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2011-12 All Purpose Kings Trade Rumors and Proposals Thread VI

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:11 PM
  #26
RAZZIE King
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Originally Posted by Seventyx7 View Post
Defense and goaltending depth are the strong point though. Muzzin, Hickey, Forbort, VV, my boy Deslauriers. Jones, Zatkoff, Gibson. Those guys can replace JJ and Bernier without a huge dropoff. Then Nash goes in for Lokti, and we hang on to Toffoli. The deal is a ton to give up and I wish we could do it for less. But if that's what it takes, it makes us a better team both now and for the next 5 years IMO.
I'm calling this one as the second coming of the Beachball... Why we drafted him is still a mystery to me...

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02-20-2012, 02:11 PM
  #27
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I always thought it was trade basics 101 to trade from a position of strength to gain in a position of weakness.

So the talk of trading Brown really baffles me.


If we want a guy like Carter, Johnson and Bernier make sense...granted it would be hard to part with JJ given his commitment to the team. That's the nature of the business. We need scoring, they need defense.

If we are trading to get bottom 6 forwards, I certainly expect a name like Martinez, Hickey or Voynov or even to some extent Mitchell, Greene, and Scuds to be the first names up on the blocks.

The only forwards I see getting moved on this team are Penner, Stoll, and Brad Richardson.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:11 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Shellz View Post
I can't post them but just go to...www.twitter.com/mayorNHL
Some more very interesting quotes. Thank you. Sutter vehemently agrees with some of us around here that Kopitar needs to do a lot more. Maybe we're not so crazy after all.

With regards to trading Brown, Birdman over at LGK had a great saying that I've seen around there: Don't marry yourself to players (unless you're Shellz and Jonathan Quick is proposing).

If trading Brown makes the team better overall, you don't reject the notion of trading Brown just because it's Brown.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:12 PM
  #29
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I'm just glad DS doesn't play favoritism much like TM did.

That kind of BS drives me nuts.

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02-20-2012, 02:13 PM
  #30
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its about time, lets hope is's not to late though.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:13 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by RAZZIE King View Post
I'm calling this one as the second coming of the Beachball... Why we drafted him is still a mystery to me...
Give the kid a break, he is young and he is a goalie in the Q. Which is probably the hardest of the 3 CHL leagues to come through as a goalie.

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02-20-2012, 02:13 PM
  #32
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Like I said I give Sutter credit for telling it like it is.

Kopitar and Brown were handled with kids gloves by Murray.

Who knows maybe Kopitar needs to be told once in a while "Kopitar you are pissing me off bud, Get your %^$% together".

Maybe Kopi just needs to be motivated that way.

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02-20-2012, 02:15 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post

Sutter on Anze Kopitar - "He needs to bring more energy and more purpose when he has the puck. It's not that he's playing poorly. If you didn't look at him as a high end offensive player he's playing well enough in the three zones. But, when he has the puck in the offensive zone, he has to be a lot more determined and purpose player."
Yea...let's jerk around Kopitar some more. He is only playing like management wanted him to.

He can be great as an offensive player, great as a defensive player, Or kind of above average at both.

Kopitar has had "don't do anything dangerous in the offensive zone so we don't allow an odd-man rush" drilled into his head for years.

It's his job to watch less-creative players try and be creative so he is in position to get back on defense.

It's *********.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:15 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I'm just glad DS doesn't play favoritism much like TM did.

That kind of BS drives me nuts.
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
Like I said I give Sutter credit for telling it like it is.

Kopitar and Brown were handled with kids gloves by Murray.
I'm loving the brutal honesty from Sutter. First about Penner and now about Kopitar and Brown. This is what I was hoping for when Sutter was first hired. Accountability.

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02-20-2012, 02:16 PM
  #35
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Honestly, we just need to make the playoffs.... We all know we have good players, and know they can play a hell of a lot better. If they showed up in the Playoffs, they would take everyone by surprise. When you read our roster, you have Kopitar, Brown, Williams, MIKE RICHARDS, Doughty, Johnson, Penner...we know he can be better...If Simon Gagne comes back in a month or so...who knows what he can do. I'm just saying when playoffs come around everyone plays at a higher level, Look at Johnson's and Doughty's stats in the last 2 playoff series, there insane numbers...I honestly beleive they can win without trading everyone, maybe just trade for a second liner...and its all about getting hot at the right time, hopefully right now is their low point and they start turning up the heat.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:16 PM
  #36
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Sutter calling out his top guys today - "These guys talk too much about the team. They should talk more about themselves and what they bring to the table. If they were in any other in environment, they would (have to answer) for their production. Kopi and Brownie have been stale."

