Fighting is banned in NCAA hockey, European Leagues and the Olympics. None of those events/leagues have a higher rate of cheap shots than the NHL.
Even the playoffs have barely any fights and its easily the most entertaining hockey we see all year. I can't say there's a higher rate of cheap shots in the playoffs either.
Seems to be a myth that fight fans cling to anytime something like this comes along.
Sad state of affairs. Hockey is slowly getting castrated. It won't be long till fighting is no more and hitting won't be far behind. Makes me sick.
Political correctness has been castrating this planet and it's creeped its way into the sports world. Anybody thinking banning fighting would be good needs to give their head a shake. We live in a world where if one guy somehow gets hurt in a fight (And how often does that happen?), suddenly everybody starts debating about whether fighting should be taken out of the game. Well, **** that.
CHL fights are a thing of beauty, and that's one reason why junior hockey is perfect.
Fighting is banned in NCAA hockey, European Leagues and the Olympics. None of those events/leagues have a higher rate of cheap shots than the NHL.
Even the playoffs have barely any fights and its easily the most entertaining hockey we see all year. I can't say there's a higher rate of cheap shots in the playoffs either.
Seems to be a myth that fight fans cling to anytime something like this comes along.
NCAA hockey has so much stick work though. To be honest, if they allowed fighting, it would be cleaner (I don't care either way if they have fighting or not).
I know you said the playoffs have barely any fights, but the fact of the matter is, they still do. And they can be instrumental in changing momentum (see Iginla vs. Beauchemin in 06, Getzlaf vs. Thornton in 09, Talbot vs. Carcillo 09, etc.).
Also, even if the CHL goes through with this and bans fighting doesn't mean there won't be any fighting. Guys will still fight after cheap/big hits and from resulting scrums.
One can make as many rules as you want about banning fighting in hockey, but they'll always remain so long as hitting is still in the game and that players are still using sticks.
Political correctness has been castrating this planet and it's creeped its way into the sports world. Anybody thinking banning fighting would be good needs to give their head a shake. We live in a world where if one guy somehow gets hurt in a fight (And how often does that happen?), suddenly everybody starts debating about whether fighting should be taken out of the game. Well, **** that.
CHL fights are a thing of beauty, and that's one reason why junior hockey is perfect.
If there's one thing that junior hockey should be all about, it's clowns like Jeff Kugel being given a chance to act like maniacs.
NCAA hockey has so much stick work though. To be honest, if they allowed fighting, it would be cleaner (I don't care either way if they have fighting or not).
I know you said the playoffs have barely any fights, but the fact of the matter is, they still do. And they can be instrumental in changing momentum (see Iginla vs. Beauchemin in 06, Getzlaf vs. Thornton in 09, Talbot vs. Carcillo 09, etc.).
Also, even if the CHL goes through with this and bans fighting doesn't mean there won't be any fighting. Guys will still fight after cheap/big hits and from resulting scrums.
One can make as many rules as you want about banning fighting in hockey, but they'll always remain so long as hitting is still in the game and that players are still using sticks.
I know there's still fighting in the playoffs but they are rare and if they were punished by a game misconduct instead of a 5 minute penalty, they would still exist.
As I said in my first post in the thread I have no problem with Fighting in the NHL, I actually enjoy a good scrap but I also don't have a problem with them being a game misconduct instead of a 5 minute penalty.
I just disagree with the idea that apply game misconducts to fighting will cause a rise in cheap shots or stick work, I think thats a myth perpetuated by fight fans afraid that they'll become a thing of the past.
I just disagree with the idea that apply game misconducts to fighting will cause a rise in cheap shots or stick work, I think thats a myth perpetuated by fight fans afraid that they'll become a thing of the past.
This "fight fan" notion is rediculous. Are there vampire fans, sure but they are a very small minority. The push to retain fights has zero to do with the fans, it is still here because more than 95% of the people who have to face the consequences WANT to keep it. But since the players clearly dont undersand the game, lets take the word of feaking anonymous internet posters who really have their finger on the pulse of the game.
