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Old
01-23-2012, 09:23 PM
  #26
Mancini79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo View Post
And we've been over this before; Bruno was also a huge part of this team and organization but we didn't bring him back (twice now). Kurtis Foster was one of our babies and we let him go. Darby Hendrickson, Antti Laaksonen, John Madden, Brian Rolston, Derek Boogaard were all fan favorites and huge parts of this organization and team (hell Madden even said he was probably going to sign back to Minnesota or retire), and we moved them all. Dwayne Roloson and Manny Fernandez.

Brent Burns, Josh Harding, Stephane Veilleux...

So he's a good coach. He's just Wes Walz without the speed and a bit better hands. He's on pace for 57 points in 72 games this year.

57...

And he's got better teammates.
Have to admit I do miss Walz. A really good guy and true leader. Personally I think the Wild should've retired his number and should AT LEAST be an assistant coach (on the Bench btw).

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01-24-2012, 09:51 AM
  #27
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What about Backstrom, Zidlicky, and Bouchard for Lecavalier and Roloson?

I assume most people would not be for that. But Lecavalier-Koivu would be a sweet 1-2 for years. Granlund would replace Bouchard. And being free of Backstrom and Zidlicky's contract would make it easier to handle Lecavalier's contract. Re-sign Harding for around 3 million/year. Cullen's contract is up soon. Then Heatley's (who could be re-signed for a lot less than his current contract).

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01-24-2012, 10:06 AM
  #28
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Vinny isn't waiving his NTC for anyone. He has his cup ring. He's living income tax free in the sun. I can't see a chance of him waiving for anyone other than the Panthers.

Just judging from the estimates done on LeBron's tax savings, Lecavalier will make an extra $5MM over the course of his contract by playing in Florida as opposed to other US states (no idea about the Canadian tax rates).

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01-24-2012, 10:20 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by squidz View Post
Vinny isn't waiving his NTC for anyone. He has his cup ring. He's living income tax free in the sun. I can't see a chance of him waiving for anyone other than the Panthers.

Just judging from the estimates done on LeBron's tax savings, Lecavalier will make an extra $5MM over the course of his contract by playing in Florida as opposed to other US states (no idea about the Canadian tax rates).
Good point. I'm surprised more atheletes don't realize that about New York City.

10% income tax in addition to federal income tax (state+city). That ends up being a lot of you are a professional athelete.

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01-24-2012, 10:22 AM
  #30
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Yeah I can't see Vinny moving unless its Montreal or Florida like squidz mentioned. At this point i'm really starting to believe that the Wild are pulling a page out of the Twins playbook. Get involved in trade rumors to get the fans attention and keep them happy, but not really serious about it.

I'm not saying its Fletcher's fault. The trade market this year just isn't a good one for the Wild, but i'm really only seeing minor deals or unloading guys like Zanon, Zidlicky, and Lundin for picks or prospects.

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01-24-2012, 10:34 AM
  #31
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I think Zidlicky, Zanon, and Lundin have no trade value whatsoever. Zidlicky would be added only if we were doing another team a favor by taking even more salary back.

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Old
01-24-2012, 10:35 AM
  #32
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You guys are crazy if you'd give Bouchard away for Carter...

Bouchard and Carter together on a line would be a first line for any team. Throw in a prototypical power forward on the left like a Nolan (not Nolan, but you get the point... so let's say Franzen...) However, let's throw the ONE guy up there that we own, but is currently out... Latendresse.

Latendresse - Carter - Bouchard

Our second line would then become centered by Koivu, where he should be...


Our lines with Carter...

Latendresse - Carter - Bouchard
Heatley - Koivu - Setoguchi
Clutterbuck - Cullen - Johnson
Powe - Peters - Staubitz/Kassian

That means that Brodziak is including in my trade thoughts... Since we have to take so much salary back, they'd need to take Zidlicky.

So my proposal for landing Carter...

Brodziak + Zidlicky + Larsson (we'd be set on centers for a while...) No draft picks included...

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01-24-2012, 10:41 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bozak911 View Post
You guys are crazy if you'd give Bouchard away for Carter...

