Is this going to be our line-up? Probably not. But I think this is a well-balanced line-up that basically has no hole in whatsoever.
If I would go major fantasy route, Subban and Plekanec would be traded, 1 with a pick would go to Anaheim's favor for Perry to play on the RW on the 1st line and and the other would be traded for a young future stud at center position, i.e Huberdeau or Couturier.
I have exactly the same thing up front. Except that Clifford and Reaves are under sontract for next year (maybe Clifford is RFA). That's why I would target Konopka and Prust
Summer
- Kovalchuk/Corrente for Kristo/Weber/Palushaj/CGY 2nd/Gomez (yes, gomez... see trade thread if u want explanation)
- trade Kaberle to highest bidder IF Markov is back & plays end of season
Now
- Gill/Moen/Campoli to highest bidder
- Kaberle to highest bidder
- Kost/conditional pick (1st 2013 if he doesn't re-sign, 3rd if he does) for Radulov/G.Bourque
UFA signings:
- Sarich- 1yr/1.25M$
2012-2013
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Ilya Kovalchuk ($6.666m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Alex Radulov ($5.500m)
Erik Cole ($4.500m) / David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Max Pacioretty ($1.625m)
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / Lars Eller ($1.900m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Louis Leblanc ($1.170m) / Ryan White ($0.825m) / Mike Blunden ($0.850m)
Gabriel Bourque ($0.618m)
GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($6.000m) / Peter Budaj ($1.150m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,248,333; BONUSES: $300,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $51,667
short term, defense is a little suspect, but with Tinordi/Beaulieu/Ellis/Pateryn/Nash all in Hamilton next year, and Bennett/Dietz/Nygren in the pipeline, we have some quality young depth that should be pushing for spots by 2013.
and with an offence like that, who needs defense anyways
the kovalchuk trade is so bad for NJ and Radulov still has 1 year on his entry level contract.
folks you cant have DD and pleks as your 1-2 punch down the middle and compete
one of the other has to go
Agreed. We need to upgrade at C. IE: Replace Gomer with someone who actually does 15G 30 A, and can play against top 2 lines Most of the lineups here are not recognizing that.
the kovalchuk trade is so bad for NJ and Radulov still has 1 year on his entry level contract.
So he would earned way less than 5.5M
you're probably right about the Kovalchuk offer... but again, if they are in a situation where they need to move him for financial reasons (cap is one thing, 11M$ is another), i really do think there won't be a huge market for him given the costs in real dollars (his cap hit is great, but 11M$/year for next 6 years will make even the wealthiest teams cringe i would think).
if it comes down to just 3-4 teams that are in on the bidding, how hard will they go for him, and what will they be offering, who knows... as a starting point, the offer I suggested isn't exactly peanuts.
as for Radulov, this is what I thought, but I read an article somewhere suggesting that whatever team has his rights could agree to rip up his deal and sign a new one... apparently Semin/Caps reached a similar agreement when he came back to the NHL.
if Habs trade for him, and that is a possibility, i don't see them playing hardball like Nashville in terms of forcing him to play for his ELC contract salary.
if he does HAVE to play for that salary period, great!
FORWARDS
Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Erik Cole ($4.500m)
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / David Jones ($2.500m)
Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.000m) / Lars Eller ($2.000m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Mike Blunden ($0.700m) / Ryan White ($0.700m) / George Parros ($0.900m)
/ Brad Winchester ($0.700m)
DEFENSEMEN
Josh Gorges ($3.900m) / P.K. Subban ($2.800m)
Nicklas Grossman ($3.100m) / Raphael Diaz ($1.300m)
Alexei Emelin ($1.300m) / Tomas Kaberle ($4.250m)
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Matt Carkner ($0.850m)
GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($4.750m) / Peter Budaj ($1.150m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,688,333; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $3,611,667
FORWARDS
Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Erik Cole ($4.500m)
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / David Jones ($2.500m)
Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.000m) / Lars Eller ($2.000m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Mike Blunden ($0.700m) / Ryan White ($0.700m) / George Parros ($0.900m)
/ Brad Winchester ($0.700m)
DEFENSEMEN
Josh Gorges ($3.900m) / P.K. Subban ($2.800m)
Nicklas Grossman ($3.100m) / Raphael Diaz ($1.300m)
Alexei Emelin ($1.300m) / Tomas Kaberle ($4.250m)
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Matt Carkner ($0.850m)
GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($4.750m) / Peter Budaj ($1.150m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,688,333; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $3,611,667
Put Winchester at Blunden's spot and I'll be happy with that. Winchester is a better player and a better fighter than Blunden.
As for Carkner, he now is a legit stay-at-home NHL defenseman, and he should be with Diaz on the third pair.
