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Jean Beliveau vs Maurice Richard

View Poll Results: Who was better?
Maurice Richard 8 19.05%
Jean Beliveau 34 80.95%
Voters: 42. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-28-2012, 06:10 PM
  #1
TheDoctor10
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Jean Beliveau vs Maurice Richard

My dad grew up in Chateguay in a time when the Habs ripped off championships like nothing. One of the defining books from my childhood is The Hockey Sweater. When I was born, my parents gave me a stuffed bear named Number 4 (After Orr and Beliveau; mom was a Bruins fan).

If you had to declare the best Habs forward of all time, which one would it be? If I'm missing anyone, I apologize; these two just seemed like the biggest Montreal icons, based on my childhood experiences anyway.

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02-28-2012, 06:21 PM
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mbhhofr
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I was fortunate enough to see both of them play many times. They were two different style of players. Richard was very emotional and Beliveau was more calm and collected. Richard was more exciting to watch. As for who the better one was, as far as I'm concerned, they both were great.

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02-28-2012, 06:21 PM
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MXD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814 View Post
My dad grew up in Chateguay in a time when the Habs ripped off championships like nothing. One of the defining books from my childhood is The Hockey Sweater. When I was born, my parents gave me a stuffed bear named Number 4 (After Orr and Beliveau; mom was a Bruins fan).

If you had to declare the best Habs forward of all time, which one would it be? If I'm missing anyone, I apologize; these two just seemed like the biggest Montreal icons, based on my childhood experiences anyway.
Divorce ensued?

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02-28-2012, 06:22 PM
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TheDoctor10
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Divorce ensued?
Nope, still together haha

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02-28-2012, 07:03 PM
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i think top 3 Habs in order are Richard, Harvey, Beliveau

best forward Richard then Beliveau

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02-28-2012, 07:06 PM
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RabbinsDuck
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I've always been more impressed by Beliveau - including his all-around play - than Richard. Richard was a playoff beast, but Beliveau was certainly no slouch either. I'd easily take Beliveau over Richard personally, but they are much, much closer when trying to figure out the 'best' player.

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02-28-2012, 09:34 PM
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Big Phil
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Beliveau for me. I have always maintained he is the #5 player of all-time. Ahead of Hull, ahead of even Harvey. And of course Richard. The reason being is that Beliveau's all around game trumps Richard's. Not to mention he was a more dangerous offensive machine than Richard. Beliveau led the NHL in goals twice, yet he was a better playmaker. Richard relied far more on goals than playmaking.

In the postseason the naked eye takes Richard. And you know what, I am fine with that. However, Richard has 82 playoff goals while Beliveau had 79. People forget just how clutch of a postseason player that Beliveau was for the Habs. If anything he is only slightly behind Richard.

Not to mention, he is the only player in NHL history to be the best player on two different dynasties. Unbelievable.

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02-28-2012, 09:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Beliveau for me. I have always maintained he is the #5 player of all-time. Ahead of Hull, ahead of even Harvey. And of course Richard. The reason being is that Beliveau's all around game trumps Richard's. Not to mention he was a more dangerous offensive machine than Richard. Beliveau led the NHL in goals twice, yet he was a better playmaker. Richard relied far more on goals than playmaking.

In the postseason the naked eye takes Richard. And you know what, I am fine with that. However, Richard has 82 playoff goals while Beliveau had 79. People forget just how clutch of a postseason player that Beliveau was for the Habs. If anything he is only slightly behind Richard.

Not to mention, he is the only player in NHL history to be the best player on two different dynasties. Unbelievable.
One could argue that Doug Harvey was the best player on the 50s dynasty and Henri Richard was the best player on the 60s dynasty.

That said, Beliveau is in the conversation for both. And his playoff record is incredible and if it's behind Maurice Richard, it isn't by much.


