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Pierre Gauthier: International Jetsetter (scouted NSH, NYR, NJ, CGY, LA, ANA...)

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Old
02-15-2012, 10:23 AM
  #701
Agnostic
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When Gauthier gets a pair of fourth rounders for Moen and Gill it will all be apparent why he was scouting so heavily.

Hope Molson takes his air miles when he kicks him to the curb.

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02-15-2012, 10:38 AM
  #702
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Below is what is wrong with Habs fans.
The mechanic quip was just a joke, maybe a poorly constructed one.

Take a deep breathe.

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02-15-2012, 10:39 AM
  #703
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Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
actually, i think that's just what's wrong with this guy. it's gibberish...


It must be awesome to be you, each post being golden and all.

Gimme a break brother.

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02-15-2012, 10:55 AM
  #704
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It must be awesome to be you, each post being golden and all.

Gimme a break brother.
oh no, i have my fair share of ---> <--- worthy posts

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02-15-2012, 11:08 AM
  #705
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Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
The mechanic quip was just a joke, maybe a poorly constructed one.

Take a deep breathe.
In fact your post was pretty funny. The pool guy, the lawn guy and the GC...hee hee

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02-15-2012, 11:46 AM
  #706
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Cool.

I was just daydreaming.... imagine if the Habs were a good organization once again. One that did not rely on former Habs players to use as PR for the unwashed masses, just so they can remember the good ol' days.

A team with structure in it's administration. Qualified, creative hockey people. Lots of them.
A team with prospects in all positions, and a plan to develop them and bring them up when a hole presents itself, and they are ready.
A team where they can direct their energies towards winning hockey, and let the PR people deal with the silly part of the media.
A team that finishes consistently in he top 4 in our conference, year after year.
A well rounded team with skill AND toughness.
A team that can out skate you, out score you, can defend with structure, and will not be intimidated

....I had a dream....

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Old
02-15-2012, 12:11 PM
  #707
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Considering PG's love with young pros (vs amateur prospects or picks), I would be on the lookout for a dude like Loktionov.

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02-15-2012, 01:02 PM
  #708
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Originally Posted by 7th Player View Post
Considering PG's love with young pros (vs amateur prospects or picks), I would be on the lookout for a dude like Loktionov.
Too bad Loktionov just started getting hot, I was thinking we were going to get him + a pick for AK, but it doesn't look like that's a possibility anymore.

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02-15-2012, 01:30 PM
  #709
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Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
Cool.

I was just daydreaming.... imagine if the Habs were a good organization once again. One that did not rely on former Habs players to use as PR for the unwashed masses, just so they can remember the good ol' days.

A team with structure in it's administration. Qualified, creative hockey people. Lots of them.
A team with prospects in all positions, and a plan to develop them and bring them up when a hole presents itself, and they are ready.
A team where they can direct their energies towards winning hockey, and let the PR people deal with the silly part of the media.
A team that finishes consistently in he top 4 in our conference, year after year.
A well rounded team with skill AND toughness.
A team that can out skate you, out score you, can defend with structure, and will not be intimidated

....I had a dream....
Cheap beer too?

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02-15-2012, 01:54 PM
  #710
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Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
Cheap beer too?
Why not!

Heineken for me, please.

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Old
02-15-2012, 02:49 PM
  #711
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Too bad Loktionov just started getting hot, I was thinking we were going to get him + a pick for AK, but it doesn't look like that's a possibility anymore.
The Kings are desperate for some scoring, so I wouldnt rule out that possibility.

Dude is hot? He has 6 points in 35 games...

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02-15-2012, 02:49 PM
  #712
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Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
Cool.

I was just daydreaming.... imagine if the Habs were a good organization once again. One that did not rely on former Habs players to use as PR for the unwashed masses, just so they can remember the good ol' days.

A team with structure in it's administration. Qualified, creative hockey people. Lots of them.
A team with prospects in all positions, and a plan to develop them and bring them up when a hole presents itself, and they are ready.
A team where they can direct their energies towards winning hockey, and let the PR people deal with the silly part of the media.
A team that finishes consistently in he top 4 in our conference, year after year.
A well rounded team with skill AND toughness.
A team that can out skate you, out score you, can defend with structure, and will not be intimidated

....I had a dream....

Oh, you mean the Detroit Red Wings or the Canadiens circa 1975. Just kidding.