FORWARDS
Erik Cole ($4.500m) / David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Max Pacioretty ($1.625m)
Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.250m) / Lars Eller ($1.575m) / Rene Bourque ($3.333m)
Travis Moen ($2.000m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Ryan White ($0.625m) / Scott Gomez ($7.357m) / Petteri Nokelainen ($0.550m)
/ / Mike Blunden ($0.615m)
edit: switch blunden and nokelainen
GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($4.000m) / Peter Budaj ($1.150m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,330,476; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $3,969,524
Are people really giving Subban an under 3M caphit ? Slump or not, he's still (on the depth chart AND in performance) at worst, our current no. 2 Dman and doing a fine job overall. Hell, didn't Luke Schenn get like 3.5 as a mostly defensive defenseman (and one who doesn't even play against top lines like Subban does) and most people tought it was a fine contract. If we can get Subban signed semi-longterm (3-4 years) at 3.5M, that would be a fine contract that would probably end up being a steal in the last few years.
Price's cap hit could go all over the place (5M-7M) depending mainly on the number of years, his performance the rest of the season (it's not like his save is sub .900, he's at like .914 so he could realistically end the season at over .920 if he/we go on a tear) and his desire to give an hometown discount.
Now the other of our 3 main RFAs, Eller has pretty hard value to gauge. He's another case where we'll know better at the end of the season but I can't help wondering if the people having him at 1.5M still think it's 2006. Didn't JVR get something like 4 or 4+ with a career high of 40 pts ? (Well okay I didn't think it was a good contract and it's not a Mtl thing to pay for potential but still) Not saying Eller will get 4M (he won't) but I would feel pretty safe with giving him about 2.5 ( it could even end up being more if he end up with near 40 pts (or even over depending on how he's used the rest of the way)) especially if it's semi-longterm like I said about Subban.
We won't have a better idea till the end of the season, but there is no way he signs for 1.5 if he ends up with what he's on pace for (35 pts). I hadn't tought about Eller's contract before reading this thread, but now that I think about it maybe not giving him PP time wasn't such a bad thing. It will keep his cap hit way down compared to what it would be if he would have ended the season with 10-15 more pts from the PP. #Greedy
I also wonder what kind of contract Diaz and Emelin will get? I had completely forgotten about them only being on one-year deals.
Also if Gaustad is willing to take a fourth line center role instead of the third line one he has in Buffalo he would be a great addition (good player that serves a purpose and isn't just some goon that can barely play 5min) but perhaps a bit pricey for a 4th liner. Maybe Pahlsson, I think his caphit will go way down from what it's now. I want a 4th line that actually serves a purpose. Not just stick a bunch of tough players together just so we can say we have a tough team. I'd love a good defensive fourth line that can play some tougher minutes than the one we have now (that can only matchup against other fourth liners), doesn't mean the players on it can't be tough or hit but I want them to actually be able to play hockey. Imagine having the luxury of matching the DD line against 4th lines at home.
With all the UFA's deleted there are 4-5 openings up front for next season. I think you have the following players going for these spots internally: Leblanc
Gallagher
Palushaj
Potential 1st rnd pick (if he's a forward)
Potential UFA's to target
Chris Kelly
Paul Gaustad
David Moss Jordin TooToo Torrey Mitchell
I think they also need to sign a d-man as insurance Shaone Morrison
Milan Jurcina
Pretty sure that we have to build the offensive around those 3
Gionta - Eller - Leblanc
(5f07 175lbs) - (6f00 198lbs) - (6f00 178lbs)
[5.000] - [1.850] 3 years - [1.170]
A new scenery for Eller who got the chance to play with a veteran and a rookie. Gionta and Plekanec must be separated to give experience to Eller and more scoring opportunities.
Are people really giving Subban an under 3M caphit ? Slump or not, he's still (on the depth chart AND in performance) at worst, our current no. 2 Dman and doing a fine job overall. Hell, didn't Luke Schenn get like 3.5 as a mostly defensive defenseman (and one who doesn't even play against top lines like Subban does) and most people tought it was a fine contract. If we can get Subban signed semi-longterm (3-4 years) at 3.5M, that would be a fine contract that would probably end up being a steal in the last few years.
Price's cap hit could go all over the place (5M-7M) depending mainly on the number of years, his performance the rest of the season (it's not like his save is sub .900, he's at like .914 so he could realistically end the season at over .920 if he/we go on a tear) and his desire to give an hometown discount.
