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TSN 990: As per a Habs executive they are NOT re-building

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:12 AM
  #51
poetryinmotion
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs Junkie View Post
Wow Plekanec gets zero respect around here!
He's the number 1 center of the best penalty kill unit in the NHL. If you want to rebuild you start with him IMO
He is an ideal second line center, but hardly a core piece to build around. and I love him as much as the next guy.

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:14 AM
  #52
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02-17-2012, 09:16 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
He is an ideal second line center, but hardly a core piece to build around. and I love him as much as the next guy.
Very good centers don't grow on trees. Hab fans take Plekanec waayyyyyy too much for granted. Is he a perennial all-star #1 type? No, but there are only about 15 of those in the whole world and they are rarely available for anything but a massive price. He is on par with anybody after those 15 guys. Some may be bigger, have more points or whatever but his overall game puts him in the 16-25 range.

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:17 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs Junkie View Post
Wow Plekanec gets zero respect around here!
He's the number 1 center of the best penalty kill unit in the NHL. If you want to rebuild you start with him IMO
Plekanec will be the stop gap number 1 until the newly drafted player fully develops. (we'll be a playoff team, but not a true threat in these years).

One day in two-three years that newly drafted player (Grigorenko, Galchenyuk) will pass Pleks on the depth chart and Pleks will become one of the best #2 centres in the NHL.

With Subban, Price, Eller and Patches also progressing, that will be the day we will be a true cup contender and not just a team fighting for a number 8 seed.

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:17 AM
  #55
Habs Junkie
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
He is an ideal second line center, but hardly a core piece to build around. and I love him as much as the next guy.
Don't get me wrong I think he's a #2 center as well, but if you get rid of him we don't have a player that can play that role and would be a sideways move. Find me a 2nd line center that can do what he does.

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02-17-2012, 09:19 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by WestIslander View Post
As per Tony Marinaro on TSN 990 at 8:10 AM this morning, the Habs are NOT re-building and beleive that all they have to do is re-tool or tweek.

Tony say's that Montreal has the following 4 components and need a few more to build on.

Carey Price = Franchise goalie
PK Subban = Star defenseman
Max Paciopretty = Top line winger
David Desharnais = PP and Faceoff Specialist

So...

If there is NO re-build, who do we build around?
looks like a stanley cup winning team to me.

if this really was the core, and the core is already in place then why the poor record this year?

other than Price, there are no other franchise or core players of that 4.

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:20 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Very good centers don't grow on trees. Hab fans take Plekanec waayyyyyy too much for granted. Is he a perennial all-star #1 type? No, but there are only about 15 of those in the whole world and they are rarely available for anything but a massive price. He is on par with anybody after those 15 guys. Some may be bigger, have more points or whatever but his overall game puts him in the 16-25 range.
He is also one of our hardest working players every game, his offensive numbers are decent considering he's had to play with guys like Gomez, Darche, Moen, Blunden this year.

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02-17-2012, 09:20 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Commandant View Post
Plekanec will be the stop gap number 1 until the newly drafted player fully develops. (we'll be a playoff team, but not a true threat in these years).

One day in two-three years that newly drafted player (Grigorenko, Galchenyuk) will pass Pleks on the depth chart and Pleks will become one of the best #2 centres in the NHL.

With Subban, Price, Eller and Patches also progressing, that will be the day we will be a true cup contender and not just a team fighting for a number 8 seed.
I agree with you but I don't think drafting and developing a #1 center is as easy as you think. I think we would be better off getting one through trade where we know what we are getting as oppose to drafting one hoping he becomes that.

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02-17-2012, 09:21 AM
  #59
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this isn't news

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:21 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maci4life View Post
looks like a stanley cup winning team to me.

if this really was the core, and the core is already in place then why the poor record this year?

other than Price, there are no other franchise or core players of that 4.
In even strength points Pacioretty is 20th in the league. In even strength goals he is fourth. Only three guys ahead of him. Your opinion is silly.

