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Jersey Woes : Habs lose to Devils 5-3, but there is a silver lining

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:11 PM
  #226
EllertoKostitsynGoal
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Originally Posted by Grant McCagg View Post
Why? You're not like most of the posters on here and actually believing that the Habs would pick Grigorenko in the top 3, or even top 5? I don't see that happening...too many questions about his work habits and consistency...and he's Russian.

The Habs scouting staff won't draft players of similar value based on their position if there are too many question marks and thus better options in their minds. there is also a huge reluctance to draft a Russian player with any issues whatsoever, and Grigorenko is well known to dog it on occasion, too often if yoju ask some scouts. The KHL looms too largely if there is any adversity don the road, and heaven knows with russian players there is often adversity. So many outside influences, including agents, teams, family, media, friends, etc.
I'm actually surprised to hear that TT isn't high on Grigorenko since he seems to have such an high ceilling. I know you can't really say on here who TT and the organisation wants but who are you high on personally? I know lots of people here love Gaunce (though I don't) but he doesn't look like a Timmins pick to me, he reminds me of McNeil a bit. Girgensons is a guy that doesn't get mentionned alot around here wich is surprising since he fits the big center mold everyone dreams about all while looking like the kind of player the organisation would legitimately love.

Thanks if you have the time to answer.

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02-02-2012, 10:14 PM
  #227
zx81
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Originally Posted by Skarjak View Post
I can't believe so many people are mad about this game.
A loss is always disappointing for the fans even in a "tanking mode".
It's also frustrating to always the same ways of losing.
I have seen today's game about 13-14 times already this season.

The problems remain the same with no sign of improvement.
In other words, it's getting old.

I wish I had this

I would travel to October 2012.

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02-02-2012, 10:14 PM
  #228
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"These guys have, at their best, played .500 hockey. What made people believe they could suddenly go on the 10 game winning streak required to get us back into the race?"

well sure when you put it that way it just sounds silly

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:16 PM
  #229
Et le But
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grant McCagg View Post
Why? You're not like most of the posters on here and actually believing that the Habs would pick Grigorenko in the top 3, or even top 5? I don't see that happening...too many questions about his work habits and consistency...and he's Russian.

The Habs scouting staff won't draft players of similar value based on their position if there are too many question marks and thus better options in their minds. there is also a huge reluctance to draft a Russian player with any issues whatsoever, and Grigorenko is well known to dog it on occasion, too often if yoju ask some scouts. The KHL looms too largely if there is any adversity don the road, and heaven knows with russian players there is often adversity. So many outside influences, including agents, teams, family, media, friends, etc.
Grigorenko is worth the risk, but I have to admit there's another Russian he reminds me slightly of... Yashin. For the record I think Yashin gets a bad rap for beig given atrocious contracts and being asked to carry terrible teams, but I don't think Yashin is any more far off than Malkin. I see Thornton like upside more than anything else.

I just can't see picking him over Yakupov. But we won't pick first anyway.

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02-02-2012, 10:16 PM
  #230
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Columbus has basically already gotten Nail

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:17 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
It's going to be hilarious if Grigorenko busts.
It would be if we get Yakupov and somebody else gets stuck with Grigorenko.

If it's us who drafts him and he busts... no, I won't be laughing.

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02-02-2012, 10:17 PM
  #232
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I think we need something a little more solid than your petty Abram tanks..


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02-02-2012, 10:18 PM
  #233
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I'm still wondering the difference a healthy Markov would have made to this team because I still don't think we have a bad team. Not this bad.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:20 PM
  #234
larek
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Originally Posted by zx81 View Post
A loss is always disappointing for the fans even in a "tanking mode".
It's also frustrating to always the same ways of losing.
I have seen today's game about 13-14 times already this season.

The problems remain the same with no sign of improvement.
In other words, it's getting old.

I wish I had this

I would travel to October 2012.
Nope!! not me - like tosee certain players play well but at the end of the game i want to see
an L

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:22 PM
  #235
larek
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Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
I'm still wondering the difference a healthy Markov would have made to this team because I still don't think we have a bad team. Not this bad.
move up a few spots- markov now will not be jesus

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:22 PM
  #236
Et le But
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Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
I'm still wondering the difference a healthy Markov would have made to this team because I still don't think we have a bad team. Not this bad.
A couple of things screwed us. Timely injuries - don't forget Gionta, shootouts, and firing the coach at the worst possible time without replacing him. We are a lot like the Devils last year.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:22 PM
  #237
Cyclones Rock
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That's what gets me. DD is a fine player, very useful, but he has his limitations. Martin spent untold amounts of effort and buried Plekanec with defensive faceoffs so that he could shelter DD from defensive assignments and give him all the offensive minutes he could possibly get so that he could cut loose with what he does best.

While he was doing this, Cunneyworth was right there. Didn't they talk? How can he not have a clue?
DD had plenty of offensive zone face offs tonight. And plenty at the end of the game-he was on the ice for the game losing goal. Ya know, at the end of tight games, most coaches don't roll four lines. Upon occasion lines don't match up entirely to coaches' likings.....changes on the fly, home team getting last changes.