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 02-28-2012 at 09:46 PM.
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02-28-2012, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Beliveau for me. I have always maintained he is the #5 player of all-time. Ahead of Hull, ahead of even Harvey. And of course Richard. The reason being is that Beliveau's all around game trumps Richard's. Not to mention he was a more dangerous offensive machine than Richard. Beliveau led the NHL in goals twice, yet he was a better playmaker. Richard relied far more on goals than playmaking.

In the postseason the naked eye takes Richard. And you know what, I am fine with that. However, Richard has 82 playoff goals while Beliveau had 79. People forget just how clutch of a postseason player that Beliveau was for the Habs. If anything he is only slightly behind Richard.

Not to mention, he is the only player in NHL history to be the best player on two different dynasties. Unbelievable.
Hull vs. Beliveau is something I am interested in.

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02-28-2012, 09:54 PM
  #10
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At the highest level , Lafleur was the best of the three montreal french canadien superstars.

Between Richard and Beliveau I would take Beliveau in general , except in a very important game which was Richard's comfort zone.

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02-28-2012, 09:54 PM
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Big Phil
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Originally Posted by RabbinsDuck View Post
Hull vs. Beliveau is something I am interested in.
I've had some interesting discussions on that topic. I choose Beliveau of course, but a really good trifecta is Beliveau vs. Hull vs. Richard. I am telling you, you don't realize how close these three men are until you compare top 10 scoring finishes, and Hart trophy finishes. By that basis alone it is as close as you can possibly get.

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02-28-2012, 11:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Beliveau for me. I have always maintained he is the #5 player of all-time. Ahead of Hull, ahead of even Harvey. And of course Richard. The reason being is that Beliveau's all around game trumps Richard's. Not to mention he was a more dangerous offensive machine than Richard. Beliveau led the NHL in goals twice, yet he was a better playmaker. Richard relied far more on goals than playmaking.

In the postseason the naked eye takes Richard. And you know what, I am fine with that. However, Richard has 82 playoff goals while Beliveau had 79. People forget just how clutch of a postseason player that Beliveau was for the Habs. If anything he is only slightly behind Richard.

Not to mention, he is the only player in NHL history to be the best player on two different dynasties. Unbelievable.
Pretty much agree with this Jean is in my top 5 as well.

He was NHL ready before the Habs got him and his final playoff was simply amazing.

A class act.

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02-29-2012, 08:45 AM
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Jean Beliveau for me here.

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02-29-2012, 09:15 AM
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Beliveau was the better player, but Richard is the bigger icon. Richard might well have saved the franchise which was on the verge of going under when he became a member of the team. In that regard, he's basically to the Habs franchise what Mario Lemieux was to the Pens.

So in terms of importance to the franchise and it's survival, it's Richard. In terms of who was actually a better player on the ice, it's Beliveau. But without Richard, Beliveau might never have played in Montreal.

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02-29-2012, 10:55 AM
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seventieslord
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definitely Beliveau. He was elite at more than one thing.

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02-29-2012, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Beliveau was the better player, but Richard is the bigger icon. Richard might well have saved the franchise which was on the verge of going under when he became a member of the team. In that regard, he's basically to the Habs franchise what Mario Lemieux was to the Pens.

So in terms of importance to the franchise and it's survival, it's Richard. In terms of who was actually a better player on the ice, it's Beliveau. But without Richard, Beliveau might never have played in Montreal.
Lafleur is much more popular than Béliveau here.Béliveau is popular , but Lafleur is more of an icon and represent a certain era that had so much flavor.Béliveau is probably the most respected person of the 3 , but people aren't as passionnate about him as they are for Richard and Lafleur.Could also include Roy.

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02-29-2012, 11:45 AM
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seventieslord
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Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
Lafleur is much more popular than Béliveau here.Béliveau is popular , but Lafleur is more of an icon and represent a certain era that had so much flavor.Béliveau is probably the most respected person of the 3 , but people aren't as passionnate about him as they are for Richard and Lafleur.Could also include Roy.
when you look at what type of players they were, that's probably exactly how it should be.

