into 1020 NHL games, that alone is pretty impressive
- He was useful enough to play 9.74 minutes per game for that long. Players who exist solely to fight typically top out around 7 minutes a game.
- He contributed to successful teams that went far, getting into 98 playoff games
- He was an excellent agitator who often drew penalties or took better players to the box with him (not just from fighting)
- He actually had well above average NHL speed
- With 333 career NHL fights, he is the all-time leader.
- Despite being 4 inches smaller than his average opponent in his career, his fight record is an impressive 166-61-74 (.674)

Domi is better than most one-dimensional goons selected to this point (Kocur, Brashear and Hunter come to mind) and his track record as a useful player is much more comparable to guys like Chris Nilan and Kevin McClelland.


Domi was a little crazy. He is remembered as a guy who could hurt his team with a penalty or suspension and while that is true, it is overblown. People remember the Samuelsson and Niedermayer incidents (and the late season Ottawa brawl of 2003) and think his whole career was like that. It wasn't. He was a good team guy.

Domi's career highlight was probably in game 6 of the Leafs' 2002 series against Ottawa in round 2. The Sens were riding the high of Daniel Alfredsson's borderline hit and ensuing goal, that led to a 3-2 series lead heading back into Ottawa. Two early goals by the Sens and the crowd was deafening. It was looking bleak, until Domi, digging for the puck in the corner with Ricard Persson, took a slight cross check in the back from the latter. I have no doubt this little tank could have stayed on his feet following this innocuous routine shove, but he instead biffed hard into the boards face first, drawing blood and earning the Leafs a 5-minute powerplay, during which they scored twice. The Leafs scored seven of the next eight goals in the series, including two on that major penalty, putting a stop to Ottawa's seemingly runaway momentum. Without Domi's selflessness and sacrifice on that play, I have no doubt that series is over in 6 games.

See:
http://offwing.com/2002/05/thanks-fo...ricard-persson
http://www.downgoesbrown.com/2009/12...of-decade.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1997-98
"Finesse"? Should that be discussed in context with this rock-hard (some might say rock-headed) right winger? Yes, because Domi played his best hockey last season.


Domi has some skills that elevate him above the level of a mere goon. He is a pretty nifty skater, and in a role as a 3rd-line checker will often be in quickly on the opposing goalie behind the net, trying to force a bad pass or a turnover. He barrels in on defensemen too (the obstruction crackdown is perfect for forecheckers like Domi). When he gets the puck, he has the presence of mind to do something useful. Ban-bang reaction plays, whether shots or passes, are his strong suit. He should't think too much. Domi has a short-range shot. He'll wallow into the activity around the crease. He is surprisingly good with his feet, and if his stick is tied up or dropped he will attempt to kick the puck to a teammate.

Short but burly, Domi is one of the most eager fighters in the NHL. He talks trash and builds up his upcoming bouts as if he were Don King, which doesn't exactly endear him to the NHL hierarchy... Domi can play with controlled aggression, but the knowledge that he can snap at any moment makes opponents leery of him, and he earns some timeand space. His key role, though, is to make his skilled teammates braver.

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01-30-2012, 10:17 PM
  #122
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Harry Smith, D



Smith is the furthest on the left.

Is he just a guy who topped out at lower levels and had some good international moments? Or did he choose a different path that just didn't include the NHL? Tough to say. He was a star everywhere he went.

At 6'0" and 200 pounds, Smith was one of the larger players of his time, particularly at the minor league and international levels in which he starred. In a career of recorded games that spans from 1953 to 1971, Smith scored 654 points and 1301 PIM in 614 games.
He played two seasons as a junior in the WCJHL, losing the Memorial Cup final to St. Catherine's with the Edmonton Oil Kings. From there he moved to the WIHL and the Trail Smoke Eaters, with whom he would have a long and storied career. He played the 1958 and 1959 seasons in the Okanagan Senior League with the Kelowna Packers, finishing 3rd and 1st in league defense scoring, and earning a 2nd team all-star nod. He then joined the Vernon Canadians to compete for the Allan Cup and lost to the Whitby Dunlops.

Smith rejoined Trail for the 1960-1963 seasons, competing for the Allan Cup in 1960 and winning in 1963. He was a 1960 1st all-star team member, leading all defensemen in scoring. In 1961 he more than doubled any other defenseman in scoring and came 2nd in scoring on Trail, behind Bobby Kromm. In 1962 he was the 2nd highest-scoring defenseman, despite not playing a full season.

For the 1964 and 1965 seasons, Smith moved to the Nelson Maple Leafs. In 1964 he was the highest-scoring blueliner and 4th in the league in PIMs. In 1965 he was again an Allan Cup finalist.

