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UFC on Fox 2: Evans vs. Davis

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Old
01-28-2012, 10:04 PM
  #201
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Not sure how much stock people put in FightMetric but they have Chael outlanding Bisping by an almost 2-to-1 margin in strikes for the first round (in addition to the two successful takedowns) so between that and the third, 29-28 Sonnen seems like a fair decision.

http://blog.fightmetric.com/2012/01/...icial-ufc.html

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01-28-2012, 10:09 PM
  #202
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Haven't read through the last few pages of this thread but was I the only one getting really annoyed by Bisping constantly grabbing the fence, the cage, the top of the cage, and punching the back of Chael's head over and over and over and over....? I'm kinda disappointed Big John didn't take a point away because he constantly warned him but did nothing.

As for the decision, I had no real problem with it. Just because Joe Rogan says Bisping is winning doesn't make it true. They both landed a bit standing but Chael took advantage of his takedowns to get the W.

Would have liked to see Rashad finish the fight but it was a good performance. His wrestling was sharp, especially going against a guy like Davis. Boxing was good too. Really hope he trains hard and destroys Jones.

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01-28-2012, 10:31 PM
  #203
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I thought Bisping earned the decision. The striking was close, but I thought his control was better in the first 2 rounds.

Oh well, it was a close fight, could have gone either way. Not really a surprise, Bisping has done well against wrestlers in the past.

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01-28-2012, 11:02 PM
  #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colonel_korn View Post
Not sure how much stock people put in FightMetric but they have Chael outlanding Bisping by an almost 2-to-1 margin in strikes for the first round (in addition to the two successful takedowns) so between that and the third, 29-28 Sonnen seems like a fair decision.

http://blog.fightmetric.com/2012/01/...icial-ufc.html
I put zero stock in it, because I thought Bisping was thoroughly tagging him harder throughout the fight. I tend to take issue with FightMetric quite often. I think their scoring is about as accurate as MSG's body checking stats.

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01-28-2012, 11:04 PM
  #205
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Oh, and for the record...

As a huge Demian Maia fan, I would be 100% OK with the UFC cutting him.

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01-28-2012, 11:09 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Oh, and for the record...

As a huge Demian Maia fan, I would be 100% OK with the UFC cutting him.
Its funny how someone can try and fix the hole in their game and it end up sorta being their own downfall.

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01-28-2012, 11:23 PM
  #207
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Two things.
Bisping won that fight.
Davis should not have been in there vs. Rashad.

Bonus thing :
Rashad going to beat this ass.


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01-29-2012, 02:11 AM
  #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Crap decision

I picked Chael. I rooted for Chael.

Bisping won that fight.

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01-29-2012, 04:33 AM
  #209
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Sonnen/Bisping was a lot closer than expected, but I don't have an issue with the judges seeing Chael as the winner. He dominated the 3rd and did enough in the 1st to get the nod IMO. The 30-27 decision was bad though, Bisping definitely deserved that 2nd round. Michael definitely proved himself tonight and I'd like to see him face someone like Munoz next. I think he's still definitely in the picture for a title fight.

Not surprising that Evans was able to come away with a dominant win over Davis. The only advantage Davis has was his wrestling and it was never going to be enough to make a difference.

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01-29-2012, 05:14 AM
  #210
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People saying Bisping won that fight is honestly comical. I think people see 30-27 and get upset because 30-27 implies it was a lopsided contest. 30-27 can be a very close fight. Watching it live I had it 30-27, but I could certainly understand a 29-28 for Sonnen. I don't see how anyone could possibly give that fight to Bisping. That being said I thought Sonnen would have an easier time with him. But ultimately he did enough to win.

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01-29-2012, 08:00 AM
  #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post

As for the decision, I had no real problem with it. Just because Joe Rogan says Bisping is winning doesn't make it true. They both landed a bit standing but Chael took advantage of his takedowns to get the W.
One of the few times I really disagreed with Joe Rogan, just because Bisping was blocking a lot of Chael's takedowns doesn't meant he won the round, Chael was the busy fighter IMO and was more aggressive bringing the fight to Bisping.

