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Florida, Tampa arenas housing the homeless?

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Old
01-21-2012, 06:12 PM
  #1
LadyStanley
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Florida, Tampa arenas housing the homeless?

http://www.postonpolitics.com/2012/0...ball-stadiums/

Florida bill SB 816 is heading to committee on Monday.

There's a law on the books for 20 years that any sports facility in the state built with state funds must open their doors as a homeless facility when they don't have events or other contractual obligations. And none of the 17 arenas/stadiums in state have done so.

Quote:
Bennett’s measure (SB 816) would require that counties and professional sports franchises who’ve received state aid to build stadiums or other facilities prove to the attorney general that they’ve got a homeless shelter in place, or refund the money to the state.

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01-21-2012, 06:21 PM
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http://deadspin.com/5878158/florida-...e-has-complied

From above: Tampa - would owe ~$32.7mm, Florida ~$30.8m


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01-21-2012, 06:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
http://www.postonpolitics.com/2012/0...ball-stadiums/

Florida bill SB 816 is heading to committee on Monday.

There's a law on the books for 20 years that any sports facility in the state built with state funds must open their doors as a homeless facility when they don't have events or other contractual obligations. And none of the 17 arenas/stadiums in state have done so.
That's a pretty ridiculous law, though I guess if it's funded by state money they can really do whatever they want...

Do we know that the Panthers and Lightning haven't been doing what they're required to?

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01-21-2012, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
That's a pretty ridiculous law, though I guess if it's funded by state money they can really do whatever they want...

Do we know that the Panthers and Lightning haven't been doing what they're required to?
None of the 17 facilities that have received state funds to build facilities have, including both NHL teams.

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01-21-2012, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
None of the 17 facilities that have received state funds to build facilities have, including both NHL teams.
Wow...guess we'll probably start seeing more homeless shelters popping up in the near future in FL

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01-21-2012, 06:53 PM
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I guess it's a legit way for the Panthers to boost their attendance numbers

On a more serious note, I think this is a good way for the various Florida teams that _do_ struggle with attendance (Panthers, Rays, Marlins) to generate goodwill & publicity etc in their respective communities, while doing something useful for those communities.

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01-21-2012, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
That's a pretty ridiculous law, though I guess if it's funded by state money they can really do whatever they want...

Do we know that the Panthers and Lightning haven't been doing what they're required to?
It was pretty close that Broward County didn't use arena as shelter after hurricane Vilma six years ago, but i guess they were able to use schools etc (schools were closed several weeks).

JOL

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01-21-2012, 07:16 PM
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What a stupid law. There's no way this is feasible, and it only sounds like a good idea to those completely clueless to the issues surrounding homelessness.

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01-21-2012, 07:41 PM
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As not a huge fan of the economic juggernauts, I am a huge fan of this law. The state had large contributions with the arena, they should be obligated to make som edifference in the community. Only problem is that there would be too many homeless surrounding the games

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01-21-2012, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
There's a law on the books for 20 years that any sports facility in the state built with state funds must open their doors as a homeless facility when they don't have events or other contractual obligations.
Wow. How is that even practicable short of an all out Katrina type situation?. In Hialeah, Ambling & Strolling is a Misdemeanor. Elsewhere in Florida, Chickens are a Protected Species. You need a Permit to have a Burglar Alarm. In Saratoga its illegal to sing in public while wearing a bathing suit. Stubborn children in Jupiter can be charged with Vagrancy & hauled away. These are all very real Laws. I could go on & on and not just in Florida but pretty much everywhere. A wonderfully munificent thought I suppose but how do you execute?. Consult with the Salvation Army & have them setup foodcourts & sleeping cots throughout the empty concourses?. You could get 1000's into an arena. What if they decide there not leaving?. Mental health issues. Stuff they bring in. All kinds of problems. Could be the States got a budget deficit & wants some financial help to build new facilities "or else" sort of approach or what?.

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01-21-2012, 09:49 PM
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Could be the States got a budget deficit & wants some financial help to build new facilities "or else" sort of approach or what?.
doubtful.. this is probably a situation where one line got inserted into omnibus bill and nobody paid much attention.. until this idiot decided to go all populist.

ah, the joys of American democracy.

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01-22-2012, 12:16 PM
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SB 816, as presented to the FL Senate

Quote:
SB 816: Professional Sports Facilities

GENERAL BILL by Bennett

Professional Sports Facilities; Requiring the county commission in a county in which a professional sports facility is located to establish a local homeless coalition if a local homeless program does not exist in that county; requiring that, by a specified date, the professional sports franchise that plays in a facility that benefited from financial assistance from the state, and the county in which the facility is located, provide the Auditor General with documentation that a homeless shelter has been operating at the facility from the effective date of the contract between the county and the professional sports franchise; requiring the Auditor General to levy a specified fine against the professional sports franchise and the county if, after a specified date, the Auditor General determines that a homeless shelter is not operating at the facility until such time that the professional sports franchise and county are operating a homeless shelter, etc.
"if a local homeless program does not exist in that county".