Bouchard and Carter together on a line would be a first line for any team. Throw in a prototypical power forward on the left like a Nolan (not Nolan, but you get the point... so let's say Franzen...) However, let's throw the ONE guy up there that we own, but is currently out... Latendresse.

Latendresse - Carter - Bouchard

Our second line would then become centered by Koivu, where he should be...


Our lines with Carter...

Latendresse - Carter - Bouchard
Heatley - Koivu - Setoguchi
Clutterbuck - Cullen - Johnson
Powe - Peters - Staubitz/Kassian

That means that Brodziak is including in my trade thoughts... Since we have to take so much salary back, they'd need to take Zidlicky.

So my proposal for landing Carter...

Brodziak + Zidlicky + Larsson (we'd be set on centers for a while...) No draft picks included...
Ahhh in a dream world....

Realistically I think it would take something like Larsson/Zucker/Phillips+Hackett/Kruemper+Clutterbuck+Zidlicky and they would throw something in too..Not that I would trade that neccessarily, but there is no way Columbus is going to give up Carter for essentially Larsson, a half year of Brodz, and an Zidlicky. Just not going to happen. If you were being sarcastic I totally missed it

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01-24-2012, 10:42 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bozak911 View Post
You guys are crazy if you'd give Bouchard away for Carter...

Bouchard and Carter together on a line would be a first line for any team. Throw in a prototypical power forward on the left like a Nolan (not Nolan, but you get the point... so let's say Franzen...) However, let's throw the ONE guy up there that we own, but is currently out... Latendresse.

Latendresse - Carter - Bouchard

Our second line would then become centered by Koivu, where he should be...


Our lines with Carter...

Latendresse - Carter - Bouchard
Heatley - Koivu - Setoguchi
Clutterbuck - Cullen - Johnson
Powe - Peters - Staubitz/Kassian

That means that Brodziak is including in my trade thoughts... Since we have to take so much salary back, they'd need to take Zidlicky.

So my proposal for landing Carter...

Brodziak + Zidlicky + Larsson (we'd be set on centers for a while...) No draft picks included...
I suggested Bouchard because (1) salary would need to go back, (2) Columbus can always use another skilled forward, and (3) Granlund could replace Bouchard next year.

Of course, Bouchard's concussion problems probably nix any trade with him.

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01-24-2012, 10:44 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickschultzfan View Post
I think Zidlicky, Zanon, and Lundin have no trade value whatsoever. Zidlicky would be added only if we were doing another team a favor by taking even more salary back.
Yes there value to us is nothing, but to other teams who have a legit shot they may have value. For instance Zanon going to a playoff to purely play 6th D mins and PK. That does nothing for us because we can't afford to let him play like that, but the Pens or Rangers can. Same for Lundin and Zidlicky but obviously PP. Not saying we would get anything great but getting them off our team would be enough for me.

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01-24-2012, 11:06 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by GetCluttered View Post
Yes there value to us is nothing, but to other teams who have a legit shot they may have value. For instance Zanon going to a playoff to purely play 6th D mins and PK. That does nothing for us because we can't afford to let him play like that, but the Pens or Rangers can. Same for Lundin and Zidlicky but obviously PP. Not saying we would get anything great but getting them off our team would be enough for me.
I can't see a playoff team wanting to put Zanon on the ice. Maybe before this season, but he's just been soooo bad and is a huge liability.

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Old
01-24-2012, 11:19 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickschultzfan View Post
I suggested Bouchard because (1) salary would need to go back, (2) Columbus can always use another skilled forward, and (3) Granlund could replace Bouchard next year.

Of course, Bouchard's concussion problems probably nix any trade with him.
I'm looking at all of the variables, though...

Todd Richards is firming up his future by getting a relatively crappy Columbus team to... Play somewhat decently. Part of the problem with his roster is that Howson, who honestly seems impervious to getting fired, doesn't know how to build a friggin team.

Columbus has the same issues that Edmonton has... The weakest part of their roster is D and in Goal. Mason is just not... Good any more. His confidence has been shaken to the point of crumbling and he just can't hold it together. He needs to get into a situation where he is the determined backup with a GREAT goalie coach to help his game.

