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01-11-2012, 08:40 AM
  #1
the tribute
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Media outlets complaining about lack of leagues control over dirty plays

So I read here relating to the Marchand hit and what not, I don't seem to understand just exactly HOW the media expects the NHL to control dirty hits. It makes no sense, are they supposed to kick the player out of the game? Increase suspensions? At any moment a player can make a stupid decision or a reactionary decision that ultimately may cause a suspension but there's nothing much else the league can do.

I agree though in the sense that less dirty plays should be made and we all know who the main culprits are for these, I really just feel as though media and certain fans are over reacting on everything that happens, let's not even get into concussions...

What does everyone else think on this? IMO it's getting unbelievably ridiculous.

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01-11-2012, 09:05 AM
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I agree. When it comes to officiating and supplementary discipline, the NHL gets no respect. People want both of these areas of the league to be perfect, but that's just impractical.

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01-11-2012, 09:12 AM
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DylanSensFan
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Get rid of the instigator, let the teams police themselves. None of this pus-sy BS that we've now let the PC left bring us to.

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01-11-2012, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DylanSensFan View Post
Get rid of the instigator, let the teams police themselves. None of this pus-sy BS that we've now let the PC left bring us to.
Yeah because the 70s, 80s, and early 90s were way less dirty than today...

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01-11-2012, 09:16 AM
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Pretty hypocritical. The media eats is up, and keeps looking, and prodding, for the most outrageous quote it can get. They just miss the good old days when you had a lot more dirty plays.

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01-11-2012, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Spensar View Post
Pretty hypocritical. The media eats is up, and keeps looking, and prodding, for the most outrageous quote it can get. They just miss the good old days when you had a lot more dirty plays.
except that the "media" is not one guy.

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01-11-2012, 10:02 AM
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Yeah because the 70s, 80s, and early 90s were way less dirty than today...
Way less spearing,slewfooting, and headhunting,yes.


"OOOHHH,there were brawls!!!OOOH!!!!"

less dangerous than the spearing and slewfooting and headhunting but bad PR.

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01-11-2012, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by nnynetpotato View Post
Way less spearing,slewfooting, and headhunting,yes.


"OOOHHH,there were brawls!!!OOOH!!!!"

less dangerous than the spearing and slewfooting and headhunting but bad PR.
Have you watched clips of Bobby Clark?

People watch their TSN/ESPN highlight reels and center ice packages and say hockey is so much dirtier than before, but the reality is we are seeing far more hockey. More teams and more games played per year means more incidents for the increased number of media outlets to send to the masses.

Players were plenty dirty, and disrespectful in the 70-90s, I'm sick of people pulling the wool over their eyes and saying it didn't happen.

That's not to say we can't/shouldn't try to do something about the appairent lack of respect and dangerous hits today, but lets not pretend the "Golden Days" were some sort of respectful haven of clean hockey.

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01-11-2012, 11:52 AM
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It is the leftist media that got rid of a lot of the enforcers. Was it any less dirty? It would seem to be that the 90's and now have been the worst hockey when it comes to complete disrespect. Players like Marchand are allowed to run around far too much, when in the old days they would have been put in their place for acting like idiots.

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01-11-2012, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DylanSensFan View Post
It is the leftist media that got rid of a lot of the enforcers. Was it any less dirty? It would seem to be that the 90's and now have been the worst hockey when it comes to complete disrespect. Players like Marchand are allowed to run around far too much, when in the old days they would have been put in their place for acting like idiots.
But OH NO we can't let violence into the game now, our kids will follow suit.. WELL YES FOR *$&^# SAKES, HOW DO YOU THINK THE GAME IS TODAY?!?!?! DERRRRRRRR.

God damn people these days.

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01-11-2012, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by nnynetpotato View Post
Way less spearing,slewfooting, and headhunting,yes.


"OOOHHH,there were brawls!!!OOOH!!!!"

less dangerous than the spearing and slewfooting and headhunting but bad PR.
No there was not way less spearing etc there was just as much if not more back in the goden years there there was issues as we have today the difference is people then did not get worked up and try and ban every little thing.

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01-11-2012, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DylanSensFan View Post
It is the leftist media that got rid of a lot of the enforcers. Was it any less dirty? It would seem to be that the 90's and now have been the worst hockey when it comes to complete disrespect. Players like Marchand are allowed to run around far too much, when in the old days they would have been put in their place for acting like idiots.
So explian why Swedish hockey there is no fightng and almost zero cheap shots and players like Marchand? They have a bigger left wing media then Canada.