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01-29-2012, 12:33 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
Yep, no doubt about that. That card didn't have good fights and was really not good for business.
Boring fights, but I disagree on the good for business thing. This event helped set up what will likely be the two biggest PPVs of the year.

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01-29-2012, 01:15 PM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGDDYKWL View Post
People saying Bisping won that fight is honestly comical. I think people see 30-27 and get upset because 30-27 implies it was a lopsided contest. 30-27 can be a very close fight. Watching it live I had it 30-27, but I could certainly understand a 29-28 for Sonnen. I don't see how anyone could possibly give that fight to Bisping. That being said I thought Sonnen would have an easier time with him. But ultimately he did enough to win.
If you had it 30-27, then I honestly question what fight you watched. There is zero chance Sonnen won the second round (just as there is zero chance Bisping won the third round).

I guess Bloody Elbow, Dana White, and a number of other sites/people out there don't know anything since they gave the fight to Bisping.

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01-29-2012, 01:17 PM
  #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
Sonnen/Bisping was a lot closer than expected, but I don't have an issue with the judges seeing Chael as the winner. He dominated the 3rd and did enough in the 1st to get the nod IMO. The 30-27 decision was bad though, Bisping definitely deserved that 2nd round. Michael definitely proved himself tonight and I'd like to see him face someone like Munoz next. I think he's still definitely in the picture for a title fight.

Not surprising that Evans was able to come away with a dominant win over Davis. The only advantage Davis has was his wrestling and it was never going to be enough to make a difference.
It's not a robbery or anything. I think Bisping definitely won, but I could see scoring for Sonnen if you are the type that scores takedowns higher than anything else (that would be how Sonnen would win the first round, I guess).

The 30-27 card is just a joke, though. Funny that it happened in Chicago (the king city of rigging ****).

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01-29-2012, 01:19 PM
  #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
Its funny how someone can try and fix the hole in their game and it end up sorta being their own downfall.
It's terrible. Maia is done as a contender in the UFC and probably even done as a gatekeeper. He either needs to completely re-evaluate his game or be cut. Sad to see one of my favorite fighters in the world ruin himself like this.

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01-29-2012, 01:43 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by Avs_19 View Post
Jones opens as a 6 to 1 favourite over Rashad.
seems fair to me

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01-29-2012, 02:02 PM
  #217
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I love the odds for Rashad there. May make sense to drop a couple bucks on him.

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01-29-2012, 02:07 PM
  #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
If you had it 30-27, then I honestly question what fight you watched. There is zero chance Sonnen won the second round (just as there is zero chance Bisping won the third round).

I guess Bloody Elbow, Dana White, and a number of other sites/people out there don't know anything since they gave the fight to Bisping.
I'd have to go back and rewatch the 2nd round because if I recall correctly it was essentially even. If I remember right the striking was close and Sonnen got a takedown, and I felt he was the aggressor (which good or bad we know that scores on the cards). I can understand people giving that round to Bisping, but I guess my point is just watching that fight as a whole, Sonnen won it. Certainly wasn't an overly impressive performance, but Bisping essentially did nothing to him. Stuffing takedowns doesn't score any points in my book. It helps in the fact that it prevents your opponent from scoring points, but it certainly doesn't warrant giving you any. I realize fights aren't scored this way, but just as a whole Sonnen dictated the majority of the action, took Bisping down several times, had his back, mounted him, and at the very least was even in the standup (I'd give him the slight edge). That translates to a win in my book.

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01-29-2012, 03:05 PM
  #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGDDYKWL View Post
I'd have to go back and rewatch the 2nd round because if I recall correctly it was essentially even. If I remember right the striking was close and Sonnen got a takedown, and I felt he was the aggressor (which good or bad we know that scores on the cards). I can understand people giving that round to Bisping, but I guess my point is just watching that fight as a whole, Sonnen won it. Certainly wasn't an overly impressive performance, but Bisping essentially did nothing to him. Stuffing takedowns doesn't score any points in my book. It helps in the fact that it prevents your opponent from scoring points, but it certainly doesn't warrant giving you any. I realize fights aren't scored this way, but just as a whole Sonnen dictated the majority of the action, took Bisping down several times, had his back, mounted him, and at the very least was even in the standup (I'd give him the slight edge). That translates to a win in my book.
Wait, stuffing takedowns scores no points but landing them and doing nothing with them does?

