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Canucks looking to package F Mason Raymond for top tier player

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Old
01-31-2012, 01:51 AM
  #101
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Originally Posted by kitchen44 View Post
Yeah guys who are top 15 in points belong on the 4th line
Yeah, Eberle looks pretty good to me too, I think he could make a lot of teams first lines,

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01-31-2012, 01:52 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi View Post
I still don't trust the Raymond, Higgin's, Hansen's etc. of the world to score when the pressure is on most. There could never be enough secondary scoring behind the Sedins/Kesler.
So logic would dictate that we'd increase our scoring depth by acquiring 2 bottom 6 guys to support that scoring.

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01-31-2012, 01:52 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
This article isn't even written by a Canucks fan or beat reporter.

The majority Vancouver fans think this is stupid. Vancouver arguably has one of the best Top 6 groups in the league. We don't need a Perry, Ryan, Getzlaf, Carter, Richards, Nash, Morrow or Doan. What we 'need' is a bigger and grittier version of Raymond, and we can afford to lose some production to get that.
lol check out CDC. Posters there actually think schenids, ballard, raymond for perry is a legit proposal that makes sense for both sides and that it could happen.

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01-31-2012, 01:55 AM
  #104
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lol check out CDC. Posters there actually think schenids, ballard, raymond for perry is a legit proposal that makes sense for both sides.
Using CDC as a logic base for how all Canucks fans think is about as logical as saying Sarah Palin is a representative of how all American Republicans think. The ******** is quite deep.

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01-31-2012, 01:55 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
So logic would dictate that we'd increase our scoring depth by acquiring 2 bottom 6 guys to support that scoring.
Ehh,

You're not going to get a trusted goal scorer/producer who is a bottom 6 forward. I'm thinking one more legit star forward (think Chicago with their four of Kane-Toews-Sharp-Hossa), we have three legit guys like that, and then 6 or 7 really good support guys. Therefore we have the depth to make a big splash and give to get.

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01-31-2012, 01:57 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post

Sedin-Sedin-Malkin
Kesler-Stamkos-Gaborik
Booth-Hodgson-Higgins
Malhotra-Lapierre-Hansen

Hamhuis-Weber
Suter-Bieksa
Edler-Hedman
Tanev

Luongo
Schneider
Really?!? This is So Unrealistic! Obviously Rome would be our number 1 Dman!

On a more serious note..I'd love a Suter or Weber coming our way...I doubt it happens though

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01-31-2012, 01:59 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi View Post
Ehh,

You're not going to get a trusted goal scorer/producer who is a bottom 6 forward. I'm thinking one more legit star forward (think Chicago with their four of Kane-Toews-Sharp-Hossa), we have three legit guys like that, and then 6 or 7 really good support guys. Therefore we have the depth to make a big splash and give to get.
If Vancouver makes a splash, it'll be for a defenseman.

Our offense has already outscored last years offense and we still have 32 games left to play.

Offense is hardly an issue.

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01-31-2012, 01:59 AM
  #108
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Yeah, good luck with that. Raymond sucks.
he has all the skill in the world, it's finish that he lacks. I say we ship Raymond+ for a Top 4 defenseman.

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01-31-2012, 01:59 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by LuiLui View Post
Really?!? This is So Unrealistic! Obviously Rome would be our number 1 Dman!

On a more serious note..I'd love a Suter or Weber coming our way...I doubt it happens though
My problem with that lineup is that Suter and Weber are split up, and Hamhuis and Bieksa were split up. NO RESPECT FOR CHEMISTRY!

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01-31-2012, 02:00 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by XavTrick View Post
AND GILLIS.

Seriously if we can get Perry without losing a Sedin, Kesler, Luongo or Edler I'd be ecstatic
Lol he was joking...

I'd be ecstatic if we got Crosby... Guess what.. Neither are happening. Perry isn't being traded, get over it.

