McCarthy played a couple more seasons in Atlanta and Smolinski had a year in Montreal, but for the most part you're right. There's also Noronen (2nd round pick) and Ouelette (5th round pick) who were acquired mid season and were out of the league within a few months. That Noronen trade is particularly baffling. The Canucks threw away a 2nd round pick that turned into Jonas Enroth so Noronen could start a grand total of 2 games for them. The real kicker is that Vancouverite Milan Lucic was picked 4 spots after that, so the Canucks could've had a pretty good shot at him too.
And that doesn't even take into account off season acquisitions. Every one of these guys played 50+ games for the Canucks in 06-07 or 07-08 and was out of the league within a year:
Cowan
Bulis
Fitzpatrick
Miller
Chouinard
Isbister
Ritchie
Normally I'd agree, but take a look at the 12 guys these guys dress at forward. There are only so many spots, the Chicago Wolves are a profitable AHL organization with their own sponsorships. They have a lot of AHL vets under contract, there's only so much room for rookies. If you aren't playing well, they send you down. This was the knock on the Wolves, they haven't typically been a very good organization for player development. Maybe I'm just looking for excuses, but a guy like Archibald who is at PPG numbers in the ECHL may still have a shot at the big league.
Undrafted free agent signing, cutting his teeth in the pro game at the ECHL level...where have I heard that before?
I cant wait until the Heat/Flames agreement is done and we can have our own AHL team in our own back yard with the majority of the team being Canuck prospects.
there are definitely some guys who should never have received pro contracts (Rai, Ellington, Tochkin..) but Archibald was a good gamble and so was Anthony at the time...who knows if they ever make the show...but I dont think offering them contracts is that big of a mistake.
I cant wait until the Heat/Flames agreement is done and we can have our own AHL team in our own back yard with the majority of the team being Canuck prospects.
No, the Flames own the AHL Franchise that is in Abbotsford - I believe they have moved their franchise 3 times: Omaha, Quad Cities, and now Abbotsford.
Some AHL franchises are independently owned (eg. Chicago), and some are owned by and NHL team. The Canucks would have to either buy the franchise from Calgary to have it in Abbotsford, or apply for their own franchise - however I'm not sure the AHL is looking to expand.
I think you are abit too positive. If your signing cannot make the AHL he should not have been signed. The odd exception for goalies. I think it is fair to say none of the players presently in the ECHL should have been signed. Maybe some day the odd one might play some games in the NHL but unlikely in the next few years or anything but a boderline player
I think that's being a little too negative, given the strength of the Wolves franchise, and the number of prospects in the minors needing ice time. I won't write off a late pick or free agent prospect if they have to spend time in their first pro season in the ECHL. They are extremely unlikely to become stars, but could still become useful complimentary players. However, if they aren't in the AHL by their second year, then their chances of making the NHL are very, very low.
He didn't dress for the last 3 games, so he's either scratched or injured, I can't find any info on that. I hope he's injured because if he has been scratched, that's not good. His point production has been ok, not great. 30gp 7G 10A 17P. It's tough to figure out how he is playing based from that, but I was expecting more points. He has an ELC though so has a few years to figure it out and hopefully makes some progress by the end of the season and plays consistently in the AHL next year.
On a side note, I like the fact that we are using our ECHL affiliate more than in the past few years. To me it's not the end of the world if I guy gets sent down there for a year, particularly late round picks, free agents or prospects that are coming off of long term injuries. I think it's better that they get the higher minutes in all situations down there than limited minutes in the AHL where our top prospects and the AHL veterans get most of the quality minutes.
edit: Just checked out the Kalamazoo Gazette and it seems that Anthony is listed as a "Medical" scratch for the past 3 games, but not on the IR.
hmmm...interesting. I glanced at his numbers, but like you said, hard to tell how he's really played down there just from that. A bit disappointing stats wise, but it's hard to judge what's really going on there, and if he ever has a shot at making it, it's as a responsible bottom-6 guy anyway at this point, so how his defensive game is coming along in the pros is probably just as important.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanuck
He hasn't played the last 3 games, whereas Archibald has 4 points in that stretch, so I'd been guessing he was out with some sort of injury. Looks like shottasasa just confirmed it too.
