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2011 Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap Part 4

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01-18-2012, 02:35 PM
  #901
Stewie G
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Sadly the time to move Laich has probably never been worse. If we could parlay him into a strong 2C cap and everything else willing, who wouldn't do it? Otherwise, you think we are thin now - move him. MJ MP Aucoin Halpern

Watching Laich and his shot blocking attempts at the top of the slot, aren't working for me. Going to one knee and sliding out of the play, head turned, is not helping our PK. Our scoring is too woeful now to have PK lapses. Watch for his move tonight, and the umbrella point faking the shot again.

I wonder if George would tout him as a potential captain in trade talks. A reference being the infamous lady with a flat tire.
The timing might never have been worse, but it's not the worst time to deal him if you don't think he's going to improve. You won't be getting top dollar for him, but I'm sure there are teams out there that think he could pick up his scoring if you put him back into a higher-tempo offense. The longer you wait however, the more people will realize that what you see is what you get.

He has averaged only 11 ES goals over the last 4 years, including the run and gun days. That average is typically about 150th in the league for forwards. He's finished 5th, 6th, and 8th on the team in ES goals the last 3 years and is currently 8th again behind Joel "Dead Weight" Ward. I know $4.5M doesn't go as far as it used to, but I say if you can get out from the next 5 years of his deal and get a reasonable return, you do it.

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01-18-2012, 02:48 PM
  #902
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I don't think we are going to be sellers so I think Laich sticks. It's too easy to land third place and see "if its our turn at the cup".

It's interesting that Joel Dead Weight Ward has passed him in ESG. Ok it's closer to sad. Brooks "Lug Nuts" Laich has to put up points now. Bottom line.

OT: Mark Cutback Davis. Bob Jungle Death Gerrard. Name the movie.

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01-18-2012, 03:20 PM
  #903
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OT: Mark Cutback Davis. Bob Jungle Death Gerrard. Name the movie.
Those guys are f*gs...

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01-18-2012, 03:27 PM
  #904
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Here is the list of notable forwards that will be UFAs this offseason
Ales Hemsky
Zach Parise
Teemu Selanne
Jarret Stoll
Mikhail Grabovski
Andrei Kostitsyn
Milan Hejduk
Olli Jokien
Vaclav Prospal
Saku Koivu
Chris Kelly
Tomas Holmstrom
P.A. Parenteau
Sean Avery
Arron Asham

List of Notable Defensemen
JM Liles
Pavel Kubina
Francois Beauchemin
Barret Jackman
Ryan Suter
Willie Mitchell
Johnny Oduya
Bryan Allen
Tim Gleason
Carlo Colaiacovo
Johnny Boychuck
Sheldon Souray
Steve Staios
Brett Clark
Matt Gilroy
Scott Hannan
Colin White
Aaron Rome
Tyler Sloan
The guys that I bolded I see moving on to other teams and most likely the teams every year rumored to be big players on July 1. I expect Philly will go hard after Suter. The other UFAs I see staying with their teams. If the Caps can't get Suter, I wouldn't mind Jackman.

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01-18-2012, 03:31 PM
  #905
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Schultz+ for Regehr please. Should of been done sooner.
This and GMGM please overpay if you have to. We should have been after Regehr for years now.

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01-18-2012, 03:35 PM
  #906
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This and GMGM please overpay if you have to. We should have been after Regehr for years now.
I was talking up a Regehr trade 2 years ago...that type of player is sorely needed on the blueline.

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01-18-2012, 03:47 PM
  #907
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McPhee doesn't believe in competent defensemen. He puts a premium on the schultzes and morrrrrrissssonnnns of the world.


Last edited by BrooklynCapsFan: 01-18-2012 at 04:11 PM.
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01-18-2012, 03:56 PM
  #908
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
As txpd would say, McPhee doesn't believe in competent defensemen. He puts a premium on the schultzes and morrrrrrissssonnnns of the world.
when did i say that?

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01-18-2012, 04:04 PM
  #909
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when did i say that?
Whenever someone brings up bringing a defensive dman, you say something to the effect that McPhee doesn't believe in that type of player and has never made a move like that.

I take it back. I don't like people putting words in my mouth either.

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01-18-2012, 04:12 PM
  #910
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Whenever someone brings up bringing a defensive dman, you say something to the effect that McPhee doesn't believe in that type of player and has never made a move like that.

I take it back. I don't like people putting words in my mouth either.
what about mcphee not wanting an old school stay at home defenseman translates into not wanting any competent defensemen? i also dont ever recall saying he puts a premium on schultz or morrisonnnnnnnnnn.

its ok. you can keep putting words in my mouth. i know this angry man act is your schtick. i dont want to ruin your fun. you go ahead.