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01-31-2012, 02:01 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
If Vancouver makes a splash, it'll be for a defenseman.

Our offense has already outscored last years offense and we still have 32 games left to play.

Offense is hardly an issue.
We could use a defenceman obviously, but Im saying if a Perry or a Nash or whoever could be had...why the **** wouldnt we try to get them? Now thats just silly.

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01-31-2012, 02:02 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi View Post
We could use a defenceman obviously, but Im saying if a Perry or a Nash or whoever could be had...why the **** wouldnt we try to get them? Now thats just silly.
Nash's nearly 8M dollar contract is a non-starter.

He and Perry are completely different. Perry is worth his salary, Nash most certainly is not. Can you actually justify paying a guy who's never cracked 85pts nearly 2M more than each Sedin?

No.

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01-31-2012, 02:05 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi View Post
We could use a defenceman obviously, but Im saying if a Perry or a Nash or whoever could be had...why the **** wouldnt we try to get them? Now thats just silly.
Because acquiring them would require us to lose depth (which is needed for a cup run), and adding a high cap hit screws us over because it means we can't have good depth (I'm mainly talking about Nash's cap hit).
If we didn't have Daniel Sedin, then yes, let's go after a superstar winger.

I'd much rather move Raymond + high draft picks and/or our best prospects for a quality top 4 d-man than a quality top 6 winger.

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01-31-2012, 02:52 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
What is the 1st line calibre for?

Ho, never mind, i get it, Cannuck put a lot of value in ''Insurance'' in case a top player fall or disappoint.
Nothing. The Canucks don't need a 1st line calibre player and they aren't going to acquire a 1st line calibre player. If Raymond's traded it's for a top 4 dman.

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01-31-2012, 03:00 AM
  #115
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I know you guys aren't thrilled with his salary, but jeez a line with Nash and the Sedins would be beyond scary. I think M_B is right, if he became available they would definitely have to think about that.

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01-31-2012, 03:03 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
I know you guys aren't thrilled with his salary, but jeez a line with Nash and the Sedins would be beyond scary. I think M_B is right, if he became available they would definitely have to think about that.
Pray tell, how would Vancouver make space for him without gutting depth? Okay, unload Ballard, Raymond, Malhotra, whatever, but why would Columbus even be interested in that? That guts us of a 20G 2 way forward, one of the most elite PKers, and a serviceable defenseman. I'd take Nash if he made 1.5M less in a heartbeat, no doubt but there's no way to justify his contract.

I think Anaheim fans will tell you that one super elite line doesn't get you very far.

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01-31-2012, 03:08 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
I know you guys aren't thrilled with his salary, but jeez a line with Nash and the Sedins would be beyond scary. I think M_B is right, if he became available they would definitely have to think about that.
7.8M caphit

ouf, the Canucks would be pretty much ****ed if they don't win the Cup. Even if he's slumping and Howsen isn't a very good GM, they wouldn't let their franchise player go without taking away some very good pieces from Gillis.

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01-31-2012, 03:10 AM
  #118
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Yea I know, it doesn't make cap sense. My eyes just lit up thinking about that line. I have watched him much more than most with him playing so close by and I know he is capable of so much more than what he is doing with the Jackets.

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01-31-2012, 03:13 AM
  #119
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How about Raymond + Tanev + 1st for Dennis Wideman and Joel Ward?

Wideman could be last years Erhoff, UFA at the end of the season, is putting up career numbers this season. Great PPQB, but Washington can't afford to resign him after the season and aren't likely going on a deep run this year.

Joel Ward was clutch in last years playoff but hasn't produced as much as hoped this year. Great Pk, gritty and strong would look good on the Nucks 3rd line.

Raymond has top-6 upside and could use a change of scenery to take the next step.

I dont know much about Tanev, but a D needs to be going back he probably wouldn't be too missed in the playoffs.

The 1st is required if Wideman is going the other way. The thing I'm not sure about is cap-implications, do Vancouver fit them both under? It's 6,937~ something going from Washington.