Chris Pronger full on elblows Dean Maccamond in the head on the biggest cheap shot in the world and he gets one game for a head shot, it has everything to do with the culture of hockey and the poeple that run the game, the cheap players that play it and nothing to do with the media.

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01-11-2012, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
So explian why Swedish hockey there is no fightng and almost zero cheap shots and players like Marchand? They have a bigger left wing media then Canada.

Chris Pronger full on elblows Dean Maccamond in the head on the biggest cheap shot in the world and he gets one game for a head shot, it has everything to do with the culture of hockey and the poeple that run the game, the cheap players that play it and nothing to do with the media.
Swedish players have always played a finesse type game, that's what they are known for. North American game has always been the more aggressive and physical type.

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01-11-2012, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by DylanSensFan View Post
Get rid of the instigator, let the teams police themselves. None of this pus-sy BS that we've now let the PC left bring us to.
Doesn't work that way.

The other team's goon will just protect whichever rat or a-hole is running around causing trouble. The little rat player will never fight or he'll turtle. Removing the instigator rule isn't the answer.

Also, I don't think that this has anything to do with left-wing, right-wing, or politically correct etc. It has to do with the fact that there are players who don't care if they hurt other players or end anyone's career. They just don't care. They have no respect for anyone out on the ice.

There are TONS of examples of guys who play hard-nosed, gritty, in your face hockey that do it without playing dirty. They crash, go to the net, fight, throw their weight around etc. But they don't play dirty.

And everybody knows who the rats are. The NHL just needs to have the guts to hand out some real suspensions.

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01-11-2012, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Micklebot View Post
Have you watched clips of Bobby Clark?

People watch their TSN/ESPN highlight reels and center ice packages and say hockey is so much dirtier than before, but the reality is we are seeing far more hockey. More teams and more games played per year means more incidents for the increased number of media outlets to send to the masses.

Players were plenty dirty, and disrespectful in the 70-90s, I'm sick of people pulling the wool over their eyes and saying it didn't happen.

That's not to say we can't/shouldn't try to do something about the apparent lack of respect and dangerous hits today, but lets not pretend the "Golden Days" were some sort of respectful haven of clean hockey.
So true. Seems that a lot of younger people who didn't actually watch hocky in those days have bought into nostalgic gibberish while growing up. Do you think Scott Stevens had "respect" for the opposition, as he blindsided them into concussion land?

I didn't watch much NHL hockey at all for a long time because there was so much garbage. Hack and slash stick work, clutching and grabbing, and hammering cross checks to the back, were the norm. Guys like Ken "The Rat" Linesman had that nickname for a reason.

Fact is the goons protected guys like Clarke and the "rats".

What has been taken out of the game is teams using violence as a team intimidation tactic. Do you really want a return to "glory" years of the Flyers stanley cup win eras? I watched it as a teenager, and that was not good hockey. Funny how the lowest point in the sport, IMHO, with the most violence, is looked at as a time when players respected each other.

It has been convenient to say that removing the instigator rule would make a big difference. So go ahead, take it out, see what happens. You won't see much difference. As teams add tough guys, every team will do it. Every time the goon hits the ice, the opposition will counter with their tough guy for those few minutes. The instigator rule will do NADA for dirty plays like Marchand did. We also see way less clipping now than in the good old days.

Another thing that has changed is the big $$ players now get. When the difference is $70k in the AHL and $600k++ in the NHL, the instigator rule in place will have no deterrent for a player if staying in the NHL means aiming at someones head, or taking out someones knees. The pressure to win now, with media and internet fans is greater than ever. The idea that the threat of taking a few punches from someone will make an iota of difference is outdated.

Regarding the "old days", if there had been HD and a dozen cameras covering every game, the nightly sports shows would have been very, very, full of dirty tricks. Media "coverage" was one game a week, and it was a big deal when a 2nd game was shown, and instead of sports TV there was a short blip at the end of the news. There just wasn't the coverage, and media guys had a sweet gig with the team the covered. Just like the media never mentioned JFK's extra activities in the bedroom, you sure as heck didn't do an article on dirty plays in the NHL.