Now the other of our 3 main RFAs, Eller has pretty hard value to gauge. He's another case where we'll know better at the end of the season but I can't help wondering if the people having him at 1.5M still think it's 2006. Didn't JVR get something like 4 or 4+ with a career high of 40 pts ? (Well okay I didn't think it was a good contract and it's not a Mtl thing to pay for potential but still) Not saying Eller will get 4M (he won't) but I would feel pretty safe with giving him about 2.5 ( it could even end up being more if he end up with near 40 pts (or even over depending on how he's used the rest of the way)) especially if it's semi-longterm like I said about Subban.
We won't have a better idea till the end of the season, but there is no way he signs for 1.5 if he ends up with what he's on pace for (35 pts). I hadn't tought about Eller's contract before reading this thread, but now that I think about it maybe not giving him PP time wasn't such a bad thing. It will keep his cap hit way down compared to what it would be if he would have ended the season with 10-15 more pts from the PP. #Greedy
I also wonder what kind of contract Diaz and Emelin will get? I had completely forgotten about them only being on one-year deals.
Also if Gaustad is willing to take a fourth line center role instead of the third line one he has in Buffalo he would be a great addition (good player that serves a purpose and isn't just some goon that can barely play 5min) but perhaps a bit pricey for a 4th liner. Maybe Pahlsson, I think his caphit will go way down from what it's now. I want a 4th line that actually serves a purpose. Not just stick a bunch of tough players together just so we can say we have a tough team. I'd love a good defensive fourth line that can play some tougher minutes than the one we have now (that can only matchup against other fourth liners), doesn't mean the players on it can't be tough or hit but I want them to actually be able to play hockey. Imagine having the luxury of matching the DD line against 4th lines at home.
One thing that will be to Montreal's advantage when negotiating new deals with Subban and Eller is that RFA's get paid according to what they can negotiate according what they'd get if arbitration eligible. i.e. What their comparables are by the stats you can find on nhl.com, which are the only data allowed in these discussions. The only other limit is what they might get if a team was willing to offer-sheet them, which tends to be only a factor in major talents like Doughty etc. (Subban may or may not fall into this catagory).
Its not like UFA's were they get paid according to what an actual population of NHL GM's would consider their current worth to be, which tends to be a better approximation of relative value than the RFA process is. Which is a big reason why defensive players salaries skyrocket more than anyone elses once they hit UFA status.
Are you serious? Weber and Kristo each could fetch a better package than that. Are you Philipp Grubauer?
Kristo is a second round pick who's nearly going nowhere : 4 fourth will be a nice thing. We can hope for more still.
Weber and Grubauer are both in the same situation nowhere near a real spot to get a chance. We need to get another goalie in the minor against Delmas Mayer etc. Someone must take Budaj spot in a year or so ...
Weber is overated by habs fan and he will have to fight to get a chance around the league. Diaz has already stoled is place on the habs, do you think Weber will be able to get a real chance somewhere?
Pretty sure that we have to build the offensive around those 3
Gionta - Eller - Leblanc
(5f07 175lbs) - (6f00 198lbs) - (6f00 178lbs)
[5.000] - [1.850] 3 years - [1.170]
A new scenery for Eller who got the chance to play with a veteran and a rookie. Gionta and Plekanec must be separated to give experience to Eller and more scoring opportunities.
Price
(6f03 219lbs)
[5.900] 10 years : 4.500*2years + 6.250*8years
Budaj
(6f01 200lbs)
[1.150]
TEAM
[64.270]
==========================
A team with a lot more size and punch who will stop every offensives systems.
Dont know where to start.
The trades are bad for us.
Leblanc on the 2nd line. Gionta LW?
Plekanec on a line with Moen?
Christensen as a 4th line center?
Gomez as an extra (7.35M on the bench)...
Gorges on the 3rd pair...
Kristo is a second round pick who's nearly going nowhere : 4 fourth will be a nice thing. We can hope for more still.
Weber and Grubauer are both in the same situation nowhere near a real spot to get a chance. We need to get another goalie in the minor against Delmas Mayer etc. Someone must take Budaj spot in a year or so ...
Weber is overated by habs fan and he will have to fight to get a chance around the league. Diaz has already stoled is place on the habs, do you think Weber will be able to get a real chance somewhere?
Huh??? There's maybe 5 defensemen in the entire NHL with more PP goals than Yanick Weber, and you think he's in "the same situation" as Philipp Grubauer and will be hard pressed to get a chance anywhere in the NHL? I'm completely stumped. Was that a troll post or are you that clueless?
I'll say it again, I think a lot of people on here really want to trade Weber just so they can complain some more about Gauthier giving up young talent a la O'Byrne.
Leblanc on the 2nd line. Gionta LW?
Plekanec on a line with Moen?
Christensen as a 4th line center?
Gomez as an extra (7.35M on the bench)...
