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Considering the Rangers offensive woes (esp PP) - Why is Zuke still in the AHL?

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Old
02-09-2012, 12:57 PM
  #51
Tawnos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UlfNilsson View Post
This whole "Wow, this thread again? We've already determined that MZA is done as a Ranger..." thing still doesn't answer some burning questions - like WHY is he done as a Ranger. I don't think there have been adequate answers to that question.
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
If a player isn't going to score consistently on this team, then he has to have some other tool that will help the team. EC is gone and Wolski is a healthy scratch... both players are of little use to the team when they aren't generating offense.

If MZA had another facet to his game, whether it be defense, speed, size, etc., he probably would have been called up already. Obviously he won't be on the scoresheet every game and he had stretches last season where he wasn't contributing. The question remains, what can he do to help the team when he's not producing, and should he be playing over the likes of Rupp/Mitchell/whomever, players that can be effective even if they aren't scoring.
Ulf, if you don't see this as an adequate answer, then all you are doing at this point is being stubborn.

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:08 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
There are plenty of top European players who fail to stick in the NHL (Jiri Dopita, Jarkko Immonen, Marcel Hossa, etc)

Why was he signed? They saw him play against top players and obviously thought he handled himself well.
Then they were wrong. Like I said before, it was a low risk, high potential move.[/QUOTE]

I love the certainty people use when discussing Zucc's play and potential. "then they were wrong". Based on what? his .55 a game scoring clip as a rookie? or his appearance at the AHL All-star game as a rookie? You are giving up on him because he is small and needed time to adjust to the NA game? Are you kidding me?

Feds gives us nothing offensively and I believe he is a minus player. Mitchell has cooled down alot. Prust and Boyle will never provide consistent offense. We need goals; we need help on the PP. Torts should stop being so stubborn and get some more talent in this lineup. That is really the issue; we are not talented enough and we are outworking the other teams especially in our end.

Once the playoffs start every team works really hard and sells out to keep the puck out of their net. Then talent wins; we need more to win. Stop crowing about our record. Yes it is great to be where we are but I don't think it's a good indication of what we will do in the playoffs especially if Sauer doesn't return and Staal remains un-Staallike.

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:09 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Vito Andolini View Post
The way that this team is playing has produced 24 goals in 12 games. We've managed to do OK in terms of record during this time, but I'm not confident in a teams ability to win on 2 goals a night.




I guess you don't think he'd help on the powerplay then.

1 for 32 over the past 12 games. New blood wouldn't hurt.
I am not feelign confident at how how he would have looked in that Philly/Boston/Buffalo/NJ games.

This team cannto afford a player who can only play the PP becuase his lack of size and defensive game do nto allow for even strength play.

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:21 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
MZA should be up here instead of Mitchell.
Disagree.

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02-09-2012, 01:23 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
Cause he's undersized, isn't that good off the puck, and a defensive liability.

I'd love for him to get called back up, I think he could work well with Richards, but those things I said before, coupled with the lack of an available spot on the roster right now, make his call up difficult.
The key here, the above negatives aside, is he simply doesn't have the speed to cause separation to get offensive chances.

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:28 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
That was not my point at all.



Obviously, the powers that be don't see him as a solution. When have they been shy about reaching down to Hartford for a guy who they feel can contribute?
Actually and as strange as it may seem, I believe it could be about conserving cap space for an eventual run. I heard this the other day from someone fairly familiar with situation. He will either be traded or get a shot after the entire roster fix is completed. This does not really add up when you see Wolski on the roster - but I guess they think a 6´ 3" 25 yo 0,6 PPG player (with over 400 NHL games) has some kind of value. Since he was injured so long they could not trade him then. Now they are patiently trying to find a taker the closer to the deadline they get. I don´t know - this is how I heard it was. Time will tell.

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:31 PM
  #57
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I feel like zuke's name is fast becoming that from the Harry Potter movie..

You know, the man who's name shall not be mentioned again...

The season still has plenty of games left for him to come in and make an impact, but if he get's the nod then he better be on his best on every shift..