Howson's biggest blunder was thinking that Carter and Nash would compliment each other. (...said this over the summer...) He was WRONG.

Realistically, my opinion is that Howson needs to ditch Mason and Carter to better his team. So the question then becomes (now that I really think about it) what does he want for both Carter AND Mason?

He doesn't want salary back, because... Ooops, he over spent...

Richards was very high on Brodziak, where Chuck Fletcher even stated that it was a #FireToddRichards that prompted him to trade for Brodziak. We also know that his familiarity with Zanon was from his days in Milwaukee. We also know that he relied on his "Z-fense" a lot during his time here...

Dunno.

I still have no effin clue how Howson still has a job...

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Old
01-24-2012, 11:31 AM
  #38
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I always wonder what will happen to Cullen next year? I suppose there's a lot of variables in what could happen. If Bouchard is healthy, he'll be 2nd line. Granlund will probably be 2nd line. If Lats is healthy, he'll be 2nd line. If he's 1st line then Seto is 2nd line. Plus who knows if we'll sign or trade for another top 6 forward. Seems like Cullen is destined for 3rd line duties, which is where I think he belongs.

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01-24-2012, 11:38 AM
  #39
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Wait, wait, wait...I didn't ever say Mikko shouldn't be captain and I didn't say he should be traded. I did say he's a high end grinder (style of play) and that he's overpaid. But I also think he's extremely vital to the team and a guy every team wants. Just not at his salary. And he's in the wrong role.

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01-24-2012, 11:41 AM
  #40
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I'm not a fan of trading for Carter and his atrocious salary but I think that Harding + 1 2012 + Zidlicky/Butch for Carter would make a lot of sense for us and Columbus.

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01-24-2012, 11:41 AM
  #41
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I'm with Bozak in that I think Bouchard has the skill to be a top line winger. He needs a goal scorer to play with though.
And no, Setoguchi is not a goal scorer. A real goal scorer. A 30+ guy.
And no, Heatley is not a 30+ guy any more.

I just don't see why we'd even think about Carter...no way he gets traded under the current management in Lumby.

I also don't think it's wise to move any of the blue chippers...Granlund, Brodin, Coyle, and Phillips should be off the table in any practical trade discussion.
And no, "well you'd move them for Ovechkin wouldn't you???" isn't a practical trade discussion.

Their ceiling and years of prime hockey at a low salary is just far too great to move them for a player who will likely never again reach his best year.
And yes, Corey Perry is the exception, not the rule. Most players are explosive in their early 20's and then start to tail off.

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01-24-2012, 11:42 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILDhockeyfan View Post
I always wonder what will happen to Cullen next year? I suppose there's a lot of variables in what could happen. If Bouchard is healthy, he'll be 2nd line. Granlund will probably be 2nd line. If Lats is healthy, he'll be 2nd line. If he's 1st line then Seto is 2nd line. Plus who knows if we'll sign or trade for another top 6 forward. Seems like Cullen is destined for 3rd line duties, which is where I think he belongs.
1. Setoguchi
2. Granlund
3. Bouchard
4. Cullen

Cullen is on the bottom of those 4. I think Latendresse is on different roster fight.

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01-24-2012, 11:44 AM
  #43
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first off Butch ain't getting traded it would have to be an incredibly stupid GM to take him after a 2nd concussion he needs to prove he can be healthy long term before anyone will chance on him. Same with Lats, who even knows how long they will be out could be a year could be more.

while Zidz has played well he doesn't hold huge value, he won't be a centerpiece of a trade for carter.

i'm thinking a realistic offer would be Scandella+1st+minor prospect

that would be the realistic starting point to getting Carter to come here.

whether carter is worth that is debatable but he won't be let go for scraps or injured guys no matter how much we wish it would happen.

and lastly if we do land carter WILL NOT BE THE NUMBER ONCE CENTER OVER KOIVU SO QUIT ****ING HATING KOIVU YOU KOIVU HATING HATERS

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01-24-2012, 11:45 AM
  #44
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Setoguchi is what he is. I think the guy peaked at age 22. He's a 2nd line, 25-goal scorer on good team with good linemates. He's not a game-breaker, and he's not a first line player. But he's a role player who has speed and can score.