I like your dream Joe. To be honest, I'm don't hold quite the level of shall we say suspicion that you and many posters here have for Gauthier. Not everything he's tried has worked, I'll admit that, but I think he's a pretty shrewd character to be honest. He hasn't been on the job all that long (2 years?) and no, the time he spent when Gainey was GM doesn't count, at least not in my book. Still, let's take a look at what he's done since becoming GM

- getting Emelin to come across the Big Pond (something I gave up on years ago)

- acquiring Eller who's rounding out into a pretty good hockey player

- acquiring Shultz who if he makes it (I'm betting he will) will add considerable toughness

- acquiring Habs leading scorer Cole under what I consider to be a reasonable contract and arguably the best UFA signing by any Habs GM since, well, forever

- signing Gorges long term to a very decent contract

- acquiring what is shaping up as a pretty decent prospect in Holland

- acquiring Kaberle who I'm not thrilled with but there is no denying the powerplay is better now and I think he's Habs leading scorer on defence

- acquiring Bourque who seems to be scoring on a pretty regular basis although it's early days

Gauthier seems to have one ability that's overlooked here and that's his ability to be a "closer" when it comes to making deals.

Gauthier has taken some risks that haven't paid off (but they were calculated risks) and every GM that has done anything has made his share of those.

The only real criticism I have of Gauthier was the way he handled the language issue when Cunneyworth was appointed to replace Martin. Then again, given the stance that Molson took on the issue, Gauthier wasn't given much wiggle room on that matter.

I think Gauthier has improved the Habs considerably with his acquisitions since becoming GM. Like I said, I think he's a very shrewd character and one who knows how to close a deal which is HUGE for a GM.

Now there seem to be a lot of posters here (some of whom are otherwise very knowledgable) whose personal dislike of Gauthier (I don't get this from your posts btw) seems to make them incapable of making an objective assessment of his work, and that's fine. They want him gone. Personally, I think Gauthier is going to be around next year, no doubt to the chagrin of many posters here, and I think he will continue building a solid Habs team as he's been doing up until now.

I'm going to be very curious to see what he does between now and trade deadline but I have a feeling that I'm going to like what he does. Not so sure about the rest of the posters here, but...hey...that's what makes it interesting.

Cheers.

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02-15-2012, 02:53 PM
  #713
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Originally Posted by 7th Player View Post
The Kings are desperate for some scoring, so I wouldnt rule out that possibility.

Dude is hot? He has 6 points in 35 games...
2 goals in last 2 games for a team that can't score. They're probably going to see what he can do before dealing him.

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Old
02-15-2012, 03:22 PM
  #714
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@FisherKing, you've gotta be kidding me. You're leaving out some brutal details.

Kaberle: everything. Cole's contract length. Schultz? Seriously. We didn't fleece St Louis like we should've. Halak would've gotten more IMO with better negotiation. Bourque is a 2nd-3rd liner tweener: When he's good, he's top 6. When he's bad, he's bottom. Much like AK, except older.

Gorges? Yea we need him but giving Markov that contract and Gorges a 1-year in the same situation is bull **** and it backfired as he had to shell out big money for Gorges' long term contract.

Bottom line is he is not good enough. I like how we got bigger, but the devil is in the details.

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02-15-2012, 03:22 PM
  #715
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Originally Posted by FisherKing View Post
Oh, you mean the Detroit Red Wings or the Canadiens circa 1975. Just kidding.

I like your dream Joe. To be honest, I'm don't hold quite the level of shall we say suspicion that you and many posters here have for Gauthier. Not everything he's tried has worked, I'll admit that, but I think he's a pretty shrewd character to be honest. He hasn't been on the job all that long (2 years?) and no, the time he spent when Gainey was GM doesn't count, at least not in my book. Still, let's take a look at what he's done since becoming GM

- getting Emelin to come across the Big Pond (something I gave up on years ago)

- acquiring Eller who's rounding out into a pretty good hockey player

- acquiring Shultz who if he makes it (I'm betting he will) will add considerable toughness

- acquiring Habs leading scorer Cole under what I consider to be a reasonable contract and arguably the best UFA signing by any Habs GM since, well, forever

- signing Gorges long term to a very decent contract

- acquiring what is shaping up as a pretty decent prospect in Holland

- acquiring Kaberle who I'm not thrilled with but there is no denying the powerplay is better now and I think he's Habs leading scorer on defence

- acquiring Bourque who seems to be scoring on a pretty regular basis although it's early days

Gauthier seems to have one ability that's overlooked here and that's his ability to be a "closer" when it comes to making deals.