Hockey is not chess. It's fluid. It's played in real life. It's not a mathematical model. Sheesh. It's impossible to generate perfect match ups at all times.

BTW, I'm not a RC fan. I'm entirely indifferent about him.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:24 PM
  #238
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
It would be if we get Yakupov and somebody else gets stuck with Grigorenko.

If it's us who drafts him and he busts... no, I won't be laughing.
We'll try to make him a good defensive player during the first 4 years in the NHL.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:24 PM
  #239
MathMan
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Problem #1 is the team isn't very good.
There's any number of signs that point to the team being much better than its record and actually pretty good.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:26 PM
  #240
MathMan
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
I think we need something a little more solid than your petty Abram tanks..
A Baneblade? Are we really breaking out the superheavies?

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:27 PM
  #241
Andy
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Originally Posted by Cyclones Rock View Post
DD had plenty of offensive zone face offs tonight. And plenty at the end of the game-he was on the ice for the game losing goal. Ya know, at the end of tight games, most coaches don't roll four lines. Upon occasion lines don't match up entirely to coaches' likings.....changes on the fly, home team getting last changes.

Hockey is not chess. It's fluid. It's played in real life. It's not a mathematical model. Sheesh. It's impossible to generate perfect match ups at all times.

BTW, I'm not a RC fan. I'm entirely indifferent about him.
I disagree entirely. Look at Hitchcock's work in St.Louis, the team is like night and day under him. He knows how to exploit his players assets and the areas they excel in by putting everyone in roles in which they can succeed and provide the greatest benefit to the team. Never under-estimate the power of good coaching.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:29 PM
  #242
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oops looks like my Delorean pic does not show.
Anyway you now know what the picture was.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:30 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by Cyclones Rock View Post
Ya know, at the end of tight games, most coaches don't roll four lines. Upon occasion lines don't match up entirely to coaches' likings.....changes on the fly, home team getting last changes.
Upon occasion, sure. And you have to give more leeway to the road coach. But tonight it wasn't "upon occasion", it was "most of the time".

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02-02-2012, 10:31 PM
  #244
Cyclones Rock
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
I disagree entirely. Look at Hitchcock's work in St.Louis, the team is like night and day under him. He knows how to exploit his players assets and the areas they excel in by putting everyone in roles in which they can succeed and provide the greatest benefit to the team. Never under-estimate the power of good coaching.
It's impossible to generate all match ups to a team's best benefit. Road disadvantage (last change), changes on the fly, PPs, PKs all impact the universe of realistic possibilities of match ups.

I'm not saying some coaches aren't better than others.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:33 PM
  #245
Andy
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Originally Posted by Cyclones Rock View Post
It's impossible to generate all match ups to a team's best benefit. Road disadvantage (last change), changes on the fly, PPs, PKs all impact the universe of realistic possibilities of match ups.

I'm not saying some coaches aren't better than others.
Yet some coaches handle it better than others. I don't like RCs matchups and I think it's his biggest downfall which hurts the team.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:34 PM
  #246
Kriss E
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I'm still wondering the difference a healthy Markov would have made to this team because I still don't think we have a bad team. Not this bad.
Jacques Martin alone would make this team better, as it has regressed since his firing.
We'd be around the .500 mark with him around. That's with a horrible PP too.

So, if we had Markov, there's no doubt we'd be a PO team.

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02-02-2012, 10:36 PM
  #247
Cyclones Rock
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Upon occasion, sure. And you have to give more leeway to the road coach. But tonight it wasn't "upon occasion", it was "most of the time".
The effectiveness-or I should say complete ineffectiveness-of all of the other lines impact RC's decision making. Plekanec is probably ready to off himself by now-being saddled with Heinz 57 Gomez and his line hasn't generated squat for some time. Eller isn't quite into his own yet offensively and he can't be counted on for much offensive generation.

DD's line would probably be overused by any coach and not ideally matched often times due to the above described facts.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:39 PM
  #248
Cyclones Rock
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Yet some coaches handle it better than others. I don't like RCs matchups and I think it's his biggest downfall which hurts the team.
If you're using DD's line as an example of this over the month of January, it's a very poor example. Tonight was the first time he'd been on the ice for two goals against all calendar year and if I'm not mistaken, he's only been on the ice for 5 or 6 goals against in all scenarios since the beginning of the calendar year. So, I think it's fair to say that DD's match ups have been very favorable under RC's reign.

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02-02-2012, 10:40 PM
  #249
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HFB: Let's blame DD for Cole's turnover on the GWG.

Not sure why it always has to be DD's fault each time the line gets scored.

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Old
02-02-2012, 10:41 PM
  #250
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Well if we are a playoff team like some of you are suggesting, and yet we draft a Yakupov/Grigorenko then what does that say about our chances next year? Under new management and Patty Roy as coach

Can you say most exciting season since...forever?

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