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Dreger: Canadiens interested in Roy

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Old
01-21-2012, 08:10 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by BuiltTagonTough View Post
It's not that I would hate him on the team as a 2nd line center, but as was already mentioned, trading for him now is like reshuffling deck chairs on the Titanic. It's gonna take a lot of other moves and I think Roy could be moved for something better elsewhere as part of a package deal. If something comes with Plekanec then I might be more amenable to it, but I doubt it would be something more than a middling prospect/middling pick.
Fair enough, I actually agree with you to be honest but I am just affraid that Regier/Sabres wont go about it that way. Kinda just assuming this is as good as it is going to get with a trade of Roy and why I would be OK with it if it were to go down.

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01-22-2012, 11:54 AM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I would trade pretty much anyone necessary (not myers) for another projected top 10-ish pick.

The idea that they could find a way to come out of the draft with Gaunce and Galchenyuk is what helps me sleep at night.

I dream about getting a first out of NYI, MON, TB, or EMD.... by shipping out 1 or both of Roy and Miller....


I will be utterly surprised if any team gives up a first round pick for Roy or Miller. Two very over rated players...

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01-22-2012, 05:27 PM
  #153
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A team gave up a first round draft pick for an older, less productive player who had a limited number of potential destinations -- that being Mike Fisher. Someone will fork over a first for Roy.

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01-22-2012, 05:36 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
A team gave up a first round draft pick for an older, less productive player who had a limited number of potential destinations -- that being Mike Fisher. Someone will fork over a first for Roy.
Exactly, and Fisher even got a conditional pick coming back with him that ended up a 3rd (and could have been a second if Nashville won another playoff series). To think Roy's value is less is just wrong.

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01-22-2012, 07:23 PM
  #155
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Colorado gave up a first and a second for Varlomov, pretty sure Miller could get a 1st

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01-22-2012, 07:38 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by SECRET SQUIRREL View Post
As would I but it seems like Regier is gonna go the top 6 swap route... I guess my question should have been if we were only going to swap roy for another top 6 guy, why do people not like Plekanec? He was one of the main reasons (Cammalleri as well) why the Canadians went deep into the playoffs the last few times. He can shut down top guys and has pretty good offensive talent, plus actually performs in the playoffs. I actually think he would fit rather well on the top line with Vanek and Poms.
Because posters are holding on to the hope (unrealistic IMO) that Roy can be packaged for that mythical #1 center. Or they actually think it makes sense to trade away our only top 6 center for picks and prospects. Thus leaving us with no top 6 centers and having an even bigger hole to fill.


If we can trade Roy for Plekanec we give up some offense but gain defensively. We would also get a center thats had some playoff success. Some posters have pointed to the difference in cap hit. But Plekanec is signed for 4more years to Roy's one more year. That 1mil difference is fairly meaningless since Roy's cap will jump after next year.

If we got Plekanec, we would be getting a good two way top 6 center thats had playoff success and is locked in for 4 more seasons and at fair price (5mil). Hardly a bad return for a player like Roy.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-22-2012 at 08:22 PM.
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01-22-2012, 08:46 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo View Post
If we give up a fist I'm officially switching teams.

For the first time since 2005 we're gonna have a top-10 draft pick (most likely) and I want to draft someone that will have an impact. If PG thinks he can salvage the season by trading for a 5'9" center then he's retarded.
Not cool and totally inappropriate! Where are the mods on this? This is completely uncalled for!

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01-22-2012, 09:02 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Because posters are holding on to the hope (unrealistic IMO) that Roy can be packaged for that mythical #1 center. Or they actually think it makes sense to trade away our only top 6 center for picks and prospects. Thus leaving us with no top 6 centers and having an even bigger hole to fill.
It may not make sense to trade away your only top-6 center for futures, but people that want to trade Roy for those futures are the same people that think tanking to try and get Grigorenko is in the team's best interest. Therefore, in their eyes, not having a top-6 center besides Roy is moot because we're aiming to lose anyhow.

I'm slowly thinking that wouldn't be a horrible move. I've never advocating tanking, but when it's in a case such as this - where the team is just so far lost and emotionally detached from the game, I'm for it. Grigorenko is a franchise-changing prospect.

I'd love for the team to get hot, make the playoffs, and win the cup. The realist in me see's that that won't happen. This team needs a change, badly.

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01-22-2012, 09:40 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Loods View Post
It may not make sense to trade away your only top-6 center for futures, but people that want to trade Roy for those futures are the same people that think tanking to try and get Grigorenko is in the team's best interest. Therefore, in their eyes, not having a top-6 center besides Roy is moot because we're aiming to lose anyhow.

I'm slowly thinking that wouldn't be a horrible move. I've never advocating tanking, but when it's in a case such as this - where the team is just so far lost and emotionally detached from the game, I'm for it. Grigorenko is a franchise-changing prospect.
It would be.