I agree though, this is the exact type of player we should be taking flyers on in the 7th round - guys who fell for some reason or another but who still have upside to them, especially if they have the skating and hockey sense to begin with. Hopefully he pans out.
Rai, btw, has 1 assist and 1 shot in 5 games. Also, 4 must be the highest number of Canucks prospects who have ever been on the ECHL team at the same time.
Interesting to see Archibald putting up numbers right away in the ECHL when it seemed as though he struggled a fair bit in the AHL. I recall at least a few posters jumping on me when i mentioned that i thought it was likely to be a real uphill battle for Archibald to make it. Still really not sold on him. I just haven't seen the natural skill/hockey sense, and more importantly...the skating to really pan out. There's still a window for him obviously, but i'm still not expecting much. But if he doesn't make it...not much really ventured with a FA signing, so nbd. Part of my gripe with Archibald though, which for me made it a bit less of a commendable 'flyer with upside', was that as an older guy, he had already been passed over by others several times, including the Wings. Whereas a guy like Anthony drafted in the late rounds is a bit of a different gamble in that yes, you use a pick on it rather than just a contract slot...but there's still more of an unkown quantity element to it, and more time to surprise.
Anthony to me at least has the skating and some natural skill, but has obviously always been a bit of a longshot to make it. But for a late pick, i really do like the idea of picking up guys with some potential upside who fall for whatever reason. Guys who have shown some level of natural ability at some point.
Hopefully with some ECHL experience under his belt and another year to bulk up, he'll be able to crack the AHL full time next year. He has a good frame to build on, but i recall him still being fairly light for his size back in camp, and i wouldn't expect he's put on much if any mass in season. It seems like getting stronger could help his game quite a bit as he adjusts to the pros though. but like i said, it's hard to say as i haven't had a chance to see any KWings games.
, so i'm just speculating based on what i have seen.
Archibald on the other hand, already has that 'mans body' (to reference the great Pierre McGuire). Which is part of what made me skeptical of him coming in. Looks like with that advantage being somewhat taken away has really exposed his skating and hockey IQ a lot more.
Still holding out varying degrees of hope for both of them eventually climbing their way back into the picture though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luck 6
It's never a good sign when a prospect is playing in the ECHL instead of the AHL, but what can ya do? The Wolves have a lot of AHL only contracts like Haydar, so there isn't as much room for our prospects. As such, it may be better to have these guys playing big minutes in the ECHL than riding the bench in Chicago.
Archibald and Anthony are two guys who I thought could maybe make the NHL at some point. Archibald needs to keep putting it together and needs to make it to the AHL next season, Anthony too.
Yeah. There's most definitely a certain stigma attached to demotion to the ECHL. I don't really like having to stash prospects there, but if they really aren't ready for the AHL and they're not going to get any playing time there, then so be it. And more than that, i think that we (and Canucks management) had a pretty clear understanding going into the Wolves affiliation agreement, that it would be like this. After all, when you're pushing the max contract limit AND working with a highly competetive AHL franchise that likes to bring in many of it's own guys, it's no surprise that it's a bit of a musical chairs situation and some fringe prospects are going to be left standing.
Of course the opposite of that would be to just throw all our prospects into the fire without much experienced AHL support...and i'm not a huge fan of that model either. Sort of a question of 'development at all costs' vs 'winning atmosphere' question. The Moose in recent years seemed to strike a pretty good balance between the two, but the prospects who HAVE managed to secure key roles on the Wolves seem to be developing quite well for the most part. So it's hard to gripe too much about a few longshots being branded with the dreaded 'ECHL label'. Not to mention, we have the extreme luxury of having a handy little hardworking - 30goal scoring - playing with the back to back art ross winners - example to point out to those guys and say, 'look, you're not totally screwed!'
