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Hawks 2011-12 Rumor , Speculation , Trade Proposal thread II

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Old
02-19-2012, 06:25 PM
  #276
topnotch
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Originally Posted by zytz View Post
I'm sorry but this is just plain stupid. The point of having cap room is to make sure you have your options open. With the cap space we have, we could take on most any players contract for this season. Three things you need to remember though:

1) Just because we have cap room doesn't mean that the players we want are available.

2) Just because we have cap room, doesn't mean we should pay spend more assets than a player is worth to acquire them.

3) Cap implications don't end at the end of the season. IE- If we kept Campbell because, **** why not we aren't using that cap space anyways, then Bowman wouldn't have been able to extend Sharps contract without being forced into dumping salary in the offseason.


It's pretty easy with hindsight on your side to go back and say "Yeah we shouldn't have dumped all that salary because we aren't using it..." but somehow people still forget about managing the players we have in the system RIGHT NOW that need to be taken care of. For me, Sharp > Campbell, AINEC. I can understand an argument going the other way, but that's what all the moaning and groaning eventually boils down to... did Bowman want to keep Campbell or Sharp long term? Because there's no chance he could have kept both.
The point of having cap room is so that your GM has flexibility when the team needs to acquire some new players. Well, the team needs a couple new players and we have the cap room. If Bowman set this team up hoping that the trade deadline would net him NHL players for nothing assests he made a gross miscalculation.

I understand that the near future should always be looked at when dealing with the cap. And I'm happy that Campbell was moved because his contract was detrimental to the Hawks keeping Sharp and Seabrook. However that doesn't mean the Hawks should sit on that extra cap. Perhaps a better D-man should have been pursued rather than both SOD and Lepisto.

The love affair with cap space is ridiculous on this board. Cap space is only good if your team uses it. Bowman needs to bring in a better defenseman, and possibly a 3rd line forward for the team to compete in the playoffs. If he doesn't like the price it will take in trade, then he should have thought about that this offseason.

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Old
02-19-2012, 06:49 PM
  #277
CS85
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Carcillo/Mayers/Burish would be a sick line. Teams would be stressed as hell having to deal with those guys all at once.

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Old
02-19-2012, 06:56 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by CS85 View Post
Carcillo/Mayers/Burish would be a sick line. Teams would be stressed as hell having to deal with those guys all at once.
Second only to:

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Old
02-19-2012, 07:00 PM
  #279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by topnotch View Post
The point of having cap room is so that your GM has flexibility when the team needs to acquire some new players. Well, the team needs a couple new players and we have the cap room. If Bowman set this team up hoping that the trade deadline would net him NHL players for nothing assests he made a gross miscalculation.

I understand that the near future should always be looked at when dealing with the cap. And I'm happy that Campbell was moved because his contract was detrimental to the Hawks keeping Sharp and Seabrook. However that doesn't mean the Hawks should sit on that extra cap. Perhaps a better D-man should have been pursued rather than both SOD and Lepisto.

The love affair with cap space is ridiculous on this board. Cap space is only good if your team uses it. Bowman needs to bring in a better defenseman, and possibly a 3rd line forward for the team to compete in the playoffs. If he doesn't like the price it will take in trade, then he should have thought about that this offseason.
Bowman doesn't pay the bills

The Hawks are throwing away money on garbage like Huet (In Europe) and Olesz (in AHL)

Hawks are spending a ton of actual $$$ well beyond the cap this year.

Once Huet's off books and Olsez is dealt with (Probably bought out IMO) the Hawks will have flexibilty financially

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Old
02-19-2012, 07:10 PM
  #280
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So, without anyone being moved... the Hawks would have about $9.3 million to work with this offseason and a roster that looks something like

Stalberg (0.875)-Toews (6.3)-Kane (6.3)
Sharp (5.9)-?-Hossa (5.275)
?-Bolland (3.375)-Hayes (0.875)
Bickell (0.541)-Kruger (0.9)-Frolik (2.33)
?

Keith (5.538)-Seabrook (5.8)
Hjalmarsson (3.5)-Leddy (1.16)
Montador (2.75)-?
?

Crawford (2.67)
?

UFAs: Brunette (2.0), Morrisson (1.25), Carcillo (0.7), Mayers (0.55), O'Donnell (0.85), Lepisto (0.75), Scott (0.5125), Emery (0.6).

Would really like to see the Hawks being willing to shell out 5 million or so to Grabovski (if on the market) and get that #2 center spot taken care of in a nice way.

If they can move Frolik and re-sign Mayers that would be great. 6th defenseman could probably be filled by Olsen at 0.875. Backup goalie, 13th forward, and 7th defenseman could be gotten for cheap on the open market.

