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Lebrun doesn't think Gauthier will be back as GM

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Old
02-21-2012, 12:12 PM
  #176
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At this point, Molson must pray for non-playoffs showing.

It will be way easier to clean up the place and get rid of Gauthier, his assistants and the whole coaching staff.

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02-21-2012, 12:27 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's actually never been proven. But it doesn't matter anyways as he had a different role and nobody here has an idea of how things went down behind closed doors.

You keep coming back to this year and how we're so bad. Well even if it were true, you don't fire someone because of one year.
You're better off questioning the handling of Lappy, SK, Pouliot, D'Ago, etc..

A fan can sit behind his cpu screen and criticize on how bad it was to re-sign Markov, like many have. But behind closed doors, if he gets a report from the medical staff saying Markov is doing well and on pace to start the year, and I'm sure the owner knows it as well, so I don't see how Molson could blame PG for that.

But I think it's pretty stupid to say he should get fired because we're having a bad year due to his decisions. We're having a bad year because quite a few of our players under performed or got injured again, Plekanec, AK, Gionta, Cammy, Spacek, Gomez haven't been all that good. The guys PG brought in, Cole, Emelin and Diaz have done quite well. Markov is a medical staff mistake, and in any event, it's a risk I personally would take over and over again, you just don't take a risk on letting such a skilled player go, no matter how big of a question mark he is.
I said it earlier, biggest mistake was re-signing Gill instead of going after a replacement for Hammer. But that was fixed when he traded him.
The Kaberle trade can raise some eye brows, but it really isn't as bad as most make it sound.
Cammy's trade isn't the best, and I'm sure he could have gotten more had he waited closer to deadline. But we still got a top 6 player, a pick, a prospect and 2M of added space. Not so bad.


People just hate Gauthier. So whatever mistake he's done gets overblown by tenfold, and whatever good move isn't credited as much.
And don't get me wrong, I have no issues with him being fired. I think it will depend on how things go until the Deadline and for the end of the year.
Plus he hasn't won ANYWHERE he has been.

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02-21-2012, 12:30 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by habitue View Post
At this point, Molson must pray for non-playoffs showing.

It will be way easier to clean up the place and get rid of Gauthier, his assistants and the whole coaching staff.
I highly doubt
Playoffs mean $$$

not making playoffs = loss of $$$

they need to fire coaches/GM and hire new one
get rid of Gomez to AHL (11 millions lost)

for the good of the team, fans yes

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02-21-2012, 12:31 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Plus he hasn't won ANYWHERE he has been.
Besides the Sens vs Leafs catastrophies year after year, Gauthier has done awesome building the Sens to a contender with the Hossa, Havlat, Chara, Alfredson and so on...

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02-21-2012, 12:32 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Pleky Roks View Post
Cole isn't and should not be going anywhere!!
I agree he's not going anywhere just like I agree that we won't rebuild. That doesn't mean we shouldn't do it though man.
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Originally Posted by Pleky Roks View Post
I understand what you mean about selling an older player while he is at the top of his game....but not after 1 season in Montreal. We signed Cole for 4 years and this could be turn out to be the worst season he has for all we know. You gotta be more patient with players and see how they do once they settle and get comfortable. He might score 80 points next season once he gets the right team around him and a coach playing the right system.
What does 1 season have to do with anything? Clearly we aren't contenders now and won't be next year. So why not do something about it?

It's not about being impatient either. What I'm saying we should do is actually taking the patient, build, deal for picks aproach. This club can be a playoff team next year for sure but we could also easily fall out of it. We're a bubble team and it's been that way for years. Dealing Cole away at the height of his value signals that we're looking to build a cup winner rather than live on the bubble perpetually. It's really not all that bad an idea to trade this guy man.

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Originally Posted by Pleky Roks View Post
Too many times we jump the gun and are forced to watch Hab players excel in other cities because we traded them too soon.
And those players are the YOUNG prospects that we deal away. Cole is 33 dude and is on the downside of his career. He's been great for us this season but we're still losing.