Agreed, good post. I have hope yet for Anthony as hockey sense is supposedly one of his strengths, as well as skating, as long as you're willing to put in the time and effort to improve your game. His two-way play is also a good foundation as he was known for it with Saint John. High end projection right now if everything goes well, IMO, seems to be a 3rd liner with some scoring prowess who can also play well defensively.
One thing I'd be concerned about at this point is any possible proneness to injury. He seems to get hurt a fair bit. Consistency is another question but that goes for a lot of young players too so hopefully these won't be concerns in future. And it might just be me, but he might have been lacking in confidence a bit during his early years with the Sea Dogs, from one Halifax Metro article I read. Not sure if it's carried over.
Weren't there some Salmon Kings fans posting here back in the day? Be nice if any K-Wings fans could give us an update.
Hopefully we never pick a Hannay type in the 7th round again. Ugh. Anthony and Tommernes are more like it. Go all or nothing and get good-reward guys with upside. The fact that Archibald has been doing well is good too, but is his hockey sense actually that big of a concern?
how is Alex Friesen? he is overage for the OHL.........hope he gets a contract with the Canucks?
I would think so. From what I've seen/heard, I think he's good enough with his two way game to make a push for a bottom 6 roster spot on the Wolves next year.
A Victoria native, after the Canucks drafted him in the 2nd round in the 2007 draft, he played parts of two seasons with the Victoria Salmon Kings of the ECHL. He has 20 games in the AHL with the Moose (scored his first pro goal in his first pro game with Manitoba in 2009), but has yet to crack the AHL on a regular basis. This season to date he has five goals and 12 assists in 42 games with the Kalamazoo Wings. Standing at 6' and 200 pounds, he is a guy who will drop the gloves when his team needs him to step up and defend someone or give them a boost. Versatile, he's also a go-to guy in shootouts.
I had no idea.
Probably the only guy who knew was Delorme since, you know, most teams at any level have shootout drills at the end of practice.
Why is the writing always so bad in these HF articles? Why can't they find better correspondents? It seems like whoever wrote this just looked at stats, no real insight here whatsoever.
Why is the writing always so bad in these HF articles? Why can't they find better correspondents? It seems like whoever wrote this just looked at stats, no real insight here whatsoever.
Agreed. There are some posters here who could write much, much better articles.
Why is the writing always so bad in these HF articles? Why can't they find better correspondents? It seems like whoever wrote this just looked at stats, no real insight here whatsoever.
Agreed, didn't learn much apart from the fact that Ellington apparently is a go-to guy in the shootout . I do think some posters here who actively follow these prospects could contribute quite a bit to articles themselves.
Agreed, good post. I have hope yet for Anthony as hockey sense is supposedly one of his strengths, as well as skating, as long as you're willing to put in the time and effort to improve your game. His two-way play is also a good foundation as he was known for it with Saint John. High end projection right now if everything goes well, IMO, seems to be a 3rd liner with some scoring prowess who can also play well defensively.
One thing I'd be concerned about at this point is any possible proneness to injury. He seems to get hurt a fair bit. Consistency is another question but that goes for a lot of young players too so hopefully these won't be concerns in future. And it might just be me, but he might have been lacking in confidence a bit during his early years with the Sea Dogs, from one Halifax Metro article I read. Not sure if it's carried over.
Weren't there some Salmon Kings fans posting here back in the day? Be nice if any K-Wings fans could give us an update.
Hopefully we never pick a Hannay type in the 7th round again. Ugh. Anthony and Tommernes are more like it. Go all or nothing and get good-reward guys with upside. The fact that Archibald has been doing well is good too, but is his hockey sense actually that big of a concern?
The injury concerns aren't too big for me. There have been a decent number of them here and there which is a bit concerning maybe, but i suspect that continuing to fill out his frame will help with that in time. And i'm not sure that his track record is really that abnormally injury prone. Probably no iron-man streaks in his future , but that's nbd.