Gorges on the 3rd pair...
sorry for Gio i didn't realize that i had put him on the left .. in my head i had leblanc a leftie and Gio ... but as we read from left to right you do see it this way ... my bad
Plekanec Moen and Bourque 3 defensive foward as a shutdown line ... if that doesn,t work for Eller Leblanc and Gio for an offensive line you can swap Moen and Gionta but i'd rather have 2 biggy surronding a smurf !!
Gome has to be out of the roster traded ou buy out ... 2 facts appear to be : we won't be able to trade him and if cba contract don't change we are stuck with him ... i rather have a young rookie to get ice experience than have him regardless than the damn salary.
Gorges is the second defenseman behind Markov (full healthy) Subban is a second B the pairing are not revealing their ice time or rank ... it's only pair of defenseman ... wich in today,s hockey is totally is unpredictable.
Christensen is a good faceoff man and good pker if engqvist can make is place ....
Huh??? There's maybe 5 defensemen in the entire NHL with more PP goals than Yanick Weber, and you think he's in "the same situation" as Philipp Grubauer and will be hard pressed to get a chance anywhere in the NHL? I'm completely stumped. Was that a troll post or are you that clueless?
I'll say it again, I think a lot of people on here really want to trade Weber just so they can complain some more about Gauthier giving up young talent a la O'Byrne.
he is a great asset okay ... but we have PK Beaulieu Diaz Kaberle Markov Emelin St-Denis Tinordi ... is he still part of our future consideration ? I guess not ... but i might be wrong. I'm not from those who trade for fun : i do see that he has lost his spot to someone else ... As Gomez lost it to Desharnais ....
FORWARDS
Zach Parise ($7.500m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Rene Bourque ($3.333m)
Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Erik Cole ($4.500m)
Louis Leblanc ($1.170m) / Lars Eller ($1.750m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Ryan White ($0.625m) / Dominic Moore ($1.100m) / Arron Asham ($0.975m)
Mike Blunden ($0.615m)
GOALTENDERS
Peter Budaj ($1.150m) / Carey Price ($5.500m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,792,500; BONUSES: $300,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,507,500
Kristo is a second round pick who's nearly going nowhere : 4 fourth will be a nice thing. We can hope for more still.
Weber and Grubauer are both in the same situation nowhere near a real spot to get a chance. We need to get another goalie in the minor against Delmas Mayer etc. Someone must take Budaj spot in a year or so ...
Weber is overated by habs fan and he will have to fight to get a chance around the league. Diaz has already stoled is place on the habs, do you think Weber will be able to get a real chance somewhere?
How is Weber overrated? That's the most ridiculous thing I've read in months. If anything he is underrated because everybody puts him in their trade proposals as a throw in when he will be a solid NHL defenseman and I'm sure lots of teams would like to have him. He had another solid game last night, but having 7 d-men is hard on everybody, guys like Campoli Gill and Kaberle have a hard time getting into the game and so do young guys like Emelin and especially Diaz and weber who end up sitting. Hopefully within a couple weeks Campoli and Gill are moved.
Last night gave me the opportunity to watch a game from beginning to end, all the periods, overtime and the shootout and I must say, not only was I entertained in a long time, but I like what I see in the Habs future and here is why:
Pacioretty - Desharnais - Cole
Bourque - Plekanec - XXXXX
XXXXX - Eller - XXXXX
White - Leblanc - XXXXXX
Gorges - Subban
Tinordi - Emelin
Beaulieu - XXXXX
Price
Not only did I like what I saw but I think that we have the right core to move forward with some top end talent on the back end and hopefully a top three pick this June that might land us Yakupov, Grigorenko or Forsberg. Personally, I feel that the need is at centre and right wing, so Grigorenko might just be the perfect fit or Galchenyuk.
Montreal is not far from being a great team for a long time, if we look at our goalie situation and the defensive core, some might say that we will be safe for at least another 10 years, lock up Price, Subban and Emelin a.s.a.p. make Gorges a captain and develop Tinordi, Beaulieu and Ellis as best as we can.
Last night I also got to see a series of shooters in the shootout that were all over six feet tall, Bourque, Pacioretty and Cole have all added a much needed dimension to Montreal's line up and now it's time to draft a top line centre and develop Leblanc and Eller to be the 2nd and 3rd line centres of the future.
We are not in bad shape at all, especially since we might have a lottery pick in June to start the re-building and re-tooling!
? Slump or not, he's still (on the depth chart AND in performance) at worst, our current no. 2 Dman and doing a fine job overall. Hell, didn't Luke Schenn get like 3.5 as a mostly defensive defenseman (and one who doesn't even play against top lines like Subban does) and most people tought it was a fine contract. If we can get Subban signed semi-longterm (3-4 years) at 3.5M, that would be a fine contract that would probably end up being a steal in the last few years.