He also has played A LOT better when he's not with Heatley and Koivu.

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01-24-2012, 11:47 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
first off Butch ain't getting traded it would have to be an incredibly stupid GM to take him after a 2nd concussion he needs to prove he can be healthy long term before anyone will chance on him. Same with Lats, who even knows how long they will be out could be a year could be more.

while Zidz has played well he doesn't hold huge value, he won't be a centerpiece of a trade for carter.

i'm thinking a realistic offer would be Scandella+1st+minor prospect

that would be the realistic starting point to getting Carter to come here.

whether carter is worth that is debatable but he won't be let go for scraps or injured guys no matter how much we wish it would happen.

and lastly if we do land carter WILL NOT BE THE NUMBER ONCE CENTER OVER KOIVU SO QUIT ****ING HATING KOIVU YOU KOIVU HATING HATERS
if we trade for Carter we would need to dump some salary back. Carter + Bouchard + Zidlickys that's a lot of caps space.

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01-24-2012, 11:53 AM
  #46
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and lastly if we do land carter WILL NOT BE THE NUMBER ONCE CENTER OVER KOIVU SO QUIT ****ING HATING KOIVU YOU KOIVU HATING HATERS
Gasket blowing much?

I don't hate Koivu.

What I am saying is this...

If we had a center that was a scoring center (like Carter) you play the roster accordingly.

Carter = Rocket Richard candidate.

Koivu = Selke candidate.

The intelligent person puts his elite play maker with someone that can finish. Therefore, a scoring center would have Butch on his right and a power forward on his left. (See DETROIT)

If you have the scoring winger... You put the scoring winger with your play making center... Think Capitals... Ovechkin = Scoring LWer. Backstrom = Play making center (with a lot of defense...)

Sorry you are so butt-hurt about people using the same terms that everyone in the industry uses about Koivu. He is a SELKE style center...

Funny how in Vancouver, their SELKE style center is on their second line...

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01-24-2012, 11:53 AM
  #47
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Bouchard will only be a 1st line play if he finds an elite, big, goal-scoring center to play with, mesh with, and be a side-kick to. Yeah, if Bouchard plays with Getzlaf, he'll be that 70-point forward we all think he can be.

But if he's expected to be the "offensive" guy on his line, he'll just continue to be that weak top-6 option who's good for 50 points but struggles for 15 goals.

The guys just gets rubbed off the puck too much to be a consistent offensive threat.

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01-24-2012, 11:58 AM
  #48
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If Carter actually was available, I would hope the Wild would be all over him, especially if Columbus is looking for a goalie (we have a lot of options) or forward prospects. Hell, Hacket is a great prospect, but the Wild could trade him and still be fine in goaltending.

Carter is the exact type of player the Wild need. If the Wild could snag Carter, it would go a long way to signing Parise this summer.

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01-24-2012, 12:01 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bozak911 View Post
Gasket blowing much?

I don't hate Koivu.

What I am saying is this...

If we had a center that was a scoring center (like Carter) you play the roster accordingly.

Carter = Rocket Richard candidate.

Koivu = Selke candidate.

The intelligent person puts his elite play maker with someone that can finish. Therefore, a scoring center would have Butch on his right and a power forward on his left. (See DETROIT)

If you have the scoring winger... You put the scoring winger with your play making center... Think Capitals... Ovechkin = Scoring LWer. Backstrom = Play making center (with a lot of defense...)

Sorry you are so butt-hurt about people using the same terms that everyone in the industry uses about Koivu. He is a SELKE style center...

Funny how in Vancouver, their SELKE style center is on their second line...
carter on the 1st line over koivu would cause that line to produce less, carter on koivus wing or even on 2nd line with cullen would be way better.

sedin >>> carter

kessler >> carter

kessler can be a number one guy on many teams he just happens to be on a STACKED roster.

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01-24-2012, 12:05 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
carter on the 1st line over koivu would cause that line to produce less, carter on koivus wing or even on 2nd line with cullen would be way better.

sedin >>> carter

kessler >> carter

kessler can be a number one guy on many teams he just happens to be on a STACKED roster.
Then you've never watched Carter play...

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