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02-29-2012, 12:04 PM
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BenchBrawl
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Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
when you look at what type of players they were, that's probably exactly how it should be.
agreed.

It's hard for people to identify themselves with Béliveau , I'm not sure I know somebody who has a more flawless life/career resume than him.Clean player , all-around great , great career , great accomplishment , leadership by flawless example , clean person without any scandal , honorable , respected...boring.No flavor at all.

Lafleur and Richard were more exciting , and their character were more flawed.Kids on the street probably wanted to be Richard and Lafleur more than Béliveau.Nobody wants to be Jean ****ing Béliveau lol.


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02-29-2012, 12:45 PM
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Nobody wants to be Jean ****ing Béliveau lol.
Lafleur would probably argue this point.

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02-29-2012, 12:47 PM
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I think people are probably in awe of Beliveau more than anything (I know I was last year when I got to meet and chat with him briefly last year).

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02-29-2012, 03:26 PM
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I pick Beliveau but didnt Beliveau become a good two way player after his 6 year peak of 55-61, regardless i still take beliveau over the rocket. Harvey vs Beliveau would be a good debate, harvey's accomplishments as defenseman trump the rocket's accomplishments as a forward IMO.

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02-29-2012, 03:28 PM
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I'm surprised this is such a blowout for Beliveau, even though I voted for him myself. Shows how far removed hfboards has become from the general public.

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02-29-2012, 06:50 PM
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Big Phil
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agreed.

It's hard for people to identify themselves with Béliveau , I'm not sure I know somebody who has a more flawless life/career resume than him.Clean player , all-around great , great career , great accomplishment , leadership by flawless example , clean person without any scandal , honorable , respected...boring.No flavor at all.

Lafleur and Richard were more exciting , and their character were more flawed.Kids on the street probably wanted to be Richard and Lafleur more than Béliveau.Nobody wants to be Jean ****ing Béliveau lol.
Lafleur always mentioned that he wanted to be Jean Beliveau. To be honest, had he taken better care of himself and not driven his car off the road a couple times he might have had a career as good as him. Alas he did nothing notable in his 30s while Beliveau won a Hart, Conn Smythe and 5 more Cups.

Denis Potvin idolized Beliveau. He claims that even at the age of 45 (the age he was in an interview I saw him in) that Beliveau is still his hero. So yeah, he is loved in Montreal for sure.

How do people relate to him? Probably the same way people related to Jimmy Stewart who was basically Hollywood's version of Beliveau. They think of him as a saint, almost like someone to look up to, or a role model. I know in Toronto Johnny Bower is often dubbed "everybody's favourite grandfather". So kind of like that.

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02-29-2012, 06:59 PM
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Yeah but these guys won't actually switch their idolization to the NHL players of their era, since they were those players.A lot of people growing up watching Béliveau switched to Lafleur just after , while people growing up watching Lafleur had nothing after him.Lafleur was just more charismatic on the ice and was more a guy you could identified yourself with.Not a lot of people are like Beliveau in real life , sport is a thing of passion , of flaws and personality , and franckly Beliveau has no real personality to speak of.He is like a politician.

Of course , Béliveau had plenty of fans , but when you compare him to such icon as Richard and Lafleur , he's losing in the popularity contest.

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02-29-2012, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by BenchBrawl View Post
agreed.

It's hard for people to identify themselves with Béliveau , I'm not sure I know somebody who has a more flawless life/career resume than him.Clean player , all-around great , great career , great accomplishment , leadership by flawless example , clean person without any scandal , honorable , respected...boring.No flavor at all.

Lafleur and Richard were more exciting , and their character were more flawed.Kids on the street probably wanted to be Richard and Lafleur more than Béliveau.Nobody wants to be Jean ****ing Béliveau lol.
If that's the case, (good is boring) maybe the League should create an award or trophy for most flawed individual. Maybe call it the Sean Avery Award. Have two nominees annually, and let them fight over it.

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