In 1966, Smith rejoined Trail, was again the league's highest-scoring blueliner twice, (and another time easily the per-game leader) and was a league all-star in 1966. Finally, in the 1969-1971 seasons, Smith started to fade. He played one last season in Switzerland but little is known about that season there.

So far, looks like your average minor/senior star, right? I would agree. But I left out some important information: Between 1961 and 1963, Harry Smith played in 3 World Championships, winning a gold and two silvers, scoring 20 points in 21 games, and was named a tournament all-star every time. His partner on the 1963 all-star squad was Alexander Ragulin. In 1962 the Soviets did not participate so it was a weaker tournament, but in 1961 Smith beat out Ragulin, Sologubov, Tregubov, Sidorenkov, plus Sweden's Bjorn and Stoltz (whom he also beat out in 1962) for this honour.
I always wondered why, when shawnmullin put together his MLD9 team full of players with Trail and BC connections, he didn't include Smith.

Someone please tell me, how is Smith not a potential all-time great? Can you do it without also seriously downplaying players like Ragulin, Sologubov, Tregubov, Sidorenkov, Bjorn and Stoltz? How are they ATD/MLD players and he's available as we approach pick 2000, when, internationally, he achieved the same things they did?

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01-30-2012, 10:18 PM
  #123
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Pat Price, D



Price was a bit of a headcase, but he was an effective defenseman, particularly with the puck and with his fists. He played a role in helping to build the Islander and Oiler dynasties, then left before they won anything. And he burned bridges on the way out of New York, too. Which is part of why this 6'2", 200 pound, 261 point, twice top-10 in PIM, 11-playoffs-in-14-seasons defenseman is still available.

Price averaged 19.09 minutes a game in his career. That's pretty good for a player available this late, though not among the very highest. And he was used relatively little on special teams: 17% on the PP and 29% on the PK. There are more relied-upon defensemen out there. But not necessarily guys who were more relied-upon by better teams. Price played 74 playoff games and was a physical presence in every one of them. Price fills a niche as a tough guy on the blueline in favour of some better overall players, but at the same time he's no plug, he can play. Price is the 2nd all-time leading scorer among available defensemen. (#1 and #3 will also be drafted here)

He filled a role as a #5 defenseman in New York while they found their way to dynasty status, but left on bad terms. When he went to Edmonton he really started to blossom, and was their #2 D-man in 1980 and #3 in 1981 for much of the season.
In Pittsburgh something snapped. They must have asked him to ramp up the physical game, because his PIMs skyrocketed, and so did his fights. In his time in Pittsburgh, Price's fights-per-game average was over twice as high as it was in the remainder of his career. He piled up 459 PIMs in 128 games there, serving as a #4 blueliner and putting up 38 points one year despite getting very little PP time. He served as a #2-5 with Quebec before fading away over the next two seasons.

Price finished his career with 115 NHL fights.

Career TOI finishes on team: 5, 5, 6, 2, 3, 4, 4, 3, 5, 5, 6, spent on very strong teams (13% better than average)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1976
played one season with Vancouver, ran into conflicts with his coach, was put on waivers by mutual agreement... smashed up a Ferrari only a couple of months after receiving it as a bonus... showed up at training camp last year in platform shoes, fell off them and missed several games with twisted ankle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1980
world of potential yet to be realized... has displayed flashes of brilliance...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1981
finally showed signs of ripening potential... credits daily playing time with his improvement... spunky guy who likes to be center of attention... has marvelous offensive skills and can be strong checker... must learn to blend the two to be more effective...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1983
Joins Baxter as the other half of the Pens' "mean team" defense.... "Pat made big improvements in his overall play last season," says Pittsburgh assistant coach Mike Corrigan... "I finally feel I've got my game together and am with a team that aprpeciates what I can do," says Price... plays a defensive style of game and enjoys bodychecking, but has scoring ability too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
Pat Price was "Mr. Everything" as a junior star, but things changed drastically when he became a pro and the easy money flowed.

Pat played in four seasons with the Saskatoon Blades in the juniors. He was big (6´2"), brash, fast and strong. In his first junior season, he was named the rookie-of-the-year, even though he was just 14 years old. His final season, he won the team scoring title, even though he was a defenseman. He carried the Blades to the Memorial Cup playoffs, was voted as best defenseman in the league and was nominated Athlete-of-the-Year in Saskatoon. He was according to some scouts, the best junior hockey player in the world.
The WHA drafted Price as an underaged junior in 1974. He signed a lucrative contract with the Vancouver Blazers of the WHA worth $1.3 million over five years, which at that time was the biggest rookie contract in professional hockey. That summer (1974), he captained a team of Western Canada junior All-Stars against Team Canada (WHA), and those who saw him said that he was often the best defenseman on either side. He was then chosen to play with team Canada against the Soviets, to represent his country, even though he had never played played one minute of professional hockey.