In the real hockey world there is absolutely no guarantee they would drop off enough to be in the lottery and then win it for the top pick. Odds are actually against that happening. In fantasyland, where all things are possible of course, everything would work out perfectly and we would get the top pick.
Quote:
I'd love for the team to get hot, make the playoffs, and win the cup. The realist in me see's that that won't happen. This team needs a change, badly
I'm not talking about this season and making the playoffs. I'm talking about next year and beyond. We we need centers. Trading away our best one with the hope that we might do bad enough for Grigorenko would be reckless IMO.


The irony in all of this is keeping Roy may actually be the best way to keep the team in a funk. Trading him may snap enough players out of it that the team starts playing better.


Last edited by joshjull: 01-22-2012 at 10:04 PM.
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01-22-2012, 10:07 PM
  #160
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They can't trade Roy unless they acquire Stastny. There aren't any other top 6 centers available via trade that could fill Roy's role and they can't deal him and hope for the best during free agent season. They should be looking to acquire another center; not looking to deal Roy.

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01-22-2012, 11:51 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
It would be.

In the real hockey world there is absolutely no guarantee they would drop off enough to be in the lottery and then win it for the top pick. Odds are actually against that happening. In fantasyland, where all things are possible of course, everything would work out perfectly and we would get the top pick.


I'm not talking about this season and making the playoffs. I'm talking about next year and beyond. We we need centers. Trading away our best one with the hope that we might do bad enough for Grigorenko would be reckless IMO.


The irony in all of this is keeping Roy may actually be the best way to keep the team in a funk. Trading him may snap enough players out of it that the team starts playing better.
I've changed my stance a little upon reading your post.

I think my outlook was jaded by the idea of coming away with Grigorenko in the draft. Like I said, he's a franchise-changing prospect. Getting him would be unbelievable. I'm also making myself believe that we can move Roy for another 1st and possibly come away with 2 of the 4 big center prospects (Grigorenko, Gaunce, Galchenyuk, Girgensons). Highly unlikely and it's warping my view.

IF we somehow come away with Grigorenko, chances are he'll sign and play in the league as soon as next year. Developing him along with another good (not great) center is probably a much better option than feeding Grigs to the wolves and expecting a number one center instantly.

I'm going to try and forget the Grigorenko possibility though.



Not getting a center for Roy puts us in a bad position not just for this year, but the next couple.


My issue with it now is only that I'm not a Plekanec fan. I never have been. But the idea of flipping Roy for another top-6 center addresses a culture change (though not fully) while keeping our center depth how it is (at the very least).

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01-22-2012, 11:57 PM
  #162
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Or you can expect to get no centers with our 1st round pick(s). And if we do, wouldn't that be cool.

That's where I'm at. I won't therefore be all pissed if we don't get one.

Also if we do get one, I don't expect him to play for the Sabres next year. If he does, cool. If not, I won't be all pissed.

That's where I'm at.


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01-23-2012, 12:00 AM
  #163
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Originally Posted by ZZamboni View Post
Or you can expect to get no centers with our 1st round pick(s). And if we do, wouldn't that be cool.

That's where I'm at. I won't therefore be all pissed if we don't get one.

Also if we do get one, I don't expect him to play for the Sabres next year. If he does, cool. If not, I won't be all pissed.

That's where I'm at.

The sports fan in me doesn't allow for that kind of thinking Being a Buffalo sports fan I should always have that frame of mind.

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01-23-2012, 12:05 AM
  #164
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The sports fan in me doesn't allow for that kind of thinking Being a Buffalo sports fan I should always have that frame of mind.


Yea but wow these forums would be so boring if everyone was rational 100% of the time.

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01-23-2012, 12:13 AM
  #165
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Watch how the Sabres will pick nothing but defenseman and mayyybe a winger or two in the draft. Tim Horton's forward lines!!

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01-23-2012, 12:17 AM
  #166
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Watch how the Sabres will pick nothing but defenseman and mayyybe a winger or two in the draft. Tim Horton's forward lines!!
That's the spirit! Looooooow expectations. Makes for a better offseason

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01-23-2012, 12:19 AM
  #167
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That's the spirit! Looooooow expectations. Makes for a better offseason
And yet, I'll still be all

The more things change...

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01-23-2012, 04:21 AM
  #168
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Because posters are holding on to the hope (unrealistic IMO) that Roy can be packaged for that mythical #1 center. Or they actually think it makes sense to trade away our only top 6 center for picks and prospects. Thus leaving us with no top 6 centers and having an even bigger hole to fill.


If we can trade Roy for Plekanec we give up some offense but gain defensively. We would also get a center thats had some playoff success. Some posters have pointed to the difference in cap hit. But Plekanec is signed for 4more years to Roy's one more year. That 1mil difference is fairly meaningless since Roy's cap will jump after next year.

If we got Plekanec, we would be getting a good two way top 6 center thats had playoff success and is locked in for 4 more seasons and at fair price (5mil). Hardly a bad return for a player like Roy.
Exactly. Make the trade for Plekanec. Then do whatever it takes to get Grigorenko at the draft. We are looking at a high pick as it is but if its not high enough use whatever assets needed to move up to get him. I would be happy with those 2 as our top centers going forward.