Again, it depends on your goals. If you want to win a cup someday then this is the kind of move that you make. If you want to compete for 8th place next year and try to get into the playoffs (which is what management really wants to do) then you hang onto him. Personally, I'm tired of watching us always build our team for 8th and that's why I'd want him traded now to maximize his return. I want us to build towards a cup whereas you just want us to make the playoffs and then see what happens. You and I have different goals.

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Old
02-21-2012, 12:33 PM
  #181
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Plus he hasn't won ANYWHERE he has been.
That's not a measuring stick anymore. The league is too competitive to hold this as a criteria. David Poile hasn't won anything, pretty sure I'd enjoy having him as a GM. Same can be said about a multitude of coaches and GMs.

Dave Tallon put a SC winning team together with the Hawks, but I don't consider him that good of a GM. Same thing with Burke in Anaheim.

So really, that doesn't mean much anymore.

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02-21-2012, 12:33 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by chewBACHa View Post
I highly doubt
Playoffs mean $$$

not making playoffs = loss of $$$

they need to fire coaches/GM and hire new one
get rid of Gomez to AHL (11 millions lost)

for the good of the team, fans yes
Pre-season games at premium price at the Bell, too.

Molson gave his blessing, no doubt, about the coaching change. He must now live with the consequences.

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02-21-2012, 12:33 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
That's not a measuring stick anymore. The league is too competitive to hold this as a criteria. David Poile hasn't won anything, pretty much I'd enjoy having him as a GM. Same can be said about a multitude of coaches and GMs.

Dave Tallon put a SC winning team together with the Hawks, but I don't consider him that good of a GM. Same thing with Burke in Anaheim.

So really, that doesn't mean much anymore.
He hasn't been good here and he hasn't won anywhere.

That's enough for me. Time for new direction and leadership.

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02-21-2012, 12:34 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Pre-season games at premium price at the Bell, too.

Molson gave his blessing, no doubt, about the coaching change. He must now live with the consequences.
I'm hearing that Molson has put in a request to have 20 home pre-season games next year.

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02-21-2012, 12:37 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
I'm hearing that Molson has put in a request to have 20 home pre-season games next year.
He's gonna get them..

They will split their 60 players in 3 teams and play 3 games a day a.m., pm. and nites. 64,000 fans a day....

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02-21-2012, 12:39 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's actually never been proven. But it doesn't matter anyways as he had a different role and nobody here has an idea of how things went down behind closed doors.

You keep coming back to this year and how we're so bad. Well even if it were true, you don't fire someone because of one year.
You're better off questioning the handling of Lappy, SK, Pouliot, D'Ago, etc..

A fan can sit behind his cpu screen and criticize on how bad it was to re-sign Markov, like many have. But behind closed doors, if he gets a report from the medical staff saying Markov is doing well and on pace to start the year, and I'm sure the owner knows it as well, so I don't see how Molson could blame PG for that.

But I think it's pretty stupid to say he should get fired because we're having a bad year due to his decisions. We're having a bad year because quite a few of our players under performed or got injured again, Plekanec, AK, Gionta, Cammy, Spacek, Gomez haven't been all that good. The guys PG brought in, Cole, Emelin and Diaz have done quite well. Markov is a medical staff mistake, and in any event, it's a risk I personally would take over and over again, you just don't take a risk on letting such a skilled player go, no matter how big of a question mark he is.
I said it earlier, biggest mistake was re-signing Gill instead of going after a replacement for Hammer. But that was fixed when he traded him.
The Kaberle trade can raise some eye brows, but it really isn't as bad as most make it sound.
Cammy's trade isn't the best, and I'm sure he could have gotten more had he waited closer to deadline. But we still got a top 6 player, a pick, a prospect and 2M of added space. Not so bad.


People just hate Gauthier. So whatever mistake he's done gets overblown by tenfold, and whatever good move isn't credited as much.
And don't get me wrong, I have no issues with him being fired. I think it will depend on how things go until the Deadline and for the end of the year.
he is a dead bean walking- this will be it for his gming in this org!

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02-21-2012, 12:57 PM
  #187
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I'm firmly pro-Gauthier but even more firmly anti-Media.

Pierre LeBrun is a rat who has been hating on Gauthier constantly, and small minded fans lap it up and think he's a good analyst. He's a turd with a goatee.

I'm with OneSharpMarble here, the haters just see it one way and lump two decades of history with the modern-day habs.