The Caps only do this though if they know Mike Green is coming back this year before the playoffs.

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01-31-2012, 03:13 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Yea I know, it doesn't make cap sense. My eyes just lit up thinking about that line. I have watched him much more than most with him playing so close by and I know he is capable of so much more than what he is doing with the Jackets.
Absolutely. I would not want to have to game plan for Sedin-Sedin-Nash, lol. I just used him as an example of the type of guy Canuck fans are saying ''we don't need'' now all of a sudden.

You know you're too cocky when...

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01-31-2012, 03:15 AM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Yea I know, it doesn't make cap sense. My eyes just lit up thinking about that line. I have watched him much more than most with him playing so close by and I know he is capable of so much more than what he is doing with the Jackets.
I agree with you, I think Nash with some elite playmakers would be amazing. Had there not been a cap, Vancouver would do it in a heartbeat. Yeah, the Sedins make Burrows (a great 3rd liner, good 2nd liner) look amazing because of their chemistry but I would like nothing more than to see them with a legit sniper. However, I'd rather have 3 legitimate scoring scoring lines than 1 elite and 2 decent. I know you're a Detroit fan and you've had the privilege of watching amazing teams for 20 years. This is a first for us, as Vancouver fans, to see a truly deep and threatening team. I wouldn't dismantle it for the hopes that our first line would be better.

I didn't mean to seem so defensive towards you, I apologize.

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01-31-2012, 03:15 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
Pray tell, how would Vancouver make space for him without gutting depth? Okay, unload Ballard, Raymond, Malhotra, whatever, but why would Columbus even be interested in that? That guts us of a 20G 2 way forward, one of the most elite PKers, and a serviceable defenseman. I'd take Nash if he made 1.5M less in a heartbeat, no doubt but there's no way to justify his contract.

I think Anaheim fans will tell you that one super elite line doesn't get you very far.
Even losing Ballard, Raymond and Malhotra it's a nonstarter.

We're 1 year away from owing Edler, Burrows, Hodgson, Higgins and Lappy around $7million in raises.

Plus we have to find a replacement for Salo, and seeing that Gleason just got $4million, our new top-4 guy is going to cost us a lot more than the $2million that Salo's currently making.

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01-31-2012, 03:17 AM
  #123
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Even losing Ballard, Raymond and Malhotra it's a nonstarter.

We're 1 year away from owing Edler, Burrows, Hodgson, Higgins and Lappy around $7million in raises.

And we have to find a replacement for Salo, which is going to cost us a lot more than the $2million that he's currently making.
Exactly. While having an All-Star lineup is definitely salivating, I'd rather retain Lapierre, Hodgson, Edler and Burrows.

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01-31-2012, 03:17 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
I agree with you, I think Nash with some elite playmakers would be amazing. Had there not been a cap, Vancouver would do it in a heartbeat. Yeah, the Sedins make Burrows (a great 3rd liner, good 2nd liner) look amazing because of their chemistry but I would like nothing more than to see them with a legit sniper. However, I'd rather have 3 legitimate scoring scoring lines than 1 elite and 2 decent. I know you're a Detroit fan and you've had the privilege of watching amazing teams for 20 years. This is a first for us, as Vancouver fans, to see a truly deep and threatening team. I wouldn't dismantle it for the hopes that our first line would be better.

I didn't mean to seem so defensive towards you, I apologize.
No offense taken, didn't take it like that. I agree with you too, I know from watching the Wings that more times than not rolling three strong lines is what wins in the playoffs. Pretty much what we are screaming for right now to get at the deadline, more depth on offense. Our bottom six right now is pretty much made up of guys with hands of stone.

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01-31-2012, 03:22 AM
  #125
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Not digging the title of the thread.

Way to many people don't actually read the post.

It's raymond ++ for a 1st line player, not just him.

Which is obvious, but some people don't read

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