Gauthier has taken some risks that haven't paid off (but they were calculated risks) and every GM that has done anything has made his share of those.

The only real criticism I have of Gauthier was the way he handled the language issue when Cunneyworth was appointed to replace Martin. Then again, given the stance that Molson took on the issue, Gauthier wasn't given much wiggle room on that matter.

I think Gauthier has improved the Habs considerably with his acquisitions since becoming GM. Like I said, I think he's a very shrewd character and one who knows how to close a deal which is HUGE for a GM.

Now there seem to be a lot of posters here (some of whom are otherwise very knowledgable) whose personal dislike of Gauthier (I don't get this from your posts btw) seems to make them incapable of making an objective assessment of his work, and that's fine. They want him gone. Personally, I think Gauthier is going to be around next year, no doubt to the chagrin of many posters here, and I think he will continue building a solid Habs team as he's been doing up until now.

I'm going to be very curious to see what he does between now and trade deadline but I have a feeling that I'm going to like what he does. Not so sure about the rest of the posters here, but...hey...that's what makes it interesting.

Cheers.
bournival for o'byrne was pretty good deal, too.

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Old
02-15-2012, 03:29 PM
  #716
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bournival for o'byrne was pretty good deal, too.
PG is competent at trades and signings, not outstanding but competent. His enormous failure are elsewhere: he has no vision of what pieces make up a winning team, he overpays, the system is devoid of talent in the pros and while there are half a dozen good prospects, there is nothing like the organizational depth there was before PG became BG's right hand man. (Was he around for the Tanguay trade? What a fiasco of pro talent scouting that was. A first and a second for one season of meh.) It will be interesting to see this year whether he continues BG's failed policy of letting UFAs walk for nothing. To think we got zero for Koivu, for instance, is ridiculous, but that was before PG's time.

All told, he has moves he can be proud of, but not a record to be proud of. He's been mediocre at best over a pretty long career now.

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02-15-2012, 03:34 PM
  #717
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Originally Posted by billy piton View Post
bournival for o'byrne was pretty good deal, too.
Indeed. Good catch. Thanks. I knew I was missing a few but those were the ones that popped into my mind when I was writing.

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02-15-2012, 03:44 PM
  #718
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Originally Posted by 7th Player View Post
Considering PG's love with young pros (vs amateur prospects or picks), I would be on the lookout for a dude like Loktionov.
Anisimov, Doherty, Loktionov, A. Desjardins from SJ, Stepan(Would be a dream come true), Boll, and Brassard are all guys I am positive PG is keeping a close eye on.

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02-15-2012, 03:46 PM
  #719
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@FisherKing, you've gotta be kidding me. You're leaving out some brutal details.

Kaberle: everything. Cole's contract length. Schultz? Seriously. We didn't fleece St Louis like we should've. Halak would've gotten more IMO with better negotiation. Bourque is a 2nd-3rd liner tweener: When he's good, he's top 6. When he's bad, he's bottom. Much like AK, except older.

Gorges? Yea we need him but giving Markov that contract and Gorges a 1-year in the same situation is bull **** and it backfired as he had to shell out big money for Gorges' long term contract.

Bottom line is he is not good enough. I like how we got bigger, but the devil is in the details.
Kaberle is an obvious mistake but I can understand why he made the trade (of course I wouldn't have done it).

Cole is playing great right now and he's actually worth more than his actual salary this season. So when (if) he'll be a little "overpaid" in 2-3 years, I won't complain.

Schultz isn't doing much for me but getting Eller for Halak was fine. Sure, you would have done better but sadly, you're not the GM...

The Cammy trade was solid. Not because of Bourque but because we didn't lose anything in terms of actual production, while getting cap space and a 2nd round pick in a deep draft.

Markov contract was a mistake? Sure but I didn't know he was a doctor? I may be wrong but I was under the impression that we had a medical staff...

As for Gorges, he would likely have gotten more on the open market. Who cares if he's "overpaid" by 400k honestly?

I want to see PG replaced too but I'm tired of all the useless and often unfair bashing.