Almost every GMs mandate is to give his coach the tools he needs to win. JM didn't want O'Byrne, Lapierre (a trade I was vehemently against), SKost and so on. As soon as JM is gone we're going a new direction, in fact it's a direction we'd been going for a while. I'm happy with this direction, to me it shows vision and proactive knowledge.

I pose a question: if you want "long-term vision" and think Goat hasn't had any, what would your moves be? Other than "BLOW IT ALL UP!!1" of course.

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02-21-2012, 01:07 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
I'm firmly pro-Gauthier but even more firmly anti-Media.

Pierre LeBrun is a rat who has been hating on Gauthier constantly, and small minded fans lap it up and think he's a good analyst. He's a turd with a goatee.

I'm with OneSharpMarble here, the haters just see it one way and lump two decades of history with the modern-day habs.

Almost every GMs mandate is to give his coach the tools he needs to win. JM didn't want O'Byrne, Lapierre (a trade I was vehemently against), SKost and so on. As soon as JM is gone we're going a new direction, in fact it's a direction we'd been going for a while. I'm happy with this direction, to me it shows vision and proactive knowledge.

I pose a question: if you want "long-term vision" and think Goat hasn't had any, what would your moves be? Other than "BLOW IT ALL UP!!1" of course.
pack your bags - Goats island retreat is supposdly marvelous- !!
gautheir will be nothing more than a trivia question after this season

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02-21-2012, 01:08 PM
  #189
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If, let's say, Carolina turns Spacek into a draft pick in the next week, does the trade look any different?
In my estimate Spacek would bring in a fifth rounder or lower. The Habs ought to be able to get something better than that for Kaberle. Let's say it's a third or fourth rounder. Isn't that better than a fifth? Wouldn't that make Gauthier look good?

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02-21-2012, 01:15 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by larek View Post
pack your bags - Goats island retreat is supposdly marvelous- !!
gautheir will be nothing more than a trivia question after this season
You contribute nothing to any and every discussion on this website. Why do you do the things you do?

What value does your post offer? Really? Are you bringing a new idea to this thread at all? Do any of your poorly thought, poorly typed posts, ever?

At least with other posters, even throughout a disagreement, there is a semblance of civility.

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02-21-2012, 01:18 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Plus he hasn't won ANYWHERE he has been.
The Senators got to the finals against Anaheim. The Habs haven't even sniffed it since 1993. Gauthier has a better track record than any Habs GM in almost 20 years. QED

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02-21-2012, 01:19 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
In my estimate Spacek would bring in a fifth rounder or lower. The Habs ought to be able to get something better than that for Kaberle. Let's say it's a third or fourth rounder. Isn't that better than a fifth? Wouldn't that make Gauthier look good?
I don't believe the 2 assumptions of your post - that Spacek is worth a 5th and Kaberle better than that.

Kaberle is diseased right now, nobody will touch him.

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02-21-2012, 01:19 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
The Senators got to the finals against Anaheim. The Habs haven't even sniffed it since 1993. Gauthier has a better track record than any Habs GM in almost 20 years. QED
If that's true (and I don't think it is) it just shows you how God awful our management has been for the past two decades.

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02-21-2012, 01:21 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
You contribute nothing to any and every discussion on this website. Why do you do the things you do?

What value does your post offer? Really? Are you bringing a new idea to this thread at all? Do any of your poorly thought, poorly typed posts, ever?

At least with other posters, even throughout a disagreement, there is a semblance of civility.
too keep Pining away for a GM that has been so amateurish in his handling of this team is almost embarrasing!

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02-21-2012, 01:21 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
The Senators got to the finals against Anaheim. The Habs haven't even sniffed it since 1993. Gauthier has a better track record than any Habs GM in almost 20 years. QED
what does this have to do with Gauthier?

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02-21-2012, 01:23 PM
  #196
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seriously, does he?
He does, if one can call that "french". Kudos for him to go on a talkshow and voice an opinion in a language he obviously hasn't used in a long long time. I have to say, it was painful to hear, though.