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02-17-2012, 09:24 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by maci4life View Post
looks like a stanley cup winning team to me.

if this really was the core, and the core is already in place then why the poor record this year?

other than Price, there are no other franchise or core players of that 4.
Subban is already a top pairing defenseman and he hasn't even turned 23 yet, Pacioretty is 23 years old and on pace for 34 goals in his first full season in the NHL... not sure how those aren't "core" players?

Anaheim has a core of Getzlaf, Perry and Ryan and aren't in the playoffs does that mean those guys can't be core players either?

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02-17-2012, 09:28 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Habs Junkie View Post
I agree with you but I don't think drafting and developing a #1 center is as easy as you think. I think we would be better off getting one through trade where we know what we are getting as oppose to drafting one hoping he becomes that.
The cost of trading for one is astronomical. And we've been trying to get one for damn near 20 years via trade or UFA. All it got us was Gomez.

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02-17-2012, 09:28 AM
  #63
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so if this team finishes 24th in the standings, they aren't considering rebuilding? Brilliant.

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:28 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by The Kremelin Wall View Post
In even strength points Pacioretty is 20th in the league. In even strength goals he is fourth. Only three guys ahead of him. Your opinion is silly.
Pacioretty is a nice young player, but he's not proven to be much of a core player, moreso than a really strong complementary piece.

People massively overrate young players here (not so much the players themselves, but the youth factor in general) and grossly underrate established top end ability.

Even after the season, with perceived improvement, we're not much different than teams with those young cores trending upwards.

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Old
02-17-2012, 09:30 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Very good centers don't grow on trees. Hab fans take Plekanec waayyyyyy too much for granted. Is he a perennial all-star #1 type? No, but there are only about 15 of those in the whole world and they are rarely available for anything but a massive price. He is on par with anybody after those 15 guys. Some may be bigger, have more points or whatever but his overall game puts him in the 16-25 range.
THIS!!!!!

Defensively, he ranks with the very best. Our PK should be proof of this. Offensively, I think he has gotten a bum stir because he's always playing with leftovers. Overall, he easily falls into the 16-25 range. I would even place him a little higher.

Joni Mitchell's You don't know what you got till it's gone applies to Pleks.

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02-17-2012, 09:31 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by AHMB Prez View Post
Diaz is too small for our D. BYE !

Desharnais our best center this year is gone ?
Didn't necessarily say Desharnais is even gone - maybe.

I know, I know but I think players evolve into gaining respect. Desharnais has been good but look where the Habs are. I can't see the Habs making a playoff run with Desharnais and Plek as the top 2 centers and I'd rather Plek over Desharnais despite the year each has had. Right now Plek gets a lot of respect from the opposition while Desharnais is somewhat sheltered.

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02-17-2012, 09:37 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
I don't give a damn what Tony Marinaro thinks. He's proven time and time again that he has no idea what it means to make decisions in the NHL.
This.

I cant believe that ANYBODY sees any value in what that twerp has to say. He's never put on a pair of skates in his life, and if he does have skates, it's probably to slice off a chunk of prosciutto hanging in his garage.

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02-17-2012, 09:37 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
Didn't necessarily say Desharnais is even gone - maybe.

I know, I know but I think players evolve into gaining respect. Desharnais has been good but look where the Habs are. I can't see the Habs making a playoff run with Desharnais and Plek as the top 2 centers and I'd rather Plek over Desharnais despite the year each has had. Right now Plek gets a lot of respect from the opposition while Desharnais is somewhat sheltered.
The Habs are where they are because they have played like crap at home, PP has been brutal and they did not get much mileage out of 20+ mil of cap room(Gomez Markov Gio Cammy) NOT because of Desharnais or Plekanec.

You can't blame those 2 for Gionta being hurt and Cammy playing like crap leading to his trade. Gomez completely falling off the map hurts. Markov missing all year(so far) hurts on many levels.

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02-17-2012, 09:46 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
The Habs are where they are because they have played like crap at home, PP has been brutal and they did not get much mileage out of 20+ mil of cap room(Gomez Markov Gio Cammy) NOT because of Desharnais or Plekanec.