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02-15-2012, 03:57 PM
  #720
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PG is competent at trades and signings, not outstanding but competent. His enormous failure are elsewhere: he has no vision of what pieces make up a winning team, he overpays, the system is devoid of talent in the pros and while there are half a dozen good prospects, there is nothing like the organizational depth there was before PG became BG's right hand man. (Was he around for the Tanguay trade? What a fiasco of pro talent scouting that was. A first and a second for one season of meh.) It will be interesting to see this year whether he continues BG's failed policy of letting UFAs walk for nothing. To think we got zero for Koivu, for instance, is ridiculous, but that was before PG's time.

All told, he has moves he can be proud of, but not a record to be proud of. He's been mediocre at best over a pretty long career now.
he has no vision of what pieces make up a winning team? he has been habs gm for two years. show me gm who turned average team into a true contender in 2 years.

gauthier dosen't overpay at all. he re-signed pleky and gorges for reasonable money, cole got same money as leino, laich and fleischmann, and 0.25m less than tim connolly. he got us kaberle for jaro špaček (not for mcdonagh ).

accusing gauthier for gainey's moves is so ridiculous, so i won't even bother to comment that.

yes, we have lost koivu for nothing, but we got cammy, gio, cole, gill, moen, and špaček for nothing as well. you can't have them all in the salary cap world.

people here only want changes, they don't really care whether they would be positive or negateve ones. gauthier is proven competent gm, and he deserves at least a couple more years as a habs gm.

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02-15-2012, 04:52 PM
  #721
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So many different ways to look at what Gauthier's done. He took a final 4 team that for the most part played without Markov to a bottom dweller that has played without Markov.

Halak: was it the right goaltender to trade for the return? We'll never know because the organization wasn't going to trade their prized pick.

Cole: he's been good this year but this year is potentially a waste. Will Cole be the same next year?

Markov: could the Habs have signed him to a "performance based" contract or did Gauthier bite on the words of two men (Markov, Markov's agent) and a doctor without doing the research that HF posters did? Still no backup plan for the what if. No excuse for that.

Bourque: meh. Created cap room for something yet to be seen. Got rid of a playoff sharpshooter - me don't like that part. But if the goal isn't to make the playoffs then I understand the move.

Kaberle: as per Gauthier - he got him to turn the powerplay around thinking it would turn the team's fortunes around. Hasn't worked yet and is taking up some the cap room gained. The pp really was more of a threat with a blast from the point. How can you blind when you've been around the organization and saw the impact of Streit, Souray, Bergeron, Schneider and Wiz?

Martin: don't think he should have been fired.

Cunneyworth: don't think he should have been hired.

Cunneyworth's Treatment: has been abysmal or in Spacek's words "a circus".

I can't absolve Gauthier completely for Gainey's moves without knowing what impact he may have had since he has been part of the organization during that time with the position he held. It's not like Gauthier has come in from another organization - he's been around.

Gorges: meh. My biggest problem with Gorges is he gets knocked into the crease. Good little d-man with not much physicality.

Gill: better options to prepare for the inevitable Markov injury?

Woywitka: remember him? LOL

Emelin: Gauthier just gave him what he's wanted to come here, right? Nothing shrewd there but I like Emelin.

Diaz: smallish d-man but skilled but I like Diaz. Just don't know the upside of an already mid twenties d-man having already played at a pro level.

Hamrlik: don't know what the guy was after. Only know he wanted 2 years and that's what Washington offered. Know he was an integral part of holding the D together w/ the inevitable Markov injury. If not Hamr then how about a replacement?

Campoli: supposedly Markov's backup? Oh paleeezzzzze. The guy that gets scratched while the Habs are dressing 7 D?

Metropolit, Moore and Halpern all served a purpose. Good crafty, PKing, faceoff guys gone.

Wiz: did he ever negotiate with him? Never mind what Wiz got but did Gauthier ever try negotiating with him?

I look at where the Habs were a couple of years ago and what made them successful in overcoming the injuries and then look at the pieces that found them success in the playoffs and those proven pieces (proven playoff goaltender, proven sniper, proven 2 way vet d-men, proven blast from the point) are gone for the most part. So here they sit today with a very questionable playoff status. Very questionable following a circus of a season partially too brought on by Gauthier.

I'm a little scared if the team gives false hope and Gauthier goes on a "buying" spree.