Pat bought himself a Ferrari and was driving so recklessly that GM Joe Crozier got a call from the local police that Price was risking his life and limb as well as others. Pat was ticketed more than once for speeding over 100 miles per hour. Pat eventually crashed the car but didn't sustain any injuries.

He then sprained his ankle while doing "tricks" with his platform shoes. It happened while he was playing for Team Canada. When the WHA season started he was in pretty bad shape. Crozier wasn't happy about the situation:

"The kid wouldn't get in shape. He didn't give a damn. He'd fool around, fool around, all the time. He had his money and I guess he figured nothing else mattered, look, the kid was a nice enough kid, but he had no character - his heart was the size of a pea."

Pat didn't get along with Crozier at all. Once, after a loss, Pat was talking to some kids outside the dressing room, laughing and smiling. Crozier didn't like that at all, yelling, "Price, if I see you smiling again after we've lost a game, I'll wipe that smile of your face so fast you won't know what hit you."

Another time Crozier ridiculed Pat in front of his teammates, shouting "You can't play defense, you can't play offense, you're no good, just what the hell can you do?"

Price was on the verge of quitting hockey. Even his father admitted that his son maybe had it too easy in life. He always excelled in anything he tried, he never had a real challenge, so when there was a challenge he just couldn't accept one. Pat however pulled himself together and continued with hockey. The Blazers, on the other hand, had had enough. He was released from his contract, although it was as much as a cost-cutting move as anything.

Price jumped over to the NHL and the NY Islanders who drafted him 11th overall in the 1975 NHL draft. He signed a five year contract, at a greatly reduced from his previous contract at $500,000. Pat attended the Islanders training camp but didn't make the team and was send down to Forth Worth (CHL).

The year down in minors did him good and Pat returned for the next season in much better shape and with a much better self confidence. He had also matured a lot and became a steady defenseman for many years to come.

He continued his NHL career playing for Edmonton, Pittsburgh, Quebec, NY Rangers and Minnesota. His best season point wise came in 1981-82 for Pittsburgh where he got 38 points (6 goals, 32 assists). He also picked up a whopping 322 penalty minutes.

His last season in the NHL came during the 1987-88 season when he as a 33-year old played 14 games for the Minnesota North Stars. Pat played a total of 726 regular season games, picking up 43 goals and 261 points. He also had 12 points in 74 playoff games.

The fast money almost cost him his hockey career but he eventually matured and became a regular blueliner in the NHL for 13 seasons. Still, given his junior hype, he remains an all time draft bust.

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01-30-2012, 10:18 PM
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Clint Malarchuk, G


When people think of Malarchuk, they think of the skate in the throat incident that nearly took his life. But for a while, (particularly the 1986-1989 seasons) Malarchuk was a very above-average goalie.
- 338 games, 5 sv% points above average in career
- in the 1986-1989 seasons, Malarchuk finished 4th, 10th, 12th, 12th in minutes
- was 3rd in 1986 sv% and above average in the other three seasons
- averaged 7 sv% points over average during this time, and still 2 points over in his "off peak years".
- Finished 4th in Vezina and all-star voting in 1986
- Finished 4th in All-star and 10th in Vezina voting in 1988

Quebec Goalies, 1984-1987:
Malarchuk: 123 GP, .885
Rest: 223 GP, .876

Washington Goalies, 1988-1989:
Malarchuk: 96 GP, .881
Rest: 80 GP, .894

Buffalo Goalies, 1989-1992:
Malarchuk: 102 GP, .894
Rest: 262 GP, .885

Malarchuk's playoff resume was awful, though. He only played 13 games worth of minutes, but in those games, he averaged 36 sv% points below the league average. Keep in mind this is an awfully small sample size. Dan Cloutier averaged 47 sv% points below average, over double the games!

And that is the end of my extensive goalie search. I was able to find just three who posted above average save percentages on a regular basis while playing decent minutes, enjoyed decently long careers and earned some norris/all-star recognition. I can't imagine who else I would even select from the NHL. (Greg Millen, the runaway leader in available goalie GP, would be one option, but he had just three good seasons - 1984, 1986, 1989 - and was comfortably below average the rest of his career, just not below average enough to drop him out of the league or even to backup status for very long)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
In two seasons with the Nords he impressed the NHL enough to be named as Grant Fuhr's backup in Rendez-Vous '87 as the NHL All Stars competed in a 2 game series against the Soviet Red Army team.

The Nordiques were in a transitional phase in 1989 and made a big trade involving their goaltender. Malarchuk was then moved to Washington with Dale Hunter for Gaetan Duchesne, Alan Haworth and a 1st round pick (who turned out to be Joe Sakic). The deal is one of the most famous deals in hockey, and is often considered to be the downward turning point of the fate of the Quebec Nordiques.