To my understanding, and I'm still researching it, the current law that exists is where in the event of a State-of-Emergency (i.e. Hurricane, other natural disasters) facilities are to open their doors as refuge and staging areas whereby the county takes over the facility temporarily.

Jol is correct, the BAC came pretty darn close to having to open it's doors. The verbiage of the County taking over the facility is in the Arena Management Agreement.

It should be noted, or at least I'll come out and say it... Sen. Bennett has for years gone after Sports Franchises (especially baseball/Spring Training) for just about everything and anything. At times, his dogged efforts have some merit. Others, well... no pun intended are fanatical

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01-22-2012, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
It should be noted, or at least I'll come out and say it... Sen. Bennett has for years gone after Sports Franchises (especially baseball/Spring Training) for just about everything and anything. At times, his dogged efforts have some merit. Others, well... no pun intended are fanatical
Oh Boy, hold on here, isnt that the same Senator Mike Bennett (R) who either crafted himself or sponsored a bill making it almost impossible for anyone other than Republicans to vote (that fortunately got shot down)?. Who wanted to drug test food stamp recipients, with a Positive resulting in "No Soup for You"?... Was caught red-handed (as featured on YouTube) eyeballing pictures of scantily clad women on his laptop while listening to (of all things) an Abortion Debate in session when he grew bored?.

That guy?!
...

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01-22-2012, 12:58 PM
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When I read the thread title I actually expected it to be a story about homeless people scooping up cheap/giveaway tickets just to be in a building for a few hours.

The actual story seems to be simply an attempt by a politician to get a dig at taxpayer-funded sports facilities - he fully knows how unrealistic the idea is.

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01-22-2012, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
Oh Boy, hold on here, isnt that the same Senator Mike Bennett (R) who either crafted himself or sponsored a bill making it almost impossible for anyone other than Republicans to vote (that fortunately got shot down)?. Who wanted to drug test food stamp recipients, with a Positive resulting in "No Soup for You"?... Was caught red-handed (as featured on YouTube) eyeballing pictures of scantily clad women on his laptop while listening to (of all things) an Abortion Debate in session when he grew bored?.

That guy?!
...
Winner! You have won... a new car!

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01-22-2012, 04:01 PM
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This is the already existing State Statute, which Sen. Bennett drafted SB 816 to amend:

Quote:
F.S. 288.1166

F.S. Chapt. 288 - Public Business - Commercial Development and Capital Improvements

Pt. 1 - General Provisions

288.1166 Professional sports facility; designation as shelter site for the homeless; establishment of local programs.—Any professional sports facility constructed with financial assistance from the State of Florida shall be designated as a shelter site for the homeless in accordance with the criteria of locally existing homeless shelter programs, except when the facility is otherwise contractually obligated for a specific event or activity. Should a local program not be in existence in the facility’s area, such program shall be established in accordance with normally accepted criteria as defined by the county or its designee.
History.—s. 8, ch. 88-226.
http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/...0288.1166.html


Last edited by Major4Boarding: 01-22-2012 at 04:05 PM. Reason: Forgot link
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01-22-2012, 05:01 PM
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What you think of this law doesn't matter. The owners were aware of it when they accepted the money, yet they had no intention to fulfil their end of the bargain. That's dishonest and they should pay for it.

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01-22-2012, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Skarjak View Post
What you think of this law doesn't matter. The owners were aware of it when they accepted the money, yet they had no intention to fulfil their end of the bargain. That's dishonest and they should pay for it.
That's not the established way of doing things.. when stupid laws are passed, workarounds are found.

This obviously has negatives and positives. But such is the legal and political system.

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01-22-2012, 05:24 PM
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Winner! You have won... a new car!
Thats what I thought. Clearly the mans bent.
A Pseudo Republican Tea Partying Fascist.

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01-22-2012, 06:47 PM
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So.... they'd just become temporary homeless shelters that would invariably seem the homeless shuffled in and out on a regular basis?

That sounds... like an awful idea. Plus, don't most teams keep offices operational in their arenas/stadiums throughout the season and even the offseason? So they're pretty much always business going on there.

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01-22-2012, 06:48 PM
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Do they define what "state dollars" are? I know the Tampa Bay Times Forum was built using county money but I'm unaware if it was built using state money(unless the money was given to the county by the state).

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01-23-2012, 07:50 AM
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This is no more absurd than taxpayers funding the building of arenas/stadiums for millionaire owners to make money off of. While we're at at it they should be forced to give discount tickets to police, firefighters, teachers, and sanitation workers as well.


Last edited by Bongo: 01-23-2012 at 10:15 AM.
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01-23-2012, 11:46 AM
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Remember folks, the County is on the hook for this too. I wonder if the loop hole he's trying to exploit is a direct coalition with the franchise, rather than a broad interpretation of "coalition".

