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Two Headed Monster

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Old
01-17-2012, 01:54 PM
  #1
y2kcanucks
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Two Headed Monster

Analyzing the Canucks goaltending situation is like a guy trying to pick between a hot brunette long-time friend and a cute red head who just moved in next door. Both options look very attractive. What if you could have both options at the same time?

A quick glance at the home/away splits for Luongo and Schneider will tell you that Schneider has had more success on the road than at home (.932Svp vs .918Svp). The opposite is true for Luongo (.925 home Svp vs .908 road SVP).

Since both goaltenders are seen as starter capable, how about taking advantage of their strengths and splitting up their starts based on these stats? Have Schneider start most of the road games (with Luongo getting a few extra on those back to backs or 3 games in 4 nights) and Luongo taking on all the home starts except back to backs? This would keep Schneider sharp, and Luongo fresh for the playoffs.

This rotation could even be carried into the playoffs. It's quite unorthodox and against conventional thinking, but it would definitely throw off the other teams game planning similar to a football team with two starting quarterbacks.

If we are going to hold on to Schneider we might as well make use of him. At the very least it makes Vancouver a likely place for him to re-sign with when his contract is up.

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Last edited by y2kcanucks: 01-17-2012 at 02:00 PM.
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Old
01-17-2012, 01:57 PM
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thepuckmonster
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*Comparing a hot redhead to a beautiful brunette.

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01-17-2012, 02:04 PM
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topched88
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In before people snapping about this being discussed already

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01-17-2012, 02:05 PM
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BluesyShoes
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So who's Betty and who's Veronica?

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01-17-2012, 03:09 PM
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Stefan It Up
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One is Christina Hendricks, the other is Megan Fox.

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01-17-2012, 03:12 PM
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ddawg1950
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Originally Posted by Stefan It Up View Post
One is Christina Hendricks, the other is Megan Fox.
And that's why I'd keep both of them.

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01-17-2012, 03:31 PM
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hackey
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Luongo's hit is $5.33M for life
Schneider being a RFA can easily fetch $2.5 - $3.0M on the open market if anyone threw him an offer sheet his way

So $8.0M to $8.5M is too much of a CapHit if the Nucks want to retain both goalies

Up to $2.5M potential savings can be allocated elsewhere, like for a defenceman

The entire puck universe knows they are both No#1's, but one goalie has to eventually move out
How great they both play is secondary at this point

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01-17-2012, 03:37 PM
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crazycanuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hackey View Post
Luongo's hit is $5.33M for life
Schneider being a RFA can easily fetch $2.5 - $3.0M on the open market if anyone threw him an offer sheet his way

So $8.0M to $8.5M is too much of a CapHit if the Nucks want to retain both goalies

Up to $2.5M potential savings can be allocated elsewhere, like for a defenceman

The entire puck universe knows they are both No#1's, but one goalie has to eventually move out
How great they both play is secondary at this point
You have this backwards, it is the middle of the season and Gillis/AV and the Canucks shouldn't be looking at potential cap savings next year when they are a very strong cup contending team this year.

Primary Issue - Keeping both goalies playing well.
Secondary Issue - Next years goaltending situation.

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01-17-2012, 03:51 PM
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VanEric
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The CBA is expiring and there might be another amnesty clause in it. A get out of jail free card where you can buy out one contract and not have it count against your cap.

If that becomes a reality, I buy out Luongo and sign Schneider long-term. If that doesn't happen, I move Schneider and find a competent backup.

Really the person I'd hate to be in this situation is Schneider because here are the two likely scenarios for him next season - he gets traded to a crappy team or he somehow stays and has to try to fill Luongo's shoes in a very tough market. Either way he's going to have a ton of pressure on him.

I don't think we keep both and I don't think it would say much good about Schneider if he re-signed here knowing Luongo's still here.

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01-17-2012, 04:05 PM
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y2kcanucks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hackey View Post
Luongo's hit is $5.33M for life
Schneider being a RFA can easily fetch $2.5 - $3.0M on the open market if anyone threw him an offer sheet his way

So $8.0M to $8.5M is too much of a CapHit if the Nucks want to retain both goalies

Up to $2.5M potential savings can be allocated elsewhere, like for a defenceman

The entire puck universe knows they are both No#1's, but one goalie has to eventually move out
How great they both play is secondary at this point
Let's say Schneider gets $3M...is the combined salaries of $8.33M that far out of line with what Nashville, Philly, New York Rangers, Buffalo or Carolina are spending? Basically Luongo's cap hit allows for us to keep an elite goalie in Luongo as well as a great up and comer.

Also consider we were spending about a million less on goaltending in total just a couple years ago under a smaller cap when we went with Luongo and Raycroft as our tandem.