As for the topic of this thread, there seems to be two stages in Gauthier's reign. Before, he mostly inactive, with small patching moves here and there. Back then, I'd agree wholeheartedly this was not the man to lead us to the 25th. It's almost as if he was acting with his hands tied. Then, this season, he seems to act a lot more. React is perharps a better word, which is never good in manament as many of you know. BUT, for the first time in a long while, he SEEMS to have finally grasped that the small, speedy, puck control, special teams strategy we had in place was doomed to fail in today's nhl (see Sabres). He seems to want to go young, big and heart. That is very encouraging. Perhaps it is too late though.

Also, he really comes off as a pretentious ******. As a french montrealer as poutine and cabane à sucre as is possible, I have an issue with that fact that this is man living in Vermont and chose to start his a carreer in the Disney organization as a young manager. Almost like he was too good for us. I know, I know. But still, this "narrative", as some of you like to say (a lot), is ubuquitous and convincing.

Maybe, despite of all that, a change is just welcome for the sake of change. As if often the case in high pressure management circles.

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02-21-2012, 01:23 PM
  #197
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I don't believe the 2 assumptions of your post - that Spacek is worth a 5th and Kaberle better than that.

Kaberle is diseased right now, nobody will touch him.
You're off your rocker if you think you can drop in weasel words like 'diseased' when describing a hockey player's value. Spacek is probably worth a low 2nd/3rd to a very desperate team but Kaberle is definitely worth more. He's a 40-50pt puck-moving d-man. He's not good but he's not bad.

And yes, I hate seeing him play.

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02-21-2012, 01:23 PM
  #198
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
I'm firmly pro-Gauthier but even more firmly anti-Media.

Pierre LeBrun is a rat who has been hating on Gauthier constantly, and small minded fans lap it up and think he's a good analyst. He's a turd with a goatee.

I'm with OneSharpMarble here, the haters just see it one way and lump two decades of history with the modern-day habs.

Almost every GMs mandate is to give his coach the tools he needs to win. JM didn't want O'Byrne, Lapierre (a trade I was vehemently against), SKost and so on. As soon as JM is gone we're going a new direction, in fact it's a direction we'd been going for a while. I'm happy with this direction, to me it shows vision and proactive knowledge.

I pose a question: if you want "long-term vision" and think Goat hasn't had any, what would your moves be? Other than "BLOW IT ALL UP!!1" of course.
I felt and still feel JM is a superior coach to Cunneyworth. I'm not sure how firing a guy who would've gave us a better chance at the playoffs shows vision.

The best part is, after all this, we know we're gonna hire someone billingual who still isn't as good a coach as JM. yay, we'll be more aggressive! More goals. Yah, a ******** more losses too. How's that vision? We can agree to disagree and that's fine, but when we get a new coach who is a shadow of JM's ability then what you want me to do? Praise Gauthier?

I don't think gauthier has been necessarily bad per se, but I don't think he's been very good either. He's been average. I really don't see the vision he has, I really don't. I'm kind of fed up of mediocrity and although Gauthier hasn't been bad, he just emphasizes another era of fighting for a playoff spot.

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02-21-2012, 01:23 PM
  #199
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People just hate Gauthier. So whatever mistake he's done gets overblown by tenfold, and whatever good move isn't credited as much.
I really don't get it when I read arguments like this. Nobody hates Gauthier for the sake of it man. People who hate him, hate his moves as our GM. I don't think he's the worst GM of all time by any stretch but he hasn't been good. I hear a lot of excuses being made for him by people and it just doesn't wash.

Everyone agrees he was dealt a bad hand by Gainey but for the most part he's made things worse. Yes, he's made some good moves and some of his mistakes can be forgiven. But when you look at his body of work as a whole, it really is a series of short gain, knee jerk reactive moves with no direction. Keeping Price? Great. Halak for Eller? Too soon to say but at least he went for a prospect he believed in. Wiz? Well, it could've worked out really well and I can't fault him for that either but there's too much other crap to go along with this here.

I won't be surprised in the least if we keep this guy but I really wish we'd look elsewhere as I think we can do a lot better.

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02-21-2012, 01:25 PM
  #200
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Gauthier is a compêtent GM.... Average, but competent.


But he is sooo weird...........

It's hard to like him as a person.

The guy has no charisma or communication skills.

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