Sutter on Anze Kopitar - "He needs to bring more energy and more purpose when he has the puck. It's not that he's playing poorly. If you didn't look at him as a high end offensive player he's playing well enough in the three zones. But, when he has the puck in the offensive zone, he has to be a lot more determined and purpose player."
None of these quotes are all that dramatic. They're true.

I've no idea why Kopitar carries the puck around the offensive zone only to pass it up to the blue line for a shot. PP, 5 on 5, no idea. We're killing ourselves...

Hell I almost jumped up and down when Loki drove to the net last night instead of his normal curler to the boards looking for a pass to the d-man.

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02-20-2012, 02:17 PM
  #37
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Where's the Richards criticism?

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:18 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Tadite View Post
None of these quotes are all that dramatic. They're true.

I've no idea why Kopitar carries the puck around the offensive zone only to pass it up to the blue line for a shot. PP, 5 on 5, no idea. We're killing ourselves...

Hell I almost jumped up and down when Loki drove to the net last night instead of his normal curler to the boards looking for a pass to the d-man.
They're definitely not dramatic, and they definitely are true, but it's more demand of the top players than we ever heard from Murray. As damacles said, Murray handled those two with kid gloves. They were never part of Murray's flawed accountability system.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:20 PM
  #39
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Where's the Richards criticism?
You withhold a few for the next time in case the slump continues.

But seriously, other than Richards not producing, his effort has been there.

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02-20-2012, 02:20 PM
  #40
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Where's the Richards criticism?
The guy has had really ****** linemates all year. Should he not get a pass? I mean, playing with Stoll and Penner for a few months would take a lot out of a guy, especially having to play defense of 2 people since Penner didn't do much of anything. He's a set up guy, and had no one to set up.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:22 PM
  #41
Jason Lewis
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Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
Some more very interesting quotes. Thank you. Sutter vehemently agrees with some of us around here that Kopitar needs to do a lot more. Maybe we're not so crazy after all.

With regards to trading Brown, Birdman over at LGK had a great saying that I've seen around there: Don't marry yourself to players (unless you're Shellz and Jonathan Quick is proposing).

If trading Brown makes the team better overall, you don't reject the notion of trading Brown just because it's Brown.
I am not opposed to this notion either, however, I don't see how trading Brown makes the team better in any situation.

Brown, 1 for 1, is not going to fetch a player that helps our depth. If he is part of a package deal for say, Carter, or Nash. It's going to be Brown +, in which case we are giving up 2 and 3 for 1.

Again, strength to weakness.


Just look back at the Chris Stewart, Kevin Shattenkirk for Erik Johnson deal last season.

Colorado had a LOT of forwards, and puck movers but no real big stay at home guy to anchor the D. St. Louis badly needed a puck mover and could have used the forward depth.

It was a good trade for both teams to make, and both improved honestly.

James Neal for Goligoski was a similar instance where the necessity of those teams was what was brought in, and the surplus was what was moved out. And it was a REAL good player that got sent the other way in both instances. Maybe their are a few in Dallas who cry over losing Neal, but they gained Goligoski, who is a fantastic puck mover and top pairing guy.

Likewise with Goligoski out of Pit. He was 2nd pairing, maybe even 3rd pairing with Letang and Paul Martin there.

If we trade any of our forwards not named Stoll, Penner, or Richardson I will be pissed.

We can stand losing a guy like Johnson, Voynov, Martinez, Bernier considering the massive amount of depth we have at those positions: Deslauriers, Jones, Zatkoff, Berube, Hickey, Kolomatis, Gibson, Muzzin etc.

But if we lose someone like Brown, Williams etc. etc. It only rubs salt in a wound that is already massive.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:22 PM
  #42
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Regardless of HFBoard fan opinion of Nash, he is still a star winger in the NHL, and we would have a good team in 2013, that either this or new management could turn into a contender.
He is a future HOFer if he gets back on his previous pace as an elite sniper. He's been on a horse$hit team for 3 years and still manages to hover around 30 G's.

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The biggest change has to start with the staff/management though. They need to admit that they need to change their tactics, attitudes, and philosophies first or else we will end up with proof in the pudding with a franchise 40 goal scoring winger who is on pace for 15 goals in a beleaguered system.
This too!