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:36 PM
  #58
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It's a simple equation, MZA's lack of speed and size severely negate his offensive creativity.

I look at him and I just don't see an NHL player. To bad, I thought it was a good gamble signing him and I was certainly rooting for him to make it.

I think he could succeed with a team with little depth of talent....read: Islanders....redux: Parenteau. But not on one of the better teams in the league.

For him to have any impact, he would have to play on the top two lines: tell me....who would he replace? Even if one of our top six forwards got hurt, the first shot at replacing him would go to WW (now, that's a whole other can of worms).

MZA can't play on our bottom two lines which are basically blue-collar, defensive first lines. MZA could not be put out in a defensive role late in a game. He could not forecheck and keep possession of the puck. He would not be effective in Tort's neurtral zone forecheck. Sure he has much more talent than Mitchell, but only offensive talent. In the role that Mitchell plays, he is quite effective, more effective than MZA would be. No one is saying put Mitchell on the top two lines. He is infinitely more valuable as a checking forward than MZA would ever be.

I feel for MZA; he worked hard over the summer, had a good camp, and opened the season with the team. He has been pushed aside because we are a much deeper team than we were. He must be frustrated as hell. But, even with our offensive woes (earth to Brad Richards....etc), MZA just doesn't fit. I wish he did but he doesn't. I hope he finds success elsewhere.

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Old
02-09-2012, 01:49 PM
  #59
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I always get a chuckle regarding the Zuccarello argument, especially between the people thinking with their heart instead of their brain.

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Old
02-09-2012, 02:31 PM
  #60
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I can't wait until Mats' contract is done and he can get his chances elsewhere. I wish he could make it on this team, I really did, but that will never happen. I don't mind if its another NHL-team or in the KHL, but anything is better than rotting in the AHL.

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Old
02-09-2012, 02:38 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
I am not feelign confident at how how he would have looked in that Philly/Boston/Buffalo/NJ games.

This team cannto afford a player who can only play the PP becuase his lack of size and defensive game do nto allow for even strength play.
There's no argument that size & defense are not his strengths, but let's not get carried away. He averaged 11 mins of even strength ice per game last year & I don't recall him being some kind of horror show out there.

Anyways, even if he isn't great at even strength...how big a deal is that? We play our 4th liners like Boyle & Prust 10-15 mins per night. It's not like we have a shortage of grinders to put out there. Is there really a harm in having a one-trick pony player on the roster for powerplays and other offense situations?

And lets not kid ourselves. This powerplay has stunk for a long time now. Just sitting and waiting for it to take care of itself may not be a wise decision. It's an important enough thing that maybe it makes sense to weaken one area (5 on 5) to address it.

Someone posted it already. 9 assists on the powerplay last year. Pathetic as it sounds, that was tied for first on our team...in only 42 games.

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Old
02-09-2012, 02:41 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I always get a chuckle regarding the Zuccarello argument, especially between the people thinking with their heart instead of their brain.

I've never had any attatchment to Zucs, as this is the first time that I have thought that we could use him. I really don't see any harm in bringing him up, but your right its great to watch our offensive juggernaut team put up big time goals. And no, I don't think he will solve our offensive Woes, but its definitely worth a shot right now.

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Old
02-09-2012, 02:43 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by SauceCheese91 View Post
I've never had any attatchment to Zucs, as this is the first time that I have thought that we could use him. I really don't see any harm in bringing him up, but your right its great to watch our offensive juggernaut team put up big time goals. And no, I don't think he will solve our offensive Woes, but its definitely worth a shot right now.
There comes a time in every season where a fan needs to realize the identity of a hockey team.

Start there, and youll see that Zuccarello is just about as far from this team's identity as one can be.

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:02 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Start there, and youll see that Zuccarello is just about as far from this team's identity as one can be.
I'm sorry, but that's just wrong.

For all his shortcomings (like his board play and forecheck) he is still a hard working kid, not afraid to play physical, makes great takeaway plays with his stick and he's always first on the backcheck.

I don't think he should be back, I don't think he should be anywhere near this team right now, but your statement was neither fair nor correct.