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Old
01-17-2012, 04:36 PM
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rye&ginger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazycanuck View Post
You have this backwards, it is the middle of the season and Gillis/AV and the Canucks shouldn't be looking at potential cap savings next year when they are a very strong cup contending team this year.

Primary Issue - Keeping both goalies playing well.
Secondary Issue - Next years goaltending situation.
I agree with this as this year there are no cap savings to be had, and we may have to lose a roster player if we wanted to add another d-man or bottom 6 player for example.

Moving a goalie (Schnieder) now is a sideways move unless we can fleece a desparate team.

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01-17-2012, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rye&ginger View Post
I agree with this as this year there are no cap savings to be had, and we may have to lose a roster player if we wanted to add another d-man or bottom 6 player for example.

Moving a goalie (Schnieder) now is a sideways move unless we can fleece a desparate team.
If New Jersey were out of playoff contention and couldn't lock up Parise I could see a deal being made there...but amongst the non-playoff teams that badly need a goalie I can't see much that would help us this year that would actually be available. Tampa has some nice forward prospects but you don't do that deal right now, Columbus doesn't have much...and I don't think Phoenix would move Yandle plus Smith somehow is playing well.

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01-17-2012, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanEric View Post
The CBA is expiring and there might be another amnesty clause in it. A get out of jail free card where you can buy out one contract and not have it count against your cap.

If that becomes a reality, I buy out Luongo and sign Schneider long-term. If that doesn't happen, I move Schneider and find a competent backup.
I seriously doubt that'll happen, though Luongo would probably love collecting 2 paychecks for the rest of his career. That's $32 million that ownership is probably not too keen to throw down the toilet.

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01-18-2012, 11:57 AM
  #14
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If Luongo gets us a cup this year, reward him and move him down to one of the Florida teams so he can be at his sunny home in Fort Lauderdale and not have to deal with our insane media anymore.

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01-18-2012, 12:20 PM
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Elliot20
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Originally Posted by Tank Hankerous View Post
If Luongo gets us a cup this year, reward him and move him down to one of the Florida teams so he can be at his sunny home in Fort Lauderdale and not have to deal with our insane media anymore.
That doesn't make sense. You don't trade a player who was a core player in getting the cup after 40+ years.

That sends the wrong message. You only trade Luongo if he asks, but I don't see why he would. Winning 1 cup isn't enough for some players. The dream is to continue being a champion, continue pursuing the championship. Luongo can go to Florida when he retires.

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01-18-2012, 01:58 PM
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DennisReynolds
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I hope Schneider takes a discount to stay in Vancouver and have the best chance to win the cup.

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01-18-2012, 02:30 PM
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The intent of this thread was whether cory should be playing the road games, not whether or not we should trade him.

And for all you traders, what do you use for a back up goalie? Its gonna cost to get someone to replace Schneider; he's one of those extreme value for money guys right now guys. As I keep stating, the problem with trading schneids is it has to be a package deal with salary dump as well.

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01-18-2012, 06:55 PM
  #18
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i don't think it's reasonable to give schneider road starts exclusively. he has certainly earned the chance to play home games.

i mean, i see where playing the percentages come in, but goalies don't look at it like that. every game is different, and changing whichever goalie plays home or away won't give us a magic formula for winning.

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01-18-2012, 07:54 PM
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Elliot20
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So 41 gmes for each?

I don't think Luongo or Schneider would be that happy....

Every professional wants to play 82 if possible.

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01-18-2012, 08:00 PM
  #20
VinnyC
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Originally Posted by Stefan It Up View Post
One is Christina Hendricks, the other is Megan Fox.
Megan Fox is terribly overrated, I'd ride Christina all day.


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Old
01-18-2012, 08:01 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Let's say Schneider gets $3M...is the combined salaries of $8.33M that far out of line with what Nashville, Philly, New York Rangers, Buffalo or Carolina are spending? Basically Luongo's cap hit allows for us to keep an elite goalie in Luongo as well as a great up and comer.

Also consider we were spending about a million less on goaltending in total just a couple years ago under a smaller cap when we went with Luongo and Raycroft as our tandem.
It's not the cap implications that make this a poor move, its the fact Schneider is ready to be a starter and deserves the opportunity. Schneider shouldn't and likely won't be back next year, assuming Luongo stays.

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01-18-2012, 10:15 PM
  #22
Barney Gumble
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So who's Betty and who's Veronica?
For the Luongo haters, it's more like a choice between Mary Ann and Mrs. Howell.

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01-18-2012, 11:01 PM
  #23
y2kcanucks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot20 View Post
So 41 gmes for each?

I don't think Luongo or Schneider would be that happy....

Every professional wants to play 82 if possible.
Or perhaps 45 for Luongo and 37 for Schneider? It's unconventional in that you aren't giving either goalie the bulk of the load, but at the same time you're playing the percentages (like a baseball pitcher) and not allowing teams to gameplan for just one goalie but rather two goalies.

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