It's sad that MMA has devolved into something like this. It's even worse that a lot of judges feel the same way. More educated people really need to be brought in to judge and this ridiculous mindset needs to be squashed.

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01-29-2012, 03:34 PM
  #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Wait, stuffing takedowns scores no points but landing them and doing nothing with them does?

It's sad that MMA has devolved into something like this. It's even worse that a lot of judges feel the same way. More educated people really need to be brought in to judge and this ridiculous mindset needs to be squashed.
Sonnen won the first and last rounds. Not sure how anyone could claim otherwise. Outside of controlling Sonnen against the cage in the clinch (all while grabbing the fence, top of the cage and Sonnen's shorts, Bisping essentially did nothing. Certainly not enough to claim that he was "robbed" of a decision.

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01-29-2012, 03:39 PM
  #221
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30-27 was a terrible score for that fight. No one can seriously argue against that. If you think Chael won or Mike won.

I only have watched it the once live. I thought Bisping had the first two rounds 10-9.
I was not a Bisping fan, or Chael hater going into the night.

Bisping is the man no matter what anyone says or what the outcome was.
Chael comes at you like a train and there is not many people in the UFC that can even slow him down. (without a triangle ) Bisping actually fought him as Chael would say and did pretty ****ing well.


Jonathan, I think Maia got stuck in the moment of wanting a exciting fight on fox.
Ever since the Anderson fight He seems to forget stuff like

Clinch-> Trip-> Mount-> Triangle is is exciting as all hell.

He is 35 and the UFC like him hopefully he gets some good fights .. and his people talk to him about game plans.


Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Outside of controlling Sonnen against the cage in the clinch (all while grabbing the fence
Bisping did a lot of controlling in that fight... and warnings for grabbing the fence mean nothing.

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01-29-2012, 03:49 PM
  #222
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It's a bit of a shame how much better the prelims were than the actual main card. The Maia fight was horrendous, it's one thing to try to add striking to your arsenal, but he didn't even attempt to use his BJJ once in the fight, even when it went to the ground. Bisping would have annihilated him.

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01-29-2012, 05:41 PM
  #223
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I had the fight 29-28 Bisping, I thought he was far more effective than Chael was in the first two rounds. Some people (including the judges) obviously value takedowns more than others. Joe Lauzon had it 30-27 for Sonnen, and Dana had Bisping winning it, so it just goes to show how differently people interpret the scoring criteria. Bisping deserved the title shot, and I hope he gets it one day simply because he was robbed last night imo.

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01-29-2012, 05:56 PM
  #224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Wait, stuffing takedowns scores no points but landing them and doing nothing with them does?

It's sad that MMA has devolved into something like this. It's even worse that a lot of judges feel the same way. More educated people really need to be brought in to judge and this ridiculous mindset needs to be squashed.
Landing a takedown and not doing anything with it scores more than defending a takedown, yes. But that being said, a takedown in and of itself scores very little. It's still aggression and control though which would have to be considered more than neutral.

Let me ask you this. Rounds aside, just having to declare a winner of the fight as a whole, would you say it was Bisping?

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01-29-2012, 06:18 PM
  #225
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Originally Posted by BGDDYKWL View Post
Landing a takedown and not doing anything with it scores more than defending a takedown, yes. But that being said, a takedown in and of itself scores very little. It's still aggression and control though which would have to be considered more than neutral.

Let me ask you this. Rounds aside, just having to declare a winner of the fight as a whole, would you say it was Bisping?
Your last point is important to me because its exactly what needs to be changed in MMA. Screw this per-round judging, each judge should just decide who was the better fighter over the course of the entire fight. Two narrow rounds for either guy should not always be worth more than one fairly dominant (but not 10-8) round. Sonnen, albeit not by much, won the fight if you judge on an 'overall' judging. Just like Machida beat Rampage, and Gleason Tibau beat Melvin Guillard. There are lots of other examples. I think its the better way to get the "true" winner.

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