As for the comment on Archibald's hockey sense...i haven't necessarily heard it widely echoed in regards to him, but i just don't see it. From what i've seen of his play, it's very 'robotic' if that makes any sense. He clearly knows that goals are scored around the net, and he's figured out where to get his excellent shot off in juniors (and from the looks of the stats, perhaps in the ECHL as well), but watching him defensively, away from the puck, and when he isn't able to use his size to easily bull his way into particular scoring areas, he often looks lost to me. I just haven't seen much natural ability to adapt to things quickly on the fly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChemicalHansen
I had no idea.
Probably the only guy who knew was Delorme since, you know, most teams at any level have shootout drills at the end of practice.
hahaha. and the truth comes out! The real reason we drafted Ellington. Clearly Nonis is a clairvoyant and knew that the future Canucks would struggle in the shootout and need an absolute ACE like Ellington!
hahaha. and the truth comes out! The real reason we drafted Ellington. Clearly Nonis is a clairvoyant and knew that the future Canucks would struggle in the shootout and need an absolute ACE like Ellington!
In some roundabout way, it could be indicative of some sort of hands that they were hoping would further develop.
But like, come on, those are hunches you chase in the 6th round.
The injury concerns aren't too big for me. There have been a decent number of them here and there which is a bit concerning maybe, but i suspect that continuing to fill out his frame will help with that in time. And i'm not sure that his track record is really that abnormally injury prone. Probably no iron-man streaks in his future , but that's nbd.
As for the comment on Archibald's hockey sense...i haven't necessarily heard it widely echoed in regards to him, but i just don't see it. From what i've seen of his play, it's very 'robotic' if that makes any sense. He clearly knows that goals are scored around the net, and he's figured out where to get his excellent shot off in juniors (and from the looks of the stats, perhaps in the ECHL as well), but watching him defensively, away from the puck, and when he isn't able to use his size to easily bull his way into particular scoring areas, he often looks lost to me. I just haven't seen much natural ability to adapt to things quickly on the fly.
hahaha. and the truth comes out! The real reason we drafted Ellington. Clearly Nonis is a clairvoyant and knew that the future Canucks would struggle in the shootout and need an absolute ACE like Ellington!
You know what....I really wouldn't be surprised if this is one of the reasons the Canucks drafted Ellington. Not kidding. Delorme has expressed that you can glean a lot of information from watching prospects in the warmups. It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to think that Ellington a WHL kid, had some pretty good hands in the warmup and shootouts which led Ronnie to believe that "this here is a big tough defenseman who actually has some skill to him."
Of course, forget the fact that his skill had never translated to the actual game.
With Higgins health uncertain........is there any players on the farm that should be called up to play in top 9? Sweatt? Rodin? Schoeder? I believe Sweatt and Hodgson have some chemistry which would help a lot
With Higgins health uncertain........is there any players on the farm that should be called up to play in top 9? Sweatt? Rodin? Schoeder? I believe Sweatt and Hodgson have some chemistry which would help a lot
I'd love it if they gave Schroeder his first NHL game, the Colorado game would be a perfect opportunity against a speedy, not overly physical, struggling team.
At the very least you see what you have or showcase him to the league.
I doubt GM's or pro scouts get down on young prospects because they haven't played in the NHL yet, but it would definitely boost his profile, as many think he is a struggling prospect, while those that keep tabs on our prospects can see the progression...
RW Nicklas Jensen scored a powerplay goal and was -1 in the Oshawa Generals' 3-2 loss to the Ottawa 67's. He now has 21-21-42 in 39 games.
C Alex Friesen recorded an assist and was +1 in the Niagra IceDogs' 3-2 win over the London Knights. He now has 16-33-49 in 44 games.
D Frank Corrado recorded 2 PIMS and was even on the night in the Sudbury Wolves' 7-3 loss to the Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds. He currently has 3-21-24 in 46 games and sports a +28, 5th overall in the OHL. (Note: It says something when you can go even on the night in a 7-3 loss and be +28 on a mediocre team with a -3 goal differential. I keep pointing to a Wolves fan who pointed out at the beginning of the season that he wanted Corrado, who was still taking part in Canucks training camp at the time, back in Sudbury because he is such an important part of their team. Looks like that poster is right.)
