I think the time of Nassau's leverage has just about gone out the door. Time is ticking and as soon as there is another viable option firmly in Wang's hand there is no leverage. Brooklyn has eroded the leverage somewhat already and don't look now but Seattle and Quebec are heating up. It is always easiest to stay pat, so if there was a viable plan for an arena at the HUB, I am sure they would stay but there is obviously not. I will continue to keep my fingers crossed for a miracle (waiting for Powerball to hit $1b so i can win and finance the arena mostly on my own after 65% tax and discount).
Nassau knows that deep down, Wang wants to own the team and some sort of development on Long Island. Thus, they have the leverage and can afford to put their feet up and pass the burden to Wang. Brooklyn has not eroded that luxury. Nassau knows Brooklyn is a bluff the same way KC was.
And the notion that Wang is going to run into Brooklyn's arms without any negotiation with Nassau is the belief that Wang is going to spite himself to spurn Nassau. He wants to be in Nassau.
If I were Wang I would just re submit the exact light house plan that he submitted to begin with. Why would he spend more money on a new proposal that is just going to be shot down again.
Re submit the old LH plans and put the ball back in their court while saying **** you at the same time.
Nassau knows that deep down, Wang wants to own the team and some sort of development on Long Island. Thus, they have the leverage and can afford to put their feet up and pass the burden to Wang. Brooklyn has not eroded that luxury. Nassau knows Brooklyn is a bluff the same way KC was.
And the notion that Wang is going to run into Brooklyn's arms without any negotiation with Nassau is the belief that Wang is going to spite himself to spurn Nassau. He wants to be in Nassau.
One of the most interesting back and forth from yesterday was between Picker and a legislator who's name I did not catch.
When the idea of public funding was brought up by Picker the legislator asked if the arena would be self sustaining. Picker would not commit at one point pointedly saying "I am not here to negotiate" Picker also kept hammering home the idea of getting a new building up as part of phase one.
It seems that Wang is trying a different approach, one that is tried and true. Get a shovel in the ground and people stop asking questions. In other words once the arena is up and the lease is in place Wang will be able to develop the rest of the site with much less red tape.
I don't think this is gong to work as the TOH is probably going to want to see an entire site plan.
The other thing I found interesting about yesterday's meeting was the comment from the Legislator in response to Pickers vagueness about the arena being self sustaining.
The legislator basically ended the question by asking Picker if the expected ROI for the taxpayer was the 2800 jobs sustained. Picker basically said yes which got me to thinking....
If you remove the Players and top team executives from this 2800 what would be the average gross yearly income?
Nassau knows that deep down, Wang wants to own the team and some sort of development on Long Island. Thus, they have the leverage and can afford to put their feet up and pass the burden to Wang.
I think its quite the opposite. Unfortunately Nassau County should have an extreme sense of urgency in this situation right now. If they call a bluff and he really isnt bluffing, what happens then? Without the Coliseum and thereby the Islanders, they stand to lose big. What else does Nassau have that can replace that team/building?
As it is they have a figure head for a County Executive since he has no final say in anything the county does financially. Which is one of the reasons they are so vehemently against the public funding aspect of it. Even if the referendum had passed last year, NIFA would still have had to approve any plans to borrow money after that.
Wang should have been listening to offers all along from other areas, collecting as much info as he could and then walk right into that legislature and pass out information on what can other cities can offer him and his team. Then they could sit back and realize the real ramifications of the Coliseum shutting its doors.
I usually do not defend Wang but there is no denying the fact that he spent a boatload of cash on the LH with every indication given that the project was a go, only to be blindsided by the TOH (and probably others behind the scene)
I think what we have to wrap our heads around is that Mangano is currently telling Wang to start from zero. Even if Wang comes up with a new plan all of the same political pitfalls still await.
No way a new plan gets its way through Nassau's maze before 2015.
Wang could once again wage this war up until the lease expires and still come away with nothing while spending another fortune.