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01-18-2012, 04:13 PM
  #911
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I was talking up a Regehr trade 2 years ago...that type of player is sorely needed on the blueline.
Haha, I'm a little biased. Regehr is one of my favorite players. Yes sir, I agree. Regehr would be what the doctor ordered at least for the defense. I remember on another Caps forum we used to drool we would get him for Juneau or other veterans like Oates. GMGM got Tezikov instead . Calgary did have to give up something to get him though. Imagine the leadership he could provide to Carslon, Alzner, and Orlov.

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01-18-2012, 04:35 PM
  #912
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What i wanna know is why GMGM went after Ward instead of Ryder.
Ryder had a better playoff performance than Ward, and it was pretty apparent we needed a 2nd liner...


Also, since Buff needs Centers and Grit, would Laich + Schultz + be an ok proposal for Regehr?

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01-18-2012, 04:49 PM
  #913
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Those guys are f*gs...
Chicken Dinner. Fast Times.... great movie. Phoebe Cates. Doesn't anybody ****ing knock anymore.

I am still surprised we inked Laich as much as we did to be a 3C / PKer. I thought for sure he'd be a 2C. You won.

We need him to pot some goals... clear the puck on PK's. Block shots... they all seem a struggle for him of late. Last 16GP 1+3

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01-19-2012, 07:23 PM
  #914
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I know that its Eklund but he says were talking with the Blackhawks about a trade

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01-19-2012, 09:05 PM
  #915
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I know that its Eklund but he says were talking with the Blackhawks about a trade
Schultz for a 5th

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01-19-2012, 11:41 PM
  #916
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Ryder has a soft and lazy **** vibe to him. Pretty obvious McPhee was going for intangibles above all in the offseason.

Not getting Regehr for what essentially would amount to Schultz and Perreault for Regehr and a waiveable salary dump should have been a fireable offense.

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01-19-2012, 11:50 PM
  #917
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Ryder has a soft and lazy **** vibe to him. Pretty obvious McPhee was going for intangibles above all in the offseason.
It's a shame that he seems to be able to focus on improving only one aspect of his team at a time. I've always been a fan and tended to give him the benefit of the doubt, but at this point you really have to question his general vision and his ability, as people here have put it, to build a real team.

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01-20-2012, 12:57 AM
  #918
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I know txpd used to joke about "longest regular season ever"... But to me, this is it. Mostly cause the injuries to our main stars are not fully known to us and those njuries, to me, decide whether to believe in a playoff chance.... Or just wait for the inevitable struggle and see what gmgm does come deadline.

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01-20-2012, 01:16 AM
  #919
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It's a shame that he seems to be able to focus on improving only one aspect of his team at a time. I've always been a fan and tended to give him the benefit of the doubt, but at this point you really have to question his general vision and his ability, as people here have put it, to build a real team.
He's a calculating, reactionary GM. That's how all reactionary GMs operate - isolate an issue, address it, then compile again, troubleshoot and repeat the process. Theoretically it should eventually lead to having a team with no issues. Ted probably loves the approach because its similar to the agile software development approach that all startup guys swear by. But as a result of that clinical approach you end up with a team with no identity, just a lot of parts each of which is tailored towards addressing a specific problem in its own way. Players have said as much when they remarked that Boston, Detroit, Vancouver know what kind of a team they are, but they don't. And problems that get "solved" 2-3 years ago by this process reappear because you can't just refactor hockey players and have them maintain the same consistency and performance in that particular area forever onward. But Ted is a software manager guy and McPhee speaks his language.

As a result of this approach, every year they get 2-3 "core" pieces added in but at the same time 1-2 pieces from previous years become obsolete. It was 3rd rate forwards and defensemen at first, but now its happening to legit core pieces like Green and Ovechkin. He needs to just grab his sack and put a 100% complete team for one year where each line and pairing has an identity, high chance of establishing chemistry immediately, and roll with it. Florida and Dallas have been able to do it with their teams to the extent that the circumstances allowed them, surely we have the hockey minds for it as well. Having 1/3 of a 2nd line after all these years is embarassing.

Sad to think that the most complete team we had post lockout was 3 years ago. That was all Kozzy and Feds though.

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01-20-2012, 07:22 AM
  #920
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Halpy hits one out of the park - great post.

This team lacks identity up and down the lineup. We have had Ovi and... crickets. Ovi has been under daily pressure to be the identity of our entire team, its energy source, all the while scoring goals in the face of teams now doubling him. He has an off night, we have no face. Win or lose, fans yawn, the board implodes.

Following your lead... the core of the code is our untouchable 4 young guns. If any are having issues, compiling leaves GM lost as the code is crap. He largely just adds code at the end aka deadline and never addresses the core code. We have no identity up and down the lineup. We are too often boring to watch.