I find it interesting that the people who claim to want to ban fighting in order to protect players brains are never the ones wo advocate full cages which would pretty much negate the chance of getting a concussion at the end of a fist. You want the nhl to go full cages ? If no, why not ?
And the people who say that there are no cheap stick plays jn the ncaa, what are you watching ? Loose stickwork is endemic in the ncaa because ther are generally zero consequences of not minding your stick.
Adam Jánošík is a fine example of a European player who is not afraid of a good fight in an appropriate situation (i.e. coming to the defence of a teammate).
There are lots of European scrappers, there are more Canadian goons though, because it is more a part of our hockey heritage. Fighting is simply more prevalent in North American hockey than it is in European hockey.
The whole 'ban fighting in hockey' movement is not about European player - it's about the people who think that fighting is worse than getting ploughed into the boards at full speed.
If people actually wanted to address player safety, they would look at ways of cutting down on dirty hits. Getting rid of fighting is counter-productive, because the only responsibility that players would need to take would be to sit out for a few games, and maybe pay a fine. The threat of getting your face bashed in kept the game cleaner than it is today for years. Think about it. The hit that took out Chris Pronger - Would you have tried that against the Flyers captain in the 70s? If anything, player safety would improve if they got rid of the instigator penalty, and actually let players police themselves to some extent.
Let's use an example - Player A runs Player B into the boards. Player A's teammate Player C comes along and fights Player B. As long as it's a clean fight (Player C doesn't start beating Player B's head into the ice, or anything like that), I'd like to see Player B thrown out of the game, and Player C get the usual five minutes in the box.
Don't get me wrong though - If you've only been able to make the NHL because of your fighting abilities, and you get into 100+ fights a year, sure, there's going to be some cumulative brain damage, but those players are becoming less and less common. Have you (not just seemsayin, but anyone else in the 'ban fighting' crowd) ever actually been in a hockey fight? I haven't been in many, but being in skates takes away just enough of your balance that you're not likely going to be throwing any serious knock-out punches. To even say that enforcers take as much damage in a game as the average boxer does in one round is laughable.
In the BCHL you can have five fights. Your 6th fight is a 1 game suspension, 7th is two games, 8 is four games and your 9th fight is a 8 game suspension or review by the league to end your season.
If you instigate your first instigator is a 1 game suspension, your 2nd instigator is a 2 game suspension, your third instigator is a 4 game suspension and your fourth instigator penalty is 8 games and review by the league to end your season.
They still have lots of fight out of heat of the moment stuff where people want to kill each other but the staged fighting is gone. If the NHL or CHL adopted this rule or a variation it would save the game.
They still have lots of fight out of heat of the moment stuff where people want to kill each other but the staged fighting is gone. If the NHL or CHL adopted this rule or a variation it would save the game.
So, some fourth liner puts your star player in the hospital, and you want one of your bigger guys to have to think twice because he's been in a few fights already and might get some huge suspension?
This saves the game how?
Maybe review the situation, and suspend people for clearly staged fights. Blanket rules like this rarely help anyone.
Ban it at the major-junior level? Fine. There is no need to have kids pummeling each other while they are still developing physically. Besides, these kids are not getting a professional wage.
At the professional levels, fighting should stay. This is how some of these people make a living. It is up to them to weigh the risks and rewards and decide what they want to do.
If you've never had a scrap ever and then you ran over a star player you would get killed by whoever came in to defend him.
In the BCHL you can have five fights. Your 6th fight is a 1 game suspension, 7th is two games, 8 is four games and your 9th fight is a 8 game suspension or review by the league to end your season.
If you instigate your first instigator is a 1 game suspension, your 2nd instigator is a 2 game suspension, your third instigator is a 4 game suspension and your fourth instigator penalty is 8 games and review by the league to end your season.
They still have lots of fight out of heat of the moment stuff where people want to kill each other but the staged fighting is gone. If the NHL or CHL adopted this rule or a variation it would save the game
Save the game from what exactly? There is nothing thing wrong with the game of hockey and fighting.