QMJHL - Friday Feb. 3/12
RW Alexandre Grenier recorded an assist and was +1 while D Sawyer Hannay was +2 in the Halifax Mooseheads' 5-3 win over the Moncton Wildcats. Grenier now has 19-30-49 in 45 games and Hannay has a whopping 2 assists in 45 games. (Note: I realize Hannay is a strictly defensive defenseman but this is getting ridiculous. He has not scored a goal in 2 seasons in the QMJHL yet.)
G David Honzik stopped 31 of 32 shots in the Victoriaville Tigres' 6-1 win over the Baie-Comeau Drakkar, a solid outing he sorely needed. He now has a 3.65 GAA, .879 Save%, 2 shutouts and a 14-13-2 record.
College - Friday Feb. 3/12
LW Joseph Labate was -1 in Wisconsin's 5-1 loss to St. Cloud State. He currently has 5-13-18 in 27 games.
D Jeremy Price was -1 in Colgate's 3-1 loss to Union. He currently has 2-14-16 in 24 games.
D Patrick McNally recorded 2 assists and was +4 in Harvard's 6-3 win over Quinnipiac. He now has 4-15-19 in 22 games as a freshman defenseman. Not bad.
G Joe Cannata had a rare rough outing as he allowed 4 goals on 20 shots in Merrimack's 4-1 loss to Boston U. He still sports a solid 2.12 GAA, .924 Save%, 2 shutouts and a 12-6-4 record.
RW Nicklas Jensen scored a powerplay goal and was -1 in the Oshawa Generals' 3-2 loss to the Ottawa 67's. He now has 21-21-42 in 39 games.
C Alex Friesen recorded an assist and was +1 in the Niagra IceDogs' 3-2 win over the London Knights. He now has 16-33-49 in 44 games.
D Frank Corrado recorded 2 PIMS and was even on the night in the Sudbury Wolves' 7-3 loss to the Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds. He currently has 3-21-24 in 46 games and sports a +28, 5th overall in the OHL. (Note: It says something when you can go even on the night in a 7-3 loss and be +28 on a mediocre team with a -3 goal differential. I keep pointing to a Wolves fan who pointed out at the beginning of the season that he wanted Corrado, who was still taking part in Canucks training camp at the time, back in Sudbury because he is such an important part of their team. Looks like that poster is right.)
QMJHL - Friday Feb. 3/12
RW Alexandre Grenier recorded an assist and was +1 while D Sawyer Hannay was +2 in the Halifax Mooseheads' 5-3 win over the Moncton Wildcats. Grenier now has 19-30-49 in 45 games and Hannay has a whopping 2 assists in 45 games. (Note: I realize Hannay is a strictly defensive defenseman but this is getting ridiculous. He has not scored a goal in 2 seasons in the QMJHL yet.)
G David Honzik stopped 31 of 32 shots in the Victoriaville Tigres' 6-1 win over the Baie-Comeau Drakkar, a solid outing he sorely needed. He now has a 3.65 GAA, .879 Save%, 2 shutouts and a 14-13-2 record.
College - Friday Feb. 3/12
LW Joseph Labate was -1 in Wisconsin's 5-1 loss to St. Cloud State. He currently has 5-13-18 in 27 games.
D Jeremy Price was -1 in Colgate's 3-1 loss to Union. He currently has 2-14-16 in 24 games.
D Patrick McNally recorded 2 assists and was +4 in Harvard's 6-3 win over Quinnipiac. He now has 4-15-19 in 22 games as a freshman defenseman. Not bad.
G Joe Cannata had a rare rough outing as he allowed 4 goals on 20 shots in Merrimack's 4-1 loss to Boston U. He still sports a solid 2.12 GAA, .924 Save%, 2 shutouts and a 12-6-4 record.
I've said this before (I think) but ever since I watched a preseason practice with Corrado I've been convinced he's the real deal. Not sure what his eligibility is like but I wouldn't be surprised to see him in the AHL next season.
Which is part of what made me skeptical of him coming in. Looks like with that advantage being somewhat taken away has really exposed his skating and hockey IQ a lot more.