Our peak probably was 2-3 years ago. The core of the code was strong. I always said, Ovi expedited our rebuild but George missed the boat. He choose to follow the "stay the course" 10 year plan - his main goal to become America's team... one lofty goal for a cupless team. Perhaps an unrealistic goal, lets be honest - but good for his job security. Letting kids like Sarge develop long and slow as a top pair guy while Ovi is trying to single handed land us a cup was a facepalm. Now Ovi is being squashed by the league and double teams, Green is turning out to be injury prone. Now Nick is down. Semin is... playing well! It's ugly.

Dale compiled and saw priority 1, Sarge isn't cutting it. High TOI for Ovi is not winning us games, running him blind into the double and triples. We needed a goalie, so he handed the job to TVo. He saw no team defense and trapped. He is doing the best he can, but its McPhee's mess.

I spend my time arguing petty details but in the end, really it's always McPhee we are talking about. Thanks for summing up the big picture so well.


Last edited by RandyHolt: 01-20-2012 at 07:29 AM.
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01-20-2012, 07:40 AM
  #921
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Here's the logical struggle with that post. While reactionary might not be inherently bad, that's generally the nature of the hockey game. There are only a few teams (Philly this year) who have EVER gone the opposite grain, and it's even harder now with the cap era to be anything else.

Teams have been hitching their wagons to three or four guys and filling in the rest for a long while, and that's been generally successful. The problem is, getting those talented players, especially when young, you never know how they're going to pan out.

If you look at the Championships of most of the teams who have won in the past decade or so, you're looking at a core nucleus of 3-4 guys, and then generally some backfilling in to get the rest of the club.

I will admit that in all probability our best chance of seeing a Cup with this team might have been that Pens year, or maybe the chance of getting past Montreal, but I still have to think in my heart of hearts that a team whose major players are still not even into their 30s has another run or two in them.

Green might be damaged goods, Semin might need to go, but ultimately, with Backstrom and Ovechkin, you have to think there's at least some chance someone (whether McPhee, Hunter, or whomever at either post) can cobble together a club around those two players that could compete. It's not like the team is a sagging hulk ready for the scrap heap. They still have 10-15 players who could jump into ANY lineup tomorrow. They've got 2 high draft picks coming up this year. They've probably got the best Non-NHL prospect right now in the world.

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01-20-2012, 08:01 AM
  #922
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Halpy hits one out of the park - great post.

This team lacks identity up and down the lineup. We have had Ovi and... crickets. Ovi has been under daily pressure to be the identity of our entire team, its energy source, all the while scoring goals in the face of teams now doubling him. He has an off night, we have no face. Win or lose, fans yawn, the board implodes.

Following your lead... the core of the code is our untouchable 4 young guns. If any are having issues, compiling leaves GM lost as the code is crap. He largely just adds code at the end aka deadline and never addresses the core code. We have no identity up and down the lineup. We are too often boring to watch.

Our peak probably was 2-3 years ago. The core of the code was strong. I always said, Ovi expedited our rebuild but George missed the boat. He choose to follow the "stay the course" 10 year plan - his main goal to become America's team... one lofty goal for a cupless team. Perhaps an unrealistic goal, lets be honest - but good for his job security. Letting kids like Sarge develop long and slow as a top pair guy while Ovi is trying to single handed land us a cup was a facepalm. Now Ovi is being squashed by the league and double teams, Green is turning out to be injury prone. Now Nick is down. Semin is... playing well! It's ugly.

Dale compiled and saw priority 1, Sarge isn't cutting it. High TOI for Ovi is not winning us games, running him blind into the double and triples. We needed a goalie, so he handed the job to TVo. He saw no team defense and trapped. He is doing the best he can, but its McPhee's mess.

I spend my time arguing petty details but in the end, really it's always McPhee we are talking about. Thanks for summing up the big picture so well.
Hindsight is always 20/20. Did anyone expect Ovi to turn into a 30 goal scorer in just a couple years or Green to spend so much time out with injuries? Was the rest of the team good enough back in 08-09 to mortgage the future for a shot then? Was anyone advocating for more moves than the Feds, Huet, and Cooke deals when the team barely had a chance at the playoffs? Was the supposed asking price for Pronger worth it? It's easy to talk in general terms about "going for it", but if they had met Anaheim's rumored price, we'd be without Carlson and/or Alzner, Varly (or at least the assets we got for him), and possibly a pick (perhaps the one that turned out to be Kuznetsov). In that situation, we might still be running out the Morrison's, Jurcina's, and Morrisonn's of the world instead of having one of the best young defense pairings in the league and one of the best prospects in the world.

Looking back now, McPhee missed the boat in '09-'10, but that team had won 14 in a row not too long before the deadline.