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:23 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funky View Post
I hate saying this as it sends shivers down my spine, but I can't help feeling we may lose Quick in a year. Do we roll the dice and trade arguable our saving grace this year? Some Pro's and Cons to think about

Pro's

1 his value has never been higher
2 numerous good teams looking for a stud goalie
3 we don't risk losing him for nothing
4 we don't pay a goalie 5 to 7 mil a year
5 we have Bernier ready to move into that spot
6 A lot of decent vets out there at a good price to help JB if he should stumble

Cons

1 he is our Mr Everything
2 he has a competitive edge
3 top 5 goalie in the NHL
4 dirt cheap contract next year
5 finally a homegrown legit star goalie

Now at this point I want to keep him. I want him locked up for the next 7 years. I just don't know if he wants to be here and at. What price.

He would fetch us a star winger, I really don't want to trade him but should we?

On a side note does JJ not look like he is turning the corner? If people are mad at what the boys are doing in Philly, and Moulsen in NY, could you imagine the backlash when JJ turns into a star elsewhere!
I think Dean keeps Quick at all costs much like Doughty and Kopitar. He is now in the same Bracket.

As for Jack. I really like the guy, and I really don't want to see him go, but what you said is true about everyone on the Kings. Every single player on the team is struggling mightily. Everyone's value has dipped and no one is producing. Most of these players would be putting up ridiculous numbers on the Flyers, Canucks, and Red Wings etc... I think, much like the Richards trade, that it doesn't matter who we put in the deal, we are going to have to cope with the fact that they are going to perform well on the team they land on and we may not pan out well this season, but that it is not permanent and we are not going to be this snakebit forever. Whether the antivenom is a change in philosophy, management, personnel, or ownership intervention; we still have the core to succeed and the team will rebound. I mean we can't get much worse than 30th in the league

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:23 PM
  #44
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Where's the Richards criticism?
Although not scoring, that King - Richards - Nolan line has easily been our best line the last 4 games.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:23 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
Where's the Richards criticism?
I think Mike Richards is getting passes cause of the type of player he is.

Also cause of what he has done in his career.

It that fair ? NO.

But Kopitar and Brown have won nothing in their Career. Kopitar is the Face of the Franchise, makes 6.8 mill a year. That comes with Some expectations.

Just like they expect Mike to produce.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:25 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
Some more very interesting quotes. Thank you. Sutter vehemently agrees with some of us around here that Kopitar needs to do a lot more. Maybe we're not so crazy after all.

With regards to trading Brown, Birdman over at LGK had a great saying that I've seen around there: Don't marry yourself to players (unless you're Shellz and Jonathan Quick is proposing).

If trading Brown makes the team better overall, you don't reject the notion of trading Brown just because it's Brown.
Problem is I do not see a potential trade that would make the Kings better. Bang for your buck what's better than Brown? When he is only 1 of 4 skilled forwards on a team, it's not his fault. Add 2 top 6 wingers and the Brown hate subsides, as does the Kopitar hate.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:28 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
I think Mike Richards is getting passes cause of the type of player he is.

Also cause of what he has done in his career.

It that fair ? NO.

But Kopitar and Brown have won nothing in their Career. Kopitar is the Face of the Franchise, makes 6.8 mill a year. That comes with Some expectations.

Just like they expect Mike to produce.
Also, it NEVER looks like Richards is coasting. There are games when Kopitar and Brown look practically invisible.

Richards seemingly is always noticeable, always doing something. Kind of like Deadmarsh when he was here. When the guy wasn't lighting the lamp he was doing SOMETHING.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:28 PM
  #48
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Yea...let's jerk around Kopitar some more. He is only playing like management wanted him to.

He can be great as an offensive player, great as a defensive player, Or kind of above average at both.

Kopitar has had "don't do anything dangerous in the offensive zone so we don't allow an odd-man rush" drilled into his head for years.

It's his job to watch less-creative players try and be creative so he is in position to get back on defense.

It's *********.
So let me get this straight, the other night Doughty carried the puck right into the goal crease and management is ok with him doing that, but not Kopitar? Got it.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:29 PM
  #49
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People keep directing their anger towards the only 4 skilled forwards on the roster and that's completely unfair IMO. Richards, Brown, Kopitar and Williams cannot do it all on their own. Other teams know this. Key on them and shut them down and the Kings have no offense. I'm all for building via defense but there comes a point when that wealth of depth on d needs to start being swapped for offensive depth. Lombardi has failed at this.

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02-20-2012, 02:30 PM
  #50
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So let me get this straight, the other night Doughty carried the puck right into the goal crease and management is ok with him doing that, but not Kopitar? Got it.
pretty sure if our offense wasn't last TM would have frowned on that play.

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