You can't blame those 2 for Gionta being hurt and Cammy playing like crap leading to his trade. Gomez completely falling off the map hurts. Markov missing all year(so far) hurts on many levels.
I don't believe I have blamed either Desharnais or Plek. Geez......simply saying I wouldn't be confident with both going into a playoff run. And I do think Desharnais will get more respect which could make life more difficult for him.

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02-17-2012, 09:46 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
so if this team finishes 24th in the standings, they aren't considering rebuilding? Brilliant.
I guess it depends of what you mean by a rebuild. Of course, it will not be a full rebuild for sure.

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02-17-2012, 09:50 AM
  #71
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I agree with management then. We don't need rebuild. We need to sell some assets, and tweak for the future. Not to mention, we may get a top 5 pick anyway and if we sell gill, moen, campoli, and whoever we can(that we dont need) it would add for the future and we have a good young core already.

However, that being said, this veteran core has 2 years to get it done. If we suck in 2 years, sell gionta, kaberle, gomez(if u can), etc...

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Old
02-17-2012, 10:01 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Habs Junkie View Post
Don't get me wrong I think he's a #2 center as well, but if you get rid of him we don't have a player that can play that role and would be a sideways move. Find me a 2nd line center that can do what he does.
With how the season has gone and the carousel of wingers Plekanec has had, it's unfair to classify him as a #1 or #2 or #3 center.

Had he played all year between Cole and MaxPac, he'd probably be close to a point a game and people would say he's got #1 center numbers and he's great defensively.

Would he play with Bourque and AK, that would be a pretty good second line and hence, he'd have decent numbers and people would say he's a very good #2 center and he's great defensively.

But he was playing with Darche and Moen and then Darche and Bourque. He's been very good but it's hard to classify him as a #1 type center with the role and linemates he is given.

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Old
02-17-2012, 10:03 AM
  #73
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All this tells me is what I already knew... We only care about 8th place. There is no real desire to build cup caliber teams here. It's going to be constant re-tweaking of a mediocre team just as we've always done. The result will be decent but not great teams. Some years will be better than others but we aren't really committed to building towards a cup.

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Old
02-17-2012, 10:03 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Ginu View Post
The pieces the OP mentioned are the 4 that Pierre McGuire mentioned a few days ago. He has this 7 player core that he pitches as what you need to contend for the Cup: a franchise goalie (Price), franchise defenseman (Subban), power forward (Pacioretty), two elite centerman, specialist and elite shut down player (Gorges, potentially Eller & potentially Emelin as a Scott Stevens type).

We have all but the two elite centerman. We may have one in Plekanec if we make him a #2.

We're not that far off. We haven't even mentioned our best player - Markov - if he comes back.
Forget Markov, he's no teams best player right now, build the team without markov in mind, if he comes back and he's 90% of what he was, there's your gravy, could put us over the top!

Draft as high as possible,

Get a free agent d-man with size and a mean steak so oponents know when he's at the backend like our man emelin

Trade for a carter type and put together a 2 scoring lines.

Fill out the third and fouth line players with shutdown and energy type players with size and a little bit of secondary scoring ...no smurfs

A # 13 forward should be someone who can play some mins on the forth line and be able to drop the mitts when needed, not when he wants too, but when needed.

I'm not a fan of Ak but, if he wants to stay for the same money or a little less, get him signed and let him play a third line roll. Moen is another guy, at 29, he should be signed for bottom 6. Add white and you already have one bottom line.

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Old
02-17-2012, 10:06 AM
  #75
poetryinmotion
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
All this tells me is what I already knew... We only care about 8th place. There is no real desire to build cup caliber teams here. It's going to be constant re-tweaking of a mediocre team just as we've always done. The result will be decent but not great teams. Some years will be better than others but we aren't really committed to building towards a cup.
I'm all for the tanking this season, but you are reading way too much into that statement to come up with that. Soap opera worthy.

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