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:11 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
There comes a time in every season where a fan needs to realize the identity of a hockey team.

Start there, and youll see that Zuccarello is just about as far from this team's identity as one can be.
Nice bit of wisdom. Here's my own...

There comes a time in every season where a team needs to take a good look at itself and identify it's weaknesses and address them.

Until there's a better solution available to help score goals...I'd like to see Zuccarello get some time.

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:15 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
There comes a time in every season where a fan needs to realize the identity of a hockey team.

Start there, and youll see that Zuccarello is just about as far from this team's identity as one can be.
Lol come on dude ,get real here for a moment. If we go into the playoffs with this stagnant offense, were a desirable first round matchup. Zuke himself isn't going to solve this problem, but your rationality for him not coming up here isn't a good one.

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02-09-2012, 03:18 PM
  #67
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i just dont think Zucc has the ability to play the Rangers style of game and be effective. i really dont.

I think guys like Carter, Ryan, etc, could, because they have the bodies, and the shot to do so. Zucc needs time and space to play his passing game...something our system doesnt usually give you a lot of.

id be interested to see him on the power play though. hed have time to make some nice passes then.

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:24 PM
  #68
Tawnos
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Besides which, isn't our problem mostly finishing?

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02-09-2012, 03:25 PM
  #69
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I miss him.

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02-09-2012, 03:25 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vito Andolini View Post
I guess you don't think he'd help on the powerplay then.

1 for 32 over the past 12 games. New blood wouldn't hurt.
Name the last person that put on a Rangers sweater and was able to do anything help the PP. Seriously.


I like Zuccarello. I wouldn't say he's the player in HFD that's currently most deserving of a call-up, and if I'm betting on someone to jump in and contribute offensively, Wolski's got a far better chance of getting it done.

Tough competition. Bad timing on multiple injuries. A hefty salary for his role. There's a LOT of reasons he's not here and probably won't get a shot. 3 or 4 injuries to forwards currently playing nightly might do it.

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:34 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Vito Andolini View Post
Anyways, even if he isn't great at even strength...how big a deal is that? We play our 4th liners like Boyle & Prust 10-15 mins per night. It's not like we have a shortage of grinders to put out there. Is there really a harm in having a one-trick pony player on the roster for powerplays and other offense situations?
Yes, it is a harm. Becuase playing at ES is what this team does best. That does not leave time for a one trick pony.
Quote:
And lets not kid ourselves. This powerplay has stunk for a long time now.
So Richards could not fix it but Zuccarello will?

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:45 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
Feds gives us nothing offensively and I believe he is a minus player. Mitchell has cooled down alot. Prust and Boyle will never provide consistent offense. We need goals; we need help on the PP. Torts should stop being so stubborn and get some more talent in this lineup. That is really the issue; we are not talented enough and we are outworking the other teams especially in our end.

Once the playoffs start every team works really hard and sells out to keep the puck out of their net. Then talent wins; we need more to win. Stop crowing about our record. Yes it is great to be where we are but I don't think it's a good indication of what we will do in the playoffs especially if Sauer doesn't return and Staal remains un-Staallike.
Feds, Prust, Boyle, etc. aren't the real problems on this squad because they're not necessarily supposed to produce. Would it be nice if they did? Of course. If the guys that were supposed to produce, were actually producing it wouldn't be an issue. Anyone expecting Boyle to repeat last season's totals are destined to be dissapointed.

Agreed we need goals... agreed we need more talent as well. MZA is not the answer because he's one dimensional on a team that needs to have versatile players in order to suceed.

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:47 PM
  #73
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The idea that Zuc could come up and fix the powerplay is laughable

im a huge Tortorella supporter, but at this point im convinved that our PP woes are a result of strategy and coaching rather than personnel

Zuc wouldn't change much of anything in that regard

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:49 PM
  #74
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Is it true that Richards was playing on the fourth line?

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Old
02-09-2012, 03:57 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
Name the last person that put on a Rangers sweater and was able to do anything help the PP. Seriously.
Brian Leetch

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