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Old
02-19-2012, 07:15 PM
  #281
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^
With all the CBA uncertainty and cap uncertainty it is hard to say how things will look

Could be headed towards another lockout sadly

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Old
02-19-2012, 07:25 PM
  #282
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Bowman would get tarred and feathered if he offersheeted Grabo for 5+.

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Old
02-19-2012, 07:36 PM
  #283
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Originally Posted by brtriad View Post
Bowman would get tarred and feathered if he offersheeted Grabo for 5+.
Anything in the $4.5-5 range is good in my book. Having Toews, Grabovski, and Bolland down the middle would be awesome.

For the future:

Sharp-Toews-Kane
Saad-Grabovski-Hossa
Stalberg-McNeill-J. Hayes
Morin-K. Hayes-Kruger

I don't know, that's just a guess. I have Morin on the fourth line.

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Old
02-19-2012, 07:50 PM
  #284
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People who don't watch the Leafs or Grabovski have no idea what kind of player he is.

He hits, he plays really good defense, and he scores 50-60pts a year playing 2nd line C.

He would be the perfect fit for Hossa with Stalberg.

Sharp - Toews - Kane
Stalberg - Grabo - Hossa
Kruger - Bolland - Bickell
Brunette - Mayers - Hayes
Frolik

That would be a dirty line up, and if we acquire a decent Dman, we would have to be cup favourites.

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Old
02-19-2012, 08:11 PM
  #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brtriad View Post
Bowman would get tarred and feathered if he offersheeted Grabo for 5+.
Grabovski is UFA

And for 5 yrs at 4.5-4.75M per cap hit I wouldn't have issue

Sharp-Toews-Kane
Stalberg-Grabovski-Hossa

Good top 6 going into next year (Maybe Saad makes team at LW and Stalberg is on 3rd line LW with Bolland at C and Kruger on RW)

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Old
02-19-2012, 08:17 PM
  #286
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I'm on the train right now so I don't have a clue how this would look cap wise, but if we got Grabo for 4/5 years at 5m

10-19-88
Saad-Grab-81
25-36-16
13-22-39

Wouldn't be too shabby for next year, and knowing Q the lines will be shuffled anyway so don't take too much stock in where I put guys.

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Old
02-19-2012, 08:19 PM
  #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Grabovski is UFA

And for 5 yrs at 4.5-4.75M per cap hit I wouldn't have issue

Sharp-Toews-Kane
Stalberg-Grabovski-Hossa

Good top 6 going into next year (Maybe Saad makes team at LW and Stalberg is on 3rd line LW with Bolland at C and Kruger on RW)
Ah I thought he was an RFA. He will get around that on the open market, but honestly I would rather spend the money on another defenseman and fill out the bottom-six than blow our wad on another mid-range center.

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Old
02-19-2012, 08:21 PM
  #288
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Originally Posted by brtriad View Post
Ah I thought he was an RFA. He will get around that on the open market, but honestly I would rather spend the money on another defenseman and fill out the bottom-six than blow our wad on another mid-range center.
This team has needed a consistant #2 C since Nylander left

Sharp was OK but for some reason Q/He dont want to play C

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Old
02-19-2012, 11:26 PM
  #289
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Way too much love on this board for Grabo at 5 mill and people think that's a good deal? He's 28. What has he actually done for 5 Mill? I want nothing long term for this guy. As a rental and at his current salary, sure perfect. He's James Neal money?? We just need a guy for 2 years till a kid can fill the spot. We start signing all these big tickets then we will be in the same boat we were before.
And yes I've seen him play a ton of times. He is a good player, gritty and plays with heart. Is he 5 Mill........NOPE!

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Old
02-20-2012, 12:15 AM
  #290
WarriorofTime
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Originally Posted by Blackhawks4life View Post
Way too much love on this board for Grabo at 5 mill and people think that's a good deal? He's 28. What has he actually done for 5 Mill? I want nothing long term for this guy. As a rental and at his current salary, sure perfect. He's James Neal money?? We just need a guy for 2 years till a kid can fill the spot. We start signing all these big tickets then we will be in the same boat we were before.
And yes I've seen him play a ton of times. He is a good player, gritty and plays with heart. Is he 5 Mill........NOPE!
Gotta overpay to get your guy in free agency. I would rather pay a reliable, proven 2nd line center 0.75 more than he deserves than go into next year with Kruger as the 2nd line center.

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Old
02-20-2012, 12:39 AM
  #291
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against Grabo for that much money

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Old
02-20-2012, 08:57 AM
  #292
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We have a ton of caproom so it make sense to overpay for a #2 center. Look at this lineup, if you wanted you could take out Salak sign another goalie to a $2 mil deal and still have cap room.