In two seasons in the nation's capital Malarchuk had his ups and downs. While he shared the league lead in shutouts in 1987-88, he lost his starting goalies job by the end of 1988-89. The scrappy goalie was trade to Buffalo with Grant Ledyard and a draft pick (Brian Holzinger) for Calle Johansson and a draft choice (which turned out to be goaltender Byron Dafoe).

Malarchuk enjoyed three very solid seasons in Buffalo. He played primarily a mentor and backup role to a young Darren Puppa.

Unfortunately Malarchuk is best remembered for one of the most horrific injuries in all of hockey. Tragedy first struck on March 22, 1989 when his jugular vein was cut by a skate. A goal mouth collision involving St. Louis Blues winger Steve Tuttle and Buffalo defenseman Uwe Krupp saw Tuttle's skate slice Malarchuk's neck. Malarchuk clutched at his bloody neck as doctors were rushed on to the ice to save his life. As it turned out he spent only one night in the hospital and competed in the NHL only a couple of weeks later. But it could have been so much worse - perhaps even fatal.

Despite his solid play Malarchuk found himself out of the NHL by 1992. One of the major reasons for his disappearance was his battle with some personal demons. The Grande Prairie Alberta native was diagnosed with Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder. His life became consumed with supposedly trivial worries which wouldn't allow him to function normally, never mind play hockey effectively. After much work with top doctors, proper medication was found and he is now over that battle too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1987
came to 1985 training camp as the 4th goalie on the Nordiques' depth chart, proceeded to earn role as team's top goalie... played well in playoffs despite sweep by Hartford... calmer now than in his earlier stint... does less wandering from the crease and more patient in waiting for shooter to make his move...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1990-91
Malarchuk is a good angle goaltender, but he is strong on the reflex side as well. He has very fast hands and feet and his improved angle play has helped him to subdue his stickside weakness, though he is still weak there. Top of the net glove shots will elude him, and he generally foes not control pucks he stops with his glove.. on the whole he does not control any rebounds well, and that is where his reflexes serve him best... Clint is a good skater and likes to leave the net to handle the puck, but is not a great puckhandler... his fast hands and feet make him very effective in scrambles near the net... mentally tough and will fight you for the next goal after giving up a bad one - most of the time. He does have a tendency to give up goals in bunches, but is able to pull himself together... Clint has good anticipation and concentration, another reason why he is so effective around the net.... just getting back in the barrel after his neck injury indicates great courage...

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01-30-2012, 10:19 PM
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Eddie Johnston, Coach



Johnston coached a very respectable 596 NHL games, and had a win% of .513. He also coached a respectable 53 playoff games, with a 25-28 record, both GP and Wins marks are likely highs among available coaches. His relative playoff success makes him a nice match with Andy Murray, whom playoff success eluded.

Johnston earned a 4th in 1995 Adams voting, for keeping the team competitive in the 1995 season while Mario Lemieux rested his aching body (they were 3rd overall)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lcshockey.com
The Pittsburgh Penguins relieved Johnston of his head coaching duties on Monday, March 3, with the club having lost four straight games and eight of its last nine. The Penguins, who were once living the good life at the top of the Northeast Division, have now fallen nine points behind Buffalo for the division lead and are showing no signs of stopping their fall from grace. GM Craig Patrick will take over behind the bench for the remainder of the season. It will be Patrick's second tour of duty as Pittsburgh's coach. When he first came to the Penguins in 1989-90, Patrick handled the roles of both coach and GM for the remainder of the season while he became familiar with the personnel. There has been no talk of bringing in someone from the outside to fill the job. That is a decision that will be made during the off-season.

Johnston, 61, originally coached the Penguins from 1980-1983, before then becoming the club's GM through 1988. After spending one more year as an assistant GM in Pittsburgh, Johnston moved on to become the Vice President and GM of the Hartford Whalers from 1989-1992. Once cut loose from the Whale, EJ returned to coach the Penguins at the start of the 1993-94 season. He had an overall record of 153-98-25 during his second stint with the club and improved in the playoffs after each season, losing in seven games to the Florida Panthers during last year's playoffs.

The announcement came as a total shock. There were no rumors of an impending move and Johnston has always been a popular coach with the players, especially Mario Lemieux. Johnston and Patrick are also very close friends, so the decision to make a change was one of the hardest in the GM's career.

...One of the nicest guys in the game of hockey, Johnston was often criticized for being just that. He was perceived by many to be too much of a player's coach, not willing or able to drop the hammer on the boys when things went sour.... However, blaming EJ for the Penguins' current struggles is absolutely ridiculous. This move isn't really a result of anything EJ did or didn't do.... And really, injuries are what cost EJ his job. If Lemieux, Francis, and Jagr were all healthy, they'd still be dominating with ease and the team would still be winning hockey games. ...The Johnston firing has set off a wide-spread panic around the city, with many questioning whether or not this team can compete in the playoffs. ...

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