What do they call it when you keep repeating the same actions and expect different results?
I think its quite the opposite. Unfortunately Nassau County should have an extreme sense of urgency in this situation right now.
Unfortunately Nassau County very rarely -- if ever -- demonstrates any level of foresight. The lease is up in three years. Might as well be 300 years from the County's perspective. They are basking in their lack of responsibility at the moment in the hopes that Wang gets desperate and latches the Islanders to something in the County's favor.
An extreme sense of urgency out of politicians only comes when money or votes are at stake in the immediate future. They don't see Wang as a threat in that department right now. In time, they will. Until that time, they'll drag their feet and pass the burden.
Nassau knows that deep down, Wang wants to own the team and some sort of development on Long Island. Thus, they have the leverage and can afford to put their feet up and pass the burden to Wang. Brooklyn has not eroded that luxury. Nassau knows Brooklyn is a bluff the same way KC was.
And the notion that Wang is going to run into Brooklyn's arms without any negotiation with Nassau is the belief that Wang is going to spite himself to spurn Nassau. He wants to be in Nassau.
I personally don't believe that Brooklyn is an ideal option by any stretch and won't drink that kool-aid. I don't doubt Wang wants to stay in Nassau, but my point is the pendulum is shifting.. wang will have some options (not saying ideal options) and nassau's desperation is rising... nassau still doesnt know it fully but the realization is sinking in as evdienced by the comments in the meeting yesterday that they need the islanders more than the islanders need them.. the islanders can move, nassau can not replace them, thus leverage.
Why cant all these mother****ers sit down and hammer something out. See what Wang wants and see what the TOH wants and meet somehwere in the middle. Its too simple to help these stupid *******s. There has to be a give and take BY BOTH SIDES. Its a negotiation. Both sides have to give to get. Please work this out. at this point I am fed up. Queens or Bklyn doesnt matter to me anymore. just stay local.
Exactly! Which is why he will probably ignore this deadline, and continue to talk to Brooklyn, Queens, Suffolk, and who knows where else he is talking to. He's being given this public deadline so when he either doesn't do anything towards it, or he does get some plans out for the deadline and they are denied, when the Islanders leave Nassau in 2015 the politicans can say it's all Wangs fault and not there's.
I'd assume Brooklyn has the edge if they sell out the preseason game we are playing there and shows it can handle having a hockey team. I wish Wang would announce a deal to build an arena in Queens though and hold out hope.
As far as Queens is concerned, I think any stadium deal will be announced AFTER the Wilpons finish their legal fight with Picard IF the Isles and Mets agree on it.
If I were Wang I would just re submit the exact light house plan that he submitted to begin with. Why would he spend more money on a new proposal that is just going to be shot down again.
Re submit the old LH plans and put the ball back in their court while saying **** you at the same time.
thats exactly what he should do!!! at the same time go to Governor Cuomo and present the idea to him. He is the governor of NY and one thing is for sure NYS is NOT happy with Nassau County right now.
He steps in and says this is a great revenue stream and it provides jobs and housing and keeps your county steady with new taxes and income. YOU MUST TAKE THIS and override the rest of the schmucks.
Nassau knows that deep down, Wang wants to own the team and some sort of development on Long Island. Thus, they have the leverage and can afford to put their feet up and pass the burden to Wang. Brooklyn has not eroded that luxury. Nassau knows Brooklyn is a bluff the same way KC was.
Not quite. There aren't thousands of EXISTING isles fans within 30 miles of KC's arena.
Though I have many fond memories of Nassau Coliseum, and still after 33 years of going to games, get that excited feeling when I walk into the arena, I think it's time to move on. Nassau doesn't deserve the Islanders. Hopefully they move to a nice shiny new arena in Queens, or to the Brooklyn arena.