I'm not disagreeing that the team now lacks an identity, but back then their identity was the run-and-gun Caps. Not all the pieces fit that mold at the time, but it looked like a work in progress. The change to a more defensive system turned everything on it's head. If that is the direction they want to continue, making additional moves to have the personnel fit that system are definitely in order.

That's how I look at it through my conservative lenses. Those with a more aggressive approach to things are bound to disagree.

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01-20-2012, 08:20 AM
  #923
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NHL Players Poll in SI this week: Who is hockey's hardest hitter?
Zdeno Chara, Bruins D - 18%
Jordin Tootoo, Predators RW - 15 %
Cal Clutterbuck, Wild RW - 11%
Douglas Murray, Sharks D - 10%
Dion Phaneuf, Leafs D - 8%

Tootoo currently making 1.25 and has 6 goals will be a UFA. There's your replacement next season for the retired Mike Knuble.

Ovechkin - Backstrom - Kuznetsov
Semin - 2C? - Brouwer
Chimera - MAJO - Laich (just get rid of Joel Ward please)
Hendricks - Halpern - Tootoo

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01-20-2012, 08:20 AM
  #924
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Yeah hindsight 2020 for sure. But it was easy to see Ovi was flat out single handedly dominating the league. For anyone to expect that to continue until the end of his contract... sure we all probably would have said yes he can if asked, but to ourselves, may have realized his extremely physical game would be tough to replicate year after year. Turns out the dumb league didnt want him to play that way even though he was their lead act, filling arenas. Then teams adjusted to his move, so obvious to see in hindsight; yet no one saw it coming.

To GM, the time to sell Sarge high was +fiddy after a disastrous playoff loss to Montreal. He and Green did meh at best. Ironically, that was probably the time he would LEAST consider trading Sarge. But its non-moves like that, that haunt this team. Moving out one of his coveted picks, that he just does not do. The recognition would have to be that Sarge is a bit slow for the modern game. It was there for all to see - he never excelled in the even faster playoffs. Now it appears ALL that grooming time we gave him during the Ovi Hart run will amount to nothing more than cap space one day. Paired with Green almost exclusively, Green now has almost no chemistry with anyone in our top 7. Those things hurt the team.

Varly was his big bold move. But Bruce didn't have faith in him and his injuries, and wouldn't play him late versus Tampa, so Bruce may have forced his hand. Coupled with Holtby showing well, he did it in an offer I think many of us would have accepted.

Make no mistake, it's not easy being a hockey GM. But in being a GM, you have to realize you have to give to get. He seems to look to loot other GM's only, pushing all in on HIS guys, guys like Sarge. When they don't pan out, he has to move them.

Will he? Hell no, not on the low. He missed the boat. So now we are stuck with him. George had him as core when he compiled last summer. Book it.


Last edited by RandyHolt: 01-20-2012 at 08:31 AM.
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01-20-2012, 08:37 AM
  #925
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Yeah hindsight 2020 for sure. But it was easy to see Ovi was flat out single handedly dominating the league. For anyone to expect that to continue until the end of his contract... sure we all probably would have said yes he can if asked, but to ourselves, may have realized his extremely physical game would be tough to replicate year after year. Teams adjusted to his move, so obvious to see in hindsight; yet no one saw it coming.

For example, the time to sell Sarge was +fiddy after a disastrous playoff loss to Montreal. He and Green did meh at best. Ironically, that was probably the time he would LEAST consider trading Sarge. But its non-moves like that, that haunt this team. Moving out one of his coveted picks, that he just does not do. The recognition would have to be that Sarge is a bit slow for the modern game. It was there for all to see - he never excelled in the even faster playoffs. Now it appears ALL that grooming time we gave him during the Ovi Hart run will amount to nothing more than cap space one day. Paired with Green almost exclusively, Green now has almost no chemistry with anyone in our top 7. Those things hurts the team.

Varly was his big bold move. But Bruce didn't have faith in him and his injuries, and wouldn't play him late versus Tampa, so Bruce may have forced his hand. Coupled with Holtby showing well, he did it in an offer I think many of us would have accepted.

Make no mistake, it's not easy being a hockey GM. But in being a GM, you have to realize you have to give to get. He seems to look to loot other GM's only, pushing all in on HIS guys, guys like Sarge. When they don't pan out, he has to move them.

Will he? Hell no, not on the low. He missed the boat. So now we are stuck with him.
I don't know how someone can criticize a move (or non-move) predicated on something that noone saw coming. I'd say that most sane people wouldn't have expected his play to continue at Hart levels for 13 years, but to expect it to go past age 26 wouldn't have been outlandish.

I agree with you on Schultz. I personally held out hope for him, but he didn't deserve top pairing ice time then and almost assuredly never will.

It's easy to say that certain non-moves haunt this team, but we might very well be saying that paying Anaheim's asking price would have been 10 times worse.

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