Refs in the old days were not fools either. They could tack on a roughing, or whatever, to in effect award an instigator penalty, and you would often see an extra 2 minutes for roughing for one of the players in a fight.

Different times, different solutions, removing the instigator has simplistic appeal, but it just won't matter if it is dropped or not.

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01-11-2012, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by the tribute View Post
Swedish players have always played a finesse type game, that's what they are known for. North American game has always been the more aggressive and physical type.
Exactly, this has nothing to do with media or fans and everything to do with the culture of the people that are running the game. The "media caused this" argument is the stupitest argument to take on this.

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01-11-2012, 12:48 PM
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Exactly, this has nothing to do with media or fans and everything to do with the culture of the people that are running the game. The "media caused this" argument is the stupitest argument to take on this.
no... no... the media got the people/parents more involved with their scare tactics at how playing hockey is going to cause their kids to get murdered on ice.

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01-11-2012, 12:55 PM
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Bobby Clarke could fight his own battles & did numerous times. The hockey was tough back then but you didn't very often see some guy get run from behind, creating the obstruction rule may have caused this. You would see the odd elbow to the head but not often, if there was a dispute it was settled pretty quickly. It just seems today there is no respect in the game for player's careers, there are way too many hits in the back & head.

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01-11-2012, 01:00 PM
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Anyone who is bringing up "the leftist media" as ANY reason for why there are dirty hits/ plays in hockey needs to get a:


I mean, come the frig on. Are you going to blame the "pinko commie lefities" for the fact that your ham sandwich didn't have any mustard on it, too?

Stop trying to connect dots that aren't there. What a terrible, awful argument. The minute you start complaining about "the leftist media" is the minute I stop taking you seriously about... well, to be honest, about almost anything.

Keep it to hockey, and keep your right-left views to the politics boards.

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01-11-2012, 01:00 PM
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no... no... the media got the people/parents more involved with their scare tactics at how playing hockey is going to cause their kids to get murdered on ice.
No. Kids getting seriously injured started getting media attention. My son plays atom and already there are kids out there trying to hurt other kids. They don't even have body checking yet and kids are bragging about how many head-shots they've delivered. Lots of teams we've played against have 9 year olds out extended lengths of time with concussions.

I've heard of some of the older kids 11+ actually getting their friends to video tape their games so that they can compile their own 'rock-em-sock-em' videos to post on youtube. These kids don't care if their team wins or if they get penalties or if they score a goal. All they want to do is go out there and take runs at other kids. It's effing creepy.




edit: actually, just go on youtube and search for 'hockey hits pee wee' and you'll see a crapload of entries. It's sickening. Some of the videos are posted by adults, edited down and matched to rocking music. You can also see that a lot of the kids have no intention of playing the puck or making a play. I am going to go out on a limb and guess that it's not the leftist media that are out there posting these videos.


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01-11-2012, 01:08 PM
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they aren't even allowed checking in younger leagues are they? I still think a lot of things are getting overblown.

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01-11-2012, 01:18 PM
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they aren't even allowed checking in younger leagues are they? I still think a lot of things are getting overblown.
Checking starts at pee wee level, age 11.

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01-11-2012, 01:27 PM
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Checking starts at pee wee level, age 11.
Thanks for the clear up.

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01-11-2012, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by aragorn View Post
Bobby Clarke could fight his own battles & did numerous times. The hockey was tough back then but you didn't very often see some guy get run from behind, creating the obstruction rule may have caused this. You would see the odd elbow to the head but not often, if there was a dispute it was settled pretty quickly. It just seems today there is no respect in the game for player's careers, there are way too many hits in the back & head.
Bobby Clarke has the biggest chicken' shyte hockey cheap shot in the history of hockey, bad example. This is one of the problems, people glorify Bobby Clarke when in fact he was the biggest Marchand cheap shot artist of his time, if someone hit one of his guys he was a cheapshot, weasel player and his track record proves that without a doubt

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01-11-2012, 02:24 PM
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Bobby Clarke could fight his own battles & did numerous times. The hockey was tough back then but you didn't very often see some guy get run from behind, creating the obstruction rule may have caused this. You would see the odd elbow to the head but not often, if there was a dispute it was settled pretty quickly. It just seems today there is no respect in the game for player's careers, there are way too many hits in the back & head.
This.

Hell,even Bobby Orr answered the bell.

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