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02-15-2012, 05:02 PM
  #722
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So many different ways to look at what Gauthier's done. He took a final 4 team that for the most part played without Markov to a bottom dweller that has played without Markov.

Halak: was it the right goaltender to trade for the return? We'll never know because the organization wasn't going to trade their prized pick.

Cole: he's been good this year but this year is potentially a waste. Will Cole be the same next year?

Markov: could the Habs have signed him to a "performance based" contract or did Gauthier bite on the words of two men (Markov, Markov's agent) and a doctor without doing the research that HF posters did? Still no backup plan for the what if. No excuse for that.

Bourque: meh. Created cap room for something yet to be seen. Got rid of a playoff sharpshooter - me don't like that part. But if the goal isn't to make the playoffs then I understand the move.

Kaberle: as per Gauthier - he got him to turn the powerplay around thinking it would turn the team's fortunes around. Hasn't worked yet and is taking up some the cap room gained. The pp really was more of a threat with a blast from the point. How can you blind when you've been around the organization and saw the impact of Streit, Souray, Bergeron, Schneider and Wiz?

Martin: don't think he should have been fired.

Cunneyworth: don't think he should have been hired.

Cunneyworth's Treatment: has been abysmal or in Spacek's words "a circus".

I can't absolve Gauthier completely for Gainey's moves without knowing what impact he may have had since he has been part of the organization during that time with the position he held. It's not like Gauthier has come in from another organization - he's been around.

Gorges: meh. My biggest problem with Gorges is he gets knocked into the crease. Good little d-man with not much physicality.

Gill: better options to prepare for the inevitable Markov injury?

Woywitka: remember him? LOL

Emelin: Gauthier just gave him what he's wanted to come here, right? Nothing shrewd there but I like Emelin.

Diaz: smallish d-man but skilled but I like Diaz. Just don't know the upside of an already mid twenties d-man having already played at a pro level.

Hamrlik: don't know what the guy was after. Only know he wanted 2 years and that's what Washington offered. Know he was an integral part of holding the D together w/ the inevitable Markov injury. If not Hamr then how about a replacement?

Campoli: supposedly Markov's backup? Oh paleeezzzzze. The guy that gets scratched while the Habs are dressing 7 D?

Metropolit, Moore and Halpern all served a purpose. Good crafty, PKing, faceoff guys gone.

Wiz: did he ever negotiate with him? Never mind what Wiz got but did Gauthier ever try negotiating with him?

I look at where the Habs were a couple of years ago and what made them successful in overcoming the injuries and then look at the pieces that found them success in the playoffs and those proven pieces (proven playoff goaltender, proven sniper, proven 2 way vet d-men, proven blast from the point) are gone for the most part. So here they sit today with a very questionable playoff status. Very questionable following a circus of a season partially too brought on by Gauthier.

I'm a little scared if the team gives false hope and Gauthier goes on a "buying" spree.
One thing's for sure: I don't want you as GM.

"Gorges meh"...

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02-15-2012, 05:05 PM
  #723
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Martin: don't think he should have been fired.
i think firing martin was gauthier's biggest mistake. but martin was old and boring...

and now we have a newbie coach who's playing hardball with veteran players while team is trying to reach a playoff spot.

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02-15-2012, 05:13 PM
  #724
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One thing's for sure: I don't want you as GM.

"Gorges meh"...
Meh........I'm deeply hurt. <doesn't shake head>

MEH - stick with the GM that took a playoff team from last year that gave the eventual SCC the biggest fight to a team that this year has been the laughing stock of the league. Keep in mind last year's team played a full season without Markov too. And "meh Gorges" was missing half of the season. I'd say some wrong pieces were cut loose and / or those voids not filled properly.

I like Gorges and his heart - don't like the length of the contract to a "meh" player.

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02-15-2012, 05:27 PM
  #725
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Meh........I'm deeply hurt. <doesn't shake head>

MEH - stick with the GM that took a playoff team from last year that gave the eventual SCC the biggest fight to a team that this year has been the laughing stock of the league. Keep in mind last year's team played a full season without Markov too. And "meh Gorges" was missing half of the season. I'd say some wrong pieces were cut loose and / or those voids not filled properly.

I like Gorges and his heart - don't like the length of the contract to a "meh" player.
Wiz did not want to comeback

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