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01-23-2012, 09:06 AM
  #169
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Originally Posted by SECRET SQUIRREL View Post
Exactly. Make the trade for Plekanec. Then do whatever it takes to get Grigorenko at the draft. We are looking at a high pick as it is but if its not high enough use whatever assets needed to move up to get him. I would be happy with those 2 as our top centers going forward.
Why would Montreal deal Plekanec?

They are in a similar spot to the Sabres with a severe lack of depth at center with Gomez playing worse than any high priced Sabre.

Montreal wants to add Roy to Plekanec and Eller.

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01-23-2012, 09:42 AM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Smitzo4221 View Post
I will be utterly surprised if any team gives up a first round pick for Roy or Miller. Two very over rated players...
You're wrong.

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A team gave up a first round draft pick for an older, less productive player who had a limited number of potential destinations -- that being Mike Fisher. Someone will fork over a first for Roy.
Precisely. And don't forget that LA gave up a 1st, a pretty good prospect (Teubert), and a conditional pick (2nd rounder if the Kings win the Cup, 3rd otherwise) for Pancakes Penner.

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01-23-2012, 09:52 AM
  #171
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You're wrong.
I would be surprised if Miller netted a huge return as the number of big goalie moves has been few and far between lately.

Yeah, the Avs gave up a big package for Varlamov and the Flyers gave a big contract to Bryzgalov.

But, Vokoun was had for a relatively cheap 1 year deal and there haven't been any other big goalie moves of note.

Add in that Varly & Bryz haven't exactly helped their new teams and Miller's injuries and struggles this year, and I'd be surprised if Miller netted the Sabres a healthy trade package.

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Precisely. And don't forget that LA gave up a 1st, a pretty good prospect (Teubert), and a conditional pick (2nd rounder if the Kings win the Cup, 3rd otherwise) for Pancakes Penner.
I would definitely expect a nice return if the team decides to move Roy for futures.

The question now is whether or not that is where the Sabres brass heads are at or not....

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01-23-2012, 10:29 AM
  #172
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I agree. I haven't run through rosters looking, but moving Miller is a matter of finding a team that:
-Is an upper tier goalie away from a cup
-Has the cap space for Miller
-Even perceives Miller to be the upper tier goalie that will get them to the cup

Roy, on the other hand... as much as he's beaten up on this board, is still a center with some solid and consistent offensive numbers that is regularly in the first unit PP and PK.

It'll be much easier to find a match for Roy than for Miller.

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01-23-2012, 10:36 AM
  #173
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I agree. I haven't run through rosters looking, but moving Miller is a matter of finding a team that:
-Is an upper tier goalie away from a cup
-Has the cap space for Miller
-Even perceives Miller to be the upper tier goalie that will get them to the cup

Roy, on the other hand... as much as he's beaten up on this board, is still a center with some solid and consistent offensive numbers that is regularly in the first unit PP and PK.

It'll be much easier to find a match for Roy than for Miller.
Finding a match for Miller mid-season would be tough. But I think if you trade him in the off season, there are a few teams that Buffalo would field offers from should he be made available.

That said, I still don't think trading Miller is a good idea.

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01-23-2012, 12:19 PM
  #174
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Agree with joshjull. I'm OK with Roy for Plekanec.

However, I'm hoping BUF retains Roy for center depth, acquires another #1a / #1B center, and then allows Roy to leave after his contract expires, when he'll be 30yo.

If BUF had center depth now, I'd trade Roy tomorow for the right package.

Even if you consider the utter calamnity this season has been, what team interested in a serious push for the Cup wouldn't want to pick up Roy at the deadline as affordable center depth insurance, plays ES, PP & PK, and has another affordable year remaining on his deal. Don't like him after your playoff run, then shop him again this offseason to another team (even back to BUF if they haven't solved their center problem - and it's a testament to how poor the Sabres center situation is that I'm even thinking that way about a boomerang).

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01-23-2012, 12:24 PM
  #175
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Agree with joshjull. I'm OK with Roy for Plekanec.

However, I'm hoping BUF retains Roy for center depth, acquires another #1a / #1B center, and then allows Roy to leave after his contract expires, when he'll be 30yo.

If BUF had center depth now, I'd trade Roy tomorow for the right package.

Even if you consider the utter calamnity this season has been, what team interested in a serious push for the Cup wouldn't want to pick up Roy at the deadline as affordable center depth insurance, plays ES, PP & PK, and has another affordable year remaining on his deal. Don't like him after your playoff run, then shop him again this offseason to another team (even back to BUF if they haven't solved their center problem - and it's a testament to how poor the Sabres center situation is that I'm even thinking that way about a boomerang).
So let's keep Roy even though he is assumed to be a big part of the chemistry problem on the team. Also instead of probably getting a 1st round pick +, let's get nothing which would obviously help build this team for the future.

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