So, some fourth liner puts your star player in the hospital, and you want one of your bigger guys to have to think twice because he's been in a few fights already and might get some huge suspension?
This saves the game how?
Maybe review the situation, and suspend people for clearly staged fights. Blanket rules like this rarely help anyone.
When players go after each other in the BCHL they usually get called for being the aggressor not the instigator. Only when they blatantly grab somebody that has nothing to do with the play do they get the instigator. If they defend a dirty play they get called for the aggressor.
When players go after each other in the BCHL they usually get called for being the aggressor not the instigator. Only when they blatantly grab somebody that has nothing to do with the play do they get the instigator. If they defend a dirty play they get called for the aggressor.
Okay, but what if this is that guy's (let's call him Adam Chapman) eighth fight of the season, because he's skilled enough to be playing with your star players, big enough to realistically defend them, and out there at the same time?
A guy like that being suspended hurts the whole team, but so does a guy like one of is linemates being injured. You can't make him have to remember that he's going to be gone for an eighth of the season if he defends his teammate.
This isn't a terrible idea, but they would need to review situations to see if a suspension is really warranted (i.e. a meaningless staged fight). We all know that the various hocky leagues are not capable of using good judgement though.
Fighting is banned in NCAA hockey, European Leagues and the Olympics. None of those events/leagues have a higher rate of cheap shots than the NHL.
Even the playoffs have barely any fights and its easily the most entertaining hockey we see all year. I can't say there's a higher rate of cheap shots in the playoffs either.
Seems to be a myth that fight fans cling to anytime something like this comes along.
Pre instigator rule, there were MORE fights/game in the playoffs than in the regular season.
as it is in junior a- 5th fight gets you a 2* i think game suspension, every fight beyond that is 4 games
i dont agree with it and dont know if its been changed this year, but basically the western leagues wanted to boycott hockey canada and form their own league cause this is redic
i want to take a second and look at this from a different direction
what about the kids that enjoy fighting? we have a local kid here, as a 15 year old he was beating up 19 year old middle weights, and even taking on heavies
the kid is 5'8 and 160 pounds and he can fight
if the kids wanna go, let em go, if they dont, oh well
dont come here and say that all they are doing is contributing to evil
If this happens, I wouldn't be suprised if somebody starts up a competing Junior league where all the tougher players can go and learn their craft.
Fighting in all BUT pro leagues would be banned under this and the league would not be sanctioned if it allowed it. Therefore this would not happen.
It's really about time, if the rednecks want to watch fighting...turn on Jerry Springer. The NHL is a professional league and it's time they start acting professional. Fighting to hockey is like smoking in bars, was ok for a while until society grew up. The only fans that will quit watching are the rednecks who don't understand the game anyways
It's kinda strange, in Sweden there are many hockey experts etc lobbying for a 5 minute major for fighting only. As of now, it's at least a game misconduct, more often than not it's a match penalty with further suspensions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by seemsayin
I blame this whole stop fighting thing on the European player.
Please, tell me how I'm wrong.
That's a strange thing to say, especially when the direct post above you states that Sweden is trying to lessen the penalty for fighting which means they are accepting it more as part of the game, no?
Fighting in all BUT pro leagues would be banned under this and the league would not be sanctioned if it allowed it. Therefore this would not happen.
It's really about time, if the rednecks want to watch fighting...turn on Jerry Springer. The NHL is a professional league and it's time they start acting professional. Fighting to hockey is like smoking in bars, was ok for a while until society grew up. The only fans that will quit watching are the rednecks who don't understand the game anyways
Fighting in hockey has occured on the first ever hockey match, do you know that? It has nothing to do with the other sports who never had fighting to begin with! It's part of hockey, it's what made the rivalries great! People talk about the Detroit but there last best series was when the faced Colorado and there was epic brawls.
That's what hockey is all about. The fire, the passion. In my opinion guys like you are not really men.