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Patrick Kane ($6.300m) / Jonathan Toews ($6.300m) / Patrick Sharp ($5.900m)
Marian Hossa ($5.275m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($4.900m) / Jimmy Hayes ($0.875m)
Viktor Stalberg ($0.875m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / Bryan Bickell ($0.541m)
Jamal Mayers ($0.550m) / Marcus Kruger ($0.900m) / Michael Frolik ($2.333m)
Andrew Shaw ($0.565m)

DEFENSEMEN
Brent Seabrook ($5.800m) / Duncan Keith ($5.538m)
Niklas Hjalmarsson ($3.500m) / Steve Montador ($2.750m)
Nick Leddy ($1.116m) / Dylan Olsen ($0.870m)
John Scott ($0.512m)

GOALTENDERS
Corey Crawford ($2.666m) / Alexander Salak ($0.612m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,056,795; BONUSES: $647,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,243,205

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Old
02-20-2012, 08:58 AM
  #293
coldsteelonice84
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Originally Posted by Illinihockey View Post
We have a ton of caproom so it make sense to overpay for a #2 center. Look at this lineup, if you wanted you could take out Salak sign another goalie to a $2 mil deal and still have cap room.

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Patrick Kane ($6.300m) / Jonathan Toews ($6.300m) / Patrick Sharp ($5.900m)
Marian Hossa ($5.275m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($4.900m) / Jimmy Hayes ($0.875m)
Viktor Stalberg ($0.875m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / Bryan Bickell ($0.541m)
Jamal Mayers ($0.550m) / Marcus Kruger ($0.900m) / Michael Frolik ($2.333m)
Andrew Shaw ($0.565m)

DEFENSEMEN
Brent Seabrook ($5.800m) / Duncan Keith ($5.538m)
Niklas Hjalmarsson ($3.500m) / Steve Montador ($2.750m)
Nick Leddy ($1.116m) / Dylan Olsen ($0.870m)
John Scott ($0.512m)

GOALTENDERS
Corey Crawford ($2.666m) / Alexander Salak ($0.612m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,056,795; BONUSES: $647,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,243,205
I agree. I am fully in favor of trading what it takes to get Grabo here and signing him to an extension. C's are just too hard to get and he's very talented offensively. He is what Hossa needs. I'm tired of this organization neglecting to get Hossa a regular C he can play with game in, game out.

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:10 AM
  #294
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Depends on how long Grabos contract is. Leddy, Bolland, Stalberg, TOEWS, and KANE all need to be resigned in the next 2 seasons. Signing Grabovski to a 4-5 year $5 mil contract cripples this team cap wise.

Yes, cold steel, cap flexibility is more important than signing Grabovski

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:24 AM
  #295
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Originally Posted by xX Hot Fuss View Post
Depends on how long Grabos contract is. Leddy, Bolland, Stalberg, TOEWS, and KANE all need to be resigned in the next 2 seasons. Signing Grabovski to a 4-5 year $5 mil contract cripples this team cap wise.

Yes, cold steel, cap flexibility is more important than signing Grabovski
bolland would be expendable if grabo was acquired.

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:42 AM
  #296
Recoil
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bolland would be expendable if grabo was acquired.
How do you figure? If Grabo is acquired, then he's the #2C we so desperately need. Bolland is still arguably the best #3C in the NHL. That's expendable....how?

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:43 AM
  #297
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Bolland has hardly earned himself a raise as it is anyway.

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:46 AM
  #298
coldsteelonice84
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Originally Posted by xX Hot Fuss View Post
Depends on how long Grabos contract is. Leddy, Bolland, Stalberg, TOEWS, and KANE all need to be resigned in the next 2 seasons. Signing Grabovski to a 4-5 year $5 mil contract cripples this team cap wise.

Yes, cold steel, cap flexibility is more important than signing Grabovski
Sign Grabo and still have flexibility. That's the way it would work out. People are insane if they think the cap is going down. I doubt it even stays the same. I likely goes up. If it stays the same, you are still good.

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:48 AM
  #299
Recoil
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Bolland has hardly earned himself a raise as it is anyway.
I somewhat agree. Performance wise, when he is on the ice, I think he warrants a small increase. However his health and actually being ON the ice sort of negates that.

Either way, we are at least 2 years from needing to worry about that, or discuss it. In 2 years time, perhaps a Kevin Hayes, McNeil, Pirri, or Kruger have developed enough to be considered to be his replacement. As of this season, we have no one to replace him.

Again, perhaps a bit of cart before the horse. But in 2 years, if he stays healthy, it will be interesting to see how everything plays out and what options we have with NHL ready prospects by then.

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Old
02-20-2012, 12:30 PM
  #300
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1 think Bowman will add 1 of these guys. Not that I want all of them, but I think it will be 1 of them

Sarich
Foster
Wideman
Rozsival
Jurcina
Martinek
Staios
Brookbank
Lee
Johnson

Franson
EJ
Schenn

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