Here's how the "Local Homeless Coalition" is spelled out in 420.623, F.S

Quote:

Local coalitions for the homeless.—
(1) ESTABLISHMENT.—The department shall establish local coalitions to plan, network, coordinate, and monitor the delivery of services to the homeless.

(various subsections)

(2) FUNCTIONS OF LOCAL COALITIONS.—Major functions of the local coalitions are to:

(a) Develop or assist with the development of the local homeless continuum of care plan, as described in s. 420.624, for the catchment area containing the county or region served by the local homeless coalition. Unless otherwise specified in the plan or as a result of an agreement with another coalition in the same catchment area, the local coalition shall serve as the lead agency for the local homeless assistance continuum of care.

(b) Discuss local issues related to homelessness and the needs of the homeless.

(c) Inventory all local resources for the homeless, including, but not limited to, food assistance, clothing, emergency shelter, low-cost housing, emergency medical care, counseling, training, and employment.

(more various subsections)
http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/.../0420.623.html

Every County in the State of Florida has a Homeless Coalition.

In summary

Sport Franchises AND the County are to provide proof to the Auditor General by Jan. 1, 2013 that from the the effective contract date between franchise and County till July 1, 2012 the facility(ies) had a homeless shelter operating.

If either "cannot demonstrate to the Auditor General that a homeless shelter has been operating, or has only been operating for a portion of that time, the county and the professional sports franchise shall refund to the state all funds advanced to the county and the professional sports franchise by the state, less the sum representing any month in which the facility has operated as a homeless shelter. Such refund shall be made no later than December 31, 2012."

If it is determined both the County and the Franchise are still out of compliance...

Quote:
This bill requires that if, after January 1, 2013, the Auditor General determines that a homeless shelter is still not operating at a facility that benefited from financial assistance from the state, the Auditor General shall fine the professional sports franchise that plays in the facility and the county in which the facility is located an amount going forward equal to 150 percent of any financial assistance received each month from the state until the professional sports franchise and the county are operating a homeless shelter at the sports facility.
http://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill...816.pre.ca.PDF

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01-23-2012, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post

Florida bill SB 816 is heading to committee on Monday.
I failed to mention earlier that the Committee it is heading to is the Consumer Affairs Committee, chaired by none other than...

Sen. Mike Bennett

They are in session as I type.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
Thats what I thought. Clearly the mans bent.
A Pseudo Republican Tea Partying Fascist.
Just a sampling of what I was referring to earlier...

Quote:
Sen. Mike Bennett: Play fair and follow the rules and the law
State-supported facilities should serve as shelters, or teams should refund money

Published: Sunday, Jan. 22, 2012

I have long argued that Florida taxpayers should be able to decide whether or not their hard-earned dollars should be spent to subsidize professional sports facilities statewide rather than having a referendum by the counties to determine if their residents choose to fund sports stadiums.

As I have said many times, if a sports team can pay out millions of dollars in salaries, they can build their own stadium.

Last summer, I discovered that a law established in 1988 provides that state-funded sports facilities should be designated homeless shelters when they are not in use for events and, guess what? To date, no state-funded sports facility has complied with that almost 24-year-old law.

Subsequently, I filed Senate Bill 816 this year, requiring county commissions with professional sports teams receiving state funds to establish a local homeless coalition if one does not exist.
http://www.bradenton.com/2012/01/22/...#storylink=cpy

This is the law he "discovered":

Quote:
288.1166, F.S. Professional sports facility; designation as shelter site for the homeless; establishment of local programs.—Any professional sports facility constructed with financial assistance from the State of Florida shall be designated as a shelter site for the homeless in accordance with the criteria of locally existing homeless shelter programs, except when the facility is otherwise contractually obligated for a specific event or activity. Should a local program not be in existence in the facility’s area, such program shall be established in accordance with normally accepted criteria as defined by the county or its designee.
http://www.flsenate.gov/laws/statutes/2011/288.1166

Quote:
Originally Posted by chasespace View Post
Do they define what "state dollars" are? I know the Tampa Bay Times Forum was built using county money but I'm unaware if it was built using state money(unless the money was given to the county by the state).
Here you go, Chaser

Quote:
Government Sector Impact:
A county with a sports franchise that is not in compliance with the provisions of the bill will be required to refund all financial assistance funds advanced to it by the state. If the county and sports franchise remain in noncompliance, the county will be fined additional amounts until it satisfies the provisions of the bill. The extent of the refund and/or fine will be linked to the financial assistance received.

It is unclear how many of the affected sports franchise have been operating homeless shelters.
http://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill...816.pre.ca.PDF

The above is the analysis done on SB 816 by his own Committee

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01-23-2012, 06:37 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chasespace View Post
Do they define what "state dollars" are? I know the Tampa Bay Times Forum was built using county money but I'm unaware if it was built using state money(unless the money was given to the county by the state).
At least sales tax rebates, $2 million per each professional team, 9 in Florida, I think.

JOL

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