I read this in the paper this morning and got furious....Wang already tried a Private plan and it got shot down.....So you asking him to pour more money into developing a plan just to have it shot down by sore losers who didnt get what they wanted.....
And because I involves common sense and rational thinking, no chance Wang takes part in doing so.
Just for kicks, I'm gonna bring back the thread of Petition to Move Isles to Queens. Hopefully we'll get some more signatures, beef it up and I'll send it to the Queens Borough president's office. The guy from the Daily News that did the story on the petition said he'd do another story if it gets sent to H Marshall's office as I spoke to him.
Since Botta wrote "Nassau had better wake up soon. According to sources with intimate knowledge of the situation, Charles Wang is listening to any municipality that wants to make the Islanders feel at home" then maybe Chuckles needs some love and would love being approached by Marshall. If nothing else, she'll be aware.
I ain't going down without a fight!! They ain't moving to Quebec without me knowing I did all I could. How about y'all?
Unfortunately Nassau County very rarely -- if ever -- demonstrates any level of foresight. The lease is up in three years. Might as well be 300 years from the County's perspective. They are basking in their lack of responsibility at the moment in the hopes that Wang gets desperate and latches the Islanders to something in the County's favor.
An extreme sense of urgency out of politicians only comes when money or votes are at stake in the immediate future. They don't see Wang as a threat in that department right now. In time, they will. Until that time, they'll drag their feet and pass the burden.
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Originally Posted by Bert Marshall days
Not quite. There aren't thousands of EXISTING isles fans within 30 miles of KC's arena.
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Originally Posted by PJGooch
Fair enough. But it's still a bluff. And for now Nassau pols aren't biting.
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Originally Posted by ledzep1212
**** are you talking about? This not even close to the same thing.
I think it is still a bluff. Don't see Wang paying rent as a tenant in a basketball arena. If he were threatening to sell and the Nets ownership was interested in buying, maybe I see this more as a legitimate option.
I think it is still a bluff. Don't see Wang paying rent as a tenant in a basketball arena. If he were threatening to sell and the Nets ownership was interested in buying, maybe I see this more as a legitimate option.
On surface, Brooklyn looks like a bluff. But IF the Isles move to Brooklyn just for a few years, they also change their jurisdiction from Nassau to NYC. Which would make it more likely the Isles leave Nassau altogether PERMANENTLY. That notion likely didn't cross the legislators' minds or they just didn't care because they want their cake to be served on a silver platter WITHOUT putting any effort into it. Anything short of that, they don't want to bother.
Just for kicks, I'm gonna bring back the thread of Petition to Move Isles to Queens. Hopefully we'll get some more signatures, beef it up and I'll send it to the Queens Borough president's office. The guy from the Daily News that did the story on the petition said he'd do another story if it gets sent to H Marshall's office as I spoke to him.
Since Botta wrote "Nassau had better wake up soon. According to sources with intimate knowledge of the situation, Charles Wang is listening to any municipality that wants to make the Islanders feel at home" then maybe Chuckles needs some love and would love being approached by Marshall. If nothing else, she'll be aware.
I ain't going down without a fight!! They ain't moving to Quebec without me knowing I did all I could. How about y'all?
We have had our differences about qns/nassau/bklyn, but man I couldnt be more on your side right now. **** these guys. We gotta do everything we can to keep the Isles local. Queens, Broolyn or wherever. I am tired of this **** with nassau County. They all suck. Lets kick some ass!!!!
I think it is still a bluff. Don't see Wang paying rent as a tenant in a basketball arena. If he were threatening to sell and the Nets ownership was interested in buying, maybe I see this more as a legitimate option.
But what sort of terms might Ratner be willing to offer for a team to eat up 41 nights a year, especially when it kills off any competition that doesn't already exist in the area? He makes money either way and perhaps he's willing to allow Wang some nice concessions to make it a reality. Didn't Botta say the Nets were lobbying extremely hard for the Islanders to come? I can see any number of incentives being on the table.
